The Great Turan. Do you support this idea?

[SKYNET]

http://www.rozanehmagazine.com/NoveDec05/Pic2-TuranMap.JPG
http://www.itusozluk.com/image/turan-haritasi_43263.jpg
http://www.gokgazete.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/1175.jpg
http://img1.blogcu.com/images/s/e/d/sedatreisvatansever/turan_haritasi.jpg
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/11440_101482729878203_7457857_n.jpg

It seems that it's idea just wants to destroy other languages and non-turk cultures

[Siginulfo]

No. Bad idea.

[Damião de Góis]

http://www.gokgazete.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/1175.jpg


Poland?

[Peyrol]

19th century turanisn included also Japan :lol:

[SKYNET]

Poland?



yep, look here http://www.gokgazete.com/turk-dunyasi-hendekte-bulusacak.html

I found it by accident in turkish website somewhere. Not nice to see a similar picture..

[Onur]

There is a common misconception about this turanism idea.

This is not invented by Turks. Turanism idea has been created by Hungarian nationalists in late 19th century and turanists ruled in hungary during 1940s. Also the current turanist Jobbik party in Hungary has around 20% support.

On the other hand, turanism always favored by a small minority in Turkey and they were never able to govern Turkey. Currently the only party which can be associated with turanism is MHP in Turkey. They have around 13% support here but the thing is, not everyone in MHP are turanists. They are minority even in the ranks of nationalist MHP party but the case is different with Hungarian Jobbik party. All teh Jobbik supporters are hardcore turanists.

So, if you have a problem with turanism, you should deal with Hungarians, not with Turks

[Hayalet]

I don't really know what "the Great Turan" is supposed to mean, but I support political and economical cooperation between independent Turkic countries, and improved cultural relations between Turkic peoples in all countries. There are two (incomplete) organizations for those purposes:


The Turkic Council is an international organization comprising Turkic countries. It was founded on 3 October 2009 in Nakhchivan. The General Secretariat is in Istanbul, Turkey. The member countries are Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, Kyrgyzstan and Turkey. The remaining two Turkic states, Turkmenistan and Uzbekistan are not currently official members of the council due to their neutral stance. However they are possible future members of the council.


The Joint Administration of Turkic Arts and Culture is an international cultural organization of countries with Turkic populations, speaking languages belonging to the Turkic language family.

General director is Duisen Kaseinov, former Minister of Culture of Kazakhstan. TÜRKSOY has its headquarters in Ankara, Turkey.

Members:

- Altai Republic
- Azerbaijan
- Bashkortostan
- Gagauzia
- Kazakhstan
- Khakassia
- Kyrgyzstan
- Northern Cyprus
- Sakha Republic
- Tatarstan
- Turkey
- Turkmenistan
- Tuva
- Uzbekistan

[Onur]

yep, look here http://www.gokgazete.com/turk-dunyasi-hendekte-bulusacak.html

I found it by accident in turkish website somewhere. Not nice to see a similar picture..
http://www.gokgazete.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/1175.jpg


This map is not related with turanism at all. At least you could try to google translate before posting here. The article mentions about the participation of folkloric dance teams to a dance festival in Turkey from Turkic states and the Tatars in Poland.

[SKYNET]

At least you could try to google translate before posting here.

lol sorry, I've forgot to use. Anyway, we don't support Turanism in Europe, including Caucasus and Balkans. I saw enough videos from youtube.com about "Great Turanism" and other Islamic brothership

[Midori]

Why not? It seems like a cool idea, just like pan-Slavism.

[Siginulfo]

Why not? It seems like a cool idea, just like pan-Slavism.

Pan-Slavism is not a good idea...

[SKYNET]

Why not? It seems like a cool idea, just like pan-Slavism.

:) okay, accepted. But without Europe, "Great Turan" only in Central Asia.

[Pecheneg]

Poland?
that is polish Tatar flag

[Midori]

Pan-Slavism is not a good idea...

It sounds good to me.

[Albion]

It sounds good to me.

Pan Slavicism and Turanism aren't compatible whilst Turanics are claiming 2/3 of Russia I would have thought.

[Onur]

:) okay, accepted. But without Europe, "Great Turan" only in Central Asia.
Hungary is not in Europe?

Btw Hungarians also organizes a great turan festival every year and i read that more than 200.000 people has attended to the festival in 2011. I found some pictures on the net;

http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/DSG_6812.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/DSG_6261.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/DSG_6801.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/002.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/DSG_6764.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/DSG_6985.jpg


It looks like they are performing shamanist, tengrist rituals too;
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/078.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/047.jpg
http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/mesa036.jpg

[Archduke]

Is Bulgaria part of this union, i ask because many hungarians and turks in youtube include Bulgaria in it.

[Pecheneg]

Is Bulgaria part of this union, i ask because many hungarians and turks in youtube include Bulgaria in it.
you mean "Turan Kurultaj"? yes bulgaria included (as far as i know)

NAPoezByqpg

2qoX-RygFns

countries
Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan, Turkey, Kyrgyzstan, Hungary, Turkmenistan, East Turkistan (Uighurs) (China), Bashkortostan, Tatarstan, Chuvashiya, Tuva, Karachay-Circassia, Kabardino-Balkar, Dagestan, the Chechen Republic and Yakutia (Russian Federation), Mongolia, Gagauzija (Moldova) and Bulgaria.

[Onur]

Is Bulgaria part of this union, i ask because many hungarians and turks in youtube include Bulgaria in it.
Well, technically yes because Bulgaria is created by Bulgars and Bulgars were Turks but today`s Bulgarians are slavic speaking people, so if you take part in this, then your slav brothers and masters in Moscow wouldnt like that at all.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Yes I do support pan-Turanism, but without single religious dominance, I especially don't want it see it under Islamism or something like this. It should be with freedom of religion, where Christian, Jewish and Muslim parts enjoy the union. It doesn't mean it should under one state but they all should keep close relations with each other as seperate states this way it would much free and strong, it could be an union as a international organization.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Is Bulgaria part of this union, i ask because many hungarians and turks in youtube include Bulgaria in it.

Well yes sometimes Bulgaria is considered as part of it because old Bulgars are regarded as Turkic people. The only reason why often Bulgaria isn't considered as part of it is because modern-day Bulgarians are Slavic-speaking people. But I myself would be in favour of having Bulgaria in it though.

[Archduke]

Well, technically yes because Bulgaria is created by Bulgars and Bulgars were Turks but today`s Bulgarians are slavic speaking people, so if you take part in this, then your slav brothers and masters in Moscow wouldnt like that at all.

Bulgars were turkic, not turks, i don't know when turks are going to differ this. Thanks God, i'm slav, i prefer to be managed by Russians, than the stinky Turks. :coffee:

[Pecheneg]

Bulgars were turkic, not turks, i don't know when turks are going to differ this. Thanks God, i'm slav, i prefer to be managed by Russians, than the stinky Turks. :coffee:

This "Turkic-Turkish" is faked-up anglo-saxon terms to divide Turkic peoples, there is only 1 term for it in Turkic languages and it is "Türk".
and yes ancient Bulgars were Turks.
the True name of the central asia is "Turkistan" > the land of the Turks.
not Turkicistan.

[Anatolian Eagle]

This "Turkic-Turkish" is faked-up anglo-saxon terms to divide Turkic peoples, there is only 1 term for it in Turkic languages and it is "Türk".
and yes ancient Bulgars were Turks, not stupid anglo-saxon term like "Turkic".

Well I think I disagree with above .
There's nothing wrong with the word "Turkic", it doesn't seperate anything, instead it unites!

[Hayalet]

Is Bulgaria part of this union, i ask because many hungarians and turks in youtube include Bulgaria in it.
No. I also don't quite see the logic behind including Hungary.

[Pecheneg]

Well I think I disagree with above .
There's nothing wrong with the word "Turkic", it doesn't seperate anything, instead it unites!
Most people don't even know the "Turkish" is sub-ethnicity of the Turkic.
some stupid people say "you are Turkish, not Turkic, Turkic are central asians bla bla bla"

[Onur]

Yes I do support pan-Turanism, but without single religious dominance, I especially don't want it see it under Islamism or something like this. It should be with freedom of religion, where Christian, Jewish and Muslim parts enjoy the union.
Already the semitic religions, islam and christianity was what divided turanian peoples. So, you cannot unite the people with the very thing which divided them before.

Semitic religions cannot be a part of turanism idea. If you claim to be a turanist, then you shouldn't be neither muslim nor christian.



No. I also don't quite see the logic behind including Hungary.
It was the hungarians who created this idea, so you cannot exclude them. Hungarians has been christianized but they didnt forget their true roots unlike bulgarians.

So, Hungarians didn't loose their original culture, it`s just they have been christianized just like we Turks has been islamized but Bulgarians has been fully assimilated after they became christians and totally lost their identity and adopted a new slavic one.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Most people don't even know the "Turkish" is sub-ethnicity of the Turkic.
some stupid people say "you are Turkish, not Turkic, Turkic are central asians bla bla bla"

Well that's their ignorance, you can tell. Everybody else knows Turkish people are subgroup of Turkic peoples, it's easy to tell by the language at least.
There are Turkic people almost everywhere across Eurasia not only in Central Asia, so yeah, that's just their ignorance at all basically.

[arcticwolf]

We are Turkic? :rolleyes: Well, TA never fails to "further" my education. You learn something new everyday. :D

[Kanuni]

As i am part Kuman myself i support great Turan.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Already the semitic religions, islam and christianity was what divided turanian peoples. So, you cannot unite the people with the very thing which divided them before.

Semitic religions cannot be a part of turanism idea. If you claim to be a turanist, then you shouldn't be neither muslim nor christian..

Well if we stay aware of our roots, learn to co-exist under with others who are part of the union and share your ancestry religion wouldn't matter, I personally wouldn't mind living near a Hungarian Christan church, nor I would see it as a threat to our unity. We cannot force people out of their faith, it would be impossible.


It was the hungarians who created this idea, so you cannot exclude them. Hungarians has been christianized but they didnt forget their true roots unlike bulgarians.

So, Hungarians didn't get fully assimilated but Bulgarians has been fully assimilated and totally lost their identity and adopted a new slavic one.

Agreed.

[Sultan Suleiman]

Pan-Slavism is not a good idea...

Explain why not?

[Hayalet]

It was the hungarians who created this idea, so you cannot exclude them.
Well, there's a reason I am not in favor of using the ambiguous word, Turan, too often. Let me just say it wouldn't make sense to include Hungary in the two international organizations in my previous post.

[StonyArabia]

Pan-Turkism is quite popular among the Balkars and Karachays in Southern Russia, and so is pro-Turkish sentiments.

[Onur]

Well if we stay aware of our roots, learn to co-exist under with others who are part of the union and share your ancestry religion wouldn't matter, I personally wouldn't mind living near a Hungarian Christan church, nor I would see it as a threat to our unity. We cannot force people out of their faith, it would be impossible.
Already, i don't believe turanism because you cannot easily unite something which has been divided 1000 years ago. This sounds like nothing but myth to me but ofc i support cooperation between Turkic states and hungarians.

Hungarians are already the only state in Europe who support Turks if we don't count the islamic ones like Bosnia, Albania. I believe we should also fully support hungary without thinking any benefit in return. I mean, they already have small population, for example rather than importing stuff from hostile states like France, i prefer to use hungarian products. They have less than 10 million population. So even if we buy few stuff from them, it would quite considerably contribute their economy.


