New Skyscrapers to Become Symbol of Macedonian Economic Miracle

[poiuytrewq0987]

http://kurir.mk/en/wp-content/uploads/fm-480x360.jpg

The construction of four skyscrapers and shopping mall will be launched Monday by the Turkish company ‘Cevahir Holding’, investment worth EUR 100 million, in Skopje settlement ‘Aerodrom.’ The towers will have 42 floors where 5.000 people will live.

President Gjorge Ivanov and Deputy PM for Economic Affairs Vladimir Pesevski will attend cornerstone laying ceremony.

“We have been working on this investment for a longer period of time…Following our presentation for doing business in Macedonia – low taxes, favorable construction land price, simple administrative procedures – the owner of the (Turkish) company has decided to invest in our country,” PM Nikola Gruevski said on Friday.

This investment will offer job to domestic construction companies, he added.

The fours skyscrapers are going to be the tallest buildings in Macedonia.

http://kurir.mk/en/2012/07/16/construction-of-the-skyscrapers-kicks-off/

[ioan assen]

Congrats! Lets hope there is more investment in Macedonia, preferably in plants, not in malls!

[Bugarash]

Miracle what?

what miracle?

[poiuytrewq0987]

Miracle what?

what miracle?

We're on the cusp of a economic miracle. Once Europe gets over with its debt crisis with Greece and Spain there's really nothing stopping the Macedonian economy from growing 5-7%/year. All the foundations are in place, we just need to wait for Europe to move on from its debt crisis.

The skyscrapers will be finished in 2017 that's when everyone will be talking about the Macedonian economic miracle and Macedonia the Balkan tiger. :)

[Bugarash]

We're on the cusp of a economic miracle. Once Europe gets over with its debt crisis with Greece and Spain there's really nothing stopping the Macedonian economy from growing 5-7%/year. All the foundations are in place, we just need to wait for Europe to move on from its debt crisis.

The skyscrapers will be finished in 2017 that's when everyone will be talking about the Macedonian economic miracle and Macedonia the Balkan tiger. :)

Son,cut the shit
After Moldova,Macedonia has the worst economy in Europe

at the moment the unemployment rate is 32%
Last year-98% of the ones that finished highschool resumed their education on the university-in other words keeping the unemployment rate fictitiously lower and from going above the current 32%!

not to mention the debt crisis that will struck Macedonia some years from now...

The current government is building Skopje 2014,paying agriculture subsidies,renovating building facades,cleaning water chanels,wasting tens of millions on self-promotion...all from credits....at least if they were investing it in something smart as infrastructure,but instead all the money goes in the air.


По колку ќе враќаме наредните години

Во Стратегија за управување со јавниот долг од 2010 до 2012 година, која е последниот ваков документ објавен на веб страната на министерството за финансии, се дава графикон за тоа по колку средства ќе треба да се отплаќаат секоја година само по основ на главницата на долгот. Овие прогнози се правени во март 2010, што значи дека во сумите што треба да се враќаат не се вклучени парите од ММФ во износ од 220 милиони евра повлечени во март лани, задолжувањето од 130 милиони евра кај две странски банки што се случи кон крајот на минатата година, како и најновото задолжување од 250 милиони евра.

Од графиконот што е објавен во Стратегијата може да се види дека годинава треба да се вратат околу 110 милиони евра, во 2013 стигнуваат за отплата 290 милиони евра, а во 2014 над 150 милиони евра. Во 2015 основицата за отплата вкупно би изнесувала околу 360 милиони евра, а слична е ситуацијата и во 2016, кога отплатата треба да биде околу 370 милиони евра. Највисок е столбот за 2017 година, за која сумата што треба да се врати се доближува до границата од 400 милиони евра.

Кога на овие годишни отплати би се додале и сумите што треба да се враќаат кон ММФ, но и новите заеми од 130 и сега 250 милиони евра, според нашите пресметки, во наредните години земјава би била приморана на следнава динамика на враќање. Во 2014 би стигнале 172 милиони евра, а веќе во 2015 ќе треба да се вратат нешто над 400 милиони евра. Во 2016, пак, стигнуваат огромни 544 милиони евра за враќање (тука е вклучено враќањето на 130 милиони евра од заемот кон Дојче банк и Сити банк).

За 2017 година, пак, со оглед што тогаш треба да стигне најновиот кредит од Дојче банк од 250 милиони евра, би дошле за враќање дури 694, односно близу 700 милиони евра во текот на само една година, без да се пресметаат каматите!

[poiuytrewq0987]

Son,cut the shit
After Moldova,Macedonia has the worst economy in Europe

at the moment the unemployment rate is 32%
Last year-98% of the ones that finished highschool resumed their education on the university-in other words keeping the unemployment rate fictitiously lower and from going above the current 32%!


not to mention the debt crisis that will truck Macedonia in the future
the current government is building Skopje 2014,paying agriculture subsidies,renovating building facades,cleaning water chanels,wasting tens of millions of self-promotion...all from credits.

Macedonia has a pretty sizable gray economy which means unemployment is more around 20% not 30%. If you're going to complain about unemployment then our neighbors are in a worse sitauation than we are. Macedonia with unemployment rate of 20-30% for a country of 2 million vs... Greece with unemployment rate of 23% for a country of 11 million and Serbia with an unemployment rate of 25% for a country of 7 million. Our neighbors are in a far worse situation numbers-wise! I am sure you are just a troll though since you're constantly posting negatively about Macedonia. :rolleyes:

[Bugarash]

Macedonia has a pretty sizable gray economy which means unemployment is more around 20% not 30%. If you're going to complain about unemployment then our neighbors are in a worse sitauation than we are. Macedonia with unemployment rate of 20-30% for a country of 2 million vs... Greece with unemployment rate of 23% for a country of 11 million and Serbia with an unemployment rate of 25% for a country of 7 million. Our neighbors are in a far worse situation numbers-wise! I am sure you are just a troll though since you're constantly posting negatively about Macedonia. :rolleyes:

Serbia and Greece dont have a gray economy?

