The Turks of Bulgaria

[Crn Volk]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turks_in_Bulgaria

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/46/TurksInBGPercent2011.svg/800px-TurksInBGPercent2011.svg.png

Bulgaria's constitution and various international treaties required it to grant minorities, including the Turkish population, equal treatment before law (however, the Tarnovo constitution also required, discriminatorily, direct government control over all, minority or majority, religious communities[74]). The policy of equal treatment was pursued inconsistently.[75] All in all, Turks and other Muslims were able to freely maintain their own cultural life during most of the time until World War II, but with periods of gross human rights violations, including a major onslaught during the right-wing authoritarian regime in the last decade of that period. Other abuses included denied access to public service and refusal of tax relief and agricultural loans as a way to encourage emigration,[76] as well as state appointment of Muslim muftis.

The condition of Turks and Bulgarian Muslims worsened gravely after the 1934 coup d'état and the establishment of Boris III's quasi-dictatorship[77] and remained so until the Communist takeover. Muslim minority teachers were deprived of pensions and the participation of the Muslim community in political and cultural life was minimized. As mentioned above, there was an immediate assault on Turkish-language press and by 1941 all Turkish-language newspapers were banned. This was justified with the claim that it promoted Kemalist ideas.[66] In general, pro-Kemalist organizations were systematically dissolved, as Kemalism was regarded as a form of pan-Turkism that turned the Bulgarian Turks into a fifth column of Turkey.[78] Ironically, emigration to Turkey was nevertheless banned during this until the early 1940s, when the government decided to issue emigration permits en masse in order to get rid of the "fifth column". Turkey, on the other hand, was very reluctant to admit any huge immigration from Bulgaria. At the same time, the overall conditions worsened even more, as the pro-Nazi regime closed all Muslim minority schools as well as schools with a significant number of Muslim or Turkish members, shut down mosques and even medical centres in predominantly Muslim areas, and systematically distributed smaller wartime foodstuff portions to Turks and other Muslims than to non-Muslim Bulgarians.[79]

The Turks were not targets of violent assimilation attempts during most of this period, although Bulgarian-speaking Muslims (Pomaks) were targeted in two such state-organized campaigns - once during the Balkan wars (which was later revoked by the Liberal Party government elected also with Pomak votes), and once in 1942,[80] by the notorious “Bulgarian-Mohammedan Cultural-Educational and Charitable Association - Rodina”. This also involved a ban on Pomak-Turkish intermarriage and coercive replacement of the Pomaks' Muslim names with Christian ones.[81]

[Bugarash 1893]

Feel better now? cuz Im sure your felt better momentarily:D

[Crn Volk]

Feel better now? cuz Im sure your felt better momentarily:D

Yeah, a little;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movement_for_Rights_and_Freedoms

http://turkeymacedonia.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/ahmed-dogan-bulgaria.jpg


http://s1.dmcdn.net/ooiq/320x240-buM.jpg

[Guapo]

Движение за права и свободи
Hak ve Özgürlükler Hareketi

:lol:

[Crn Volk]

Independent Western Thrace

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Government_of_Western_Thrace

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/52/Flag_of_TRWT-Republic_of_Gumuljina.PNG/800px-Flag_of_TRWT-Republic_of_Gumuljina.PNG

The Provisional Government of Western Thrace[1][2][3] (Ottoman Turkish: غربی تراقیا حكومت موقتهسی - Garbi Trakya Hükûmet-i Muvakkatesi), later renamed to Independent Government of Western Thrace[1][4] (Ottoman Turkish: غربی تراقیا حكومت مستقلهسی - Garbi Trakya Hükûmet-i Müstakilesi), was a small, short-lived unrecognized republic established in Western Thrace from August 31 to October 25, 1913. It encompassed the area surrounded by the rivers Maritsa (Evros) in the east, Mesta (Nestos) in the west, the Rhodope Mountains in the north and the Aegean Sea in the south. Its total territory was c. 8.600 km².

This administration was created during the Second Balkan War by a joint rebellion of Turks and Pomaks against the withdrawing Bulgarian forces who had recently annexed the region. It survived for 3 months, between two Balkan treaties; between the May 1913 Treaty of London and the August 1913 Treaty of Bucharest that ended the Second Balkan War.

It was founded as a provisional state, in order to return the territory to the Ottoman Empire later. However, Greek forces occupied its major cities (Porto Lagos, Komotini and Alexandroupolis) and handed them over to Bulgaria, according to the terms of the Treaty of Bucharest (1913). The area remained a part of Bulgaria until 1919 when it was taken under French protectate. It was finally annexed by Greece in 1920 and has been part of that country ever since, except for the Bulgarian occupation between 1941-1944. Its capital was Gümülcine, now (Greek: Κομοτηνή, Komotini), in Greece.

[Crn Volk]

Republic of Tamrash

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Tamrash

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/ff/Map_Of_The_Republic_Of_Tamrash_EN.png/522px-Map_Of_The_Republic_Of_Tamrash_EN.png

The Republic of Tamrash (Bulgarian: Тъмръшка република, Tamrashka republika) was a short-lived self-governing administrative structure of the Pomaks, living in the Tamrash region of the Rhodope Mountains. It existed from 1878 to 1886.

Geography

The territory spanned over the area locked between the Vacha River and the Chepelare River. The rebel territory initially consisted of 17 villages but its number increased up to 21 in 1880. Some of those villages were Trigrad, Mugla, Beden, Mihalkovo, Skoblevo, Churukovo and Devin.

History

The self-governing territory emerged as the Pomaks of the Tamrash region struggled to avoid the influence and the rule of the Christian Bulgarians and the Russians after the Russo-Turkish War.

President of the territory was Ahmed Agha Tamrashlyata. He had participated in the April Uprising, supported by the dwellers of the Tamrash villages on the Ottoman side, so when two years later the Bulgarian and Russian forces advanced to the south, he and his fellows fled even further south to avoid retaliation.

After the Russian army withdrew from the hard to supply Rhodope Mountains, the agha and his party returned to their villages to establish the self-governing territory.

Ahmed Agha Tamrashlyata imposed three times lower taxes which led to expanding the territory from 17 to 21 villages in the autumn of 1880. At the same time the Republic of Tamrash sent a representative in Plovdiv and introduced visas. But in the winter of the same year officials from Tamrash, the Ottoman Empire and the authority of Eastern Rumelia met and agreed that the newly added 4 villages should be returned to Eastern Rumelia.

[Guapo]

jebata turska bugarska kopilada

[Crn Volk]

It seems the bulgars need to look at their own backyard, instead of looking to gain more land.

[Guapo]

It seems the bulgars need to look at their own backyard, instead of looking to gain more land.

Gain what? To be closer to their other Turkic kin the Albanians as well as Turkey? :lmao:

[Methmatician]

Sokol, Pomaks aren't Turks.

[Bugarash 1893]

It seems the bulgars need to look at their own backyard, instead of looking to gain more land.

What yard and in terms of what?

I still cant see what are you trying to prove?:rolleyes:

It is crazy to even compare things in Macedonia with Bulgaria.
In Bulgaria there isnt even officialy a turkish minority.

in Macedonia they talk in albanian while speaking from the main post in the parlament.

[Talvi]

My boyfriends parents, grandparents etc lived in Bulgaria but were forced to immigrate back to Turkey in the end of the 80s or beginning of 90s. Something like that. All of his family holds dual citizenship though and they can all speak Bulgarian and also Russian. (except for my bf since he grew up in Turkey)

[Bugarash 1893]

My boyfriends parents, grandparents etc lived in Bulgaria but were forced to immigrate back to Turkey in the end of the 80s or beginning of 90s. Something like that. All of his family holds dual citizenship though and they can all speak Bulgarian and also Russian. (except for my bf since he grew up in Turkey)

How the hack you found a turk in Japan to be your bf?

[Crn Volk]

Yes, things are just rosie in bulgaria...

http://media.economist.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/290-width/images/print-edition/20111008_EUP003_0.jpg

http://www.thenational.ae/deployedfiles/Assets/Richmedia/Image/SaxoPress/AD20111021866524-Police%20officers.jpg

[Bugarash 1893]

Sokol, Pomaks aren't Turks.

Sokol is just mad for some reason because Macedonia is being run over by minorities and Bulgaria isn't.

[Crn Volk]

Sokol, Pomaks aren't Turks.


Yes, I know. But they did have there own republic at one time, and are muslim.

[Talvi]

How the hack you found a turk in Japan to be your bf?

:D there are some Turks selling kebab and ice cream on every festival here.

However I met him when I was still in my home country and he was doing Erasmus there.

[Bugarash 1893]

Yes, things are just rosie in bulgaria...

http://media.economist.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/290-width/images/print-edition/20111008_EUP003_0.jpg

http://www.thenational.ae/deployedfiles/Assets/Richmedia/Image/SaxoPress/AD20111021866524-Police%20officers.jpg

Point?

