Scots go mad in the food aisles.

[Beorn]

Food fight over Scots language in supermarkets


THE battle for independence has moved into the fruit and veg aisles. A Nationalist politician has written to supermarkets demanding that they translate the English names of fresh produce into their Scots equivalents, such as "tatties", "neeps" and "brambles".

Bill Wilson, the MSP for the West of Scotland, says stores should label goods in their stores according to the most commonly used Scots phrases north of the border.

Wilson says few people use the English names potato, turnip or blackberry, so the stores should change their labels. As a compromise, he suggests both the English and Scots words for fruit and vegetables could be used on packaging to respect both tongues.

Wilson, a long-time campaigner for Scots to be given equal status as a recognised language, has previously claimed that people who use Scots words face discrimination. But critics last night attacked him for wasting the stores' time during a recession.

Wilson said: "I can't see why they shouldn't use Scots words. For example, nobody uses the word 'blackberry' in Scotland; they're always referred to as brambles. The stores are very keen to say that they use Scots goods. Why don't they use Scots words as well?"

Wilson wrote to the main stories including Tesco, Sainsbury's and Asda, which have now given him a blunt rebuff, saying any change would cause confusion, particularly among tourists and new arrivals.

The campaign is just the latest attempt by Wilson to ensure the Scots language is given a more official status. He has called for the European Union to give Scots the status of a regional or minority language, so it is considered alongside Welsh, Gaelic and Irish.

Wilson also said that the failure to provide education to native speakers of Scots was "a breach of human rights".

Scots words for vegetables that Wilson wants to restore include the Scots "tumshie" for turnip. He says it would end the current confusion caused by the use of the English "swede" in supermarkets. He would also like spring onions to be referred to by the Scots "syboes".

Wilson said last night: "I haven't had an overwhelming response. Tesco said no they won't. The other supermarkets wrote back saying they thought it would cause confusion. Why don't we, in the year of Homecoming, recognise that there are other languages?"

Richard Dodd, of the Scottish Retail Consortium, said: "It would be like saying in other parts of the country that we're going to label potatoes as spuds. Product labelling is there to provide the maximum clarity to the biggest number of people, and that is why the correct and most widely understood words are the ones used.

"There will often be people visiting from other parts of the country who might not understand these words. Tourism is also very important to the Scottish economy, and if you end up with overseas visitors being confused by what is on the label, it isn't good for them or us".

Labour MP for Aberdeen South Anne Begg accused the SNP of wasting time. She said: "It doesn't matter what things are called on the bag – what's inside is important. We are all proud of our Scots tongue, but people are worried about their jobs and homes, not the names vegetables are sold under."

She added: "What will the SNP be wanting next? Different packages for rowies and butteries depending which part of the north-east the supermarket is in? Different bags for softies and hardies depending on the local words?"

One industry source added: "This idea was clearly dreamed up sitting on the cludgie. Scottish food and drink should be going more global, not more parochial."

Source (http://news.scotsman.com/scotland/Food-fight-over-Scots-language.5386456.jp)

[Fortis in Arduis]

How about obliterating the supermarkets and replacing them with locally-owned buying co-operatives?

Oh, but the SNP is chock full of shit, I forgot...

[Allenson]

How about obliterating the supermarkets and replacing them with locally-owned buying co-operatives?.

Is there such a thing in Britain? I'd be surprised if there weren't.

We have them here.

We also have quite a few CSAs (community supported agriculture) where folks buy a share of a local farm's output and are entitled to a weekly supply of fresh fruits & veggies during the growing season. I'm not a member of a CSA but I know a fellow who runs one....

[Fortis in Arduis]

Is there such a thing in Britain? I'd be surprised if there weren't.

We have them here.

We also have quite a few CSAs (community supported agriculture) where folks buy a share of a local farm's output and are entitled to a weekly supply of fresh fruits & veggies during the growing season. I'm not a member of a CSA but I know a fellow who runs one....

There is a co-operative movement, but the only UK political party who would use public money to assist such ventures is the British National Party.

The SNP lost all their interesting radical policies like money reform in the 1950s.

[Paleo]

allot of small local shops do it anyway,but i see no real reason not to do it . i consider it to be a language in its own right and should not be looked down on! (as allot of upper-class and English do, not all though:P)

(with all the immigration into Scotland, the "Scots language" it slowly dieing out:cry2)

[Óttar]

Ridiculous. Scots and standard English are ultimately both mutually intelligible for Scottish people. You don't see produce in Mississippi translated into redneck.