Btw i just saw some videos on youtube. These people are really into this turanism issue;
agQGTJtkdaY

After watching this, Altay`s comment becomes more absurd because no one does anything about turanism in turkey while Hungarians are organizing these festivals. I think if there is someone who needs to be excluded from turanist states, it`s the turkey :)



Pan-Turkism is quite popular among the Balkars and Karachays in Southern Russia, and so is pro-Turkish sentiments.
This shouldn't surprise anybody because these people has been oppressed a lot during the communism era, so they regard pan-turkism as a solution for their suffering. Everyone suffered under communism, probably the Tatars and Circassians at most.

[SKYNET]

In Europe - Great Turan or European Union. The third is not given ;)

[SKYNET]

This shouldn't surprise anybody because these people has been oppressed a lot during the communism era, so they regard pan-turkism as a solution for their suffering. Everyone suffered under communism, probably the Tatars and Circassians at most.

there isn't any difference between pan-turkism and communism :rolleyes2:

[Aces High]

I was just going to say something about Ronnie Biggs and the Great train Robbery until i read the thread title again.

Carry on.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Already, i don't believe turanism because you cannot easily unite something which has been divided 1000 years ago. This sounds like nothing but myth to me but ofc i support cooperation between Turkic states and hungarians.

Hungarians are already the only state in Europe who support Turks if we don't count the islamic ones like Bosnia, Albania. I believe we should also fully support hungary without thinking any benefit in return. I mean, they already have small population, for example rather than importing stuff from hostile states like France, i prefer to use hungarian products. They have less than 10 million population. So even if we buy few stuff from them, it would quite considerably contribute their economy.


Btw i just saw some videos on youtube. These people are really into this turanism issue;
agQGTJtkdaY

After watching this, Altay`s comment becomes more absurd because no one does anything about turanism in turkey while Hungarians are organizing these festivals. I think if there is someone who needs to be excluded from turanist states, it`s the turkey :)



This shouldn't surprise anybody because these people has been oppressed a lot during the communism era, so they regard pan-turkism as a solution for their suffering. Everyone suffered under communism, probably the Tatars and Circassians at most.

I already said uniting these countries are kinda impossible, would be awesome but isn't possible near future, they're obviously too separted geographically. That's why I suggested as what you said, i.e. closer ties between those nations but I think there could be at least a cultural organization uniting them all. And yeah I agree with supporting Hungary 100%, like using Hungarian stuff and products instead of French stuff, importing them to Turkey, and improve economical ties with them which would benefit us both.

[Onur]

there isn't any difference between pan-turkism and communism :rolleyes2:
Where are you from specifically, your ancestry? westernboy the caucasian?



I was just going to say something about Ronnie Biggs and the Great train Robbery until i read the thread title again.

Carry on.
Hmm, i see how you managed to post 4,666 messages in the forum. Keep up the good work, high five :rolleyes:

[SKYNET]

bullshit

[Comte Arnau]

A single country? Absurd. A sort of Union, to face Europe, Russia, Middle East, South Asia and China? Ok. But it should be limited to real Turkic-speaking nations.

[Hayalet]

After watching this, Altay`s comment becomes more absurd because no one does anything about turanism in turkey while Hungarians are organizing these festivals. I think if there is someone who needs to be excluded from turanist states, it`s the turkey :)
Fun fact:

"Turkic states" in Google = 1,010,000 results

"Turanist states" in Google = 2 results, both of them referring to the post you have just made :)

[Sultan Suleiman]

In Europe - Great Turan or European Union. The third is not given ;)

Explain to me how is this even possible :lol:

[Sultan Suleiman]

Fun fact:

"Turanist states" in Google = 2 results, both of them referring to the post you have just made :)

I've got 36K results for Turanist states :D

[Hayalet]

I've got 36K results for Turanist states :D
Don't omit the quotation marks. :thumb001:

[Anatolian Eagle]

Fun fact:

"Turkic states" in Google = 1,010,000 results

"Turanist states" in Google = 2 results, both of them referring to the post you have just made :)

"Turanian states" gets much more results :)

[Hayalet]

"Turanian states" gets much more results :)
I believe you might be getting carried away from the point there.

Anyway, I must admit the festival in Hungary seems pretty impressive, but ultimately it's really counterproductive to make these movements seem like an esoteric quasi role play cult.

[Dacul]

Turks are not turanids,they are caucasians mostly.
Look on autosomal DNA tests.
Turks does not even have 10% autosomal admixture turanid.

[Kanuni]

Turks are not turanids,they are caucasians mostly.
Look on autosomal DNA tests.
Turks does not even have 10% autosomal admixture turanid.

You are anti-Turk/Turk hater from now one.

[Vanguard]

There is a significant part of Hungarian nationalists who adopt Turanist views over our history, maybe they could be in equal numbers to White Nationalists/NS/Hungarists, but none of these two groups are the largest in the nationalist community. The biggest group are those who speak of Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity, the traditionalists. My personal views are also the closest to this last one. The answer for the popularity of Turanist views is that many hungarians feel betrayed by the west because they cut our country in pieces, so they look for allies in the east.

[SKYNET]

Turks are not turanids,they are caucasians mostly.

what is reason exactly? Answer one: the mixing with a local tribes

[Dacul]

There is a significant part of Hungarian nationalists who adopt Turanist views over our history, maybe they could be in equal numbers to White Nationalists/NS/Hungarists, but none of these two groups are the largest in the nationalist community. The biggest group are those who speak of Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity, the traditionalists. My personal views are also the closest to this last one. The answer for the popularity of Turanist views is that many hungarians feel betrayed by the west because they cut our country in pieces, so they look for allies in the east.

Dude from where did you made hungarians turanids?
You are serious?
There is almost no turanid admixture in Hungary on autosomal DNA.
The language is not turanid either,since is fino-ugrian.
The population is just central europeans,it does not have nothing to do with turanids.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Dude from where did you made hungarians turanids?
You are serious?
There is almost no turanid admixture in Hungary on autosomal DNA.
The language is not turanid either,since is fino-ugrian.
The population is just central europeans,it does not have nothing to do with turanids.

Turanid covers both Uralic and Altaic.

[cmd_]

I have no problem with "Great Turan" as long as it's not imperialistic. A Turan Union would be the same term as European Union basically. But the reason why I cannot get along with Turanism is because I don't feel connected to people outside of my race. The union should rather be based on race. Similiar to the 'people's community' ("Volksgemeinschaft"), but that doesn't mean you cannot cooperate with other people regardless of race.


There is a significant part of Hungarian nationalists who adopt Turanist views over our history, maybe they could be in equal numbers to White Nationalists/NS/Hungarists, but none of these two groups are the largest in the nationalist community. The biggest group are those who speak of Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity, the traditionalists. My personal views are also the closest to this last one. The answer for the popularity of Turanist views is that many hungarians feel betrayed by the west because they cut our country in pieces, so they look for allies in the east.True. Trianon is really a sad part. I think the leaders of Jobbik feels the same as you mentioned above.

[Pecheneg]

Turks are not turanids,they are caucasians mostly.
Look on autosomal DNA tests.
Turks does not even have 10% autosomal admixture turanid.
what is turanid admixture idiot? Hungarians are only 0,9% mongoloid so what?
and most Turkic nations are also heavily caucasoids, you are simply sabotaging the thread.

i've posted these for billion times, but here again;
Turkish-Karachay-Balkar-Kumyk-Azeri > ~7% mongoloid
Turkmens > ~15% mongoloid

it's not about race at all, it's a cooperation between Turkic-speaking nations.

[Anatolian Eagle]

I have no problem with "Great Turan" as long as it's not imperialistic. A Turan Union would be the same term as European Union basically. But the reason why I cannot get along with Turanism is because I don't feel connected to people outside of my race. The union should rather be based on race. Similiar to the 'people's community' ("Volksgemeinschaft"), but that doesn't mean you cannot cooperate with other people regardless of race.

Turanism isn't imperialistic, there are many of them whom already oppressed or under another rule, though there are of course those who live in peace and keeping good relations with other Turanian countries aswell as their neighbours (i.e: Kazakhstan).


True. Trianon is really a sad part. I think the leaders of Jobbik feels the same as you mentioned above.

Yep, it was terrible injustice done to Hungarians forcing many Hungarians find themselves outside of their national homeland. It was as terrible as Sèvres in my opinion.

[Onur]

There is a significant part of Hungarian nationalists who adopt Turanist views over our history, maybe they could be in equal numbers to White Nationalists/NS/Hungarists, but none of these two groups are the largest in the nationalist community. The biggest group are those who speak of Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity, the traditionalists. My personal views are also the closest to this last one.
Can you explain to me what is the difference between Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity and Turanists?

You know the word Turan means central Asia/Eurasia and Scythians-Huns-Magyars were from the land called as Turan again. So how come they become different? To me, it`s the same thing. Also you cannot monopolize Huns for yourself. Turks were part of the Huns too and most likely the biggest group in it and Attila was speaking Turkic too.



But the reason why I cannot get along with Turanism is because I don't feel connected to people outside of my race. The union should rather be based on race. Similiar to the 'people's community' ("Volksgemeinschaft")
This is racism, an union based on race. Also this is something impossible in 21st century because none of us are isolated tribes. So, even the Australians Aborigines or Amazon tribes cannot form an union based on race today.

A true union would be based on cultural unity but not with race. Already, even the early medieval turanian union was based on culture again, not race. As you know, Huns were not consisted of single tribe.



Yep, it was terrible injustice done to Hungarians forcing many Hungarians find themselves outside of their national homeland. It was as terrible as Sèvres in my opinion.
Yes, we were able to tore Sevres treaty apart but Hungarians couldnt and still suffering today. They forced half of the Hungarian people to live as minorities in different countries. Especially Serbians did a lot of crimes towards them during Yugoslavia era by killing them and forcing many Hungarians to exile out from the Banat region, the place they call as voyvodina today.

[Dacul]

Well hungarian is not turkish language,is fino-ugrian.
Turkish languages are altaians.
Hungarians are central european nation towards nordic nations,I highly doubt most hungarians would want a "turanic alliance".

Here is the map with fino-ugrian languages:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8b/Fenno-Ugrian_people.png

And here is the map of turkic languages,which are from altaian languages:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkic_languages
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0a/Map-TurkicLanguages.png

[Anatolian Eagle]

Well hungarian is not turkish language,is fino-ugrian.
Turkish languages are altaians.
Hungarians are central european nation towards nordic nations,I highly doubt most hungarians would want a "turanic alliance".

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8b/Fenno-Ugrian_people.png

And here is the map of turkic languages,which are from altaian languages:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkic_languages
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/0a/Map-TurkicLanguages.png

You don't even know difference between Turkic and Turkish it seems, why would I take you serious?
Nobody here said Hungarian is a Turkish language, nor Turkic, lol that makes no sense. Though they're releated but they're not same.
Uralics, which cover Fino-Ugrians are considered part of Turanid family. Fino-Ugrians are of course not Altaians, but relatives.

[Sultan Suleiman]

There is a significant part of Hungarian nationalists who adopt Turanist views over our history, maybe they could be in equal numbers to White Nationalists/NS/Hungarists, but none of these two groups are the largest in the nationalist community. The biggest group are those who speak of Scythian-Hun-Magyar continuity, the traditionalists. My personal views are also the closest to this last one. The answer for the popularity of Turanist views is that many hungarians feel betrayed by the west because they cut our country in pieces, so they look for allies in the east.

