Ottoman population census about the population of Macedonia

[Bugarash]

No ethnic macedonians?:D

http://www2.units.it/storia/corsi/Dogo/tabelle/popolaz-ottomana1911.jpg

[Bugarash]

Maybe the turks were bulgarian nationalists for not seeng any macedonians eh?

http://img511.imageshack.us/img511/7504/karpat1978ottomanpopuladb0.jpg

[Vojnik]

The Ottoman census's were not based on Ethnography, they were based on religion and church affiliations.

[Bugarash]

So why was the population of Macedonia in favor of the Bulgarian exarchate?

[Onur]

Someone try to educate this Balkanite because i am sick of repeating this anymore, tell him that Ottoman censuses done according to religious communities and the tags like "Bulgar, Greek" doesn't mean ethnic Bulgars or ethnic Greeks but it means the people who were adhere to Bulgarian and Greek church.

Bulgarian church members; Bulgarians and some slavic speaking Macedonians

Greek church members; Orthodox Vlachs, Rum/Romioi speakers known as Greeks, christian gypsies, orthodox Albanians, some slavic speaking Macedonians, Gagauz-Urum-Karamanli Turkish christians etc.

[Minesweeper]

Oh look who's back, it's Bugarash. Somebody sound the fag alarm!

[Bugarash]

Someone try to educate this Balkanite because i am sick of repeating this anymore, tell him that Ottoman censuses done according to religious communities and the tags like "Bulgar, Greek" doesn't mean ethnic Bulgars or ethnic Greeks but it means the people who were adhere to Bulgarian and Greek church.

Bulgarian church members; Bulgarians and some slavic speaking Macedonians

Greek church members; Orthodox Vlachs, Rum/Romioi speakers known as Greeks, christian gypsies, orthodox Albanians, some slavic speaking Macedonians, Gagauz-Urum-Karamanli Turkish christians etc.

Again,why then they joined the bulgarian church?
why all of the people they consider as ethnic macedonian national heroes worked as bulgarian teachers in exarchate schools?

So why didint those ethnic macedonians have Milet then?
all other nations had their own milet even vlachs

thats because in ottoman times there were no ethnic macedonians
they were bulgarians;)

thats a well known fact but turks like to play a very pathetic game these days hah i remember when the turkish minister of eurointegration came here-Agamin Begseh was his name or something like that...anyway he said-I am glad to be in the land of Alexander the Great:D

typical ass licking just to counter the greeks.
same thing now only to go against the bulgarians because you have some frustrations thinking communists deported you from Bulgaria:D

sorry man but turks came as occuping nomads in these lands,even if we deported you,that was nothing after 500 years of terror so you are lucky we let you remain in Bulgaria and live freely.

[Ivo Arandur]

Someone try to educate this Balkanite because i am sick of repeating this anymore, tell him that Ottoman censuses done according to religious communities and the tags like "Bulgar, Greek" doesn't mean ethnic Bulgars or ethnic Greeks but it means the people who were adhere to Bulgarian and Greek church.

Bulgarian church members; Bulgarians and some slavic speaking Macedonians

Greek church members; Orthodox Vlachs, Rum/Romioi speakers known as Greeks, christian gypsies, orthodox Albanians, some slavic speaking Macedonians, Gagauz-Urum-Karamanli Turkish christians etc.


Heh Onur, as the saying goes, you keep your eyes on the single trees and you miss the forest ;)

The Ottoman census may have been based on religious affiliation BUT the Bulgarian Exarchate was an ETHNIC organisation! You do realise (I hope) that both the Greek Patrarchate and the Bulgarian Exarchate were Orthodox churches, right?
However, the Bulgarian Exarchate was formed on an ETHNIC basis - the very reason for creating the Exarchate was to preserve the Bulgarian ethnic consciousness and to preserve the Bulgarian people from being Hellenized by the Greek Patriarchate...

So the mere fact of those people (of any people) supporting the Exarchate meant that they felt as a part of the Bulgarian community....