Greece even now has the highest living standard on the balkans.
If Greece went bankrupt it will come on the levels of Macedonia is today.

As I told you,the populist moves of Gruevski's government in the education system are hiding the real % of unemployment!

98% of those who finish highschool go on the university!
those who study arent registered as unemployed!

[poiuytrewq0987]

98% of those who finish highschool go on the university!
those who study arent registered as unemployed!

You don't make sense! Of course, students can't be counted as unemployed because they're not looking for a job... because they are busy studying!

[Ladejarlen]

Not much to congratulate. The standard of life will approve, but not life quality.

http://i.imgur.com/4dMSx.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/VywBd.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/goxB7.jpg

[Bugarash]

You don't make sense! Of course, students can't be counted as unemployed because they're not looking for a job... because they are busy studying!

And thats why he made the educational system in such a way where 98% go on the university-dues keeping the real number of unemployed behind the curtain.;)

[poiuytrewq0987]

And thats why he made the educational system in such a way where 98% go on the university-dues keeping the real number of unemployed behind the curtain.;)

Making Macedonians go to uni is a bad thing, how? :rotfl:

[Ladejarlen]

Making Macedonians go to uni is a bad thing, how? :rotfl:

A lot of leftist indoctrination in universities, but we pretty much need to go in our post-industrial societies.
The best education is, however, the one you provide yourself:thumb001:

[poiuytrewq0987]

A lot of leftist indoctrination in universities, but we pretty much need to go in our post-industrial societies.
The best education is, however, the one you provide yourself:thumb001:

You can't compare Macedonia and Norway. We haven't been infected with the Western liberal disease unlike Norway. We're building up a large educated workforce so we can offer more... and this is NOT a bad thing for the country. Bugarash wants Macedonians to be illiterate peasants. :rolleyes: Not going to happen!

[Ladejarlen]

You can't compare Macedonia and Norway. We haven't been infected with the Western liberal disease unlike Norway. We're building up a large educated workforce so we can offer more... and this is NOT a bad thing for the country. Bugarash wants Macedonians to be illiterate peasants. :rolleyes: Not going to happen!

Yeah, you guys are obviously much better off than us.

The oil we found has been our doom, and seems societies catholic or orthodox has fared better.

[Bugarash]

Making Macedonians go to uni is a bad thing, how? :rotfl:

If you have 90+% of your population with a university degree then who will work at the store?,who will work at the car wash? who will drive tha cab?

btw that is olso one of the reasons why the macedonian universities are on the bottom in terms of quality and nobody recognizes the diplomas.;)

[Ladejarlen]

If you have 90+% of your population with a university degree then who will work at the store?


The people with degrees in history, philosophy, literature, sociology... There are lots of useless educations where few will find jobs. And there will be younger people and student themselves who could do some of the jobs.

In no way realistic that 90% of the population will have university degrees.

[poiuytrewq0987]

If you have 90+% of your population with a university degree then who will work at the store?,who will work at the car wash? who will drive tha cab?

btw that is olso one of the reasons why the macedonian universities are on the bottom in terms of quality and nobody recognizes the diplomas.;)

Like every other Balkan country? If you want to work in an advanced position in a Western European country then you will have little luck with a Serbian, Bulgarian or Bosnian uni degree. You need to further study in France, UK, Germany, etc... and 99.9% of them accept Macedonian uni degrees.

[Fortis in Arduis]

How do I become a Macedonian?

I want to live the economic miracle, live in a symbolic skyscraper, walk through the Arch of Love, enjoy the fabled facades and be a statue for my people!

Where do I make my application?

[Crn Volk]

Balkan tiger indeed;

Belgium's Van Hool to build plant in FYR Macedonia
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151188

Draxlmaier Group to open 4.000 jobs in FYROM
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151184

PM Gruevski: FYROM's 8% growth in tourism comes as a result of government's policies
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151171

[Crn Volk]

How do I become a Macedonian?

I want to live the economic miracle, live in a symbolic skyscraper, walk through the Arch of Love, enjoy the fabled facades and be a statue for my people!

Where do I make my application?

http://www.macedonianembassy.org.uk/

[Bugarash]

Balkan tiger indeed;

Belgium's Van Hool to build plant in FYR Macedonia
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151188

Draxlmaier Group to open 4.000 jobs in FYROM
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151184

PM Gruevski: FYROM's 8% growth in tourism comes as a result of government's policies
http://www.balkans.com/open-news.php?uniquenumber=151171

Dude,giving 150 euro paid jobs to some thosands of pepople in a country where unemployment is over 30% isnt a tiger,someone should teach you about economy and about the term ''tiger''.

Btw how old are you?

[Bugarash]

The tiger...

Recession in Q/1 -1,4%
Industrial production fall in Q/1 -7,5%


Tumbling Industrial Output Worries Macedonia

For nine months in a row, largely thanks to the European crisis, Macedonian industrial output has been in decline, raising fears that the country could fall into recession.

Latest data from the State Statistical Office show that industrial output in Macedonia in May plummeted 5.4 per cent compared to the same month last year.

In the first five months of this year, compared to the same period in 2011, the fall is even more pronounced, standing at 7.5 per cent.

The figures show that the country’s flagship metal and construction industries, which represent the backbone of the local economy, have been hard hit.

Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski, speaking last week to CNN, admitted that the situation was a cause for concern, explaining that his country is largely dependent on the crisis-hit European economy.

“Approximately 90 per cent of our exports are linked directly or indirectly with the EU and in a way we are very dependent on the economic situation in the EU," he said.

In the hope of offsetting the economic slowdown gripping Europe, parliament last week approved taking a €100 million loan from the European Investment Bank for local companies.

“I am confident that this money will help companies, if they apply with good projects, to get out of the crisis and keep up the number of employees,” Finance Minister Zoran Staverski said on Friday, commenting on the latest figures.

In hope of keeping the construction industry alive amid shrinking demand abroad, this year Macedonia envisages spending some €270 million, 11 per cent of its annual budget, on capital investment.

“We will try to maintain a high level of capital investment so that money... ends up in the hands of Macedonian companies,” Stavreski explained.