Confused broken Slavs are confused :D















...and broken :lol:

[Onur]

Confused broken Slavs are confused :D

...and broken :lol:
So, you wanna say "Hungary nije Huns ama je slavs?" :)

I think i am gonna learn slavic from the Balkan hour in the chatbox :D

but notice the Turkish "ama" in there :)

[bimo]

Bulgars were turkic, not turks, i don't know when turks are going to differ this. Thanks God, i'm slav, i prefer to be managed by Russians, than the stinky Turks. :coffee:

the only sure thing is that modern bulgarians are a slavo-thracian mix , proto bulgarian are a mistery , iranic? turkic? or just local people from balkan and many propaganda around them?
why can't be the opposite , they did not come from asia but a group of people from the balkan went to Russia and then to the asia
modern bulgarian aren't close at all to turkic nations or iranians , they are balkanian and south slavic people , i don't see that bulgarian look like khazakhs or afghan what the f**k are these BS

[Onur]

modern bulgarian aren't close at all to turkic nations or iranians , they are balkanian and south slavic people , i don't see that bulgarian look like khazakhs or afghan what the f**k are these BS
It was 1000 years ago. If i drop you in the middle of Ethiopia and return 1000 years later from now on, you can be sure that your descendants wont look or act like you either.

[Sultan Suleiman]

So, you wanna say "Hungary nije Huns ama je slavs?" :)

I think i am gonna learn slavic from the Balkan hour in the chatbox :D

but notice the Turkish "ama" in there :)


Well if they were Huns they would still be slant-eyed piss skins :D

No my friend those are Slavs who need to be recivilized :thumb001:

[cmd_]

Turanism isn't imperialistic, there are many of them whom already oppressed or under another rule, though there are of course those who live in peace and keeping good relations with other Turanian countries aswell as their neighbours (i.e: Kazakhstan).


Yep, it was terrible injustice done to Hungarians forcing many Hungarians find themselves outside of their national homeland. It was as terrible as Sèvres in my opinion.I never said it was imperialistic but as long as it doesn't go so far that it becomes imperialistic, then I'm okay with it.

Yes. It's really sad. I've seen how the Hungarians live in poor condition and how they are treated, outside of the Hungarian borders. Slovaks for example are brutally oppressing and even killing has occurred.


This is racism, an union based on race. Also this is something impossible in 21st century because none of us are isolated tribes. So, even the Australians Aborigines or Amazon tribes cannot form an union based on race today.

A true union would be based on cultural unity but not with race. Already, even the early medieval turanian union was based on culture again, not race. As you know, Huns were not consisted of single tribe.I wouldn't say it's racism but rather making a community feel more connected with people who look, talk and act the same. And I don't think you quite understand what racism really means. I respect other races and their right to exist as long as it does not come in danger to others. You can still cooperate with others but you don't need to mix in order to show respect.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism
There is quite a good documentary about 'racism' but I cannot find it right now. I'll maybe post it later if I can find it.

Finding "racially" pure people is quite hard nowadays, yes, but Anatolian Turks are predominant Caucasoids and should always remain so. The Mongoloid admixture is declining for each generation coming. Keep in mind that NS Germany was not so pure if you are to look at the ethnicities that lived in Germany under that time. I am now comparing these people with the Aborigines.

[Archduke]

So, you wanna say "Hungary nije Huns ama je slavs?" :)

I think i am gonna learn slavic from the Balkan hour in the chatbox :D

but notice the Turkish "ama" in there :)

Cool, you will learn the language of your ancestors.

[Midori]

Confused broken Slavs are confused :D















...and broken :lol:

I agree. Hungarians are just Magyar speaking Slavs with some Germanic influence. LOL at people who really believe they are Turanic :lol:

[Anatolian Eagle]

the only sure thing is that modern bulgarians are a slavo-thracian mix , proto bulgarian are a mistery , iranic? turkic? or just local people from balkan and many propaganda around them?
why can't be the opposite , they did not come from asia but a group of people from the balkan went to Russia and then to the asia
modern bulgarian aren't close at all to turkic nations or iranians , they are balkanian and south slavic people , i don't see that bulgarian look like khazakhs or afghan what the f**k are these BS

We don't physically look Central Asian either, neither are the Gagauzs, Azeris, whom are Turkic.

Modern Bulgarians are Slavicized people, with Slavic language, so it's normal they don't share anything Turkic anymore, but ancient Bulgars were Turkic people who appeared in Central Asia and reached all the way to Volga and then Balkans.

The Chuvash people, whom are Turkic-speakers of Volga, are said to be descended from Bulgars who stayed around Volga and they speak a language belonging to Oghuric group of Turkic languages.

[Vanguard]

Confused broken Slavs are confused :D















...and broken :lol:

Comming from a guy whose people changed ethnicity 5 times in the last 100 years:clap:

[Onur]

Cool, you will learn the language of your ancestors.
How about you start to learn the language of your true ancestors and return to your roots? You already know some words like "AMA", i am sure you can learn the rest :D

[Vanguard]

Well if they were Huns they would still be slant-eyed piss skins :D

No my friend those are Slavs who need to be recivilized :thumb001:

Most Bosniaks I saw were piss-skinned(dinarid/mediterand).Does that mean you aren't slavs?

[Sultan Suleiman]

Comming from a guy whose people changed ethnicity 5 times in the last 100 years:clap:

And who on SF told you that my poor little broken Slav :D

[Hess]

I like Jobbik, but they should renounce Turanism and turn back to Europe.

[Sultan Suleiman]

Most Bosniaks I saw were piss-skinned(dinarid/mediterand).Does that mean you aren't slavs?

Here you go little Slavling.

http://racialreality.110mb.com/racesofman_files/race_mongoloid.jpg

A real Hun :)

[Vanguard]

And who on SF told you that my poor little broken Slav :D

I don't post on SF.First you were Turks,than Yugoslavs,than Muslim Croats,than just "Muslims" as ethnicity and finally Bosniaks.Although nobody ever wrote himself as "Bosniak" on any population census so far.

[Pecheneg]

Here you go little Slavling.

http://racialreality.110mb.com/racesofman_files/race_mongoloid.jpg

A real Hun :)
You can't say that all Hungarians are Magyaricized Slavs or Germans.
Even there were many Kuman(Turkic) and Pecheneg(Turkic) tribes in Hungary, but there is still only 0,9% asian admixture among Hungarians.
So, it's basically the ancient Magyars were predominant caucasoids with some asian admixture. Hungarians have significant Magyar ancestry as well as Kuman.

ps: Huns were not an ethnicity, they were confederation of Turkic, Uralic and even some Germanic tribes.

[Archduke]

How about you start to learn the language of your true ancestors and return to your roots? You already know some words like "AMA", i am sure you can learn the rest :D

You said today Bulgarians are slavs and have nothing to do with Turkic Bulgars. :P

Look this:

There are more than million Muslims among the Bulgarians. But unlike most people think, they haven't come from Asia, They are descendents of the Bulgarians who were turned from Christianity to Islam during the Ottoman conquest of Bulgaria. They are the children of this country, this race and this line(Bulgarian|. And a part of them doesn't speak no other language except Bulgarian. - Midhat Pasha, 1878

[Xenomorph]

Great cultural and economic connections between Turkic peoples would be good, but I'm very leery at the prospect of a political union, especially over an area of that magnitude.

[SKYNET]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSb6BNRly5Q&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_Dzq_mKhok&feature=related



LOL

[Pecheneg]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSb6BNRly5Q&feature=related





LOL
this is simply a negligible video and probably uploaded by an adolescent nationalist boy. There are billions of videos, that shows whole Turkey as divided between armenia, greece, kurdistan etc... but i don't give a shit.

[Onur]

You can't say that all Hungarians are Magyaricized Slavs or Germans.
Even there were many Kuman(Turkic) and Pecheneg(Turkic) tribes in Hungary, but there is still only 0,9% asian admixture among Hungarians.
So, it's basically the ancient Magyars were predominant caucasoids with some asian admixture. Hungarians have significant Magyar ancestry as well as Kuman.

Thats true and i can say that when Kumans migrated to Hungary in 13th century, they were no less than 15-20% of total population and they continued to speak Turkic `till 17th century. The existence of Pechenegs in Hungary is also the truth. Afaik, there are many people with the name Besenyö in there, meaning Pecheneg in magyar tongue.

[Dacul]

Hungary-central european country,with central european lifestyle and so on.
Finland-northern european country,with northern european lifestyle and so on.
Turkey - south-eastern european country,no idea about lifestyle and others but I think is close to caucasians.
Other nations included in "greater Turan" -very different lifestyles from those mentioned above,non-europeans.
So greater Turan is not possible.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

I was surprised when i met some really hard core Korean Turanists on some web forums as well as you tube..and one Ainu Japanese too..

[SKYNET]

Japanese and Korean lol have you not had a meeting with an american indians? xD

[Pecheneg]

Japanese and Korean lol have you not had a meeting with an american indians? xD
believe or not, there are also many Turanist Amerindians.

[Sultan Suleiman]

I don't post on SF.First you were Turks,than Yugoslavs,than Muslim Croats,than just "Muslims" as ethnicity and finally Bosniaks.Although nobody ever wrote himself as "Bosniak" on any population census so far.

Check the Ottoman census from early 16th century Slavling :)

[SKYNET]

believe or not, there are also many Turanist Amerindians.

nooooooo, are you seriously? :eek::eek: it is joke man

[Supreme American]

It seems that it's idea just wants to destroy other languages and non-turk cultures

And whites in that space would be vastly outnumbered with little to no territorial sovereignty.

Plus the Turkish Muslim presence would probably revert everything to the 7th century.

[Kanuni]

Hungaryans are in majority Central European and cluster with neighboring countries.Everyone who refuses this is dumb and ignorant.

[Pecheneg]

people, who have an obsession with genetics of Ural-Altai nations of west are simply losers. Their nations were passive weaklings, that's why they are trying to impose their weaknesses on other nations via genetic shits.
cheering themselves up with consolations like "Hungarians are forcibly Magyaricized native people bla bla bla.."
But many chroniclers, archival datas, historians very well documented the huge populations of new-arriving nomads. These newcomers intermarried with locals and created new nations.

and people, who are searching for isolated pure nations on earth are simply idiots.

Researchers found that even Xiong-nu (asian Huns) of bc were mixed people and there were j2, R1a carrier Hunnic skeletons.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

nooooooo, are you seriously? :eek::eek: it is joke man

Onedia tribe of Amerindians even joined to Turks parade in Newyork this year !!!
I was surprised too..

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/738/oneida3b.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/208/oneida3b.jpg/)

Azerbaycan Kırgız Kırım Uygur Türkmen and Balkan Türks were all together.

[Vasconcelos]

http://files.sharenator.com/what_the_fuck_is_this_shit_Meme_base_6-s259x194-147643-535.jpg

[Hayalet]

Onedia tribe of Amerindians even joined to Turks parade in Newyork this year !!!
I was surprised too..

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/738/oneida3b.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/208/oneida3b.jpg/)
What could American Indians have anything to do with Turks if they passed through the Bering strait at least some 10,000 years ago? These crackpot theories aren't doing anyone any good.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

What could American Indians have anything to do with Turks if they passed through the Bering strait at least some 10,000 years ago? These crackpot theories aren't doing anyone any good.

I don't know ..We must ask Oneida people..if they feel like that ,should we reject?
i liked the idea of uniting people like in very old days ,regardless of religion or etnicity ,matches with nomadic culture ,our ways..we dont need genetic affinity..Europeans do..

and i love Amerindians :thumb001:
may be that's why ^_^ i liked the idea ,crackpot or not

[Incal]

:) okay, accepted. But without Europe, "Great Turan" only in Central Asia.

Agreed. As long as it doesn't affect the western world everything's cool.

[SKYNET]

Onedia tribe of Amerindians even joined to Turks parade in Newyork this year !!!
I was surprised too..

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/738/oneida3b.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/208/oneida3b.jpg/)

Azerbaycan Kırgız Kırım Uygur Türkmen and Balkan Türks were all together.