You are running out of ideas.:D


Show me something like this from Bulgaria:

albanians in front of the government building in Skopje

ppW7evLSe0E

[Crn Volk]

Point?

You are running out of ideas.:D


Show me something like this from Bulgaria:

albanians in front of the government building in Skopje

ppW7evLSe0E

You are not immune to this. Bulgaria is a Balkan country. You act like Bulgaria is Iceland or Denmark:rolleyes2:

[Bugarash 1893]

Yes, I know. But they did have there own republic at one time, and are muslim.

Yes,a republic the size of San Marino,lasted 1 year and the Ottomans stood behind the entire project.

Do you read the links you post?

Running out of ideas Sokol:D

[Methmatician]

Yes, I know. But they did have there own republic at one time, and are muslim.

That still doesn't make them Turkish.

[morski]

Sokol is just a pissed off hater. He knows perfectly well that we are right and he's wrong. He can't disprove anything about the history of MAcedonia we post, but he's Yugo-brain just can't manage the truth.

[Crn Volk]

Sokol is just a pissed off hater. He knows perfectly well that we are right and he's wrong. He can't disprove anything about the history of MAcedonia we post, but he's Yugo-brain just can't manage the truth.

This thread is about Turks of Bulgaria, not Macedonia. Stick to the topic.

[Bugarash 1893]

This thread is about Turks of Bulgaria, not Macedonia. Stick to the topic.

Same,you are pissed off because Macedonia is a banana state where the minorities stuck the macedonians in a bottle and Bulgaria isn't.

Btw if Bulgaria wanted to remove every trace of turks in Bulgaria she would have done it,there were a million opportunities.

It could have just opened death camps in WW2 and just...but it didint.
So...spare us from the stories of bulgarians assimilating,killing poor helpless turks.

[Crn Volk]

Same,you are pissed off because Macedonia is a banana state where the minorities stuck the macedonians in a bottle and Bulgaria isn't.

Btw if Bulgaria wanted to remove every trace of turks in Bulgaria she would have done it,there were a million opportunities.

It could have just opened death camps in WW2 and just...but it didint.
So...spare us from the stories of bulgarians assimilating,killing poor helpless turks.

You're denying the bulgarization of the Turks of Bulgaria? The name changes etc.? This happened not that long ago. You're sounding like the Serbs and Greeks now.

[Bugarash 1893]

You're denying the bulgarization of the Turks of Bulgaria? The name changes etc.? This happened not that long ago. You're sounding like the Serbs and Greeks now.

Most of the turks in Bulgaria are in fact Pomaks-muslim bulgarians.
So,it was understandable.

[Guapo]

Most of the turks in Bulgaria are in fact Pomaks-muslim bulgarians.
So,it was understandable.

Shimshala bimbim, torok.

[Crn Volk]

http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=144049

[ioan assen]

Boring crap!!! The Turks enjoy the same rights as the Bulgarians here. The same cant be said about the Bulgarians in Macedonia.

[Trun]

Sokol should be warned about posting crap in our section. This is at least his tenth thread here for the last week.

The funny thing is that Macedonia has the same minorities as Bulgaria do, plus Albanians (the last are about to make the state their puppet).

[Bugarash 1893]

I am a little bulgarian-on turkish:D

CHA8Sut4d3M

[Onur]

I am a little bulgarian-on turkish:D
Which has been read by a bulgarian on a propaganda tv channel of Skad, operated by former secret service agents of commie Bulgaria, today`s members of ATAKA, VMRO-BG parties who follows anti-Turkish agenda.

Like most of the things, nationalism in Bulgaria is degenerated and pathetic too. You can find formerly hardcore communist but today`s nationalists only in Bulgaria :lol:

[Cannabis Sativa]

I am a little bulgarian-on turkish:D

CHA8Sut4d3M

That's the ugliest Turkish accent i've seen in my life.

[Bugarash 1893]

Which has been read by a bulgarian on a propaganda tv channel of Skad, operated by former secret service agents of commie Bulgaria, today`s members of ATAKA, VMRO-BG parties who follows anti-Turkish agenda.

Like most of the things, nationalism in Bulgaria is degenerated and pathetic too. You can find formerly hardcore communist but today`s nationalists only in Bulgaria :lol:

It's SKAT not SKAD...

Are you saying communist cant be nationalists?

Nobody in Bulgaria doesnt follow anti-turkish agenda.
What they fallow is a struggle against turkish provocations,neo-ottomanism and antibulgarian propaganda spread by turkish and proturkish structures from out of the country and within.

[Bugarash 1893]

This scene doesnt come because someone hates turks.

This scene comes after TRT comes with a provocative tv show campaign under the even more provocative name-Balkan Express,with the hidden goal to report on ottoman legacy in the Balkans and Bulgaria and starts its first call for the show from in front of the Alexander Nevsky Cathedral-built to honour the 200,000 dead for the war of liberation of Bulgaria.

rDVefeBcbd8

Tell me,if this happened in Athens...how many dead will the turkish tv crew have?

[Bugarash 1893]

Bulgaria needs to have an Iron fist policy towards Turkey.
Or should I say have an iron curtain style relations.

No contacts with anything coming from Turkey.
And I do mean with anything.
Not even letting them film documentaries where the promote Bulgaria.Nothing!
The less we have to do with Turkey the better.

Turkey as a state cant be trusted,they have showed it so many times.

Turkey means no good to any of the balkan states,they are just searching for the link to get into the balkan affairs as a factor.
Thats the entire deal,they want to have this region under their sphere of influence something of the sort Central Asia is for Russia.

Greece is a model of how we should act towards Turkey,I would suggest to be even more careful.

[ioan assen]

I think we better have good relations with all neigbours, however I m against the wave of Turkish movies which promote historic lies like conquest or golden age being shown in Bulgaria.

[Bugarash 1893]

Yeah,good relations...

Here is another turkish islamist

NQLL29MdYM0

[ioan assen]

ok I agree its kind of stupid to wear headskarf especially on such an occasion, its like the wife of the Bulgarian president wearing the national dress, because its an expression of her upbringing and culture...

[Bugarash 1893]

Btw whats with turks and mustache...?

In Turkey every second person I saw had one.
Erdogan has one,Gul has one,Davutoglu has one...probably Onur has one as well.

[MfA_]

Moustache is accepted as masculine looking and for Erdoganidis and co. its a political sign -badem bıyık which is one of the most ugliest form of moustache- .. IMO moustache is generally good on swarthy people lol..

[Bugarash 1893]

I would like to know the CBR of Bulgarian Turks.

I am every surpised about their birth rate in Turkey itself.


I wanted to post the latest statistics on Turkey but I forgot.
Btw when you already mentioned the Turks...

Here are the 2011 stats for Turkey:

Western Marmara: 11,5 CBR

-Turks in Western Marmara region have a lower birth rate than some european countries!
Just for a comperasion,a few years ago Bulgaria reached over 10 CBR!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/fc/Marmara_Region_in_Turkey.svg/800px-Marmara_Region_in_Turkey.svg.png

There is a big variation from region to region in terms of birth rate.
The kurdish regions are the strongest.
Southeastern Anatolia: 27,1 CBR

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/71/Southeastern_Anatolia_Region_in_Turkey.svg/800px-Southeastern_Anatolia_Region_in_Turkey.svg.png


Here is the graph for all of Turkey

http://www.tuik.gov.tr//hb_en/94/kapak/10923_img_1_94_19.10.2012-176716641.jpg

[Bugarash 1893]

Turks in Bulgaria

1992: 800,052

2001: 746,664

2011: 588,318 - 604,246 stated turkish as a mother tongue

[Crn Volk]

Turks in Bulgaria

1992: 800,052

2001: 746,664

2011: 588,318 - 604,246 stated turkish as a mother tongue

Declining population of Bulgaria is common knowledge.

Kardzhali, Bulgaria;

http://www.novinite.com/media/images/2009-09/photo_verybig_107907.jpg

[Bugarash 1893]

Declining population of Bulgaria is common knowledge.

Kardzhali, Bulgaria;

http://www.novinite.com/media/images/2009-09/photo_verybig_107907.jpg

Declining but Bulgarians are increasing their share in the total population.:)
Exept for Gypsies and Turks,all other minorities are brought almost till extinction.

Btw nice picture,it just shows that people in Bulgaria under 80 years of age arent that much into religion.:D

[Onur]

Turks in Bulgaria

1992: 800,052

2001: 746,664

2011: 588,318 - 604,246 stated turkish as a mother tongue
It`s because they are migrating to Turkey. I personally know some of them who works in Turkey for few years. The ones who comes to Turkey for study or work, never returns to Bulgaria except 10-15 days short visits per year in summers. They work in Turkey and send money to Bulgaria, to their elder family members who still lives in Bulgaria.



Declining but Bulgarians are increasing their share in the total population.:)
Exept for Gypsies and Turks,all other minorities are brought almost till extinction.
The working restrictions for the Bulgaria citizens in EU will be lifted in next January and take a guess about how many of those electricity bill protesters will migrate to western Europe then?

