Which is Bulgarian history, politics and culture more tied with; Greece or Russia?

[Trun]

Discuss. Let's hit 50 pages.

[Archduke]

It's very difficult to answer.

[Tabiti]

North-east Russia, South-east and Central Asia. And maybe some Central Africa.

[Trun]

It's very difficult to answer.

I'm expecting 50 pages because of that. This topic has been discussed, but still.

I think, if we exclude 1944-1989, history and politics with Med Europe. Culture, in between.

[Sikeliot]

The rest of the Balkans, Greece, and Turkey.

Not so much Mediterranean Europe (i.e. they have little to do history with Spain and Portugal, Italy, etc.) but a Balkan-West Asian sphere of influence, so I'd say "Greece and Turkey" instead of "Mediterranean Europe".

[Trun]

By Med Europe I mean mostly where Greco-Romans lived. And mostly modern Italy, Greece, Croatia and Montenegro.

[Tabiti]

I'm expecting 50 pages because of that. This topic has been discussed, but still.

I think, if we exclude 1944-1989, history and politics with Med Europe. Culture, in between.
So, what makes you think we were have in common with Italy and Spain? Catholicism, Renaissance, Colonisation of the New World or probably olives?

[Trun]

So, what makes you think we were have in common with Italy and Spain? Catholicism, Renaissance, Colonisation of the New World or probably olives?

The beaches and that we both have had a team in the Champion's League.

[Tabiti]

The beaches and that we both have had a team in the Champion's League.
And mafia, the words "chao", "gusto" and so;)

[morski]

So, what makes you think we were have in common with Italy and Spain? Catholicism, Renaissance, Colonisation of the New World or probably olives?

Well, in medieval times there used to be some interaction with the Italian merchant republics of Venice and Genoa, some Catalan pirates even made it to the Southern Black Sea coast. In the Strandzha dialect the vocabulary on maritime activities(names of types of boats, winds, waves, etc.) is of Italian-Spanish origin.

[Archduke]

Most foreigners, which were never been in Bulgaria describe us as dark, grey, cold country and associate us with Russians mainly because communism.

I bet that most Americans would be suprised that we don't look Russian.

[Trun]

Even if I remember correctly, on the South Black sea coast we have domestic olives. One more similarity.

Now seriously, by Med Europe I mean mostly Greco-Roman and Thracian heritage. Also the modern EU and the age of capitalism between 1878-1944.

As I said, I exclude Spain and Southern France.


I bet that most Americans would be suprised that we don't look Russian.

For them Russians look either like Balkan or Caucasian ethnicities. They'd be rather surprised how Russians look like.

By the way, I doubt any Greek or Italian to say they find us similar. For them we are shitty ethnicity.

[Sikeliot]

I think that without a doubt, Bulgaria is culturally more akin to Greece than to Russia. I have a friend from Bulgaria and when she speaks of Bulgarian food, she is speaking of moussaka, baklava, and items that are common to the Balkans, Turkey, and the Caucasus.. she's not speaking of boiled potatoes and cabbage and other "northern" foods. Bulgarian music also sounds similar to Greek music.

[Tabiti]

Well, in medieval times there used to be some interaction with the Italian merchant republics of Venice and Genoa, some Catalan pirates even made it to the Southern Black Sea coast. In the Strandzha dialect the vocabulary on maritime activities(names of types of boats, winds, waves, etc.) is of Italian-Spanish origin.
Following that logic we're tied with almost whole Europe since some of the crusaders passed through here. Not to mention the attacks of Goths and the colonisation of Romans in more ancient times.

[Archduke]

I think that without a doubt, Bulgaria is culturally more akin to Greece than to Russia. I have a friend from Bulgaria and when she speaks of Bulgarian food, she is speaking of moussaka, baklava, and items that are common to the Balkans, Turkey, and the Caucasus.. she's not speaking of boiled potatoes and cabbage and other "northern" foods. Bulgarian music also sounds similar to Greek music.

That's Ottoman heritage.

[Sikeliot]

That's Ottoman heritage.

Exactly. And from my perspective, Bulgarian culture today is in large part, transplanted Ottoman culture. It may not have always been, but the Ottoman Empire has likely played the most essential role in what Bulgaria is today.

[morski]

Following that logic we're tied with almost whole Europe since some of the crusaders passed through here. Not to mention the attacks of Goths and the colonisation of Romans in more ancient times.

Hehe, no shit Sherlock! Bulgaria is in Europe.

[Tabiti]

she's not speaking of boiled potatoes and cabbage and other "northern" foods. .
Oh, common, everyone here loves sauerkraut with pork (for me the pig only, please;)) and in some regions they eat only potatoes...
The modern Greek music is like the Bulgarian one because both turbo folk performers steal their music.