:eek: sources please
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

:eek: sources please
:laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:


Here's the link:)
http://kazakhworld.com/?p=109

you can search too ,for further info..it's everywhere

[SKYNET]

Here's the link:)
http://kazakhworld.com/?p=109

you can search too ,for further info..it's everywhere

okay, but that's not enough. I need a true source about "Turk-American indians kinship" :)

[Onur]

I need a true source about "Turk-American indians kinship" :)
There is no such a thing. It`s just a romantic fantasy on their side and Turks have a sympathy for them because of their shamanic, animist, naturalist ways. Thats it.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

But still we have same teeth ..with amerindians ..shovel shaped teeth..does it count ? :icon_ask:

^I know i m forcing my luck a bit hard ^

[east]

Well, technically yes because Bulgaria is created by Bulgars and Bulgars were Turks but today`s Bulgarians are slavic speaking people, so if you take part in this, then your slav brothers and masters in Moscow wouldnt like that at all.

Here I am not agree with you , Onur. Last researches shows that Bulgarians are not Turkic tribe, neither ethnic, nor by DNA.
I can not understand why many people trying to prove that Bulgarians has Turkic origin. May be I must to remind that this is Soviet doctrine for Bulgarian history. This doctrine was imposed by KPSS (Communist party of Soviet Union). 50 years suggests that Bulgarians are Tatar, with Turkic origin and other bullshits. Remember Volga Bulgaria. Stalin has killed many million Volga Bulgarians, declaring them "Tatars".

[Gospodine]

Here I am not agree with you , Onur. Last researches shows that Bulgarians are not Turkic tribe, neither ethnic, nor by DNA.

Bulgarians are a predominantly Paleo-Balkanic people like the other South Slavic groups, they have just inherited their ethnonym from a nomadic, steppe culture that migrated from the beyond the Black Sea that was either Turkic or Iranic in origin.

There is no significant Central Asian admixture in Bulgarians, even in Bulgarian Turks.

The same theory likely applies to Serbs and Croats as the names "Srbi" and "Hrvati" are also non-Slavic and likely stem from a ruling class of Iranic tribes that migrated from the Black Sea/Caucasus region and mingled with migrating Slavic tribes southward beyond the Carpathians.

The elite dominance model is essentially where a group of numerically-inferior, but technology/culturally-superior culture imposes elements of their language, customs, religion and lifestyle onto a numerically-superior group of nomadic/semi-nomadic, sedentary people. Genetic admixture between the two groups is slight to negligible.

It doesn't make any of the above mentioned ethnic groups "Iranic" or "Turkic", it's just simply a vestigial remnant of cultural contact with Iranic or Turkic tribes.

It's a model that's been repeated throughout history time and time again. Look at England, Persia, Turkey, the Roman Empire, Uralic speaking peoples, etc.

[Sultan Suleiman]

Bulgarians are a predominantly Paleo-Balkanic people like the other South Slavic groups, they have just inherited their ethnonym from a nomadic, steppe culture that migrated from the beyond the Black Sea that was either Turkic or Iranic in origin.

There is no significant Central Asian admixture in Bulgarians, even in Bulgarian Turks.

The same theory like applies to Serbs and Croats as the names "Srbi" and "Hrvati" are also non-Slavic and likely stem from a ruling class of Iranic tribes that migrated from the Black Sea/Caucasus region and mingled with migrating Slavic tribes southward beyond the Carpathians.

The elite dominance model is essentially where a group of numerically-inferior, but technology/culturally-superior culture imposes elements of their language, customs, religion and lifestyle onto a numerically-superior group of nomadic/semi-nomadic, sedentary people. Genetic admixture between the two groups is slight to negligible.

It's a model that's been repeated throughout history time and time again. Look at England, Persia, Turkey, the Roman Empire, Uralic speaking peoples, etc.

You are too brainy for your own good... :(

[morski]

But still we have same teeth ..with amerindians ..shovel shaped teeth..does it count ? :icon_ask:

^I know i m forcing my luck a bit hard ^

:confused:

[Gospodine]

You are too brainy for your own good... :(

U mozak Kinezac, Bosanac u dusi ;)

[Onur]

Here I am not agree with you , Onur. Last researches shows that Bulgarians are not Turkic tribe, neither ethnic, nor by DNA.
I can not understand why many people trying to prove that Bulgarians has Turkic origin. May be I must to remind that this is Soviet doctrine for Bulgarian history. This doctrine was imposed by KPSS (Communist party of Soviet Union). 50 years suggests that Bulgarians are Tatar, with Turkic origin and other bullshits. Remember Volga Bulgaria. Stalin has killed many million Volga Bulgarians, declaring them "Tatars".
No one is trying to prove that Bulgars were Turkic because that would be an unnecessary motive as much as like trying to prove Germanic origin of English people.

But you guys are trying to spread some mythical Iranian ancestry from Afghan mountains since 1990s by going against the 1000 year old facts about Turkic Bulgars.

This doctrine has nothing to do with your communist era. This is your imagination. Take a look at what Romans, Byzantines, Arabs wrote in their chronicles in 9-10th century. They were writing the same like Bulgars speaks Turkic and they are Turks. Read what Cyril&Methodious wrote about the Bulgars in Balkans. They baptized your people and said that Bulgars are Huns, akin to Turkic Khazars.

It`s the new post-commie Bulgaria who tries to impose Afghan mountains Iranian myth by going against the facts. Turkic history for the Bulgars was always here, it didn't get invented by your soviet party. Whats getting invented here is your Iranian theory.

[east]

No one is trying to prove that Bulgars were Turkic because that would be an unnecessary motive as much as like trying to prove Germanic origin of English people.

But you guys are trying to spread some mythical Iranian ancestry from Afghan mountains since 1990s by going against the 1000 year old facts about Turkic Bulgars.

This doctrine has nothing to do with your communist era. This is your imagination. Take a look at what Romans, Byzantines, Arabs wrote in their chronicles in 9-10th century. They were writing the same like Bulgars speaks Turkic and they are Turks. Read what Cyril&Methodious wrote about the Bulgars in Balkans. They baptized your people and said that Bulgars are Huns, akin to Turkic Khazars.

It`s the new post-commie Bulgaria who tries to impose Afghan mountains Iranian myth by going against the facts. Turkic history for the Bulgars was always here, it didn't get invented by your soviet party. Whats getting invented here is your Iranian theory.

Turkic Bulgars is not historical accurate.

Mentioned doctrine really exist because Russians always bring down Bulgarians. I turn back in 1981 when Bulgaria celebrates its 1300 years anniversary. KPSS put under ban celebrations. I have not explanation why. Might be Russia is many more young state and they jealous of it. The Russian elephant is bigger than Bulgarian.:)

If you have some proves what language have used Bulgarians who came on Balkan Peninsula, you will be the biggest discover in Bulgarian historical science, May be you don't know, but we have not any evidence what language have used Balkan Bulgarians before accept Slavic Bulgarian.

DNA distribution in Bulgaria you read here: http://www.proceedings.bas.bg/PDF0/9_03-16b.pdf

[Albion]

But still we have same teeth ..with amerindians ..shovel shaped teeth..does it count ? :icon_ask:

^I know i m forcing my luck a bit hard ^

Isn't that a Mongoloid trait? :icon_ask:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3473/3747590190_91df1facef.jpg

Now all you need is the Mongol spot and then you're a certified Asian. ;)

[Onur]

If you have some proves what language have used Bulgarians who came on Balkan Peninsula, you will be the biggest discover in Bulgarian historical science, May be you don't know, but we have not any evidence what language have used Balkan Bulgarians before accept Slavic Bulgarian.
Early Bulgars was speaking Turkic and writing with Turkic runic script before they have been assimilated with the conversion to christianity and switching to slavic tongue laters. Read the autobiography of Cyril&Methodious written in 870 AD, the brothers proudly mentions about how they managed to assimilate and tame the warlike Hunnic/Turkic Bulgars in favor of eastern Roman domination in Balkans.

This is a 100% fact. Already, the another clue is your distant cousins in Volga Bulgaria. It`s attested by the several travelers that they were speaking Turkic in 9th century. If Bulgars who gone to Balkans from Volga would speak Iranian tongue then the remaining Bulgars of Volga would speak that Iranian language in 9th century but they weren't and they still speak their original Turkic tongue today unlike the ones in Balkans.

Read the articles of Bulgarian scholars about the language of early Bulgars in Balkans in this thread;
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44335

[morski]

Early Bulgars was speaking Turkic and writing with Turkic runic script before they have been assimilated with the conversion to christianity and switching to slavic tongue laters. Read the autobiography of Cyril&Methodious written in 870 AD, the brothers proudly mentions about how they managed to assimilate and tame the warlike Hunnic/Turkic Bulgars in favor of eastern Roman domination in Balkans.

This is a 100% fact. Already, the another clue is your distant cousins in Volga Bulgaria. It`s attested by the several travelers that they were speaking Turkic in 9th century. If Bulgars who gone to Balkans from Volga would speak Iranian tongue then the remaining Bulgars of Volga would speak that Iranian language in 9th century but they weren't and they still speak their original Turkic tongue today unlike the ones in Balkans.

Read the articles of Bulgarian scholars about the language of early Bulgars in Balkans in this thread;
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44335

That part is way off. First of all Volga Bulgars settled the lands they live in now after the colapse of Old Great Bulgaria in the steppes north of the Black Sea. That's the same territories from which Danube Bulgars came to the Balkans. That means that Danube Bulgars did not come to the Balkans from Volga-Kama Bulgaria.

Second. Volga Bulgars speak a kipchak dialect (which was imposed on them by their Tatar conquerors), while the original Bulgars (if we believe the conventional theories about them) spoke a totally different variety of Turkic.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

Isn't that a Mongoloid trait? :icon_ask:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3473/3747590190_91df1facef.jpg

Now all you need is the Mongol spot and then you're a certified Asian. ;)

lol..
These birthmarks vanish after a few years usually..I had pink ,not blue..
Amerindians have same shaped teeth..i dont know its a scientific proof or not..that's why i say i m forcing my luck..

..can't help..i freaking love Asia,not related with Turanism....it's my personal obsession.

[archangel]

:)well as a Türk ı support a pan Türkist view,about Turanism ıts found by Hungarians and ı personally love it us and Hungarians seperated around 1000 years ago in that time we were a nation together.ı would like to attend one of those Hajra Turan meetings

[Vesuvian Sky]

Only place that takes this concept seriously is Hunmagyar.org and some other rather estoric personalities on the net.

Otherwise, its another pan-cultural mismatch-modge podge distaster idealogy.

[Anatolian Eagle]

Only place that takes this concept seriously is Hunmagyar.org and some other rather estoric personalities on the net.

Otherwise, its another pan-cultural mismatch-modge podge distaster idealogy.

People participating in Kurultaj held in Hungary aren't just a bunch of folks popped up from a monitor for sure. And Jobbik is hundred times more real than keyboard warrior irredentists you see in YouTube.

[Sagjaz]

I like the idea. The third map looks pretty nice – seems to include most Turkic peoples and not too many non-Turkic peoples. I think the huge Russian and Chinese minorities that this Turan would include wouldn’t be satisfied though and could cause some trouble.

[Vesuvian Sky]

People participating in Kurultaj held in Hungary aren't just a bunch of folks popped up from a monitor for sure. And Jobbik is hundred times more real than keyboard warrior irredentists you see in YouTube.

That may be but I'm sure the net plays a huge role in propagating some of these ideas, kinda like Pan-Aryanism which is another pipe dream.

But quite a few of these nations are so different from one another and diverged so much from a Proto-Altaic-Uralic source that I have a trouble seeing how such an idea will work in theory unless everyone reverts back to Tengrism.