Bulgaria has no future and most likely it will be desolated after 2014. If this trend continues, Bulgaria will phase out itself due to demographic problems.

[Archduke]

My aunt is a lawyer and she says that many young Turkish families want their Bulgarian names from 89' to be returned.

A Turkish girl from my class changed her name to Denitsa.

I bet that the Turkish minority will be culturally assimilated in few decades.

[Bugarash 1893]

It`s because they are migrating to Turkey. I personally know some of them who works in Turkey for few years. The ones who comes to Turkey for study or work, never returns to Bulgaria except 10-15 days short visits per year in summers. They work in Turkey and send money to Bulgaria, to their elder family members who still lives in Bulgaria.

HAHAHA
Turkey?
Send money from Turkey?
Dude,Turkey is behind Bulgaria in terms of everything!
You are a primitive muslim asiatic califat!
You are a sinonym for that.
WAKE UP!

Turks from Bulgaria are mostly running away to Western Europe.
-BTW I dont care where they go,at least they are leaving Bulgaria.
If this rate of drop of the turkish population resumes till the next census,we can officialy say that Bulgarian Turks are going towards extinction.

You have to admit that the lower parts of the bulgarian population-Turks and Gypsies are leaving is a good thing.

Turkey is in the hole,because it has Kurds who arent going anywhere!


The working restrictions for the Bulgaria citizens in EU will be lifted in next January and take a guess about how many of those electricity bill protesters will migrate to western Europe then?

Bulgaria has no future and most likely it will be desolated after 2014. If this trend continues, Bulgaria will phase out itself due to demographic problems.

Keep dreaming.
The turks are facing extinction in Bulgaria.
As I said,Bulgarians are increasing their share.

This is a normal phase,that was present in Grece as well.
Where do you think the current greek diaspora came from?
In 1990,Bulgaria had a zero diaspora,especially in Europe,Greece had millions.
Until it got an higher standard of living.
Even part of the Greeks rom abroad returned back home.

The ones leaving are mostly Turks and Gypsies.
The turkish regions are kept with intention or without,but are kept in the highest poverty,so most of the people are forced to leave.
Thats a good policy.:)
Macedonia tried to pull through the same with the Albanians but...

All Bulgarians who wanted to imigrated already left.
BTW 80% of the EU countries lifted work restrictions in 2007,part of the rest in 2009.
And lifting restrictions doesnt isnt as simple as it sounds.You cant just go there are start living like its your own country,there are still some conditions.

[iNird]

Declining population of Bulgaria is common knowledge.

Kardzhali, Bulgaria;

http://www.novinite.com/media/images/2009-09/photo_verybig_107907.jpg

Dinarid looking.

[Bosnjakinja]

The ones leaving are mostly Turks and Gypsies.

You left aswell, and you're not a Turk or Gypsy.

Btw, are the Turks of Bulgaria ethnic Turks or Bulgarians who converted?

[iNird]

Btw, are the Turks of Bulgaria ethnic Turks or Bulgarians who converted?

Probably the latter.

[Azalea]

You left aswell, and you're not a Turk or Gypsy.

Btw, are the Turks of Bulgaria ethnic Turks or Bulgarians who converted?

Converted Bulgarians = Pomaks. Turks = Turks.

[iNird]

Converted Bulgarians = Pomaks. Converted Bulgarians that speak Turkish= Turks.

Corrected.

[Bugarash 1893]

My aunt is a lawyer and she says that many young Turkish families want their Bulgarian names from 89' to be returned.

A Turkish girl from my class changed her name to Denitsa.

I bet that the Turkish minority will be culturally assimilated in few decades.

We need more of them to start migrating to the cities.
In Ludogorie region there are still many Turks living in majority turkish villages.

As soon as they settle especially in the big bulgarian cities,they usualy get the feeling that if you have a turkish name it is shameful,people will make fun of you...

And Turks by living together with the Bulgarians understand the bulgarian view on Turks,get to know the marks that make Turks look primitive and strange in the eyes of Bulgarians and voluntarily get rid of them,leave those mark behind so they can blind into the environment.

[Azalea]

Corrected.
They can not be Bulgarians as they are already Turks. Seriously, this over emphasizing of the Turkification process is getting really old and a person with even a bit of knowledge about anthropology should really drop this nonsense. There is no difference in the way Turks got Turkified compared to the way our neighbours got 'ified'.

Besides, a converted Bulgarian not being a Turk is a paradox since we know that ancient Bulgarians were a Turkic people to begin with.

[archangel]

its unacceptable that Türks in bulgaria is under pressure,we must do something to prevent it

[Bosnjakinja]

Corrected.

I don't know. From about 2:50 in this video you see Turkish people who accept Bulgarian names, they look pretty Turkish to me.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXrZ-t99vI4

[Bugarash 1893]

You left aswell, and you're not a Turk or Gypsy.

Btw, are the Turks of Bulgaria ethnic Turks or Bulgarians who converted?

Im from Macedonia.:)

They are probably turkinized Bulgarians,I take thats why they are so easy to intigrate into society.
While if you look at Turks from Turkey who live in Germany,they live in ghettos,have been living in Germany for 40 years and still walk around with a fes...

[Azalea]

People need to get their facts straight about what's Turkish and what's not. The Turkish presence in the Balkans is as old or even older than the Turkish presence in Anatolia. So taking Anatolian Turks as a proxy for the Turkishness of the Bulgarian or any other Balkan Turkish group is idiotic.

[Bugarash 1893]

I don't know. From about 2:50 in this video you see Turkish people who accept Bulgarian names, they look pretty Turkish to me.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXrZ-t99vI4

Some of them yes,but in many cases you cant tell whos Bulgarian and who Turkish.

Btw another example of a assimilated Turks:)

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/530771_4785206161739_1314210500_n.jpg

[archangel]

there are some jeaolus slavs who cant grow facial hair like us lol.All barbarian people were observed with beards etc.. from vikings to barbarians from steppes.But chubby nosed baltid slavs cant grow it lol,thats why lots of Türks have über facial hair cos we can grow it lol:)

[Bugarash 1893]

Good old turkish propaganda:)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2Cr3t32_os

[Hurrem sultana]

While if you look at Turks rom Turkey who live in Germany,they live in ghettos,have been living in Germany for 40 years and still walk about with a fes...


Fes is not walked with even in Turkey,but yes in Germany they have it ..how yes no

[Azalea]

Turkish=/Turkic get the facts straight woman! :P

Balkan Turks are Turkish, belong to the same Oghuz Turkish groups and speak the same Oghuz language. We are the same people. Balkan Tatars on the other hand are an example of a non-Turkish Turkic people.

[Azalea]

Fes is not walked with even in Turkey,but yes in Germany they have it ..how yes no

It's Bugaresh you are talking to. Don't bother. :)

[Bosnjakinja]

Some of them yes,but in many cases you cant tell whos Bulgarian and who Turkish.

Btw another example of a assimilated Turks:)

http://sphotos-a.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/530771_4785206161739_1314210500_n.jpg
He is quite goodlooking, who is he?

[Bugarash 1893]

More bulgar zulum:picard1:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uHOdBMDLE04

[Bugarash 1893]

He is quite goodlooking, who is he?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdjNV9nv3QQ

[archangel]

this Türkish dude look like Tatars so über Türkic lol

[Hurrem sultana]

Good old turkish propaganda:)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2Cr3t32_os

WTF its barbaric ,did most of them return to their old names now?

[MfA_]

He is quite goodlooking, who is he?

A man who happens to be a Bulgarian yet his brother is Turkish according to him:picard1: and the same person compares 60 years old Turks in Germany to 700 years Turkish influence on Bulgaria :picard2::picard1:

[iNird]

Balkan Turks are Turkish, belong to the same Oghuz Turkish groups and speak the same Oghuz language. We are the same people. Balkan Tatars on the other hand are an example of a non-Turkish Turkic people.

IMO the Yoruk Turks in the Balkan but the Turks in Western Macedonia/Kosovo are not atleast. Even the Yoruk Turks consider the Turks in Macedonia to be assimilated autonomous people.

[Azalea]

a man who happens to be a Bulgarian yet his brother is Turkish according to him:picard1: and same person compares 60 years old Turks in Germany to 700 years Tukish influence on Bulgaria :picard2::picard1:

Bunlari okuyunca alt yazini oku gec. It ürür, kervan yürür. :)

[alfieb]

Why would Balkan Turks be older than Anatolian Turks? the Byzantine Emperor John VI first allowed the Turks to settle in Thrace in mid 1300s, they had been in Anatolia from around 1066. The other, older, Turkic people in the Balkans had been Pecheneg/Cuman/Bolgar, hardly the same as Azeris or Turks.

[Bugarash 1893]

WTF its barbaric ,did most of them return to their old names now?

Some did,some didint.
There are also many cases where they change their names to Bulgarian even after communism.
A trend still present.