Opposition Social Democrats contest the strategy, arguing that many of these projects are unproductive ways of spending money that will not yield economic results.

Instead of spending millions on the government-funded revamp of the capital, the project called Skopje 2014, they urge redirecting more money towards building infrastructure that directly boosts economic activity in the future.

Following the latest statistical data on the economy, some observers say that the country could fall into recession this year.

Economic growth was minus 1.4 per cent in the first quarter of this year and forecasts predict negative growth for the second quarter as well.

The government optimistically predicts 2 per cent growth in 2012, saying that in the current circumstances this would be a good result. But many fear that even 2 per cent growth now looks unlikely.

[Absinthe]

This thread to me is totally reminiscent of the hyper-elevated state of euphoria that Greeks were before and after the Olympics in Athens.

It was like, construction sites everywhere, new highways and buildings everywhere you could look, the brand new Metro, amazing rates of economic development and so on and so forth.

And less than a decade later.... ;)

The same happened in Ireland and the famous "Celtic Tiger".

So careful: erecting fancy buildings alone does not equal development and prosperity, nor does it improve a country's quality of life in any way.

If anything, in such disproportionate economies such as the Balkan ones, you end up with a huge gap between the privileged elite and the rest of the people. On one hand you have skyscrapers and on the other hand you have unemployment and poverty and people living in degraded areas.

[Fortis in Arduis]

http://www.macedonianembassy.org.uk/

http://statics.192.com/estreet/original/large/1063/10639500.jpg

The Macedonian Embassy is above an Italian coffee shop. Can you see the flag two stories up on the right?

At least the Albanian Embassy has a whole building, even if it's in the wrong place. Meheheheheh... :D

[Bugarash]

Not surprised,the macedonian ambassy in Sofia is one apartment...and they always send an albanian for a ambassador

comperation to the bulgarian embassy in London
http://i591.photobucket.com/albums/ss353/KarahunovAerodrom/3408531347_8fb7b02d7a_b.jpg

[poiuytrewq0987]

This thread to me is totally reminiscent of the hyper-elevated state of euphoria that Greeks were before and after the Olympics in Athens.

It was like, construction sites everywhere, new highways and buildings everywhere you could look, the brand new Metro, amazing rates of economic development and so on and so forth.

And less than a decade later.... ;)

The same happened in Ireland and the famous "Celtic Tiger".

So careful: erecting fancy buildings alone does not equal development and prosperity, nor does it improve a country's quality of life in any way.

If anything, in such disproportionate economies such as the Balkan ones, you end up with a huge gap between the privileged elite and the rest of the people. On one hand you have skyscrapers and on the other hand you have unemployment and poverty and people living in degraded areas.

Sorry but no dice. You built your Greece entirely through loans and REPEATEDLY. We, on the other hand, have lots of foreign investment. The skyscrapers are being entirely financed by Cevahir Holdings, a Turkish investment firm. No dime from the Macedonian government will be spent on this project. Our debt level is also very low, at 27%, so it's not like we don't have any breathing room, can we say the same for Hellass? lol. We also have much less red tape to cut through vs Greece where red tape rules the land, AND it's the worst place to do business because of the closed business environment which breeds an noncompetitive economy... a la Greece 2012.

[Absinthe]

And you think that "foreign investments" are so different to loans from the EU? You are in for a big surprise. That's what we called it here as well, before the crisis :p


The skyscrapers are being entirely financed by Cevahir Holdings, a Turkish investment firm. No dime from the Macedonian government will be spent on this project.

Oh great, how proud you must be that the government has no money to spend on such an endeavor and brings in Turkish money to do so. :)


Our debt level is also very low, at 27%, so it's not like we don't have any breathing room, can we say the same for Hellass? lol.

That's what we were told in "Helass" too, before we found out the government hid its statistics and lied to everyone. Boy you're in for some big surprises! Fortunately it won't affect you, personally, as an American. ;)


We also have much less red tape to cut through vs Greece where red tape rules the land, AND it's the worst place to do business because of the closed business environment which breeds an noncompetitive economy... a la Greece 2012.

Back in the days I was talking about earlier, red tape had magically disappeared. Anyone could do just about anything and let's say 2 out of 3 people had somehow managed to built their own businesses. And now they're all closed and bankrupt.

Don't you get it, boy? I am not trying to be insulting here. I'm merely pointing out how the illusion of = prosperity can have its devastating effects upon a nation.

[poiuytrewq0987]

And you think that "foreign investments" are so different to loans from the EU? You are in for a big surprise. That's what we called it here as well, before the crisis :p

Taking money from EBRD =/ foreign investment.


Oh great, how proud you must be that the government has no money to spend on such an endeavor and brings in Turkish money to do so. :)

No, it's called being smart but seeing how the average Greek IQ is 92... I wouldn't hedge my bets.


That's what we were told in "Helass" too, before we found out the government hid its statistics and lied to everyone. Boy you're in for some big surprises!


Only in Greece.


Fortunately it won't affect you, personally, as an American. ;)

Even if it comes true it does affect my family who lives in Macedonia. So, sod off with your obsession about me.



Back in the days I was talking about earlier, red tape had magically disappeared. Anyone could do just about anything and let's say 2 out of 3 people had somehow managed to built their own businesses. And now they're all closed and bankrupt.

Oh no, if you think our banks just lend out money to everyone like Greece used to do. You thought wrong. My friend in Skopje who is trying to open a garage shop still is having trouble opening one because the banks are VERY VERY strict! Red tape is only cut for foreign investors but still very strict for Macedonians. Sorry... but we're not a fkked up country like Greece. We have rules in place.

[Queen B]

Macedonia has a pretty sizable gray economy which means unemployment is more around 20% not 30%. If you're going to complain about unemployment then our neighbors are in a worse sitauation than we are. Macedonia with unemployment rate of 20-30% for a country of 2 million vs... Greece with unemployment rate of 23% for a country of 11 million and Serbia with an unemployment rate of 25% for a country of 7 million. Our neighbors are in a far worse situation numbers-wise! I am sure you are just a troll though since you're constantly posting negatively about Macedonia. :rolleyes:

Greece's unemployement by 2012 is 22.6 %
Fyrob's unemployement by 2012 is 31.6 %

Also, as Bugarash pointed out, even with the crisis, the quality of life in Greece is 3 times as good as it is to your country.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Greece's unemployement by 2012 is 22.6 %

= 2,500,000!