[The Lawspeaker]

Ridiculous. Scots and standard English are ultimately both mutually intelligible for Scottish people. You don't see produce in Mississippi translated into redneck.
Well my English is relatively fluent but I really have trouble understanding what some of my (rl) Scottish friends say and sometimes write. It's not only the accent but sometimes also the lexicon and even grammar.

[Beorn]

(with all the immigration into Scotland, the "Scots language" it slowly dieing out:cry2)

With no disrespect to you my Scottish chum (:p), but like England, the local dialects are far from withering and dying, but growing and expanding their core vocabulary.

Whether they be Neds or Chavs, the local slang and mannerisms are growing and/or vegetating in key core areas; like Glasgow, Endinburgh, Bristol, Taunton, etc... the onus is upon us to harness this staunchly local patriotism and nurture it past the constant attack of the Queens English.

Hey, could you imagine Naveed speaking like a 'ladee-da'? Just ain't as funny, is it? ;)

[Paleo]

With no disrespect to you my Scottish chum (:p), but like England, the local dialects are far from withering and dying, but growing and expanding their core vocabulary.

not quite friend, growing up we spoke nothing (with the exception of my mother) nothing but Scots, and iv noticed its decline with all the pakistanie,Negro and chinese immigrants moving here.
(not to mention the major tension between native Scots and immigrants)


Whether they be Neds or Chavs, the local slang and mannerisms are growing and/or vegetating in key core areas; like Glasgow, Edinburgh, Bristol, Taunton, etc... the onus is upon us to harness this staunchly local patriotism and nurture it past the constant attack of the Queens English.

it always been spoken here for hundreds of years (in the lowlands). we all can speak English, but are native tough it Scots. seams to me the queens English is attacking the Scots dialect.

[Beorn]

It must be the strength of the dialect then, as in Bristol you find that all kids of any background soon pick up the local accent and dialect. Obviously the blacks still talk their mumbo-jumbo gangster shieet, but even they still resort to the 'oo-ar' when their mates aren't around.

[Fortis in Arduis]

not quite friend, growing up we spoke nothing (with the exception of my mother) nothing but Scots, and iv noticed its decline with all the pakistanie,Negro and chinese immigrants moving here.
(not to mention the major tension between native Scots and immigrants)

it always been spoken here for hundreds of years (in the lowlands). we all can speak English, but are native tough it Scots. seams to me the queens English is attacking the Scots dialect.

I have a particular interest in the English language as I am training to proofread and copy-edit, and my general impression is that whilst dialects are not being protected, standard English is being depreciated.

There are correct and incorrect forms of spelling, grammar and punctuation for standard English and our native dialects, and there are better and worse forms of sentence structure.

I am not an expert yet, but in correcting yourself:

Not quite, friend. Growing up, we spoke nothing but Scots (with the exception of my mother) and I have noticed its decline with all the Pakistani, negro and Chinese immigrants moving here, not to mention the major tension between native Scots and immigrants.

It has always been spoken here in the lowlands for hundreds of years. We can all speak English, but are native tough-it Scots.

It seems to me that the Queen's English is attacking the Scots dialect.

Why do you not write in Scots?

[Paleo]

There are correct and incorrect forms of spelling, grammar and punctuation for standard English and our native dialects, and there are better and worse forms of sentence structure.

I am not an expert yet, but in correcting yourself:

[I]Not quite, friend. Growing up, we spoke nothing but Scots (with the exception of my mother) and I have noticed its decline with all the Pakistani, negro and Chinese immigrants moving here, not to mention the major tension between native Scots and immigrants.

It has always been spoken here in the lowlands for hundreds of years. We can all speak English, but are native tough-it Scots.

oh hell, dyslexia.. you got me again:shakefist


Why do you not write in Scots?

its very hard to understand when reading.

examples:

"ah went oot fir a game o fitba"

" wahr dae yi bide?"

"ah pand yir windie, fir bein a babag!"

" git tae fuk!"

" shut yir pus! ya wee jakeba"

its easier to read English.:thumbs up

[Albion]

Yes, as highlighted above the problem is Scots is phonetic, it simply looks like English spelt very badly and to Scottish people brought up with an education system that uses English spellings it would be hard to grasp.
Children would need to be taught Scots reading and writing at school for it to work, its easy enough to talk and hear it but reading and writing it is a different matter.