[MfA_]

Bunlari okuyunca alt yazini oku gec. It ürür, kervan yürür. :)

ahaha QFT.. maksat imzayı bir daha görsünler ;)

[Bugarash 1893]

ahaha QFT.. maksat imzayı bir daha görsünler ;)
Kebab cok guzel?

[Hayalet]

Keep dreaming.
The turks are facing extinction in Bulgaria.
As I said,Bulgarians are increasing their share.
Reading your posts, one would think ethnic Bulgarians didn't lose 30% of their population in their homeland in last 40 years.


1975 Census

Bulgarians - 7,930,024 - 90.9%
Turks - 730,728 - 8.4%

2011 Census

Bulgarians - 5,664,624 - 84.8%
Turks - 588,318 - 8.8%

[Azalea]

IMO the Yoruk Turks in the Balkan but the Turks in Western Macedonia/Kosovo are not atleast. Even the Yoruk Turks consider the Turks in Macedonia to be assimilated autonomous people.

I am a Yoruk. Hi.

Yoruk is umbrella name given to almost all Turkish tribes in the Balkans. Yet in Turkey it's only used for the actual nomadic ones. After the collaps of the Ottoman Empire the Rumeli Turks (Balkan Turks) were named Yoruk, while the Turks in Irak and Syria were named 'Turkmen'. Both Turkish groups are equally Turkmen and Yoruk.

And no, no sane Turk with actual knowledge of history considers Balkan Turks to be assimilated. Like I said before, they are as much assimilated as a Anatolian, Syrian, Georgian or Iraqi Turk.

[Bugarash 1893]

Reading your posts, one would think ethnic Bulgarians didn't lose 30% of their population in their homeland in last 40 years.

The census in 1975 added part of the Turks and all Gypsies into the graph-Bulgarians.
And the 2011 census has hundreds of thousands of Bulgarians that didint state their ethnicity and religion.

[Azalea]

Why would Balkan Turks be older than Anatolian Turks? the Byzantine Emperor John VI first allowed the Turks to settle in Thrace in mid 1300s, they had been in Anatolia from around 1066. The other, older, Turkic people in the Balkans had been Pecheneg/Cuman/Bolgar, hardly the same as Azeris or Turks.

The Pechenegs, Azeri's and Turkish people are all Oghuz Turks.

But the point was that there were Turkic peoples in the Balkans before there were any Turks in Anatolia. So taking the Anatolian Turks as a proxy for the Turkishness (or Turkicness) of the Balkan Turks doesn't make sence.

[Bugarash 1893]

Turks in Bulgaria at the moment before they started leaving-during the ''Great Excursion'' were about 1 million!
Now they are no more than 600,000!

Total crack!

[Hayalet]

And the 2011 census has hundreds of thousands of Bulgarians that didint state their ethnicity and religion.
And how do you know the ethnic identity of those who didn't declare it? Were you running a side census?

[iNird]

I am a Yoruk. Hi.

Yoruk is umbrella name given to almost all Turkish tribes in the Balkans. Yet in Turkey it's only used for the actual nomadic ones. After the collaps of the Ottoman Empire the Rumeli Turks (Balkan Turks) were named Yoruk, while the Turks in Irak and Syria were named 'Turkmen'. Both Turkish groups are equally Turkmen and Yoruk.

And no, no sane Turk with actual knowledge of history considers Balkan Turks to be assimilated. Like I said before, they are as much assimilated as a Anatolian, Syrian, Georgian or Iraqi Turk.


Also significant, however, is the opposition Yuruks make between themselves and other Turkish speakers in Macedonia, whom they call Citak and whose dialect they call citak dili.2 Yuruk tradition holds that other Turkish-speakers in Macedonia are Islamicized and subsequently Turkicized autochthnous populations (palikruseva 1986.)

http://books.google.com/books?id=tj4Jd3izAE0C&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=turkish+dialects+in+macedonia&source=bl&ots=3gEVdvV7NV&sig=5SoQKfSt-DEU3O7tHiSfoGLU4e4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VjX_UInpMo79qQG1nIDICA&ved=0CGgQ6AEwCA#v=snippet&q=eastern&f=false

Most of the Yoruk in Macedonia are located in the SE part and the Turks in NW part and Kosovo look like typical Balkanites. Though I will admit the pictures I have seen of Yoruks online don't differ too much from Balkanites either. I'm not too sure on the Bulgarian Turks.....

[archangel]

Türks in balkans came mostly from north,from north of black sea....They are not indigenous to the region thus not southern wogs like bulgarians,greeks,albanians et....(there are some chubby nosed,short baltid types in the region(among some yugoslavs) though lol from the slavs)

[Bugarash 1893]

And how do you know the ethnic identity of those who didn't declare it? Were you running a side census?

Because most of those who didint declare their ethnicity can be found in the big bulgarian cities.
Another example,200,000 people who didint state their religion or are irreligious are in Sofia.

Btw the number of Turks is even lower than the declared on the last census.
Many Gypsies and Pomaks declare to be Turks.

[alfieb]

The Pechenegs, Azeri's and Turkish people are all Oghuz Turks.

But the point was that there were Turkic peoples in the Balkans before there were any Turks in Anatolia. So taking the Anatolian Turks as a proxy for the Turkishness (or Turkicness) of the Balkan Turks doesn't make sence.

My mistake, I had thought Pechenegs were closer to Cumans than to Turks.

[Hayalet]

iNird, "Turkicization" is one of the most overly used words in these forums. It's one thing to claim Turks have intermarried with other groups around them throughout generations and become genetically/phenotypically similar to them, but the idea of Islamization and subsequent Turkicization is quite something else. Turks (unlike, say, Greeks) never had the required institutions for that, no Islamic counterpart of a national church, no use of Turkish as liturgical language, nothing.

[gori]

I am a Yoruk. Hi.

Yoruk is umbrella name given to almost all Turkish tribes in the Balkans. Yet in Turkey it's only used for the actual nomadic ones. After the collaps of the Ottoman Empire the Rumeli Turks (Balkan Turks) were named Yoruk, while the Turks in Irak and Syria were named 'Turkmen'. Both Turkish groups are equally Turkmen and Yoruk.

And no, no sane Turk with actual knowledge of history considers Balkan Turks to be assimilated. Like I said before, they are as much assimilated as a Anatolian, Syrian, Georgian or Iraqi Turk.

Georgian turks ? in which region do they live ?

[Azalea]

iNird, I will reply to your comment from the other thread in this thread if you don't mind.


Merhaba,

http://books.google.com/books?id=tj4Jd3izAE0C&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=turkish+dialects+in+macedonia&source=bl&ots=3gEVdvV7NV&sig=5SoQKfSt-DEU3O7tHiSfoGLU4e4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=VjX_UInpMo79qQG1nIDICA&ved=0CGgQ6AEwCA#v=snippet&q=eastern&f=false

Saygılarımızla,

iNirdoğlu

I really have no freaking idea what the author of this book is talking about. It doesn't make any sence at all. :lol: You can ask any other Turk (Su f.e is partial Yoruk also), but this guy is talking about of his ass big time. :confused:

Yoruks in generally are very proud of other Yoruks outside of Turkey and identify with them a lot. Even if you look at the 'Yoruk groups' on the internet/social media you will clearly notice this. For example, the biggest 'Yoruk group' on Facebook is called 'World Yoruk Unity'. Besides that, Yoruks are not considered to be different Turkish or anything. They are just Turks who happen to be nomadic or have nomadic past. And the only reason why a Yoruk from Turkey would identify less with a Yoruk from the Balkans is that many of the Balkan Turks are simply not nomadic. They are just Turks who happen to carry the name Yoruk because all Turkish tribes in the Balkan got the name Yoruk for some reason. Just like the Middle Eastern Turks were called Turkmen.

[Azalea]

Georgian turks ? in which region do they live ?

Georgian Turks are called 'Ahiska Turks' or 'Meshketian Turks' so obviously in the Ahiska region. A lot of them were expelled to many Central Asian and other ex-sovjet countries. There are still some left in Georgia though.

[iNird]

iNird, "Turkicization" is one of the most overly used words in these forums. It's one thing to claim Turks have intermarried with other groups around them throughout generations and become genetically/phenotypically similar to them, but the idea of Islamization and subsequent Turkicization is something else. Turks (unlike Greeks) never had the requited institution for that, no Islamic counterpart of a national church, no use of Turkish as liturgical language, nothing.

I don't think it was a forced assimilation rather these people are more remnants of the Ottoman period. Turkish was spoken in most urban centers and those that held on to the language after the Ottoman period and had a stronger attachment to the Ottoman past identified as Turkish.

The forced assimilation was actually done more on the Yugoslavs during the 50's and 60's that attempted to assimilate Albanians in the Turkish ethnos to dilute their presence and attempt to force them to leave for Turkey. This is clearly visible in Macedonia's census in 1948 to 1953 where the Turkish figure increases dramatically while the Albanian figure decreases dramatically as well all in attempt to leave for Turkey (one had to be "turkish" to leave.)

[Hoca]

I think Turks in Bulgaria are growing. They are quit large group there.