[Trun]

I think that without a doubt, Bulgaria is culturally more akin to Greece than to Russia. I have a friend from Bulgaria and when she speaks of Bulgarian food, she is speaking of moussaka, baklava, and items that are common to the Balkans, Turkey, and the Caucasus.. she's not speaking of boiled potatoes and cabbage and other "northern" foods. Bulgarian music also sounds similar to Greek music.

But I understand what a Russian tells me, while Greek language sounds like "hala-sasa-masa" to me.

Also many Bulgarians claim we have the same mentality and traditions with Russians, I haven't seen such thing however...Russians are much colder and introvert than us, and much more frowned in nature. Greeks are very materialistic however, we aren't like them.

[morski]

Oh, common, everyone here loves sauerkraut with pork (for me the pig only, please;)) and in some regions they eat only potatoes...
The modern Greek music is like the Bulgarian one because both turbo folk performers steal their music.

Which would those potato eating regions be?

[Sikeliot]

Also many Bulgarians claim we have the same mentality and traditions with Russians, I haven't seen such thing however...Russians are much colder and introvert than us, and much more frowned in nature. Greeks are very materialistic however, we aren't like them.

I don't think so. The Bulgarians I know are vibrant and loud people, while the Russians I know are quiet and suspicious people. I'd say you guys act more like Sicilians than like Russians.

Looks wise, Russians look like a cold people.. Bulgarians have a warmth to their faces.

[Trun]

Southerners also eat pork, cuisine is not that indicative. But sure it tells many things.

Btw, Bulgaria and Greece have similarities because we were both part of Byzantine and Ottoman Empires, Bulgaria and Russia because we are both Slavs. So the question is rather Greece vs Russia.

[Sikeliot]

Southerners also eat pork, cuisine is not that indicative. But sure it tells many things.

Btw, Bulgaria and Greece have similarities because we were both part of Byzantine and Ottoman Empires, Bulgaria and Russia because we are both Slavs. So the question is rather Greece vs Russia.

Then undoubtedly Greece IMO. Other than language and more Slavic heritage (but Greeks have some too!) what do Bulgarians have in common with Russians that they don't have in common with Greeks?

[morski]

Southerners also eat pork, cuisine is not that indicative. But sure it tells many things.

Btw, Bulgaria and Greece have similarities because we were both part of Byzantine and Ottoman Empires, Bulgaria and Russia because we are both Slavs. So the question is rather Greece vs Russia.

The core of both Bulgarian and Russian culture is the Slavo-Byzantine culture that was born in and spread out of the First Bulgarian Empire. So there you go.

@Sikeliot

Russians are not suspicious, wtf!? You haven't heard much of the Russian soul, have you? I suggest you find yourself some Russkies and have a drink with them, haha.

[Trun]

Then undoubtedly Greece IMO. Other than language and more Slavic heritage (but Greeks have some too!) what do Bulgarians have in common with Russians that they don't have in common with Greeks?

Hot women, and lots of rituals with Slavic heritage.

Can you change the poll options to Greece and Russia?

[Tabiti]

Neither Russians I know are cold, neither we're vibrant. Loud maybe, but more in the negative meaning. Russians are much more disciplined, maybe mostly due historical memory of totalitarism.
However the most distinguishing Bulgarian trait is individuality. There's no strong national "aura".

[Sikeliot]

I did, and I changed the thread title too.

[Trun]

I have inherited dislike for Russians, and adopted dislike for Greeks. Don't take my opinion as relevant therefore. I'll probably spit hate on both.

It'll be good to hear Greek and Russian opinions. Greeks: "Fuck you, third world gypsies", Russians: "Oh our dear Slavic brothers, let us be your masters again".

[morski]

Neither Russians I know are cold, neither we're vibrant. Loud maybe, but more in the negative meaning. Russians are much more disciplined, maybe mostly due historical memory of totalitarism.
However the most distinguishing Bulgarian trait is individuality. There's no strong national "aura".

When I read your posts I kinda feel like I'm reading an old Warsaw Pact era leaflet on Bulgarian self-stereotypes, seriously. Almost all of your statements are very misleading and hateful generalizations.

Russians more disciplined? Really, where the hell do you come up with those things?

[Sikeliot]

I just was saying my own perception from the outside.. Bulgarians are warm Southerners, and Russians are cold Northerners. When I see Russians I see people who look like they come from somewhere icy and cold, with personalities to match. I don't get that vibe from Bulgarians, many of whom remind me of Greeks, Turks, and other Balkanians.

[Xenomorph]

It'll be good to hear Greek and Russian opinions. Greeks: "Fuck you, third world gypsies", Russians: "Oh our dear Slavic brothers, let us be your masters again".

This is understandable. The Greeks have their delusions of being some pure master race and the Russians have typically been more than a little aggressive towards their neighbors.

