PDA

View Full Version : Moldova canceled



poiuytrewq0987
05-12-2012, 07:40 AM
The Moldovan nation does not exist. This was the agreement made by the presidents of Moldova and Romania Nicholas Timofti and Traian Basescu. Meanwhile, the census showed that the majority of Moldovans do not consider themselves Romanians. Despite the similarities between the two nations, the historical background to their union as one state is not greater than that for their separate existence.

Moldovan nation does not exist. This was stated by Romanian President Traian Basescu at a meeting with his Moldovan counterpart, Nikolai Timofti in Bucharest. Timofti did not object. Thus a unique situation is observed: the president has denied the existence of the nation he leads.

The meeting held on May 3 at Bucharest had little resemblance to the talks between the two heads of sovereign states. There was a feeling that Basescu was speaking not to his colleague, but one of the governors of the Romanian County. Timofti did not seem to be bothered by this situation. The discussion of the two leaders left doubts that the Moldovan president was defending his country's sovereignty.

"We talked and agreed that Romania and Moldova are two independent and sovereign states populated mostly by Romanians. We are united by the language, tradition, joy and misery the Romanians have been through in the last century. We put an end to the confusion over the Moldovan minority," said Basescu. Here it is: the majority was declared a national minority.

Next, Basescu continued the story of the brotherhood of the two states. He said that the strategic partnership with Moldova will be developed by every Romanian president, regardless of political affiliation. In addition, Romania will support the desire of its eastern neighbor to enter the EU. The fact that Moldova has not been invited did not bother him in the least.

The Romanian leader also said he had presented Timofti a wooden church to be placed in Soroca region of Moldavia, as well as "a million books in Romanian." Apparently, in order to explain to the Moldovan youth that they are in fact young Romanians, Bucharest decided to increase the number of scholarships to Moldovan students in Romanian universities from 5 to 10 thousand.

On his part, Timofti thanked his Romanian counterpart for support and invited Basescu to attend Chisinau with an official visit. In addition, the Moldovan president once again said that Russian peacekeepers should be withdrawn from the territory of Transnistria. Basescu nodded and promised to support Moldova in matters related to Transnistria.

Cancellation of the Moldovan nation is an open invasion of the two politicians in the consciousness of every individual in the area of ​​linguistic and ethnographic science. No one questions the similarity of Moldovans and Romanian languages. As for the nation, it is more than debatable. In the end, Germany and Austria also share a language, but many Austrians do not consider themselves German. Montenegrins speak Serbian, but consider themselves Montenegrins. There are plenty of similar examples.

A census held in Moldova eight years ago, showed that only 2.2 percent of the population consider themselves Romanians, and 75.8 percent consider themselves Moldovans. If we take only the title nation, the Romanian language was named native by 18.8 percent of Moldovans, and the Moldovan - by 78.4 percent. From these numbers it is clear that the Romanians in Moldova are at best a minority.

The current non-identification of the majority of Moldovans with Romanians is due to historical reasons. In the Middle Ages in the area where east-roman languages were spread out, two states have emerged - Moldavia and Wallachia. There could not be a single linguistic norm because Old Church Slavonic was used as a written language. Moldavians and Wallachians were Orthodox, and Moldovans and Romanians are modern Orthodox as well.

In the 16th century, the two principalities became vassals of the Ottoman Empire, and Wallachia had higher dependence. At that point, the eastern roman written language appeared, but it was based on the Cyrillic alphabet. Modern Romanian in the Latin alphabet originated in the late 18th century in Transylvania, part of the Austrian Empire. It was adopted as an official language in 1862.

The fate of Bessarabia, the eastern part of Moldavia, was different. From 1812 to 1917 it was part of the Russian Empire. The Cyrillic alphabet remained there, and Moldovans largely got mixed with Russians and Ukrainians, and adopted the Russian language. Chisinau has become one of the centers of the organization "Union of the Russian people." There were all the conditions for the formation of another nation in Bessarabia.

Coexistence of Moldovans and Romanians within one state lasted for nearly 20 years - in 1918-1940 and 1941-1944. Then the jurisdiction of the Romanian Orthodox Church was extended on Bessarabia, and the name "Moldovan language" was forbidden. In that case not all Moldovans joined Romania. Some of them lived in what is now Transnistria - in the Moldavian SSR as part of Soviet Ukraine, which in 1940 merged along with Bessarabia to the Moldavian SSR attached to the USSR.