[gori]

Georgian Turks are called 'Ahiska Turks' or 'Meshketian Turks' so obviously in the Ahiska region. A lot of them were expelled to many Central Asian and other ex-sovjet countries. There are still some left in Georgia though.

very funny, i guess we have new region in Georgia "Ahiska" sounds fierce . not a lot we can safely say all of them. now that region has Armenian majority and Georgian minority .

[archangel]

Bulgarian Türks are about 1 milliom in Bulgaria and they are growing

[iNird]

Bulgarian Türks are about 1 milliom in Bulgaria and they are growing

Let me use some Turk logic:

"Bulgarian Turks are the Kurds of the Balkans. Having 3-5 kids"

;)

[Bugarash 1893]

Bulgarian Türks are about 1 milliom in Bulgaria and they are growing

I would rather trust the official statistics and the demographic trends who say Turks are 600,000 and dropping big time,than trust a fussy looking Turk with snagy hair,using a nickname Archangel.

[Azalea]

I don't think it was a forced assimilation rather these people are more remnants of the Ottoman period. Turkish was spoken in most urban centers and those that held on to the language after the Ottoman period and had a stronger attachment to the Ottoman past identified as Turkish.


There are Turkish speaking Albanians, Gypsies and Pomaks in the Balkans yet none identifies as Turk. Apparently, there is more to it than speaking Turkish only.

Although I didn't want to drag genetics into this discussion at first, I do want to point out that there is an actual difference between Balkan Turks and their neighbours in terms of genetics. There is a spreadsheet named 'The Balkan similarity project' somewhere wandering on the internet (you can also search for it on 23andme). It's been managed by a Bulgarian woman and there are 23andme results of Balkan Turks, other Balkan ethnic groups and Anatolian Turks in it. The majority of the ethnic Balkan Turks show Asian DNA which almost all their neighbours seem to lack. So although most of their DNA is very similar to their immidiate neighbours, there is one significant part of their DNA that differentiates them from them. Just like with Anatolian Turks and their West Asian neighbours. And even more interesting enough, the few Bulgarian Turkish participants in the projects carry Y-DNA and mtDNA's associated with Central/North Asia. Two Bulgarian Turks have Y-DNA N (the Asian variant) and one of them has the same mtDNA as me.

This can not be the result of random Balkanites speaking Turkish and 'deciding' to become Turk.

[iNird]

I might have asked this, but why is the Turkish population in Bulgaria so scattered. It's kinda weird to see a strong presence in the most Southern Part and a strong Turkish presense in the Northern parts.

[Hoca]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=261gcC1hHvs
Bulgaria in EU was good consequence for Turkish minority in Bulgaria. Their rights are secured and protected by NATO and Turkey is just on the doorstep :)

Turkish Bulgarians are definitely growing.

[Bugarash 1893]

Bulgaria in EU was good consequence for Turkish minority in Bulgaria. Their rights are secured and protected by NATO and Turkey is just on the doorstep :)

Turkish Bulgarians are definitely growing.

Turks in Bulgaria have the same rights since 1990 till now.

And thank you,we are happy having Turkey as a shield between us and the rapidly expanding Kurds.

http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/map-of-turkey-areas-with-kurdish-population/9208579-1-eng-US/Map-of-Turkey-Areas-with-Kurdish-population_full_600.jpg

[Azalea]

iNird,

Ok it seems that I misread both your post and the book. Weird. Anyway, Yoruks sometimes brag about their Turkishness and how they've kept their old Turkic traditions and blablabla. Anatolian Yoruks do the same to other Turks. However, this is hardly serious. Can't believe the guy actually noted that in his book. Like I said, you can ask any other Turk about this subject.

(my message didn't fit in a rep :P )

[Hoca]

We don't have problems with Kurds. 90% of them vote on AKP government. You should be more concerned about your Muslim population.We are there to protect them with second largest army of NATO called the Turkish Armed Forces.

[gori]

We don't have problems with Kurds. 90% of them vote on AKP government. You should be more concerned about your Muslim population.We are there to protect them with second largest army of NATO called the Turkish Armed Forces.

http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/1839/35608386.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/11/35608386.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

[Bugarash 1893]

We don't have problems with Kurds. 90% of them vote on AKP government. You should be more concerned about your Muslim population.We are there to protect them with second largest army of NATO called the Turkish Armed Forces.

Turkey has no problems with Kurds who are takingover Turkey.
Turned entire areas into war zones.
Are drasticly increasing.
Are 20 million people=30% of Turkeys population

Muslims in Bulgaria=10% of the population
8% of which Turks.
Harmless people!
Many of those Turks hide in public that they are Turks because they think it is a shame to be a Turk.

So why didint you protect them?

No worries,some time fron now,Turks will be fully extinct in Bulgaria.
They will eather go to Western Europe,Turkey or will be assimilated into Bulgarians.

[Bugarash 1893]

Turks and Kurds loving eachother-no problems at all:D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oldPXYLcOk8

[Bugarash 1893]

Kurds and Turks chilling,killing:D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuoRV5gHLYw

[Hoca]

Turkey has no problems with Kurds who are takingover Turkey.
Turned entire areas into war zones.
Are drasticly increasing.
Are 20 million people=30% of Turkeys population

Muslims in Bulgaria=10% of the population
8% of which Turks.
Harmless people!
Many of those Turks hide in public that they are Turks because they think it is a shame to be a Turk.

So why didint you protect them?

No worries,some time fron now,Turks will be fully extinct in Bulgaria.
They will eather go to Turkey,Western Europe or will be assimilated into Bulgarians.
Kurds are 15% of Turkey. And Turks in Bulgaria are also 15%.

Most Turks in Bulgaria vote for Ethnic Turkish parties. While Kurds in Turkey, don't vote on ethnic Kurdish party but on AKP current government as I stated in my previous reply.

Turks in Bulgaria are protected by EU and by Turkey, there is nothing going to happen to them. You assimilated and massacring was in the past. It is 21th century now. If something happens like that. It won't be good for Bulgaria. I think people have learned from non-action because of Srebrenica disaster.

[Hayalet]

I don't think it was a forced assimilation rather these people are more remnants of the Ottoman period. Turkish was spoken in most urban centers and those that held on to the language after the Ottoman period and had a stronger attachment to the Ottoman past identified as Turkish.
There is a gap between speaking additional Turkish tongue in Ottoman urban life and teaching one's newborn Turkish instead of one's native language. Until the time of republican Turkey, only ethnic Turks natively spoke Turkish.

[Hurrem sultana]

Kurds are 15% of Turkey


Huge problem,you guys should just give them independence,,once they are over 25% they will want even more ;)

[Bugarash 1893]

Kurds are 15% of Turkey. And Turks in Bulgaria are also 15%..

All good,but there is a little thing called FACTS!
The censuses say a different story!
What facts you have to claim Turks are 15%?

I for exmaple claim they are even lower than the 8% on the census.
But because I dont have an official proof,I'll stick to the census date.

Kurds in Turkey 15%?:D
Did you get that from Archangel?


Most Turks in Bulgaria vote for Ethnic Turkish parties. While Kurds in Turkey, don't vote on ethnic Kurdish party but on AKP current government as I stated in my previous reply.

There are no ethnic turkish parties in Bulgaria.
Bulgarian constitution doesnt allow parties and organizations formed on a ethnic base.

Dont know for who do Kurds vote in Turkey but I do know that they are staging an open war within Turkey!
Even killing your soldiers!


Turks in Bulgaria are protected by EU and by Turkey, there is nothing going to happen to them. You assimilated and massacring was in the past. It is 21th century now. If something happens like that. It won't be good for Bulgaria. So I would think about the long-term consquences of this.

We dont need to do anything to them because they are harmless!
And they are voluntarily on the path of extinction.
Many leave Bulgaria and go to Western Europe and Turkey.
Others are fully intigrated in bulgarian society.

If we massacred them and assimilated them in the past you think they would still exist in Bulgaria?
If we wanted to wipe them out,there wouldnt be any Turks in Bulgaria now.

[Hayalet]

There are more Kurds in Turkey than Turks in Bulgaria, but it's worth noting that the de facto Turkish minority interests party gets 14% of the votes in Bulgaria, while their Kurdish counterpart gets less than 7% in Turkey.

[Hoca]

Dude, what I said is official statistics. These Bulgarians are delusional.

If you look ratio wise. Bulgaria has bigger foreign minority than Turkey. Turkey has the advantage that its minorities are muslim and vote for current AKP government. While bulgaria's minority vote on that Turkish party. haha.

[Bugarash 1893]

There are more Kurds in Turkey than Turks in Bulgaria, but it's worth noting that the de facto Turkish minority interests party gets 14% of the votes in Bulgaria, while their Kurdish counterpart gets 7% in Turkey.

Its because the people who vote for turkish ''minority'' interest parties are mostly the Bulgarian Turks holding bulgarian passports in Turkey.