Of course, let us not mix modern terms with 19th century terms - a Bulgarian of the 19th century is not the same as a Bulgarian of the 21th century...back then a "Bulgarian" meant a person who was a part of the greater Bulgarian community, a community that spoke a similar language, had similar traditions, dreamt similar dreams etc. I wouldn't call a "Bulgarian" of the 19th century a "nationality" but it was definitely a distinctive community - the same way there was a Serbian community, a Greek community and so on and so on...

[Optimus]

Someone try to educate this Balkanite because i am sick of repeating this anymore.

You better educate yourself mister ignoramus.Regarding the consensus Vojnik has quite right.


The Ottoman census's were not based on Ethnography, they were based on religion and church affiliations.

[Onur]

So why didint those ethnic macedonians have Milet then?
all other nations had their own milet even vlachs

thats because in ottoman times there were no ethnic macedonians
they were bulgarians;)
Ohh yes, i forgot to add Vlach church in my post. Ottoman authorities recognized separate Vlach church in 1890s and some of them left the Greek patriarchy of Istanbul and became affiliated with the new Vlach church. So, thats exactly why after the 1890s, Vlachs has been counted separately under the autonomous Vlach church. When Greeks invaded Aegean Macedonia in 1912, they shut down the Vlach church and hellenized them all laters.

Yes, there was no Macedonians in the Ottoman censuses because there was no autonomous Macedonian Church at that time. Also, all the Turks, Albanians, Pomaks was getting counted under the tag "muslims". Does it mean that there was no Turks, Albanians and muslim Bulgarians at that time?


thats a well known fact but turks like to play a very pathetic game these days hah i remember when the turkish minister of eurointegration came here-Agamin Begseh was his name or something like that...anyway he said-I am glad to be in the land of Alexander the Great:D
OK, i will personally write an e-mail to the Egemen Bagis and recommend him to say that he is happy to be in the land of Turkic Bulgar Khans like Omurtag, Attila, Asparuh when he goes to Bulgaria.

Would you be glad then?

[Bugarash]

Ohh yes, i forgot to add Vlach church in my post. Ottoman authorities recognized separate Vlach church in 1890s and some of them left the Greek patriarchy of Istanbul and became affiliated with the new Vlach church. So, thats exactly why after the 1890s, Vlachs has been counted separately under the autonomous Vlach church. When Greeks invaded Aegean Macedonia in 1912, they shut down the Vlach church and hellenized them all laters.

Yes, there was no Macedonians in the Ottoman censuses because there was no autonomous Macedonian Church at that time. Also, all the Turks, Albanians, Pomaks was getting counted under the tag "muslims". Does it mean that there was no Turks, Albanians and muslim Bulgarians at that time?

Eveery nation that asked for it's milet got it!

muslims in ottoman times were counted as one because they were recognized by the empire as one body thats why no matter of his nationality a muslim could became a ottoman official,all a person needed to do is to convert!

Your knowlage about the macedonian issue is walking on the surface edge.
My advice-start reading what nationality did the ones who the ''macedonians'' claim were their national heroes stated in their letters,documents...start reading official ottoman documents who describe the population of Macedonia.


OK, i will personally write an e-mail to the Egemen Bagis and recommend him to say that he is happy to be in the land of Turkic Bulgar Khans like Omurtag, Attila, Asparuh when he goes to Bulgaria.

Would you be glad then?

Turkic;)
looks like you dont know the difference between turkic and turkish

[Onur]

Eveery nation that asked for it's milet got it!
You are ignorant in every issue including your own Bulgarian history.

Bulgarians fought so hard to be able to form their own church because Greek patriarchy was so strong upon all the christians of Ottoman empire and they were suppressing any separatist movement inside the christian community of the empire. So, it wasn't like you claim as "Eveery nation that asked for it's milet got it!"

You are not worthy of any response, so do not respond to me from now on.

[Bugarash]

You are ignorant in every issue including your own Bulgarian history.

Bulgarians fought so hard to be able to form their own church because Greek patriarchy was so strong upon all the christians of Ottoman empire and they were suppressing any separatist movement inside the christian community of the empire. So, it wasn't like you claim as "Eveery nation that asked for it's milet got it!"

You are not worthy of any response, so do not respond to me from now on.

You should go and visit Petric some time...ask everyone you see about their nationality and hear the answer.