[Midori]

If I have to choose between Greece and Russia, I pick Greece.
But I voted for Russia since the original question was whether Bulgaria is more tied to the Mediterranean countries (which include Spain, Italy and Portugal) or Russia.


I just was saying my own perception from the outside.. Bulgarians are warm Southerners, and Russians are cold Northerners. When I see Russians I see people who look like they come from somewhere icy and cold, with personalities to match. I don't get that vibe from Bulgarians, many of whom remind me of Greeks, Turks, and other Balkanians.

I guess I fit much better in Russia than in the Balkans then :D

[Anusiya]

This is understandable. The Greeks have their delusions of being some pure master race and the Russians have typically been more than a little aggressive towards their neighbors.

Actually no. The Bulgarians are predominantly a cultural blend of Turkic tribes and Slavs appearing in the region during the 7th century AD. At that time there were no Greeks, but Roman/Byzantines and certainly not Russians in their current "form". I voted Russia because of the strong slavonic elements and their cuisine/diet. And LOL, no I am not "pure".:p

[Trun]

Actually no. The Bulgarians are predominantly a cultural blend of Turkic tribes and Slavs appearing in the region during the 7th century AD. At that time there were no Greeks, but Roman/Byzantines and certainly not Russians in their current "form". I voted Russia because of the strong slavonic elements and their cuisine/diet. And LOL, no I am not "pure".:p

What? Bulgarians culturally similar to Turkic tribes? :picard1: What is the similarity, living in yurts or worshiping Tengri? Ugh, modern Bulgaria is as far culturally from Turkic people (except Turks, Gagauz and Volga Tatars) as from Native Americans.

Similar cuisine/diet with Russia? Really? Our cuisine is similar with other Balkanites (including Greeks) and Turks.

[Archduke]

I voted for Russia since for me Greeks are totally foreign people.From my personal experience, i would say that Russians aren't those "cold" people which Sikeliot describes. They are very friendly and most of them are ready to die for Bulgaria.

When i was in Thasos, the guide there mentioned that the island was part of Bulgaria in WW2 and one Russian woman behind me started screming "Return it to Bulgaria, return it to Bulgaria!!!"

Russians are very cool people and they have the same mentality like Bulgarians.

[Γέλως]

...and most of them are ready to die for Bulgaria.:picard1:

[Trun]

I voted for Russia since for me Greeks are totally foreign people.From my personal experience, i would say that Russians aren't those "cold" people which Sikeliot describes. They are very friendly and most of them are ready to die for Bulgaria.

When i was in Thasos, the guide there mentioned that the island was part of Bulgaria in WW2 and one Russian woman behind me started screming "Return it to Bulgaria, return it to Bulgaria!!!"

Russians are very cool people and they have the same mentality like Bulgarians.

I have had exactly the opposite experience with Russians and Greeks. So I guess it's all based on individuals of course.

And "die for Bulgaria" is an enormous exaggeration IMO.

I have spoken with Padre Organtino about Russian stereotype for Bulgarians and what he said shocked me.

[beaver]

feuerfrei
It'll be good to hear Greek and Russian opinions. Greeks: "Fuck you, third world gypsies", Russians: "Oh our dear Slavic brothers, let us be your masters again".



You dont know modern Russians: fuck all Russians, fuck all Slavic, fuck all Universe.

[Trun]

LOL, I'm the only Bulgarian who voted Greece, probably only I had bad experience with Russians.

[bimo]

I don't think so. The Bulgarians I know are vibrant and loud people, while the Russians I know are quiet and suspicious people. I'd say you guys act more like Sicilians than like Russians.

Looks wise, Russians look like a cold people.. Bulgarians have a warmth to their faces.

surely russian are cold compared to bulgarians , but russians are more warm people compared to northern europeean

[bimo]

bulgaria is different both from russian and greece , even if have more connection with russia in my opinion but they are conneced even with mediterranean europe , now that's bulgarian are more warm people and their mentality/style of life have southern europeean influence is another matter , and bulgarian mentality is not even like sicilian or greeks mentality

however why i don't see any pool where is write , are russian closer to bulgarian or polish? , agre greeks closer to southern italians or bulgarians? , i am tired of that a nation like bulgaria with great history and the first slavic nation must always be pulled under some other country

[Psa31]

I voted russia because of the slavic link.

[Psa31]

bulgaria is different both from russian and greece , even if have more connection with russia in my opinion but they are conneced even with mediterranean europe , now that's bulgarian are more warm people and their mentality/style of life have southern europeean influence is another matter , and bulgarian mentality is not even like sicilian or greeks mentality

however why i don't see any pool where is write , are russian closer to bulgarian or polish? , agre greeks closer to southern italians or bulgarians? , i am tired of that a nation like bulgaria with great history and the first slavic nation must always be pulled under some other country

Agreed. Bulgaria can't really be pulled under some other country. It has its own unique culture.