Here are the buses with them coming for the elections-other voting sections are set up in Turkey


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTb8HZwu1Y0

[Don Arb]

So called turk minorities should be treated like kurds there, I think is fair enough.

[Hayalet]

Its because the people who vote for turkish ''minority'' interest parties are mostly the Bulgarian Turks holding bulgarian passports in Turkey.
I believe I had called you on your bullshit before.



All good and all,but you forget to note that almost half of the votes DPS gets are coming from turks holding bulgarian passports and living in Turkey.
Check your facts, pathological bullshitter.

DPS got 592,381 votes in 2009 parliamentary elections.
156,180 Bulgarian citizens voted abroad, 57% of them from Turkey.
If all who voted in Turkey had voted for DPS, that would amount to about 89 thousand people, which in turn would be about 15% and not 'almost half'.

[Bugarash 1893]

I believe I had called you on your bullshit before.

Thats the ones who vote in polling sections in Turkey,and doesnt include the ones that come with buses from Turkey to Bulgaria and cast their vote there!

Anyway,when you put it all together.
A major part of the votes come from Turks from abroad.

[Bugarash 1893]

So called turk minorities should be treated like kurds there, I think is fair enough.

Bulgaria had many chances to destroy the Turks.
Best chance was probably during WW2,we could have set up camps,called in the Turks in for a ''bath''...and that would be it.

But we didint,Turks dont respect that.

[Hoca]

Thats the ones who vote in polling sections in Turkey,and doesnt include the ones that come with buses from Turkey to Bulgaria and cast their vote there!

Anyway,when you put it all together.
A major part of the votes come from Turks from abroad.

Do you think one video is proof for that? Do you have reliable source?

[Bugarash 1893]

Do you think one video is proof for that? Do you have reliable source?

One video?
There are tons of videos.
That trend is known to the entire bulgarian public.
It even got a term-''voting tourism''

The buses are free,no charge at all.
Turkish TV stations even post the information about the time of the buses will be heading and coming back.

Here is another video when one of the roads going from the turkish border was blocked by bulgarian nationalists in order to stop the buses


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_bn1dqhnWs

[legolasbozo]

So called turk minorities should be treated like kurds there, I think is fair enough.

Meanwhile in turkey mr.Erdoğan mash up turkish identity for embrace pkk militas. You guys talk about 'insult turkish identity is forbidden in turkey what a shame' but actually things are upside down. Talking about turkishness almost forbidden in turkey right now, because erdoğan trying to lic king kurds ass. Iraq kurdistan would provide almost half of the world's necessitiy for oil till 2030, and he is trying to add ıraq kurdistan to turkey. Hakan sukur's albanian ethnic confess is a a part of this politics. He is trying to revolt new ottomanism. İ think who should concern about kurds are not we but you. İ don't have a problem with kurdish oil money but you guys have to worry about these new ottomanists.

[Bugarash 1893]

I like this Miriam girl:)

Turks like her are more than welcomed to stay,Im opened to take care of them personally:D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pp4DC60dKf8

[Hoca]

I like this Miriam girl:)

Turks like her are more than welcomed to stay,Im opened to take care of them personally:D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pp4DC60dKf8

what are they saying?

[Onur]

Dinarid looking.
what now? Are you trying to say that the Turks in Bulgaria have Albanian origin?!



The forced assimilation was actually done more on the Yugoslavs during the 50's and 60's that attempted to assimilate Albanians in the Turkish ethnos to dilute their presence and attempt to force them to leave for Turkey. This is clearly visible in Macedonia's census in 1948 to 1953 where the Turkish figure increases dramatically while the Albanian figure decreases dramatically as well all in attempt to leave for Turkey (one had to be "turkish" to leave.)
You are lying. The Turkish population of Macedonia never increased during the Yugoslavia era but Albanian population always increased because it was the Turks who were forcefully expelled out by Tito back then;

Here are census results in Macedonia;

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/1523/clipboard22.jpg

[Bugarash 1893]

Onur is just another amateur.

Onoroglu efendi.
Many Albanians back then declared to be Turks-in the hope they will leave for Turkey!
Yugoslav commie government till 1960 was pulling through a campaign of stimulating Muslims from Kosovo and Macedonia to leave for Turkey.

[Hayalet]

Thats the ones who vote in polling sections in Turkey,and doesnt include the ones that come with buses from Turkey to Bulgaria and cast their vote there!

Anyway,when you put it all together.
A major part of the votes come from Turks from abroad.
Here is the result of the 2009 elections again. Note that out of 3 regions bordering Turkey (where buses from Turkey would have arrived), DPS received a minority of votes in Burgas and Haskovo, but is largely absent in Yambol.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e8/BG_Parliamentary_2009_pie_EN.png

Then we take a look at the 2011 census results and we see that self-declared Turks are about 13% in Burgas and Haskovo and only 3% in Yambol.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/TurksInBGPercent2011.svg

You should seek professional help, because you are either clinically delusional or have a pathological lying problem.

[Bugarash 1893]

Here is the result of the 2009 elections again. Note that out of 3 regions bordering Turkey (where buses from Turkey would have arrived), DPS received a minority of votes in Burgas and Haskovo, but is largely absent in Yambol.

Then we take a look at the 2011 census results and we see that self-declared Turks are about 13% in Burgas and Haskovo and only 3% in Yambol.

You should seek professional help, because you are either clinically delusional or have a pathological lying problem.

LOL
And you proved what with this exactly?
Here is an idea:When posting a comment-HAVE A POINT!

Ok,it didint get 51% of its votes from Turks abroad,it got 30% of its votes from Turks abroad!
30% is no joke!

And have in mind that there are also Bulgarians voting for that party.
Part of the top officials of that party are Bulgarians.

[Bugarash 1893]

what are they saying?

Miriam says how she likes to get dirty.
The others are just saying that they came for the elctions.

[Guapo]

all bugarians are turks

[Bugarash 1893]

all bugarians are turks

Back in your cage

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4a0cst9Xp1rwwy2xo1_400.jpg

[iNird]

what now? Are you trying to say that the Turks in Bulgaria have Albanian origin?!



You are lying. The Turkish population of Macedonia never increased during the Yugoslavia era but Albanian population always increased because it was the Turks who were forcefully expelled out by Tito back then;

Here are census results in Macedonia;

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/1523/clipboard22.jpg

No I was merely making an observation. You're the one that claims all Alpines in the Balkans as Turkish. :D

As for the latter, reread my post and see that I referred to 1948.

Please refer to the Footnote 1 on page 53

http://books.google.com/books?id=tj4Jd3izAE0C&pg=PA51&lpg=PA51&dq=%22in+the+1948+census,+there%22&source=bl&ots=3gFP8AV8RQ&sig=ym44S4sxAuuUmhQfncGXGanKH64&hl=en&sa=X&ei=DmE1Ub7HLePS2AWU3IGwDA&ved=0CEsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=%22in%20the%201948%20census%2C%20there%22&f=false

But you already know this. I have brought this up multiple times to you and it still won't register in your thick head.

[Bugarash 1893]

Turks in Bulgaria are protected by EU and by Turkey, there is nothing going to happen to them. You assimilated and massacring was in the past. It is 21th century now. If something happens like that. It won't be good for Bulgaria. I think people have learned from non-action because of Srebrenica disaster.

As I said,they are harmless,thats why no need to massacre them LOL!
If we wanted to kill the Turks in Bulgaria you think we couldnt?
Do you know how many chances we had for that?
What happened to the Turks in Serbia and Greece?

The current Bulgarian minister of culture is a turk,so your stories about turks in Bulgaria being under threat go down the toilet

http://img.deltanews.bg/be390352c7aff48239796f5eb7d3907c.jpg

[Yalquzaq]

http://www.csmonitor.com/var/ezflow_site/storage/images/media/map-of-turkey-areas-with-kurdish-population/9208579-1-eng-US/Map-of-Turkey-Areas-with-Kurdish-population_full_600.jpg

This made me laugh, not only that it is exaggerated beyond any logic, but also because the author seems to have thought that "Kürdəmir" in middle of Azerbaijan is related to "Kurd" eponym (and for some reason being populted by Kurds, while there is no Kurdish settlement in or around that area), while in fact its Kür-Dəmir, "Kür" being the Kura river, and "Dəmir" which means "iron".

And I'm pretty sure that there is no Kurdish settlement in Karabakh. Of course 90% of that map is false, so its not even worth to go into details.

And I didn't knew that Russia had become "Ukraine". :D

[Vulcho]

And I'm pretty sure that there is no Kurdish settlement in Karabakh. Of course 90% of that map is false, so its not even worth to go into details.

That's not Karabakh but the region between Karabakh and Armenia. It did in fact have a Kurdish majority at one point in history, but I'm not sure about today (I don't know if there are any non-Armenians living there today).

[Yalquzaq]

It had some Kurdish population indeed, but not a Kurdish majority, nowhere near anything like that. The Kurdish population of that area were deported to Central Asia during Soviet era. They had settled there in 18-19th century btw, lets also make that clear.