Macedonia's unemployement by 2012 is 31.6 %

= 280,000 Sorry but your unemployment situation is FAR worse. Stop being dumb with percentages... what matters is the RAW numbers.


Also, as Bugarash pointed out, even with the crisis, the quality of life in Greece is 3 times as good as it is to your country.

That's because we're not robber barons unlike you people.

[Queen B]

How do I become a Macedonian?

I want to live the economic miracle, live in a symbolic skyscraper, walk through the Arch of Love, enjoy the fabled facades and be a statue for my people!

Where do I make my application?

:rotfl:

[Queen B]

= 2,500,000!

= 280,000 Sorry but your unemployment situation is FAR worse. Stop being dumb with percentages... what matters is the RAW numbers.



Hey, Einstein, there is a reason that's why the RATES are used to compare countries.
If you had 2.5 million unemployed, would mean that no-one would work in your country. But rates exist to compare countries of different populations.
That's why 2.5 million f.e. from Germany, is not the same with 2.5 from Greece. Even 10.000.000 unemployed from Germany is the same with let's say 5 million from Greece.

What you get is out of 100 Greeks, the 22 are unemployed. Out of 100 Fyromians, the 31 are unemployed. Get it?

I guess you were never good at math and statistics. That's what matters, genius :rolleyes2:



That's because we're not robber barons unlike you people.
I am pretty sure that you have no idea from what Quality of Life index and human development index is made from, genious.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Hey, Einstein, there is a reason that's why the RATES are used to compare countries.
If you had 2.5 million unemployed, would mean that no-one would work in your country. But rates exist to compare countries of different populations.
That's why 2.5 million f.e. from Germany, is not the same with 2.5 from Greece. Even 10.000.000 unemployed from Germany is the same with let's say 5 million from Greece.

What you get is out of 100 Greeks, the 22 are unemployed. Out of 100 Fyromians, the 31 are unemployed. Get it?

I guess you were never good at math and statistics. That's what matters, genius :rolleyes2:

:rotfl: You can twist the numbers all you want. It's what the Greeks are good at and precisely why they are 360 billion euros in debt. :rotfl: 2.5 million unemployed Greeks are still 2.5 million unemployed Greeks. If they had a regular job and were earning a salary then they wouldn't be called unemployed, "genius". :rolleyes: Additionally, there has already been a MASSIVE exodus of Greeks from the country where over 600,000 Greeks left for rich Western countries!



I am pretty sure that you have no idea from what Quality of Life index and human development index is made from, genious.

:rotfl: Danny boy, the ONLY reason why you have anything resembling a Western standard of living is because you ROBBED from Western European countries and then got Greece into MASSIVE debt to a point an EXIT from the EURO is considered! Your country is despicable, full of robbers, liars, cheats!

[Linet]

We robbed them :naughty:...we put a gun to their heads :whip: and said... "Give us your money! :icon_mad:"

She didnt twist any numbers :icon_ask:...she used something known as maths :chin:....but i suppose you have never heard of it :noidea:

PS. Yep yep :icon_yes:...we are despicable :dev but you are just a plain nothing :desert:

[Queen B]

:rotfl: You can twist the numbers all you want. It's what the Greeks are good at and precisely why they are 360 billion euros in debt. :rotfl: 2.5 million unemployed Greeks are still 2.5 million unemployed Greeks. If they had a regular job and were earning a salary then they wouldn't be called unemployed, "genius". :rolleyes: Additionally, there has already been a MASSIVE exodus of Greeks from the country where over 600,000 Greeks left for rich Western countries!

I m not twisting any numbers Douchesan. The numbers are there, in Eurostat and you can also find them. Greece has 22% you have 31%.
When we'll have the same rates, we can talk about unemployment.

Rates exist for a reason, go and check it. Your country is not a paradise, you should know this.But I guess you already do, else, you would live there in a first place, not in the states.



:rotfl: Danny boy, the ONLY reason why you have anything resembling a Western standard of living is because you ROBBED from Western European countries and then got Greece into MASSIVE debt to a point an EXIT from the EURO is considered! Your country is despicable, full of robbers, liars, cheats!
I was pretty sure that you are that stupid to post the same stupid things to point out how much of ignorant you are.
You don't know what affects boths of those indexes. Have a look here, Einstein.

Human development index =Life expectancy at birth, Education index, GNI per capita
Quality of life index= Life expectancy at birth, Divorce rate, Community life,: GDP per person, Political stability and security ratings, Climate and geography, Unemployment rate, Average of indexes of political and civil liberties, Gender equality

[Sturmgewehr]

The best indicator of the Macedonian Economic miracle is the 35% Unemployment rate :)

[poiuytrewq0987]

I m not twisting any numbers Douchesan. The numbers are there, in Eurostat and you can also find them. Greece has 22% you have 31%.
When we'll have the same rates, we can talk about unemployment.

Rates exist for a reason, go and check it. Your country is not a paradise, you should know this.But I guess you already do, else, you would live there in a first place, not in the states.


I was pretty sure that you are that stupid to post the same stupid things to point out how much of ignorant you are.
You don't know what affects boths of those indexes. Have a look here, Einstein.

Human development index =Life expectancy at birth, Education index, GNI per capita
Quality of life index= Life expectancy at birth, Divorce rate, Community life,: GDP per person, Political stability and security ratings, Climate and geography, Unemployment rate, Average of indexes of political and civil liberties, Gender equality


:rotfl: Deny, deny, deny... that's all Greeks are good at! My God!!! :rotfl:

[poiuytrewq0987]

The best indicator of the Macedonian Economic miracle is the 35% Unemployment rate :)

TELL me where did I SAY there is an economic miracle ongoing?? The HORRENDOUS reading comprehension of you guys!!! I SAID when the skyscrapers are completed in 2017!! It IS bound that there will be an economic miracle ongoing by then! All the foundations are in place for an economic miracle. What you all people want to do is troll and take my quotes out of context!