I see a few nations on the map that this probably ain't gonna go over so well with.

[archangel]

:)ı watched some of these kurultaj(kurultay in Türkish lol) and ıt looks cool as hell like ride horse all these bows.I visited slovakia last year but didnt have a change to visit Hungaria but in the future i will! Hajra Turan:)

[finþaų]

TURAN POWER!

[Kemalisté]

No. This is just an utopic dream, nothing else. Ataturk heavily criticized this idea and hated its supporters, say Enver, Talad and Cemal Pashas, who dragged Turkey into the world war and sacrificed 90.000 people on the Caucasian territories just for that utopic aim. Enver Pasha tragically died in Caucasia after running into a heavily armed soldier with a knife.

Turanism had no place in the foundation principles of the Turkish Republic, and will never have.

[Sultan Suleiman]

Isn't Turan Project pan-Iranian dream of reclaiming their lost territories from the Mongolian buggers to the north?

[Onur]

People participating in Kurultaj held in Hungary aren't just a bunch of folks popped up from a monitor for sure.
As far as i read from the official website of kurultaj, more than 150.000 people attends to that festival for the last 3 years. It`s one of the biggest festivals in Europe.

I was shocked when i read that. I didn't know that it`s that popular.

[Albion]

I don't support Turanism, but I do support breaking Russia up into a million pieces. :thumb001:

Here's how I'd divide it:

(starting from west to east)

http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/7464/turanandothers.png


Dark red - extended border of Hungary - taking in Hungarian areas of Transylvania and Southern Slovakia, with a corridor linking them.
Blue - Finnic Federation. Taking in Finland, Estonia, Livonians, Votes, Ingrians and a few others. Also taking in some Lapps in Finnmark.
Turquoise blue - Russia. Basically historical Russian occupied areas of European Russia + Belarus (it's fake anyway) and Russian areas of Ukraine. Minus Koningsberg which would either become a new state of Prussia in Germany or join Lithuania (Balts need lebensraum too).
Red - Turkic Federation. Call it whatever you want.
Yellow - other Finno-Ugric peoples (Uralics?). Uralic Federation. Includes Finnic Mordvins because they're separated from other Finnic peoples by lots of Russia proper.
Orange - North Tungusic peoples and Yenesian peoples. Some sort of federation again. Maybe nomads could just have different laws for the different ethnicities instead of borders. This might be a better way of governing much of the Turkic Federation's Central Asian subjects - states for settled areas (like most of Turkey) and undefined areas with state-defined ethnicities with their own laws (within reason and not challenging the federation).
Dark Blue - Mongolians et al. Includes Tuvans and Buryats. Another federation.
Green - Tunguska - Tungusic peoples (including Manchu). A federation.
Brown - Kamchatka - federation taking in Chukchi, Ainu and the other random indigenous peoples of the region.
Black dots in Moldova and Bulgaria - minorities within those countries receiving protection from Turkic Federation. Too small to be independent, too far away to be in the federation. Mostly Bulgarian Turks and Gaugauz.
Grey areas - other areas which would be lost by certain states. Includes North Caucasus, some Kurd and Armenian areas. Turks would still get a corridor to Azeri lands in Iran.


What would happen to Russians, Chinese and others that had settled Siberia? - They'd be removed and resettled back in European Russia and Northern China.


How the states would have an economy:


Hungary - do as it does now
Finnics - Combine Finland and Estonia and develop the rest along Finnish lines.
Turkics - sedentary areas would develop industry and agriculture with the help of Turkey. Nomadic areas would just do as they traditional did.
Russians - as they currently do, minus Siberian oil, gas and other resources. Economically it would be disastrous and their economy would have to start from scratch.
Uralics - Oil, gas, coal, other resources, fishing, Arctic sea routes, tourism. Not many people, so easier to build an economy.
North Tungusic peoples and Yenesians - most would be nomads I suppose. The state could fund itself by selling resources to outside companies (or existing Russian ones).
Mongol areas - whatever Mongolia does now, and some light manufacturing and agriculture (irrigate some land with a tiny bit of water from Baikal - don't turn it into another Aral Sea).
Tungusic peoples - resources, fishing, forestry.
Peoples of Kamchatka - fishing, forestry, tourism, resources.

[SKYNET]

the third one of


Turquoise blue - Russia. Basically historical Russian occupied areas of European Russia + Belarus (it's fake anyway) and Russian areas of Ukraine. Minus Koningsberg which would either become a new state of Prussia in Germany or join Lithuania (Balts need lebensraum too).


a big part of this area historically belonged to Finno-Ugric people

[Albion]

the third one of




a big part of this area historically belonged to Finno-Ugric people

Yeah, the Russians have to live somewhere though. :D

[archangel]

lol i like the idea of independence to Türkics there ı am in:thumb001:

[Onur]

I don't support Turanism, but I do support breaking Russia up into a million pieces. :thumb001:

Here's how I'd divide it:
It should break up. It`s ridicules for a country to occupy and dominate a territory as big as continents. Thats quite illogical.

Enough of Russian oppression over the peoples of Eurasia for centuries.

[kabeiros]

Turkey should break up. It`s ridicules for a hanfull of Turanians to occupy and dominate a territory as big as Asia Minor. Thats quite illogical.

Enough of Turanid oppression over the peoples of Anatolia for centuries.

[Albion]

It should break up. It`s ridicules for a country to occupy and dominate a territory as big as continents. Thats quite illogical.

Enough of Russian oppression over the peoples of Eurasia for centuries.

That's what I've always thought. And the Soviet Union moved people around so much so that Russians would have the majority throughout. What threat were the Nenets or Chuckchi? I couldn't see them rebelling and trying to win independence.
It's a shame Russia settled so much of it. Maybe some Agricultural lands in the South and the Pontic Steppe in European Russia, but not all of that. Russia will never leave it now though. So many potential states, so many cultures ruined (both European and Asian). :(
Russia is also rather a threatening country. Few would miss it.

[Kemalisté]

America is the one that is likely to divide into pieces soon, not Russia. Don't hold your breath for that, Russia and China are growing more and more, which annoys those capitalist dogs here. :D

Eventually, the Eastern alliance will be victorious!

[Kemalisté]

It should break up. It`s ridicules for a country to occupy and dominate a territory as big as continents. Thats quite illogical.

America dominating half of a continent and Australia dominating an entire continent ? your logic is stupid. Don't envy the greatness of Russia, those lands are precious enough that they would not be left to a bunch of uncivilized steppe barbarians and islamic terrorists.

And how ironical that there are not so much people in other Central Asian countries cheering for such an utopic dream. In fact, they are loyal to Russia and respect their territorial integrity. I think that's what we call '' reckon without one's host ''. :D If the Turkish PM asked for any of them to form such a stupid union they would probably answer like " get the *uck off you american puppet " oh, because they are honorable enough not to support such an idea that would serve the interests of America, Israel and other imperialist countries.

Fethullah Gülen is also working hard in Central Asian countries to spread american-financied moderate islamist turan propaganda there, but thanks god they did not play into their hands (his schools have been closed in most countries there such as Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Russia etc. )

[SKYNET]

I don't know anymore how can I more sharing my own fucking opinion with a fucking soviet communist guy? :confused: It's killing time.

[Pretan]

I don't support Turanism, but I do support breaking Russia up into a million pieces. :thumb001:

Here's how I'd divide it:

(starting from west to east)

http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/7464/turanandothers.png


Dark red - extended border of Hungary - taking in Hungarian areas of Transylvania and Southern Slovakia, with a corridor linking them.
Blue - Finnic Federation. Taking in Finland, Estonia, Livonians, Votes, Ingrians and a few others. Also taking in some Lapps in Finnmark.
Turquoise blue - Russia. Basically historical Russian occupied areas of European Russia + Belarus (it's fake anyway) and Russian areas of Ukraine. Minus Koningsberg which would either become a new state of Prussia in Germany or join Lithuania (Balts need lebensraum too).
Red - Turkic Federation. Call it whatever you want.
Yellow - other Finno-Ugric peoples (Uralics?). Uralic Federation. Includes Finnic Mordvins because they're separated from other Finnic peoples by lots of Russia proper.
Orange - North Tungusic peoples and Yenesian peoples. Some sort of federation again. Maybe nomads could just have different laws for the different ethnicities instead of borders. This might be a better way of governing much of the Turkic Federation's Central Asian subjects - states for settled areas (like most of Turkey) and undefined areas with state-defined ethnicities with their own laws (within reason and not challenging the federation).
Dark Blue - Mongolians et al. Includes Tuvans and Buryats. Another federation.
Green - Tunguska - Tungusic peoples (including Manchu). A federation.
Brown - Kamchatka - federation taking in Chukchi, Ainu and the other random indigenous peoples of the region.
Black dots in Moldova and Bulgaria - minorities within those countries receiving protection from Turkic Federation. Too small to be independent, too far away to be in the federation. Mostly Bulgarian Turks and Gaugauz.
Grey areas - other areas which would be lost by certain states. Includes North Caucasus, some Kurd and Armenian areas. Turks would still get a corridor to Azeri lands in Iran.


What would happen to Russians, Chinese and others that had settled Siberia? - They'd be removed and resettled back in European Russia and Northern China.


Well, Kamchatka and Tunguska would lose the vast majority of their population if that happened. Also, the Ainu are pretty much extinct due to intermarriage with Japs since their expulsion from the Kurils.


Enough of Russian oppression over the peoples of Eurasia for centuries Lol, pot calling the kettle black! How are those Kurds doing......

[Kemalisté]

I don't know anymore how can I more sharing my own fucking opinion with a fucking soviet communist guy? :confused: It's killing time.

I'm not so keen on paying attention to a xenophobic racist white supremacist pro-KKK guy either.

[Pallantides]

Blue - Finnic Federation. Taking in Finland, Estonia, Livonians, Votes, Ingrians and a few others. Also taking in some Lapps in Finnmark.


Albion, majority of Finnmarkinger would never agree to that crap. I don't even think the Kven would want to be incorporated with Finland either as they'd lose their "special" status and just be Finns with funny accents.:p

[SKYNET]

I'm not so keen on paying attention to a xenophobic racist white supremacist pro-KKK guy either.

you are not an ideal person as your favorite gay Mao Zedong that killed about 78 million of their citizens

[Kemalisté]

you are not an ideal person as your favorite gay Mao Zedong that killed about 78 million of their citizens

78 million ? lol not even an addict could get that high to put forward such a ridiculous number. That's what they teach you in your KKK brainwashing camps ?

[Albion]

America dominating half of a continent and Australia dominating an entire continent ?

Australia is small in comparison. It's a small continent similar in size to America. Russia is huge.


Albion, majority of Finnmarkinger would never agree to that crap. I don't even think the Kven would want to be incorporated with Finland either as they'd lose their "special" status and just be Finns with funny accents.:p

They're just scared of having a Russian population and retaliation from Russia.

[Sultan Suleiman]

America is the one that is likely to divide into pieces soon, not Russia. Don't hold your breath for that, Russia and China are growing more and more, which annoys those capitalist dogs here. :D

Your nations successes and ever improving life standard is thanks to the Free Market policies. :rolleyes:




Eventually, the Eastern alliance will be victorious!

You do realize you are on the wrong fucking side? Or will you be betraying the Turkish crescent in favor of a sickle and a hammer?

[Corvus]

Yes I support this idea unconditionally and with pleasure and a bright heart:

MbtiWe08_zo

[finþaų]

We need a Pan-Turan anthem. I propose this one:

VTCJ5hedcVA
I've got this song on repeat every time i go to the gym, gets me so pumped especially at 1:00 when he starts whistling, i get in the zone and start power lifting everything

lfinn315

It seemingly instills Turanic pride in the heart and soul of the Finnic.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

Than I am in too..can't resist Tuvan khöömei

[immortaltendency]

Racial union type idea are nonsense.