[east]

I would offer you one exelent analisys about Bulgarian Turks wrote by Sevim Tahir , student in Plovdiv university:


Ethnocultural characteristics of Bulgarian Turks

Sevim Tahir

The purpose of this analysis is to present the main features of the ethnic communities of Bulgarian Turks, who now account for 10 percent of the population.
The presentation of the cultural and social characteristics of the ethnic group of Bulgarian Turks is inextricably linked to the influence of historical processes which determine the threats of conflict of identities.
After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire and the creation of independent states emerge and problems with ethnic minorities of the peninsula. The reason for the constant migration of people between countries is a mismatch of ethnic and national boundaries. The first exodus of the Turkish population of the Bulgarian lands towards Turkey have started already during the Russo-Turkish War of 1877-1878, the migration of this period mainly affects urban strata - officials and representatives of the intelligentsia. At that time the group of Turks and Tartars are assigned * Gagauz.

In 1909 Istanbul Convention was signed, with which Bulgaria is obliged to observe the religious, cultural and legal rights of the Turkish population. The reason for such an agreement is anti-Turkish sentiment in Bulgaria caused by memory suppression of the April Uprising and the Liberation War.

During the Government did a drop of emigration, which helps government policy Stambliyski Alexander (1919 - 1923), which guarantees the rights and observes the Bulgarian Turks, unlike the policies pursued by the National Accord (1923-1931) that removes the boards and limited autonomy of schools.

As a result of the Turkish propaganda "back home all the Turks' policy responses and actions by the Bulgarian government in the period 1935-1949, is activated a new wave of about 67,000 immigrants.

During the communist regime the Turkish population in the country is estimated at 675,500 people. Atheistic propaganda against the entire population is a major feature of policy in this period, designed not only to strengthen secular influence at the expense of the religious, but to oppose Turkish propaganda and interference in the internal affairs of the country.

Plenum of the Central Committee of the Communist Party Georgi Dimitrov publicly justify the idea of a "fifth column" by saying:"In fact, we limit our non-Bulgarian population, which is a constant plague to our country. Before us as a party and government is to issue it out of there and to settle elsewhere, and there to settle our, Bulgarian population. "

On this occasion, Todor Zhivkov said:"We are in line not for the formation of the Turkish population in Bulgaria and for his inclusion. In this population, we look not as something separate, but as an integral part of the Bulgarian people. Hence the emphasis we put on learning the Turkish language, the issue of more books and newspapers in Turkish, and the communist education of this population. "

On 22 March 1968 contract was signed "For the emigration of Bulgarian citizens of Turkish descent whose close relatives have emigrated to Turkey in 1952." Under this contract, the period 1969-1978 had migrated nearly 114,392 people.
Restoration process from 1984-1989 was a crucial event for the community of Bulgarian Turks.
The reasons for the organization and conduct according to different sources of information are numerous and contradictory. They can be divided into several groups: the international situation and relations between Bulgaria and Turkey, the internal situation in each country and the influence of the historical past.

The international environment is characterized by difficulties in negotiating the total emigration of Bulgarian Turks in Turkey and its propaganda that reminded "Cyprus scenario" in Bulgaria. In this period, Bulgaria and Turkey belong to two different military units, which some analysts have a decisive impact on the internal political processes in the country.

In the early '80s ethnic Turks in Bulgaria are more than 1.5 million people. This fact is perceived as threatening to the Bulgarian nation. This leads to a management decision to rename the Turkish population for inclusion in the Bulgarian nation. In view of the internal political situation in Turkey in the late 80s, when the country was shaken by Kurdish and the labor movement, the Bulgarian government began conducting the "revival process".

Central Committee sent to the party leaderships material called "Strengthening the unity of the Bulgarian socialist nation, its ethnic homogeneity" that aims to permanently and irrevocably separation of this population from turtsizma and clarifying and strengthening the Bulgarian national consciousness.

The ideological justification of the "Revival Process" states: "The current stage revival process is not just a quantitative extension of our national revival, and the relatively new qualitative phenomenon in our national and social history: first, because he has won a new bourgeois ideology and second, because it is not directed against the "feudal-church ideology" and against "anti-Bulgarian operation" of the religiosity of modern descendants of Bulgarians forced Islam during the five centuries of Ottoman-Turkish rule over our land. "Paradoxically," forced Islam Bulgarians during the five centuries of Ottoman-Turkish rule over our land "again forcibly returned to their Bulgarian identity. The idea of a state based ednonatsionalna duplication of nation and nation, "Bulgarian nation was formed on the ethno-cultural heritage of a nation - Bulgarian." In order to achieve the idea of a unified Bulgarian nation, the Turkish population is presented as part of the Bulgarian ethnicity and "Revival Process" is "recovery, clarification and strengthening of the Bulgarian national consciousness among all those Bulgarians with proven Bulgarian origin, whose ancestors were Muslim during slavery. In the broadest sense, this is a process that restores the moral and political unity of the nation, contributing to the creation of the Bulgarian socialist nation. "

The results of the process are contrary to expectations and lead to encapsulation of the Turkish community looks to its roots and history, seeks the truth about his origins and resumed forgotten traditions.

Rather than "re-Bulgarian identity" community of Turks in Bulgaria openly declared their Turkish identity and their Muslim religion. "Revival Process" is perceived as an attack on the most intimate, namely the identity and consciousness of the Bulgarian Turks, which undoubtedly accumulate negative emotions in interethnic relations in the country.

Todor Zhivkov again proposes to sign an agreement with Turkey on the part of the exodus of Bulgarian Turks, which sees Turkey as their homeland. On the Turkish side in the face of Suleyman Demirel, Ecevit and also Jews and rejecting resettlement as an option saying that home Bulgarians of Turkish origin is Bulgaria. In Bulgaria remained all Bulgarian Muslims, in which is preserved a sense of belonging to the Bulgarian nation.

On May 9, 1989 adopted the Law on passports, under which Bulgarian citizens are entitled to leave the country and reside temporarily in another country. On May 29 the borders are open and allowed the emigration of all Bulgarian Turks. The end of the "Great trip" was placed on 22 August 1989.

The number of Turks left the country was between 310 and 370 thousand people, but soon after leaving 152 thousand people back in an advanced state of Bulgaria.

After a survey in 1989 found that the reasons for the expulsion of the Turks: the pressures, anxieties about isolation, insecurity, propaganda Turkey. Many of the immigrants can not identify a specific reason for their emigration and claim that they were covered by universal movement. This is one reason why most of them did not take long to return to Bulgaria, while another - not to join the local Turkish population.

In 1992 the Turks numbered 800,052 people, and at the last census in 2001 they amounted to 746,664 people. The reasons for such a trend should be looking at changes in the identity of another Muslim (Bulgarian-Muslims and Gypsies), the volatile politics of inclusion and removal, inflow to Turkey, the U.S. and Western Europe, and the process of globalization.

Bulgarian Turkish community distinguished historical, social, and moral by the Turks in Turkey, as evidenced by the fact that they remain "settlers" ("Bulgar Göçmenleri") and even inhabit divisional areas in Turkey. Differences between local Turkish immigrants from Bulgaria and starts from the anthropological features of appearance that appear distinctive marker in ethnocultural terms.

Diligence of Bulgarian Turks is confirmed by their prosperity, professional success and high standard of living. As an example, indicating the huge houses and grown from small villages fashionable neighborhoods. Bulgarian Turks in the place of negative characteristics of polygamy, which rarely can still be observed in Turkey. It is defined as a lack of morality and ethics, and spiritual abnormality and sexual attitudes. Along with polygamy and denying populous brood, which is considered a disability. As opposed to polygamy and mnogodetstvoto model describes families must have two children. This is considered "normal" and "European". So put the border between European civilization and oriental backwardness.

Hospitality and courtesy are key features of ethno-cultural aspect of the Bulgarian Turks, who at the same time an integral part of their personal identity.

For the most part, Bulgarian Turks living between the two countries and so in the broadest sense, we can speak of "interstate" or "transetatichna" identity. The arguments in this direction are numerous. Following Fr. Barth, ethnicity is seen as building boundaries with the "other," "different," in an attempt to situating the individual or group in space and time. The Bulgarian Turks in Turkey birthplace - Bulgaria was associated with had brought from there artefacts. They are symbolically loaded and beautiful memories they evoke the experience while there. Even certain smells continue to be associated with the "old" land:

"For 12 years a bag with thyme and I still do tea. This odor in Turkey can not feel it. "

"I am a Turk, but I am a Bulgarian citizen and Bulgaria is my native land." Said Sunay Chalakov in an interview on the website: "Bulgaria. Positive information about Turks in Bulgaria "* (http://bulgaria-turkofil.blogspot.com/)

The question of national identity of Bulgarian Turks is essential to their acceptance as part of the Bulgarian nation. Social mobility of modern society becomes the question of confessional affiliation to a matter of personal choice. Religion is a heritage confidence that their faith is the only true. In the modern world the confidence of every individual the opportunity to construct their own religious identity in response to personal experience and change according to the situation in which it occurs. The role of religion in the self-determination of the Bulgarian Turks was so significant as that of historical processes. View of Islam prevalent in the West, is all wrong and is the result of ignorance or systematic negativity. And worst of counterfeiting the facts, as if misjudgments can be excused, then the presentation of facts contrary to truth can not be forgiven. There is relief from the most common prejudices that can give us an accurate notion of what is in fact a Muslim. Examples are presented randomly distributed:
1. Naming the Muslim Allah God, as if Muslims believe in God, different from that of Christians. Allah ("Al lah") is of Arabic origin and means God, ie Muslims and Christians believe in the same God.