[Queen B]

:rotfl: Deny, deny, deny... that's all Greeks are good at! My God!!! :rotfl:
Where did you see that? I m pointing out numbers, facts, and rates. You pointing out bullshit, and irrelevant things.
Everyone here is laughing at you.

I have never said that Greece is a paradise to live, or that is as good as Norway or Germany in terms of economy. You say those hilarious things and close your eyes to reality, not accepting the facts. You are the one denying it.

Well, I m waiting for you to come and live to your paradise country. This miracle :rotfl:

[Linet]

.....Ok Dusan...dont bother...i ll tell you a secret :icon_whisper:
...Dand isnt very clever :icon_no: ...unlike you, she is using Maths, statistics and common knoweldge :nerd: and not your advanced imagination and clever tricks :wink

Of course i was ironic...she is far more clever... :wink

[poiuytrewq0987]

Where did you see that? I m pointing out numbers, facts, and rates. You pointing out bullshit, and irrelevant things.
Everyone here is laughing at you.

280,000 unemployed Macedonians vs 1.0-2.5 million unemployed Greeks. Percentages mean shit in this situation! You are the only one making a fool of yourself! Oh, maybe, you're just doing to impress Linet? :lol:


I have never said that Greece is a paradise to live, or that is as good as Norway or Germany in terms of economy. You say those hilarious things and close your eyes to reality, not accepting the facts. You are the one denying it.


I said REPEATEDLY, the only reason you even have a decent standard of living is BECAUSE rich Western countries uplifted your country with 360 billion euros of loans (more like stolen money since Greece can't even pay it all back!).

[Sturmgewehr]

TELL me where did I SAY there is an economic miracle ongoing?? The HORRENDOUS reading comprehension of you guys!!!

I highly doubt the "skyscrapers" will change the Macedonian Economy, they will just fill the pockets of certain investors and people involved in the project.

You should also read ur own thread title, it is not people who have problems with comprehension it is u who needs to formulate the concept better.

The thread says that the Macedonian Economy works miracles and the Skyscrapers will become its symbol.

Like saying, Jesus was a miracle and the healing of the blind was the symbol of his miracle or the awakening of the dead if u believe in fairy-tales

[Bugarash]

TELL me where did I SAY there is an economic miracle ongoing?? The HORRENDOUS reading comprehension of you guys!!! I SAID when the skyscrapers are completed in 2017!! It IS bound that there will be an economic miracle ongoing by then! All the foundations are in place for an economic miracle. What you all people want to do is troll and take my quotes out of context!
You said a tiger
which is even worse

[poiuytrewq0987]

You said a tiger
which is even worse


A tiger economy is the economy of a country which undergoes rapid economic growth, usually accompanied by an increase in the standard of living. The term was initially used for Japan, South Korea, Singapore, Hong Kong, and Taiwan (the East Asian Tigers or Four Little Tigers), and in the 1990s it was applied to the Republic of Ireland (the "Celtic Tiger"). Later on Dubai, Slovakia and the Baltic countries developed a tiger economy as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiger_economy



Please understand the meaning of 'tiger economy' before making such post! Oh, it's pointless to post here, in 5 years all of yers will have your mouth shut. :rolleyes:

[Onur]

Absinth, Dusan have a point. You cant compare Greece with Macedonia because you were able to live in fairytale for a decade because of 200+ billions of free EU funds on top of 400+ billions of loan from ECB. Macedonia doesn't do such a thing.


Greece's unemployement by 2012 is 22.6 %
Fyrob's unemployement by 2012 is 31.6 %

Also, as Bugarash pointed out, even with the crisis, the quality of life in Greece is 3 times as good as it is to your country.
Dandelion, you might regret about saying this next year because it`s expected that the unemployment rate to go up above 30% in a year in Greece. Also, you shouldn't be surprised that if the quality of life in Greece goes below Macedonia in less than a year. You know, Greece busted and you are able to continue to your "high quality of life" with foreign loans.

[Sturmgewehr]

U r comparing Macedonia with Japan TOLOLOLOLO :D :D :D :D

In 5 years maybe they will find a new way to enlarge penises and then maybe u will stop being insecure and stop opening this kind of threads.

You probably don't know anything about the Japanese Economy and what it was like before it reached its climax that is why u spouting ur nonsense here.

By this Logic Albania is gonna be a Lion in front of Macedonia :D



Absinth, Dusan have a point. You cant compare Greece with Macedonia

Now u r talking rot dude.

he is cxomparing Macedonia with Japan and he probably knows less than nothing about the Japanese Economy and how it developed through the years.

Dusan has no point, he just saw the concept of Tiger Economy and he thought he could apply that to Macedonia.

As I said by his Logic Albania in 5 years should be Lunching Satellites to Jupiter and Turkey should be traveling in Time and parallel dimensions :D

[poiuytrewq0987]

Where did I compare Macedonia with Japan? A TIGER ECONOMY doesn't mean JAPANESE ECONOMY! But... thanks for showing all of us how horrendous your reading comprehension is! Tiger economy is just a name for an economy that is growing fast with improving standard of living!

[Bugarash]

Please understand the meaning of 'tiger economy' before making such post! Oh, it's pointless to post here, in 5 years all of yers will have your mouth shut. :rolleyes:

Didint I show you that for Q1 the macedonian economy is in recession?:rolleyes:

[poiuytrewq0987]

Didint I show you that for Q1 the macedonian economy is in recession?:rolleyes:

Again... DID I say there is an economic miracle ongoing?? No! I said it IS likely to occur in 2017 with the new skyscrapers exemplified as example of such economic miracle! About Macedonian economy showing negative growth in first quarter... this isn't at all surprising because of economic troubles Greece is inflicting on Europe! All of Europe is in recession save for a few countries.