In recent decades, Moldovans and Romanians have existed in different states. The Moldovans in the Soviet Union had their own language based on the Cyrillic alphabet. Only on a wave of nationalism in the late 1980s it was replaced with Romanian Latin. However, change in the alphabet is not enough to change the nation. Moldovans in Transnistria are still using the Cyrillic alphabet. Should they also be considered Romanians?

At best, Basescu and Timofti declared the end of the Moldovan nation too soon. At worst, it is wishful thinking. The poor Romania wants to extend its territory. Yet, it has no objective prerequisites for this. As can be seen from the results of the census, Moldova residents have been slow to renounce their own state. If they ever agree to it, there will still be Transnistria that will definitely not want to be part of Romania and the Romanian nation.

http://english.pravda.ru/world/europe/08-05-2012/121049-moldova_romania-0/

Dacul
05-12-2012, 07:59 AM
Most romanians would want that Republic of Moldavia citisens will be given working rights in Romania,but UE is not agreeing,since they are discriminating people based on how wealthy they are and Republic of Moldavia is too poor so UE would be interested in it.
On the other hand,Republic of Moldavia are not enough white skined + blue +green eyed so neo-nazists that are leading now Russia would be interested to help them,with giving them working rights in Russia.
So people from Republica of Moldavia are of the interest of no one.
So I do not really understand,what is the problem of that guy if Romania want to make the relation between Republic of Moldavia and Romania more close?
Is he concerned about the russian speakers in Republic of Moldavia?
Well the russians from Republic of Moldavia are not blonde and blue eyed enough to be accepted as russians by the racists from Sankt Petersburg and Moscow.
If Republic of Moldavia unite with Romania,they would be a minority in Romania and they will be very good citisens on Romania,here no one is discriminating you because you do not have enough white skin or enough blue or green eyes,or enough light hair.

However,Romania can not unite with Republic of Moldavia because UE would kick Romania out of UE,if Romania would dare to bring to UE 3.5 milions people more,that are not wealthy enough for their tastes.

This is the "reward" of romanians for our ancestors sheding their blood to defense Europe,with Russia included,from uncivilised pagans from Otoman Empire:
we are called inferior people,UE refused and is refusing to give romanians working rights,ok some countries (Italy,Spain,Sweden,Norway) gave working rights to romanians,but those working rights in Sweden are only in theory,very few romanians are working there,only Italy and Spain have lots of romanians that work there.
Norway would hire romanians,but we have very few with so high qualification as it is wanted.
Russia was selling Romania natural gases at a very high price and so on.

Onur
05-12-2012, 08:30 AM
Moldovans are indeed Romanians but if they join to Romania, then it will be as big as Germany with a quite low population?

The reason is Romania has the region of Banat since WW-1, separated from Hungary at that time. I think around a million Hungarians lives in there and i believe if Romania will grow bigger with Moldova, then it should consider leaving Banat or at least allow them to be an autonomous region.

Also the autonomous region of Gagauzia in Moldova already declared that if Moldova joins Romania, then they might declare their independence.

It`s a complicated issue.

Dacul
05-12-2012, 08:34 AM
Romania can not unite with Moldavia because UE does not allows us to do such a thing.
As for hungarians from Romania,they are living well here,better than romanians,because they are minority and they receive nice money from the state.
So they do not want to declare their independence.
Being minority in Romania is really nice,lol.
But Romania will not be as big as Germany (when Bessarabia will be united back to Romania),only about 277.000 square kilometers.
Germany is 357.000 square kilometers.

Nurzat
05-12-2012, 08:42 AM
do not forget that half of the region (not country) moldova is in romania. why not uniting the half of moldova which is under romanian rule to the independent moldova so that moldovans be first united, not separated, and then decide if the big, whole moldova should unite romania or not. and be advised that between romanians and moldavians (both moldavians of western moldavia and those of the republic) there are differences at least as great if not greater than between germans and austrians, czechs and slovaks, yugoslavians etc, so if those states exist moldova can exist too and western moldavia which is romanian territory now could one day say it wants to unite to the republic

poiuytrewq0987
05-12-2012, 09:52 AM
do not forget that half of the region (not country) moldova is in romania. why not uniting the half of moldova which is under romanian rule to the independent moldova so that moldovans be first united, not separated, and then decide if the big, whole moldova should unite romania or not. and be advised that between romanians and moldavians (both moldavians of western moldavia and those of the republic) there are differences at least as great if not greater than between germans and austrians, czechs and slovaks, yugoslavians etc, so if those states exist moldova can exist too and western moldavia which is romanian territory now could one day say it wants to unite to the republic

Do Moldovans in Romanian Moldova even identify as Moldovan?