And this idea activated as being doctrine of Young Turk power of Ottoman Empire and a political party who managed to enter in Japan parlimentary.

[Kemalisté]

Your nations successes and ever improving life standard is thanks to the Free Market policies. :rolleyes:

Sorry ? with those policies only the state and the rich got richer, but the poor got poorer. Do you have any knowledge about unemployment rates in Turkey ? I doubt you do. Don't try to talk about things you have no fucking knowledge about.


You do realize you are on the wrong fucking side? Or will you be betraying the Turkish crescent in favor of a sickle and a hammer?

Turkish crescent and star are Eastern-origin, your point ? and I don't think I'm on the wrong side. I think my country has been captured by American puppet neo-liberal governments for 50 years who betrayed the foundation principles of my country (Statism, a different version of State socialism is one of the Ataturk's six principles) so I'm aiming to change it, being a member of lots of organizations and participating in rallies and such. At least when I die I will have something to be proud of because I advocated the principles of our republic and our great leader Ataturk and always followed my ideals for my whole life. But when they die what they would be proud of ? their consigning our country to American imperialism and their bases ?

[agality]

Sorry ? with those policies only the state and the rich got richer, but the poor got poorer. Do you have any knowledge about unemployment rates in Turkey ? I doubt you do. Don't try to talk about things you have no fucking knowledge about.



Turkish crescent and star are Eastern-origin, your point ? and I don't think I'm on the wrong side. I think my country has been captured by American puppet neo-liberal governments for 50 years who betrayed the foundation principles of my country (Statism, a different version of State socialism is one of the Ataturk's six principles) so I'm aiming to change it, being a member of lots of organizations and participating in rallies and such. At least when I die I will have something to be proud of because I advocated the principles of our republic and our great leader Ataturk and always followed my ideals for my whole life. But when they die what they would be proud of ? their consigning our country to American imperialism and their bases ?

I think Ataturk`s principles are too outdated. Like Statism, which brings nothing but corruption in our time.

[Anusiya]

And the point of the Great Turan in 2012 is...let me guess...to stabilize the Silk Road and have ample quantities of horse meat, to store in our yurts.

:loco:

[Vesuvian Sky]

And the point of the Great Turan in 2012 is...let me guess...to stabilize the Silk Road and have ample quantities of horse meat, to store in our yurts.

:loco:

Yeah that's where I'm kinda at w/ these 'Pan' idealogies. And really are the interests of say Hungarians the same as, oh I dunno, Siberian Yakuts? Me thinks not.

[Kemalisté]

I think Ataturk`s principles are too outdated. Like Statism, which brings nothing but corruption in our time.

Oh, really ? Turkey under Ataturk's statist policies was one of the rare countries which overcame the 1929 crisis with the least harm. We saw a great industrial advance, produced our own aircrafts while the dominant powers of the west were nearly collapsed.

Why ? because we were not dependent on them. So, technically, their crisis would not affect us at all. But now, the smallest economic problem in the US would have a hard impact on us.

[agality]

Oh, really ? Turkey under Ataturk's statist policies was one of the rare countries which overcame the 1929 crisis with the least harm. We saw a great industrial advance, produced our own aircrafts while the dominant powers of the west were nearly collapsed.

Why ? because we were not dependent on them. So, technically, their crisis would not affect us at all. But now, the smallest economic problem in the US would have a hard impact on us.

As i said that was 1929, when capitalism wasn`t accepted by most world governments and US Dollar wasn`t the world`s reserve currency. Today, a crisis in US affects all world. Please don`t tell me, let`s say, UK wouldn`t be affected if they had followed Ataturk`s policies.

[Kemalisté]

As i said that was 1929, when capitalism wasn`t accepted by most world governments and US Dollar wasn`t the world`s reserve currency. Today, a crisis in US effects all world. Please don`t tell me, let`s say, UK wouldn`t be affected if they had followed Ataturk`s policies.

Although being near the US, any global crisis does not affect Cuba for instance. During the 1929 crisis, domestic goods were encouraged (where do you think Domestic Goods Week come from), heavy customs duty was applied on foreign goods. I don't say that we would close our economy to the world, but we would trade with countries which have not fully adopted global policies such as Cuba, North Korea, China, Russia and India. Those countries are unlikely to face a serious crisis in the near future, their market is growing more and more. But what would change ? you'll drive Roewe instead of Ford or eat in Fairwood instead of McDonalds. Is it bad ? I don't think so. We would see more investments here and more opportunities to support domestic productions.

[agality]

Although being near the US, any global crisis does not affect Cuba for instance. During the 1929 crisis, domestic goods were encouraged (where do you think Domestic Goods Week come from), heavy customs duty was applied on foreign goods. I don't say that we would close our economy to the world, but we would trade with countries which have not fully adopted global policies such as Cuba, North Korea, China, Russia and India. Those countries are unlikely to face a serious crisis in the near future, their market is growing more and more. But what would change ? you'll drive Roewe instead of Ford or eat in Fairwood instead of McDonalds. Is it bad ? I don't think so. We would see more investments here and more opportunities to support domestic productions.

I partly agree with you. But comparing Cuba and North Korea with Russia, China is a bit absurd. Their economical policies are completely different. Also if you read some news, you will notice that Turkey is one of the biggest emerging markets. Only serious problem for Turkey is account deficit and it`s narrowing month-by-month.
Also I`d like to say that collapse of US Dollar would affect the whole world, China holds 3 Trillion dollars of US bonds.

[Annihilus]

Yes I support this idea unconditionally and with pleasure and a bright heart:

MbtiWe08_zo

What a beautiful language:thumb001: (songs 2 and 4 are Maygar)

[Annihilus]

Onedia tribe of Amerindians even joined to Turks parade in Newyork this year !!!
I was surprised too..

http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/738/oneida3b.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/208/oneida3b.jpg/)

Azerbaycan Kırgız Kırım Uygur Türkmen and Balkan Türks were all together.

Any people that revere the wolf I consider brothers and sisters:)

JzxDXLGJoYU

[SKYNET]

BUMP :)

[DJVT]

Seems like an excellent Idea, fits well in the stories they they believe in :)

[Proto-Shaman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmiypJgKpHg

[SILNI]

All teh Jobbik supporters are hardcore turanists.
No wonder , all those defeats reflected badly on theirs power of logical reasoning.

Btw , quite a big percent of hungarian nationalists are radicaly anti-islamic , so i don't know how it fit in this "turan" thing.

[Proto-Shaman]

No wonder , all those defeats reflected badly on theirs power of logical reasoning.

Btw , quite a big percent of hungarian nationalists are radicaly anti-islamic , so i don't know how it fit in this "turan" thing.

They are just angry because all territories they lost during 20th century.
That is the main reason this "turanism" have any support in hungary. People there feel betrayed by europe regarding Tranon , ect ...
roughly like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmNkBlEelNw

Common Culture, common past...

[Hoca]

Turan is a fancy word for uniting all Turkic people.

In the past there was no distintion between Azeri and Tatar or any other Turk. These different names were put by Russians and Iranians to divide Turkic peoples.

[SILNI]

So, Hungarians didn't loose their original culture, it`s just they have been christianized just like we Turks has been islamized but Bulgarians has been fully assimilated after they became christians and totally lost their identity and adopted a new slavic one.
They are just angry because all territories they lost during 20th century.
That is the main reason this "turanism" have any support in hungary. People there feel betrayed by europe regarding Tranon , ect ...

[archangel]

off course,hajra turan!

[Szegedist]

They are just angry because all territories they lost during 20th century.
That is the main reason this "turanism" have any support in hungary. People there feel betrayed by europe regarding Tranon , ect ...

Actually Turanism emerged before Trianon, when we went to search for our ancient ancestors.
Friar Julian in 1235 set out to find Magyars in Bashkiria (which he did)

In 1819, Sándor Kőrösi Csoma set out to search for ancestors of Hungarians in land of the Uyghurs.

[adsız]

Picture tells more than words

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/581438_180819232054319_2068804270_n.jpg

[Baluarte]

Great Turan: Probably the dumbest theory right after Afrocentrism.

[Szegedist]

Great Turan: Probably the dumbest theory right after Afrocentrism.

What about Zionism or Aryanism, Nordic space aliens, is that ok?

[adsız]

Baluarte ,
Was it not you Turks have no place in EU ? Hypocrisy...
Plus, EU is collapsing , why not a strong TURAN UNION ?

[Musso]

Naive idea, that is popular among naive nationalists. More romantic than anything else. Turkic Turkmenistan has very warm relations with Armenia, better relations with Armenia than with Azerbaijan. Kazakhstan/Kyrgyzstan are in military alliance with Armenia/Russia rather than with Azerbaijan or Turkey. As you see, countries pursue their national interests, not nationalistic wet dreams that are rather naive.

http://gdb.rferl.org/42F3F01C-C686-41C3-8091-3DCF8CD1B76D_mw1024_n_s.jpg

Turkic soldiers in Armenia for military exercises:

http://gdb.rferl.org/F2A09A76-DA31-49CE-8104-B2999FE093FA_mw1024_n_s.jpg

http://www.panorama.am/g_image.php?id=230405&t=b

Turkmen folk dances in Armenia, dedicated to Turkmen/Armenian relations:
http://gdb.rferl.org/238001CA-78D7-468B-8106-E031C8F53FFB_w640_r1_s.jpg

So where is the Turkic brotherhood???? :laugh:

[Szegedist]

The Central Asian countries have a lot of Russian and USSR brainwashing, and their goverments are still essentially Russian puppets.

[adsız]

Here is ermenian and Turkish president.. SO ?
http://www.bursa.bel.tr/dosyalar/resimler/haberler/5200-org.jpg

Musso, you are Mosov in ABF?

[Hayalet]

@Mosov, all those are the natural result of the disintegration of the Soviet Union. None of them were created by fresh initiative.

@adsız, good point. In Mosov's world, the US is best friends forever with China and Russia.

http://www.thehindu.com/multimedia/dynamic/00031/ARV_HU_OBAMA_31760f.jpg

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2012/06/18/world/18summit2_cnd/18summit2_cnd-articleLarge.jpg

[Musso]

Here is ermenian and Turkish president.. SO ?
http://www.bursa.bel.tr/dosyalar/resimler/haberler/5200-org.jpg

Musso, you are Mosov in ABF?

Armenia and Turkey are not in military alliance. Armenia and Turkey don't have "brotherly relations" like relations between Turkmenistan and Armenia are described. Nor they have economic relations like Armenia/Turkmenistan.


@Mosov, all those are the natural result of the disintegration of the Soviet Union. None of them were created by fresh initiative.

@adsız, good point. In Mosov's world, the US is best friends forever with China and Russia.

http://www.thehindu.com/multimedia/dynamic/00031/ARV_HU_OBAMA_31760f.jpg

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2012/06/18/world/18summit2_cnd/18summit2_cnd-articleLarge.jpg

What does that mean? Is Turkmenistan less Turkic than Turkey?

When did I say US is best friends with China/Russia? and what does that have to do with my point?

[Yalquzaq]

The cold relations between Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan is due to oil-field disputes in Caspian Sea, perhaps this should be mentioned.

[Szegedist]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Asian_Union

That is much more likely than a Turan union.

[adsız]

Ermenia has a population less than 3 millions. Nobody will care them.

[Musso]

Ermenia has a population less than 3 millions. Nobody will care them.

You are just rambling nonsense and didn't address my points.