[Queen B]

280,000 unemployed Macedonians vs 1.0-2.5 million unemployed Greeks. Percentages mean shit in this situation! You are the only one making a fool of yourself! Oh, maybe, you're just doing to impress Linet? :lol:

Νο, its percentage that mean, you dumbo.
If we had the same population, yes, then the 280.000 compared to the 2.000.000 wouldn't be the same, but were we are talking about different sizes, then its rates that counts.
Unless the 6.5% unemployment of Germany ( 5.2 millions) means that is in worst situation of Greece .
After all ''percentages mean shit'', right?
Oh - my, what kidn of logic is that?
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-38Or80_CcWg/T2GKmR2YIBI/AAAAAAAAJwE/K2jN2vtuex8/s1600/618px-JeanLucPicardFacepalm.jpg



I said REPEATEDLY, the only reason you even have a decent standard of living is BECAUSE rich Western countries uplifted your country with 360 billion euros of loans (more like stolen money since Greece can't even pay it all back!).
Genious, see what those indexes are MADE of . Look at my previous post about that. I wonder if Climate, or life expectancy are also sponsored by Western money :rotfl:

Everyone is laughing at you, even people that support you in other threads. :D

[poiuytrewq0987]

If you are going to worship percentages, danny boy then I guess you should be proud of your 22.5% unemployment. Only 8% more until you catch up with us!!

[Queen B]

If you are going to worship percentages, danny boy then I guess you should be proud of your 22.5% unemployment. Only 8% more until you catch up with us!!
I m not worshiping anything. I m pointing out facts, something that you deny, and can't fight back.
Unlike YOU, I am working. Unlike YOU, I am living in my country.
Unlike you, I m pointing out facts.
:thumbs up

[Sturmgewehr]

Where did I compare Macedonia with Japan? A TIGER ECONOMY doesn't mean JAPANESE ECONOMY! But... thanks for showing all of us how horrendous your reading comprehension is! Tiger economy is just a name for an economy that is growing fast with improving standard of living!

U did indirectly, to be able to go through the Tiger Economy process u need to be Japan or the Japan during the 50s and u r not that by any means.

THERE IS NO ECONOMY IN THE WORLD that will grow fast with a 35% unemployment rate, without solving the unemployment issue u not gonna see any improvements, Macedonia will surely face a lot more unemployment in the future, just look at the Macedonian Administration, it is PACKED, I was reading some critiques and reviews from an European Institution, the review said based on statistical analysis that 40 - 50% of the Macedonian Administration should be made redundant, VMRO has been employing people in the Administrative sector just so they collect votes, many many peoples sit at home and receive salaries, I know at least 30 people like this personally.

Let's say u didn't compare Macedonia to Japan but u did allude to Macedonia being able to achieve TIGER ECONOMY = JAPANESE ECONOMY.

So yes, u r an illiterate douche if u think in 5 years u will be something, it is getting worse and worse, every year the gas prices go up, electricity, infrastructure is becoming more shit each year, there are minimal Investments compared to the Tiger economies who had HUGE investments and there is not even a single denominator that will make us hope for more investment, Macedonia is also Rated somewhere just above the bottom of the list of places where people wanna invest.

Get real yo :D.

2015 Albania is Launching their first Mars Expedition :D

[Onur]

Greece`s "quality of life" during the past decade was fake. It was an illusion created by the gigantic loans. I mean, if you give 500 billion Euros to Albania, they can live in a fairytale and be richer than Luxembourgers for a decade but this wouldn't represent a real situation of Albania. It would be fake, an illusion, just like your former days of "high quality of life".

So, we see the true capability of Greece for only the past two years. Actually even this is an illusion because they are still able to leech some money from ECB. We will see true economical state of Greece when Germans completely turn off the money tap. We wont wait for so long to see it. This will happen in the upcoming winter.

[dralos]

i dont love fyrom but its normal they and us have come to a good way,bcs we didnt get any funding atall,while greece got masses of money from eu and usa.
we had to do it all at our own,fyrom had its albanians to help it,in albania,alboz invest and work to rebuild it while greeks just use eu money,you people are lazy this is a fact

[poiuytrewq0987]

I m not worshiping anything. I m pointing out facts, something that you deny, and can't fight back.
Unlike YOU, I am working. Unlike YOU, I am living in my country.
Unlike you, I m pointing out facts.
:thumbs up

Yep, when you can't shut me out, you resort to personal attacks! How about the huge Greek diaspora, and the recently added diaspora amounting to 600,000 Greeks who fled Greece as soon benefits ran out??

[Bugarash]

Again... DID I say there is an economic miracle ongoing?? No! I said it IS likely to occur in 2017 with the new skyscrapers exemplified as example of such economic miracle! About Macedonian economy showing negative growth in first quarter... this isn't at all surprising because of economic troubles Greece is inflicting on Europe! All of Europe is in recession save for a few countries.


I really dont have the nerves explaining to you what is right,what is wrong,not to chew stuff you find on the playground to kids,teaching an amtsaff to dance.
For those three things I really dont have the nerves for.

BUT I MUST

1.Greece has nothing to do with the troubles in Europe!
2.You cant make a economic miracle accure by building a bunch of residential buildings that will suck in 5000 people from the already depopulating provincial regions to the capital.

How,oh how you dont get this??
or maybe you're a 15 year old pulling my nose here?

[Graham]

Always correlate skyscrapers with financial boom and bust, pretentious statements or urban poverty. Don't have great opinions on them.

[poiuytrewq0987]

I really dont have the nerves explaining to you what is right,what is wrong,not to chew stuff you find on the playground to kids,teaching a amtsaff to dance.
For those three things I really dont have the nerves for.

BUT I MUST

1.Greece has nothing to do with the troubles in Europe!
2.You cant make a economic miracle accure by building a bunch of residential buildings that will suck in 5000 people to the capital.

How,oh how you dont get this??
or maybe you're a 15 year old pulling my nose here?