2. The presentation of Islam as a religion of fear and bigotry. These allegations against numerous quotations from the Koran, which reveal Islam as a religion of love, compassion and mercy. Every Muslim holiday is connected with charity, patience and love. These spiritual values are incorporated into the customs and traditions of Bulgarian Turks and influence their social interaction.

3. "Orientation dialogue between Muslims and hristiyanii" is a document issued after the second Vatican Council in 1970, states: "the term" jihad "or rather" Al jihad fi sabil Allah "in Arabic means -" my effort on the road to God and no targets destroyed, and dissemination and preservation of the rights of God and man (...) The violence in the past for jihad followed the laws of war ... "

In the contemporary Muslim world religious trends are related to denial of fanatical religiosity, which is inherent in developed economically and socially countries with low educational attainment of the population.

Bulgarian Turks have relatively little knowledge of their own religion. The reasons for this trend are both internal and external. Limitations of religious knowledge due to the family environment, the strong influence of secular education, the long-imposed communism atheistic views and perceptions, and the weakness of spiritual institutions under totalitarian rule.

Reflection turns and limiting the role of religion in the last 20 years worldwide. Clearly, secular education, economic development and social mobility reduces the influence of religion. Secularism is particularly visible in lifestyle. Ban during the "revival process" to perform all religious and traditional practices of the Muslim community and the imposition of civil ceremonies also affects the customary feast system. The above factors are a prerequisite for conservation, reduction and innovation in the customs and rituals of the Bulgarian Turks.

For this reason, special attention is paid to family holidays and calendar showing the preservation of traditions and the amendments to trace the influence of the processes of storing and amending customary feast system. Differences and differences in the practice of Islam take the form of ethnic and religious differences.

Important role in the identification of individual plays subjective attitude and devotion to a mythical land.

Understanding of the area as "their" or "foreign" becomes an integral part of personal identity. Its important role in the identification of the Bulgarian Turks who rationalize space you inhabit, in different ways. There is a distinction between the territory as a geographical concept, the state and its social organization, while each is loaded with various symbolic and cultural meanings. Earth as a social space takes different dimensions of "home," "homeland" or rather the "birthplace" of "historic land" or "homeland" and finally - the state-political institution with its specialized bodies of regulating the .

Those Bulgarian Turks who see Turkey as their homeland, have repeatedly been able to leave Bulgaria and, as mentioned above, after inflow tended to drastically reduce the number of representatives of this ethnic community.

Another group of Bulgarian Turks are loyal and accept their citizenship in Bulgaria.

Demand for ethnic roots of the Turkish community in Bulgaria goes from "Revival Process". Developed and distributed at that time official thesis claims that "so called "Bulgarian Turks" were indeed descendants of Muslim Bulgarians in the past that at various times, in one way or another have turtsizirali. "This theory of" birth Bulgarian origin "has met resistance from the Turkish population. Experience the authorities to enforce the idea of their genesis Bulgarian provoked the opposite reaction and forced the Bulgarian Turks seeking to prove the opposite. In an attempt to identify their origin, they have turned to the past of the community. Evidence was found immediately, if no - were invented. Returning to the legends about the origin is a kind of strategy for the preservation of the group. This reveals the ability of Bulgarian Turks to consolidate and preserve the cultural and religious foundations of their ethnic community.

The nation's historical collectivity type, marked by community inhabited territory, official language, cultural traditions, interests and constituent ethnic groups. Nature is multietnokulturna modern nations and their segmentation is the mark of destruction. In this sense, conflicts based on ethnic and religious interests are unacceptable in the context of European and universal values. Ethnic and religious self-identity are the result of individual freedom to define themselves by their faith and convictions.

Here is the source (http://www.omda.bg/public/studentski_forum/2008-2009_esen/sevim_tahir_bg_turtsi.htm)in Bulgarian.

[Bugarash 1893]

Again-Turks should thank us.
For us was the easiest to massacre or deport them all.
We had clean chances for that,now there wouldnt be a thread like this where Onur could write his frustrations.
But we didint.

Turks still existing in Bulgaria even after 500 years of torture,rape and murder just shows how big is the tolerance level of Bulgarians.

[Loki]

There's a sizable Turkish population in Bulgaria. They make up about 9% of the population of the country. Having been there since the 14th and 15th centuries, they are truly "native" there. They are also concentrated more in certain regions:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/46/TurksInBGPercent2011.svg/800px-TurksInBGPercent2011.svg.png

[Guapo]

Send them to Berlin

[Bugarash 1893]

I think we should open another thread eh?
I mean two threads is alright,but a a third one,now that would be something...

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?59502-The-Turks-of-Bulgaria

[Loki]

I think we should open another thread eh?
I mean two threads is alright,but a a third one,now that would be something...

http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?59502-The-Turks-of-Bulgaria

Apologies, I will merge them.

[Hoca]

I heard Bulgarian Turks number around the million. We need to give more support to them IMHO.

[wvwvw]

[

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provisional_Government_of_Western_Thrace[/ur


Scary flag...

[morski]

I heard Bulgarian Turks number around the million. We need to give more support to them IMHO.

I heard there was life on Mars.

[Bugarash 1893]

I heard Bulgarian Turks number around the million. We need to give more support to them IMHO.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjQBq6tVXc8

[Loki]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjQBq6tVXc8

Not bad :thumb001:

[Hoca]

Turkey should presure Bulgaria more for more rights for Bulgarian Turks.

[Kastrioti1443]

Lol, bulgarians do not give them any rights, salute you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=U-EQJA8Ahac

[morski]

Turkey should presure Bulgaria more for more rights for Bulgarian Turks.

They have all the rights other ethnic groups in Bulgaria have.

[wvwvw]

They have all the rights other ethnic groups in Bulgaria have.

Bulgarian Turks deserve priviledges and preferential treatment which Bulgaria denies them

[morski]

Bulgarian Turks deserve priviledges and preferential treatment which Bulgaria denies them

That's counter-productive to democracy and the whole concept of human rights.

[Kastrioti1443]

Bulgarian Turks deserve priviledges and preferential treatment which Bulgaria denies them

you wogs can not speak about rights, because almost 50% of the population in greece is not '' greek'', you know what i mean, turks, arvanites, vlachs, fyromans etc etc

[wvwvw]

you wogs can not speak about rights, because almost 50% of the population in greece is not '' greek'', you know what i mean, turks, arvanites, vlachs, fyromans etc etc

In your Albrownian dreams maybe

[wvwvw]

That's counter-productive to democracy and the whole concept of human rights.

True human rights is what's in Quran ;)

[Bugarash 1893]

you wogs can not speak about rights, because almost 50% of the population in greece is not '' greek'', you know what i mean, turks, arvanites, vlachs, fyromans etc etc

No such thing as fyromians in Greece.
There can be Bulgarians but not fyromians.

[Bugarash 1893]

Bulgarian Turks deserve priviledges and preferential treatment which Bulgaria denies them

When you will return everything north of Thessaly yhen we can talk...

[Kastrioti1443]

In your Albrownian dreams maybe

You greek nigger, how dar you denying the rights of the white people in greece you arabo-iranian????

[Crn Volk]

No such thing as fyromians in Greece.
There can be Bulgarians but not fyromians.


That's true, there are no 'fyromians', only ethnic Macedonians

[Crn Volk]

you wogs can not speak about rights, because almost 50% of the population in greece is not '' greek'', you know what i mean, turks, arvanites, vlachs, fyromans etc etc

says the shiptar wog

[wvwvw]

You greek nigger, how dar you denying the rights of the white people in greece you arabo-iranian????

Whites have no place in Greece


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaRxKR81PKo

[Kastrioti1443]

says the shiptar wog

What are you doing here you slavophone nigger??? It is well know that albanians are whiter than nigger fyromans, every blond fyroman comes from the western side of fyrom, where albanians live.

You are not evan bulgarians, because you are dark.

[Kastrioti1443]

Whites have no place in Greece


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UaRxKR81PKo

lol this nigger has really gone crazy!!!!1 Thracians were blacks and ramses has conquered europe lol loooool

[Crn Volk]

What are you doing here you slavophone nigger??? It is well know that albanians are whiter than nigger fyromans, every blond fyroman comes from the western side of fyrom, where albanians live.

You are not evan bulgarians, because you are dark.

I opened the thread shitard