[Szegedist]

You are just rambling nonsense and didn't address my points.

Hungary is allied with Romania and Slovakia in the NATO allience, also the EU, etc.
Turkey and Greece are NATO allies.

Does that mean Turks and Greeks are friends?

[Hayalet]

When did I say US is best friends with China/Russia? and what does that have to do with my point?
You are fond of posting leaders meeting, standing next to each other and/or shaking hands as if they mean anything. Ex-Soviet countries that are still in Russia's sphere of influence are part of those organizations, it's not because they have genuinely good relations with each other. Get real.

[adsız]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Asian_Union

That is much more likely than a Turan union.

Add Japan, Korea, Turkey, Hungary and Azerbaijan then the biggest power .

[Yalquzaq]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkic_Council

[Musso]

Hungary is allied with Romania and Slovakia in the NATO allience, also the EU, etc.
Turkey and Greece are NATO allies.

Does that mean Turks and Greeks are friends?

Just adds to my point. Turks and Greeks are in military alliance together, while Armenia is in military alliance with Turkic countries + Russia. Such romantic ideologies are not practical.


You are fond of posting leaders meeting, standing next to each other and/or shaking hands as if they mean anything. Ex-Soviet countries that are still in Russia's sphere of influence are part of those organizations, it's not because they have genuinely good relations with each other. Get real.

Turkmenistan/Kazakhstan have genuinely good relations with Armenia, especially in economic sphere. There is also increasing cultural cooperation and in general warm atmosphere in all sectors. When the President of Turkmenistan calls relations with your country as "brotherly" that signifies that your relations are better than normal.

[RussiaPrussia]

The Central Asian countries have a lot of Russian and USSR brainwashing, and their goverments are still essentially Russian puppets.

lol turanism.

If you want to live in the real succors of genhkis kahns and atilas empire go to russia, it almost covers all of it. Russians are also genetically uralic like any finn so yeah we are uber turanist, you mad?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-GOlxR_kKfXM/UHLdwt-k7YI/AAAAAAAAAKo/dqV-xm43f3M/s1600/Genetic+Map+of+Europe.png

[SILNI]

EU is collapsing , why not a strong TURAN UNION ?
You think we are against EU because we want turan instead?
We want to use turks that EU collapse but not to live with them.
This "turan union" can be formed only if last european disappear. It is unnatural for us.
Turan on european soil? Only over our dead bodies.

[SILNI]

Add Japan, Korea, Turkey, Hungary and Azerbaijan then the biggest power .

Are japan and korea turanic also?

[adsız]

Actually what Erdogan thinks is almost the same if remove Russia and China and add more Turan states: http://www.turkishnews.com/en/content/2013/03/01/turkey-reuniting-the-ottoman-empire-analysis/

[Hoca]

I think Turanian union is too narrow word. There are a lot of countries who are not Turanian, so I think neo-Ottomans will never use Turan Union as terminology.

Turkey has influence all around its neighbors deep into Balkans Caucasus, Central Asia, middle-east and Africa. We have to use different terminology that appeals to all people that are friends of us. Of course there will be people who oppose this know, but I believe some kind of Neo-Ottoman union is needed in our sphere of influence when EU collapses, it is inevitable something will come in to place. We already have a lot of influence in Europe. In middle-east, Muslims are calling for a leader, the natural leader will be Turkey. In central-Asia a lot of countries are already working closely with Turkey, but I admit a lot of work needs to be done there, such as language and mutual understanding. In Africa, Turkey also gains a lot of influence in recent years.

Turkey will be top 10 economies in 2030. So don't think with the Turkey today, we have to imagine these things with the Turkey of the future. Countries that will oppose this will be isolated and growth nullified.

[Hayalet]

When the President of Turkmenistan calls relations with your country as "brotherly" that signifies that your relations are better than normal.
No, that kind of statements are routine in diplomacy. In reality, Armenia has as brotherly relations with Turkmenistan as Turkey does with Spain.


Turkmenistan/Kazakhstan have genuinely good relations with Armenia, especially in economic sphere.
Are you serious? The whole international trade volume of Armenia is tiny. And the trade with Turkmenistan and Kazakhstan is a tiny percentage of that already tiny figure:


The value of Armenian exports to Kazakhstan: $2,796,925 (0,26% of all Armenian exports)
The value of Armenian imports from Kazakhstan: $58,798 (0,01% of all Armenian imports)

The value of Armenian exports to Turkmenistan: $8,336,466 (0,77% of all Armenian exports)
The value of Armenian imports from Turkmenistan: N/A

To put things in perspective:


The value of Turkish exports to Kazakhstan: $819,018,496 (0,67% of all Turkish exports)
The value of Turkish imports from Kazakhstan: $2,302,865,670 (1,39% of all Turkish exports) - Nearly 4 times as large as ALL Armenian imports.

The value of Turkish exports to Turkmenistan: $1,137,521,835 (0,93% of all Turkish exports) - Greater than ALL Armenian exports.
The value of Turkish imports from Turkmenistan: $381,100,697 (0,23% of all Turkish imports)

Armenia's economic relations with Kazakhstan or Turkmenistan is comparable to Turkey's economic relations with Latin American or Pacific nations or territories like Barbados or New Caledonia.

[SILNI]

but I believe some kind of Neo-Ottoman union is needed in our sphere of influence when EU collapses, it is inevitable something will come in to place.
Hoca , some things you will never understand. Only reason Turkey have any influence so far was exactly because USA , EU and Nato supported it.
When you make one wrong step (even against EU) it will be the end for you , because usa , eu and nato are part of the same mechanism , and if you think that you will get from it anything more than crumbs , you are very mistaken.

[Pallantides]

http://kurultaj.hu/wp-content/uploads/047.jpg

http://imagemacros.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/i-shall-play-you-the-song-of-my-peo.png

[adsız]

You think we are against EU because we want turan instead?
We want to use turks that EU collapse but not to live with them.
This "turan union" can be formed only if last european disappear. It is unnatural for us.
Turan on european soil? Only over our dead bodies.

You misunderstood me.
OFC Europe (except Hungaria) has no place in a TURAN UNION

[RussiaPrussia]

You misunderstood me.
OFC Europe (except Hungaria) has no place in a TURAN UNION

yet russia is more turanic than turkey as i pointed out

[Szegedist]

yet russia is more turanic than turkey as i pointed out

Then embrace your Türanic roots and stop pretending to be some kind of "Aryan European".

[Empecinado]

Turanism is a really vague term, there is no even consensus among linguists to recognize the existence of the Altaic linguistic family and it's like the Aryan term for Nazis. This Great Turan is just a justification from Turkish nationalists to extend their influence to other countries, it has geostrategic validity, but has no scientific validity.

[adsız]

Turanism is a really vague term, there is no even consensus among linguists to recognize the existence of the Altaic linguistic family and it's like the Aryan term for Nazis. This Great Turan is just a justification from Turkish nationalists to extend their influence to other countries, it has geostrategic validity, but has no scientific validity.


The idea comes from Hungarians and Japan as i know not from Turkish .

[Yalquzaq]

Thanks for the statistics Altay. Shows what kind of a useless, insignificant country Armenia is, its sole role for existence being a colony and forepost of Russia.

[RussiaPrussia]

Then embrace your Türanic roots and stop pretending to be some kind of "Aryan European".

so define turanism whats typical in it culturally?

[Empecinado]

The idea comes from Hungarians and Japan as i know not from Turkish .

Yeah but I've seen it especially in Turkish nationalists.

[RussiaPrussia]

Yeah but I've seen it especially in Turkish nationalists.

i have never seen japanese practicing it, there isnt even a japanese wikipedia article about it

http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q269248

[SILNI]

I would really want to see what average japanese will say when somebody start to explain to him that he is turanic. :picard1:

[SILNI]

i have never seen japanese practicing it, there isnt even a japanese wikipedia article about it

http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q269248
It's a turkish myth.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-1xvOKvAus7M/TnxBAHkma5I/AAAAAAAAAto/eL0BCUDVZrk/s1600/Satsuma-samurai-during-boshin-war-period.jpg

Turanics? I don't think so.
I believe that average japanese would have a good laugh if he hear it.

[Szegedist]

i have never seen japanese practicing it, there isnt even a japanese wikipedia article about it

http://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Q269248

In the past there were connections and meetings between Japanese and Hungarian Turanist Societies.

And if I am not mistaken, Japanese was present at the Kurultaj.

Also Ural-Altatic languages theory includes Japanese and Korean.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c2/Linguistic_map_of_the_Altaic%2C_Turkic_and_Uralic_ languages_%28en%29.png

Personally, I am not so sure about this, but I am not opposed to them.

[Szegedist]

so define turanism whats typical in it culturally?

It is mostly about origin and the steppe heritage+the things that come with that.

[RussiaPrussia]

In the past there were connections and meetings between Japanese and Hungarian Turanist Societies.

And if I am not mistaken, Japanese was present at the Kurultaj.

Also Ural-Altatic languages theory includes Japanese and Korean.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c2/Linguistic_map_of_the_Altaic%2C_Turkic_and_Uralic_ languages_%28en%29.png

Personally, I am not so sure about this, but I am not opposed to them.

lol its a vague group. So then it makes Russians uber turanic more than Hungarians and Turks. Serbs can be also considered turanic even more than you.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3f/Haplogrupo_N_%28ADN-Y%29.PNG

[Szegedist]

lol its a vague group. So then it makes Russians uber turanic more than Hungarians and Turks. Serbs can be also considered turanic even more than you.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3f/Haplogrupo_N_%28ADN-Y%29.PNG

You are mixing linguistics with genetics. Nobody here is talking about genetics.
By the way, Russia is a multiethnic federation, and many of those areas in Russia with high N are Uralics.

[SILNI]

Serbs can be also considered turanic even more than you.
Yeah , and due that we want half a world also , same as turks. :thumb001:

This turanic idea is more pathetic than anything I had misfortune to hear in a long time
Tokio - turanic ? http://forum.santabanta.com/images/smilies/june11/banghead.gif

[RussiaPrussia]

You are mixing linguistics with genetics. Nobody here is talking about genetics.
By the way, Russia is a multiethnic federation, and many of those areas in Russia with high N are Uralics.

you can clearly see that central russia is more uralc than huangary or turkey. Many of these ares of ingenoious people are also not so high populated and are almost all russian populated

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nenets_Autonomous_Okrug#Ethnic_groups

russians make 81% of the population, uralic minorities are not enough to have so much halogroup n. Russians mixed a lot and vis versa.

[Szegedist]

Yeah , and due that we want half a world also , same as turks. :thumb001:

This turanic idea is more pathetic than anything I had misfortune to hear in a long time
Tokio - turanic ? http://forum.santabanta.com/images/smilies/june11/banghead.gif

Nobody is forcing you to read this or post on this thread.

[Szegedist]

you can clearly see that central russia is more uralc than huangary or turkey. Many of these ares of ingenoious people are also not so high populated and are almost all russian populated

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nenets_Autonomous_Okrug#Ethnic_groups

russians make 81% of the population, uralic minorities are not enough to have so much halogroup n. Russians mixed a lot and vis versa.

So Russians are not "White" or "Aryan", good for you. Next time some Nordicist says Russians aren't white and you start crying, I will link this post ;)

[SILNI]

Nobody is forcing you to read this or post on this thread.
This is my favourite thread. I am still waiting when you will call Eskimos and Maya people - a turanic.

[SILNI]

So Russians are not "White" or "Aryan", good for you. Next time some Nordicist says Russians aren't white and you start crying, I will link this post ;)

It's funny , you always wrote white and aryan term under "". Like it doesn't exist.
While "turanic" as a God given. It say a lot how hipocrite you are. No wonder slovaks romans croats and serbs turned against you more than once in history.