Bugarofil! Where did I say the 4 skyscrapers will make Macedonia rich? I said they will only become a symbol of a revving Macedonian economy! If you think the new skyscrapers is the only thing that is being invested in the country. You thought wrong, there are a TON of different foreign investment projects being entirely funded by who... foreign investors. Not banks, or anything of that sort but money from investment firms who DECIDED to invest in Macedonia, be it a factory, residential building, a mall, but the fact is they are investing in the country with THEIR own money. That is a fact.

PLENTY more of info on foreign investment on this fine forum!: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=623673&page=2

[Bugarash]

i dont love fyrom but its normal they and us have come to a good way,bcs we didnt get any funding atall,while greece got masses of money from eu and usa.
we had to do it all at our own,fyrom had its albanians to help it,in albania,alboz invest and work to rebuild it while greeks just use eu money,you people are lazy this is a fact

And why blame the greeks for you living 50 years in a communist cave?

Greeks are the smart guy in this story.
All of you now,albanians,serbs,macedonians...are waiting in line for membership in the EU so you could use the same benefits the greeks use in the last 30 years.

[Linet]

Even if its a symbol :irminsul:...its a symbol that you wont built yourselves...:no000000:
Turks can be proud of it :thumb001:...you? No... :wink

Arent you tired of building nothing?
Arent tired of expecting others to give you? :confused2:

[poiuytrewq0987]

Even if its a symbol :irminsul:...its a symbol that you wont built yourselves...:no000000:
Turks can be proud of it :thumb001:...you? No... :wink

Try again, troll!



This investment will offer job to domestic construction companies, he added.


Cevahir Holdings will provide mainly logistics and planning but the skyscrapers will be built with Macedonian hands!

[Linet]

Troll :chin:
...Why? Is it a lie :noidea:? Turks will built it indeed...:thumbs:

[Fortis in Arduis]

:rotfl:

I am inconsolable. (FYROM)

The closest I shall ever be to living the Macedonian (FRYOM) dream would be sweeping up the fingernail clippings in the manicure salon beneath the Macedonian (FYROM) Embassy in London.

http://statics.192.com/estreet/original/large/1002/10029197.jpg

So ends the dream (FYROM) of a lifetime. :cry

[Queen B]

i dont love fyrom but its normal they and us have come to a good way,bcs we didnt get any funding atall,while greece got masses of money from eu and usa.
we had to do it all at our own,fyrom had its albanians to help it,in albania,alboz invest and work to rebuild it while greeks just use eu money,you people are lazy this is a fact

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Albania
http://www.neurope.eu/article/eu-provide-82-million-aid-albania
http://www.economist.com/node/835809

Yep, when you can't shut me out, you resort to personal attacks! How about the huge Greek diaspora, and the recently added diaspora amounting to 600,000 Greeks who fled Greece as soon benefits ran out??

I can't shut you out? I m pointing out FACTS and you all say ''deny deny''.
You are the one that you can't fight me and shut me out.

[Drawing-slim]

Absinth, Dusan have a point. You cant compare Greece with Macedonia because you were able to live in fairytale for a decade because of 200+ billions of free EU funds on top of 400+ billions of loan from ECB. Macedonia doesn't do such a thing.


Dandelion, you might regret about saying this next year because it`s expected that the unemployment rate to go up above 30% in a year in Greece. Also, you shouldn't be surprised that if the quality of life in Greece goes below Macedonia in less than a year. You know, Greece busted and you are able to continue to your "high quality of life" with foreign loans.This number is amazing.
600 billion euros how much money would that be for each individual person in greece. 10 million population!?

[Queen B]

I am inconsolable. (FYROM)

The closest I shall ever be to living the Macedonian (FRYOM) dream would be sweeping up the fingernail clippings in the manicure salon beneath the Macedonian (FYROM) Embassy in London.

So ends the dream (FYROM) of a lifetime. :cry

You can be, easily.
Wear socks and scandals, dress like this, and you would be a ''MAcedonian'' wariors
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-C14yeGRKl3Y/TmkxBWdXi2I/AAAAAAAAKm0/q3yD7yy3DhA/s1600/fyromian-redic2.jpg

[dralos]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_relations_of_Albania
http://www.neurope.eu/article/eu-provide-82-million-aid-albania
http://www.economist.com/node/835809


I can't shut you out? I m pointing out FACTS and you all say ''deny deny''.
You are the one that you can't fight me and shut me out.
82million towards 200 or 300 bilion that greece got lol:D

[Linet]

Whats up Dusan :eyes ? You cant put up with me and you give me negative reputation :chin: ? Thank you... :wink

[Queen B]

82million towards 200 or 300 bilion that greece got lol:D
I m not comparing anything.
I was just pointing out that ''we did that ourselves'' part of your post.
Plus, AID and LOAN are different things, I think.
Additionally, we have - at least - contributed to EU, while you, as a non-member, haven't.

Anyway, my point is not that, since I don't even care about Albania's economy, but I wanted to reply to what ''you have done for yourselves'', when at the same time, you tried to bash Greeks.

[The Lawspeaker]

Hmm.. I guess that there will be a real crash in the real estate market coming up. How do I know ? Look at the Netherlands and Spain. We've been there.

[Drawing-slim]

Honestly, its hard not to feel bad about the greek situation
I was reading a story yesterdy about this greek doctor who jumped off a building..
He had being retired for four months and hadn't recieved his pention.

Tragic really.

[Linet]

...Ahm...:1099:
...In your case i am not sure if i should say thank you :) or if there is a hint of sarcasm behind :icon_mad:....:icon_ask:

[Queen B]

...Ahm...:1099:
...In your case i am not sure if i should say thank you :) or if there is a hint of sarcasm behind :icon_mad:....:icon_ask:

I don't think its sarcasm. Only a really really bad person could ever make fun of a suicide, and although I dissagree with everything he says, I don't think he is that kind of person.

[Drawing-slim]

...Ahm...:1099:
...In your case i am not sure if i should say thank you :) or if there is a hint of sarcasm behind :icon_mad:....:icon_ask:I dont say stuff like that to get a thnx. I'm human first

There's somthing deeply sad in these stories..Also there's something nobel, unfortunately.
Think about how this doctor pictured his life and his retirement ten years ago which is literally yeaterday, and what he was faced with.