Nurzat
05-12-2012, 07:57 PM
Do Moldovans in Romanian Moldova even identify as Moldovan?

well they all are moldavians because it is also the name of the region and they all speak a funny dialect called moldavian, which is also spoken in rep. moldova, but most consider this to be only the local aspect and identify as romanian as nationality. very few consider themselves only moldavian. it's more of a double identity - they are moldavians and emphasize on that with romanians but they are romanians in front of foreigners and defend romanian ideas

rareswega
06-14-2012, 07:57 AM
well they all are moldavians because it is also the name of the region and they all speak a funny dialect called moldavian, which is also spoken in rep. moldova, but most consider this to be only the local aspect and identify as romanian as nationality. very few consider themselves only moldavian. it's more of a double identity - they are moldavians and emphasize on that with romanians but they are romanians in front of foreigners and defend romanian ideas

I am from "Moldavian" Region of Romania and sincerely, we do not agree the idea to unite to the Basarabia (R.Moldova). The dialect spoken in Moldavian region of Romania is verry different with the dialect spoken in Basarabia (R.Moldova). If they consider "moldavian people" why we should unite with them ? If they don't want this, why should we ?

morski
06-14-2012, 08:53 AM
Kind of reminds me of two other countries slightly southwards...

Daos
06-17-2012, 01:34 PM
The reason is Romania has the region of Banat since WW-1, separated from Hungary at that time. I think around a million Hungarians lives in there and i believe if Romania will grow bigger with Moldova, then it should consider leaving Banat or at least allow them to be an autonomous region.

What part of your arse did you pull that number out of? In 2002 there were 56,380 Hungarians (5.6% of the total population) living in Banat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banat#Romanian_Banat_2). The numbers have most likely gone down since then.

Mary
06-17-2012, 01:44 PM
Moldovans are indeed Romanians but if they join to Romania, then it will be as big as Germany with a quite low population?

The reason is Romania has the region of Banat since WW-1, separated from Hungary at that time. I think around a million Hungarians lives in there and i believe if Romania will grow bigger with Moldova, then it should consider leaving Banat or at least allow them to be an autonomous region.

Also the autonomous region of Gagauzia in Moldova already declared that if Moldova joins Romania, then they might declare their independence.

It`s a complicated issue.

Banat has never been an issue (it was split between Rumania and Serbia after WW1). I think you mean Ardeal (Transylvania)?

Gagauzia can be independent all they want. We don't want them anyway, neither does anyone else.

Onur
06-17-2012, 02:01 PM
What part of your arse did you pull that number out of? In 2002 there were 56,380 Hungarians (5.6% of the total population) living in Banat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banat#Romanian_Banat_2). The numbers have most likely gone down since then.
I was talking about the Hungarians all over Romania, not only one specific region. I just checked from wikipedia, it looks like i was wrong and the number of Hungarians in Romania is over 1,3 million;


The Hungarian minority of Romania is the largest ethnic minority in Romania, consisting of 1,237,746 people and making up 6.5% of the total population, according to the 2011 census.[1]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungarians_in_Romania




Gagauzia can be independent all they want. We don't want them anyway, neither does anyone else.
In the autonomy agreement between Moldova and Gagauzia, it says that if Moldova unites with Romania, then Gagauzia will have a right to declare it`s own full independence.

They are Turkish christians, we surely protect their rights if such a thing happens.

Mary
06-17-2012, 02:26 PM
In the autonomy agreement between Moldova and Gagauzia, it says that if Moldova unites with Romania, then Gagauzia will have a right to declare it`s own full independence.

They are Turkish christians, we surely protect their rights if such a thing happens.

Gagauzians are considered one step above Gypsies. What makes you think we want them in the country?

Onur
06-17-2012, 02:32 PM
Gagauzians are considered one step above Gypsies. What makes you think we want them in the country?
Well, We consider Moldovans as such because they are either working as prostitutes or charwoman, sometimes both in Istanbul. So unfortunately they are even lower than gypsies here because Gypsies sells drugs but Moldovans sells themselves. Tough, this is another subject.

Anyway, i have nothing against Romanians, in fact i love them. Maybe Gagauzs prefers to be a minority inside greater Romania, who knows because what would another tiny country works for? pretty much nothing useful at all but i wanted to say that Turkey surely protects their rights, thats it.