[Szegedist]

This is my favourite thread. I am still waiting when you will call Eskimos and Maya people - a turanic.

Eskimos and Native Americans are both from Central Asia. Since genetics have been brought up, Haplogroup Q is interesting:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG

[Szegedist]

It's funny , you always wrote white and aryan term under "". Like it doesn't exist.
While "turanic" as a God given. It say a lot how hipocrite you are. No wonder slovaks romans croats and serbs turned against you more than once in history.

What is "White"? What is "Aryan"? You can doubt and troll about "Turanian", something similar can be said for you, and your anti-Turanist arguments can be also used against Aryanism and White nationalism too.

[SILNI]

Eskimos and Native Americans are both from Central Asia. Since genetics have been brought up, Haplogroup Q is interesting:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG

BINGO !
I knew deep inside that they are turks also.
Now lets move further , are english , scots and irish turanic also? I believe they are. :fponder:

[adsız]

Silni is sabotaging the thread..!

[Szegedist]

BINGO !
I knew deep inside that they are turks also.
Now lets move further , are english , scots and irish turanic also? I believe they are. :fponder:

There is a Scottish clan that claims descent from Árpád
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Drummond#Origins_of_the_Clan

Ps. I am not saying whether they are Turanic or not, I am just listing facts, that they do claim it (personally I think it is crazy but also interesting)

[Szegedist]

Silni is sabotaging the thread..!

When really he is our Orthodox Türk brother speaking Croatian.

(Only joking Silni ;), although there is some truth in it)

[SILNI]

What is "White"? What is "Aryan"? You can doubt and troll about "Turanian", something similar can be said for you, and your anti-Turanist arguments can be also used against Aryanism and White nationalism too.
Only in what you believe that exist is your turanic dream , all other traits/origins are non-existent according to you. If not why would you write term white under "" ?

I can not believe that majority of your compatriots share your opinion.
I mean I understand they want greater hungary , but to betray their own race (which they claim to belong) can't.

[Szegedist]

I am going to let Silni translate this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roEmNHJSUNM

[SILNI]

Silni is sabotaging the thread..!

Thread - "do you support great Turan or not"

Am i allowed to say my opinion or only opinion will be praise toward that "movement"?

[Szegedist]

Only in what you believe that exist is your turanic dream , all other traits/origins are non-existent according to you. If not why would you write term white under "" ?
No, I do not believe that other traits and origins do not exist.



I can not believe that majority of your compatriots share your opinion.
I mean I understand they want greater hungary , but to betray their own race (which they claim to belong) can't.
Betraying our "race"? What, betraying our White Brothers? How exactly?? Would you prefer for us to say that we are Slavic? :D

[Szegedist]

I am going to let Silni translate this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roEmNHJSUNM
I doubt he will so
translation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=R0nGlsu-xVQ

[SILNI]

I am going to let Silni translate this:

wow , one turk from bosnia (half drunk here btw) praise serbs how we are similar with country where he live currently (turkey)
among other stupid things he said that one serbian song is turkish origin.
it is a song "tamo daleko" (there far away) - which is made by serbian soldiers who were stationed in greece in ww1

that statement is so stupid that i can not even begin to explain , anyway even if it is true , have not meaning what so ever.

[RussiaPrussia]

You are mixing linguistics with genetics. Nobody here is talking about genetics.


Look what you try to sum up mongolia, japan, korea, finland, turkey, central asia just because of some far far away theory about their origin of their languages. They have nothing in commen. Its redicolous and actually my genetic map makes much more sense.


It is mostly about origin and the steppe heritage+the things that come with that.

So why you put finland, japan and south korea into it?

also

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dd/Die_drei_Bogatyr.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1b/TheKnightAtTheCrossroads.jpg

http://времяверить.рф/uploads/posts/2011-09/1315558672_molodye-kazaki.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMBeLr3Zk-k#t=2m33s


haters gonna hate :laugh:

[Szegedist]

Look what you try to sum up mongolia, japan, korea, finland, turkey, central asia just because of some far far away theory about their origin of their languages. They have nothing in commen. Its redicolous and actually my genetic map makes much more sense.



So why you put finland, japan and south korea into it?



If you actually read what I said, you would see that I never said that Japan/Finland/Korea/etc are Turanic.

[SKYNET]

Eskimos and Native Americans are both from Central Asia. Since genetics have been brought up, Haplogroup Q is interesting:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG


it is not the first and last source that you can provide us.

[RussiaPrussia]

So Russians are not "White" or "Aryan", good for you. Next time some Nordicist says Russians aren't white and you start crying, I will link this post ;)

they are as white as fins )))

[SILNI]

btw translation is wrong
he never said serbs are turks but that we are similar.
man is drunk , video shows
anyway what integrity have basketball trainer regarding origin similarities?
do you want i to post link that claim that we are aliens from venera?

i see turanist start to be a little bit deseperate here , especialy hungarian ones.

[SILNI]

I never said that Japan/Finland/Korea/etc are Turanic.
I stand corrected then.

[Szegedist]

What are we then? Slavs? Germanics? Celts? Latins?

[adsız]

it is not the first and last source that you can provide us.

What about you WB ? Do you support the Great Turan?
What do the Native Americans generally think about their roots ?

[Corvus]

What are we then? Slavs? Germanics? Celts? Latins?

A bit of everything, but Turanid is also an element

[Szegedist]

A bit of everything, but Turanid is also an element


We are talking about identity. When someone asks you, "Corvus, what are you?", you don't say "Well, I am a multicultural mix of pre-Indo-Europeans, Celts, Germanics, Slavs, maybe some Hungarians, a bit of R1a haplogorup there and some R1b haplogroup here", you say "I am Germanic Austrian", no?

[SILNI]

So what you are? In the most narrow sense.

[Corvus]

We are talking about identity. When someone asks you, "Corvus, what are you?", you don't say "Well, I am a mix of pre-Indo-Europeans, Celts, Germanics, Slavs, maybe some Hungarians, a bit of R1a haplogorup there and some R1b haplogroup here", you say "I am Germanic Austrian", no?

Austrian yes, Germanic not entirely, someone with a Slavic name and an appearance like me cannot call himself Germanic

But I get your point. Culture comes first.

[SKYNET]

What about you WB ? Do you support the Great Turan?
What do the Native Americans generally think about their roots ?


they don't consider yourself a part of turanic, me too

[Pallantides]

Eskimos and Native Americans are both from Central Asia. Since genetics have been brought up, Haplogroup Q is interesting:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG

Here is a more detailed map of Y-DNA haplogroup Q's frequency in Europe:
http://www.disnorge.no/cms/system/files/offentlige_filer/Haplogroup-Q%20Eupedia.gif

[Szegedist]

So what you are? In the most narrow sense.

I am asking you, because it seems foreigners know best what we are.

[SILNI]

I am asking you, because it seems foreigners know best what we are.

Well you have the big percent of slavic blood , given that you had lumped with slavs (which were already here) on a large scale when you invaded carpatian basen. You lost most of your original people due the mongol and turkish invasion so you replaced the population due mixing but largely due assimilation with Slavs. Slavic component do not support turanic faction origin though.
Edit , and yes there was assimilation on expense of romanians also , so ...
Hungarians during history often made just something above 50 % of population in their empire.

[adsız]

they don't consider yourself a part of turanic, me too

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Native-American-Turanian-Brotherhood-FIRST-NATIONS-First/254587994552741?fref=ts

Edit:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDI7j1eftqk

[Szegedist]

Well you have the big percent of slavic blood , given that you had lumped with slavs (which were already here) on a large scale when you invaded carpatian basen. You lost most of your original people due the mongol and turkish invasion so you replaced the population due mixing but largely due assimilation with Slavs. Slavic component do not support turanic faction origin though.

If you want talk genetics, Serbs are only 15% R1a (usually a Slavic marker), so genetics do not support Slavic origin of Serbs, you are a Slavified paleo-Balkan people. I mean "Diranic Slavs", be serious.
If we go by your logic off course.
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

[Corvus]

If you want talk genetics, Serbs are only 15% R1a (usually a Slavic marker), so genetics do not support Slavic origin of Serbs, you are a Slavified paleo-Balkan people. I mean "Diranic Slavs", be serious.
If we go by your logic off course.
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

Thats right, according to genetics and also physical anthropology Serbia is not really the epicenter of the Slavic sphere

[SILNI]

We are not talking about serbs here.
It isn't a serbs who feel ashamed of their 15 % slavic marker , but opposite.
Tell me why are you ashamed of your slavic marker and not of your "turanic" one?
There must be an logic answer in this madness here.

[Hevo]

If you want talk genetics, Serbs are only 15% R1a (usually a Slavic marker), so genetics do not support Slavic origin of Serbs, you are a Slavified paleo-Balkan people. I mean "Diranic Slavs", be serious.
If we go by your logic off course.
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml

L2A2 could also be a Slavic marker. It has high percentages in the South Slavic countries+ Moldava and Ukraine.

[Szegedist]

We are not talking about serbs here.
It isn't a serbs who feel ashamed of their 15 % slavic marker , but opposite.
Tell me why are you ashamed of your slavic marker and not of your "turanic" one?
There must be an logic answer in this madness here.

If you think we are Slavs, then I suggest you go easy on the Rakia for a few days.

[Pallantides]

You guys should update to atDNA:cool:

[SILNI]

you are a Slavified paleo-Balkan people.
You want to say we are native here? Thanks for compliment.
In fact many serbs support that theory , while our enemies deny it.
I am more slavic oriented so I am neutral regarding that issue.

[SILNI]

If you think we are Slavs, then I suggest you go easy on the Rakia for a few days.

That's your answer? hahah.

[Albion]

Eskimos and Native Americans are both from Central Asia. Since genetics have been brought up, Haplogroup Q is interesting:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/70/Haplogroup_Q_%28Y-DNA%29.PNG

Yes and its brother lineage is haplogroup R - R1a and R1b - found highest among Indo-Europeans. :rolleyes:

[Szegedist]

I will tell you what we are.
Tribes from Asia, which was pretty mixed, and contrary to popular belief, Mongoloid was a minority. We were mostly Caucasoids and Turanids. The Conquering Hungarians themselves were not homogeneous peoples.

We then conquered the Carpathian Basin, set up a state here (one of the oldest in Europe), adopted Christianity, and began to be influenced by Western Culture and absorbed various other groups, from Turkic Cumans to Slavs to Germanics.

Today we look mostly Caucasoid, and culturally we are the closer to our Northern,Western neigbours and maybe Northern Croats than we are to Kazaks or Türkmen. However we do share an ancient link, which we focus on in these difficult times, instead of the treacherous so called "White European brothers". Not all off course, we do have friends in Europe, one or two.

Also to clear things up, we are not anti-European, and Jobbik has been at the forefront of pan-European nationalist organisations:
http://www.hungarianambiance.com/2012/07/first-festival-boreal-was-resounding.html
http://www.hungarianambiance.com/2012/07/european-nationalist-organizations-held.html
http://www.hungarianambiance.com/2012/10/the-alliance-of-european-national.html

Also, Japan too
http://www.hungarianambiance.com/2010/08/japanese-and-european-nationalists.html

See, we still have some hope in Europe, and since we are on this continent, what happens to us effects us too. Sadly..

[Insuperable]

Thats right, according to genetics and also physical anthropology Serbia is not really the epicenter of the Slavic sphere

Indeed. Invading Slavs were untermenschized by native Balkanians.

[Szegedist]

That's your answer? hahah.

A stupid answer is fitting for a stupid question. I repeat, we are not Slavic, no matter how hard you pan Slavists try to make us to be.