[iNird]

THERE IS NO ECONOMY IN THE WORLD that will grow fast with a 35% unemployment rate, without solving the unemployment issue u not gonna see any improvements, Macedonia will surely face a lot more unemployment in the future, just look at the Macedonian Administration, it is PACKED, I was reading some critiques and reviews from an European Institution, the review said based on statistical analysis that 40 - 50% of the Macedonian Administration should be made redundant, VMRO has been employing people in the Administrative sector just so they collect votes, many many peoples sit at home and receive salaries, I know at least 30 people like this personally.


Large public sector, large government expenditures, no real private sector, a shrinking population and an over-reliance on funds from the diaspora. Ye a real "tiger" in the making.

:coffee:

[iNird]

Also I just wanted to sa that, every-time I visit back to FYROM I dislike the place more and more and become more critical. At times, I don't even feel like visiting the place anymore. I don't understand how some of you diasporians are so "positive."

:confused:

[poiuytrewq0987]

Also I just wanted to sa that, every-time I visit back to FYROM I dislike the place more and more and become more critical. At times, I don't even feel like visiting the place anymore. I don't understand how some of you diasporians are so "positive."

:confused:

The country is probably becoming too Macedonian for your tastes? :confused: At least you have mother Albania. ;)

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/68/Albania_map_mk.png/200px-Albania_map_mk.png

[iNird]

The country is probably becoming too Macedonian for your tastes? :confused: At least you have mother Albania. ;)

I've only visited Albania about 5 times or so, and although it was behind Macedonia for quite some time, it has drastically improved with every trip I've made. Albania atleast has a sea and potential in tourism. Other than that it's the same shit.

Unfortunately I was born in Macedonia. Unlike most of you hardcore diasporians.

:laugh:

[Absinthe]

Dusan, I have one question for you, and with no intention at all of being ironic.

If you are such a patriot, then why aren't you there to help this country flourish and actively participate in this effort of development? What good are you doing to this country from another continent? I mean this, sincerely.

[poiuytrewq0987]

Dusan, I have one question for you, and with no intention at all of being ironic.

If you are such a patriot, then why aren't you there to help this country flourish and actively participate in this effort of development? What good are you doing to this country from another continent? I mean this, sincerely.

No offense, Abs, but I'm not going to lay out the intricate details of my life, of how I support Macedonia in the real world, and what I do to accomplish that... all on a public forum.

[Crn Volk]

http://www.setimes.com/cocoon/setimes/xhtml/en_GB/features/setimes/features/2012/07/30/feature-05

Turkish investment furthers co-operation with Macedonia
30/07/2012


Cevahir Holding's 300m-euro investment in a Skopje residential complex is an economic opportunity for Macedonia.

By Menekse Tokyay and Biljana Lajmanovska for Southeast European Times in Istanbul and Skopje -- 30/07/12

The construction of Skopje's largest private residential complex by Turkish company Cevahir Holding is expected to strengthen Macedonia-Turkey co-operation and encourage economic development in the Macedonian capital.

Eser Cevahir, a Cevahir Holding board member, told SETimes the company's primary goal is to extend innovative projects into new markets.

"Macedonia is a developing market economy and has good relations with Turkey. The advantage Macedonia offers to us comes from its location as a gateway to Europe with no visa requirements," Cevahir said.

The residential complex is located Skopje's expanding Aerodrom municipality. It is spread over 280,000 square meters and consists of four 42-floor towers – 130 m tall – and a business and shopping centre.

The company announced it will complete it within three years.

Owner Ibrahim Cevahir said he met extensively with Macedonia's leaders in the planning stages prior to concluding the deal.

The project is also an opportunity to help reduce the 30% unemployment rate.

"We called some experts and managers from Turkey, but we give special attention to hire Macedonians for other key stages of the construction works," Cevahir said.

The construction will be conducted by a Turkish-Macedonian engineering team, but officials said it will engage other production and service sectors.

Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski said the government will heed Cevahir's calls to relax the employment law and allow more readily foreign consultants.

"This type of huge construction will influence at least 20 other economic branches and will add value to the overall economy of the country," Vladimir Peshevski, Macedonia's deputy prime minister, said.

Turkey’s representative in Skopje, Ambassador Gurol Sokmensuer, said he hoped that Turkish investment in Macedonia will grow even more. "Despite being in times of global crisis, bilateral economic and commercial relations between Turkey and Macedonia are developing at a rapid pace and we look forward to, for our mutual benefit, further strengthening of the economic ties," he said.

The complex will house 5,000 people and an additional 2,000 to 3,000 people are expected to frequent it daily.

Real estate experts and citizens foresee an additional benefit -- a decrease in real estate prices that currently go for 1,200 to 1,300 euros per square meter.

"With a greater offer of apartments, [prices] may drop," municipality resident Slavcho Tanevski told SETimes.

Cevahir has not begun to sell the apartments yet, but company officials said interest is great. Macedonians and Turks have inquired about the project's progress.

Some Turks are already inspired to invest in real estate in Macedonia and are searching for family ties. Istanbul resident Asli Ozsar decided to purchase an apartment in Cevahir's residential complex.

"I have strong family roots in Skopje … [E]verybody from my family was quite excited about such an important residential project. It is a strong encouragement for some Turkish people [to] search for their Macedonian roots," Ozsar told SETimes.

[Albion]

The people with degrees in history, philosophy, literature, sociology... There are lots of useless educations where few will find jobs. And there will be younger people and student themselves who could do some of the jobs.

In no way realistic that 90% of the population will have university degrees.

Exactly. And this also links into how service economies are ultimately unsustainable. Why would the Chinese want endless services from us in return for their products? Eventually that trade deficit is going to have to be closed either by us consuming less or by us producing more.

Prizing useless services such as telemarketing and advertising over farming and manufacturing is the sign of sick economies. Eventually the west will have to learn that it can't base its quest for constant growth on nothing whilst the rest of the world will have to learn that they can't emulate the west.