Russia calls on UN Security Council to let Bosnia go

[mysticism]

"Russia calls on UN Security Council to relinquish Bosnia to those who live there"

RUSSIA has called upon the UN Security Council to state: that the situation in BiH has stabilized long ago and thus the citizens of that land can from now on control their destiny themselves.

"There must be an end to the ignoring of the fact, that the situation in BiH in the past 5 years has been particularly stable." - Stated Russia's UN Security Council representative Vitali Churkin.

In the name of his country he separately stated that now the main goal of the international community is to give BiH to those who live there. Thus - said Churkin - we must look forward and create "a course of further reform in the international presence in this state".

Churkin called again to dismantle the Office of the High Representative for Bosnia and Herzegovina.

http://fakti.org/rossiya/mid/rusija-pozvala-savet-bezbednosti-un-da-sudbinu-bih-prepusti-onima-koji-u-njoj-zive (In Serbian)

[Methmatician]

I love Russia and Russians, but I can see what he's trying to do, and I don't like it.

[sevruk]

I love Russia and Russians, but I can see what he's trying to do, and I don't like it.

:picard1:

[Mraz]

They should mind their business.

[sevruk]

They should mind their business.

U.S. and EU should also take care of
their business and not get involved in other countries' affairs

[Sultan Suleiman]

I love Russia and Russians, but I can see what he's trying to do, and I don't like it.

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

[Mraz]

U.S. and EU should also take care of
their business and not get involved in other countries' affairs

US and EU are factors of stability and supporters of Bosnian sovereignty. Russians are as legitimate in Bosnia than Saudi Arabians...

[Sultan Suleiman]

U.S. and EU should also take care of
their business and not get involved in other countries' affairs

Bosniaks invited them to be the non partisan player, help around with issues and for the last 20 years they had been doing a great job.

[mysticism]

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

This is no way to speak about your slavic brothers :D

[Methmatician]

If Russia wants to help with the stability of Bosnia and Herzegovina, invest more in Bosnia. I rather Russian money going to Bosnia than Saudi.

[mysticism]

If Russia wants to help with the stability of Bosnia and Herzegovina, invest more in Bosnia. I rather Russian money going to Bosnia than Saudi.

In which time Bosnia stays a UN/NATO satellite state? :rolleyes:

[The Lawspeaker]

US and EU are factors of stability and supporters of Bosnian sovereignty. Russians are as legitimate in Bosnia than Saudi Arabians...

:rotfl:

[Sultan Suleiman]

If Russia wants to help with the stability of Bosnia and Herzegovina, invest more in Bosnia. I rather Russian money going to Bosnia than Saudi.

Money is money bro :thumb001:

[Methmatician]

Money is money bro :thumb001:

Yeah, but with Saudi money comes Wahhabi Mosques, missionaries and Qurans rewritten in a more extreme form. It's a subtle kind of propaganda that easily attracts people who are having trouble with life. Religious conversion is usually for the troubled or poor.

[mysticism]

Money is money bro :thumb001:

Would you accept a "donation" of 20 million dollars to the federation, in exchange for 300ft Russian Orthodox Church in the center of Sarajevo?

[evon]

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

Russians never do anything for free...and in this age of post-soviet empire building, its no wonder they are checking their potential boundaries..

[Sultan Suleiman]

:rotfl:

Actually in our case the US has been a good partner which stayed true to their word. :thumb001:

[Sultan Suleiman]

Russians never do anything for free...and in this age of post-soviet empire building, its no wonder they are checking their potential boundaries..

IDK how are they thinking of expanding borders and influence spheres when their state is about to trough one of the worst cases of depopulation world has ever seen? :(

[Sultan Suleiman]

Would you accept a "donation" of 20 million dollars to the federation, in exchange for 300ft Russian Orthodox Church in the center of Sarajevo?

Depends on location in Sarajevo :D

[Hurrem sultana]

Depends on location in Sarajevo :D

he said center :O no way

[The Lawspeaker]

Actually in our case the US has been a good partner which stayed true to their word. :thumb001:

Until they don't need you anymore. :thumb001:

[evon]

IDK how are they thinking of expanding borders and influence spheres when their state is about to trough one of the worst cases of depopulation world has ever seen? :(

I think they are using their resources and military might still, the brief war with Georgia was the final test versus other world powers on the matter, and it seems Russia still is a power to be reckoned with..lucky for my own country we solved most of our border disputes with them just a few years ago :)

[Sultan Suleiman]

he said center :O no way

Imaš Centar Istočnog Sarajeva :D

[Sultan Suleiman]

Until they don't need you anymore. :thumb001:

I know it too well.

Well while there are still those 9 billion barrels of oil (for which we don't have the capacaties to get to 2/3 of it) they need us and we need their educational, financial and military expertise. It is a good trade off TBH.

[Sultan Suleiman]

I think they are using their resources and military might still, the brief war with Georgia was the final test versus other world powers on the matter, and it seems Russia still is a power to be reckoned with..lucky for my own country we solved most of our border disputes with them just a few years ago :)

We don't share any borders with them, so lucky us :D

[evon]

We don't share any borders with them, so lucky us :D

But you share borders with their favourite child, Serbia..

[Sultan Suleiman]

But you share borders with their favourite child, Serbia..

I doubt that my step dad caught in his stars and stripes pajamas on his worst day would let anything happen to one of his most loyal meal tickets.

[mysticism]

Actually in our case the US has been a good partner which stayed true to their word. :thumb001:

You just can't be disappointed because you had absolutely nothing before. :thumb001:

[sevruk]

Bosnian - Subslavs:D

[Sultan Suleiman]

You just can't be disappointed because you had absolutely nothing before. :thumb001:

Why do you refer as Serbs as "nothing"? We shared the same federation for the last 70 years of the last century. :rolleyes:

[mysticism]

Why do you refer as Serbs as "nothing"? We shared the same federation for the last 70 years of the last century. :rolleyes:

You had the Serbs? As far as I know you were mere "Muslims" speaking Serbo-Croatian for 50 years and then Serb/Croatian Muslims for another 25 within the Kingdom of the Serbs Croats and Slovenians.

Izetbegovic was a fool for doing what he did, practically sacrificed a load of your population for an idea that will never come to fruition.

[Mraz]

:rotfl:

Basicaly, without them Serbs from Bosnia would already been independant since they don't listen to federal gvt...


This is no way to speak about your slavic brothers :D

They are not brothers of Bosniak, they are your brothers....Turks are our brothers.

[Sultan Suleiman]

You had the Serbs? As far as I know you were mere "Muslims" speaking Serbo-Croatian for 50 years and then Serb/Croatian Muslims for another 25 within the Kingdom of the Serbs Croats and Slovenians.

Term Bosniak and Bosnian language were banned under Kingdom of SHS, while on 4 different occasions the communists denied us Bosnianhood and Bosniaks as an ethnicity precisely for this effect we have right here so that Serbs could say "Lol you didn't call yourself Bosniaks for 100 years, u must be imagnury herp derp"

That communist shit Tito had the entire petitioners of Bosniak Resolutions arrested and every educated officer which promoted Bosnianhood during the "NO"B quickly disappeared in aftermath of war thanks to "counter revisionism" political activities. The communist "freedom fighters" did more damage to Bosniaks than all the Chetniks. At least during the SHS we knew where our enemies lie.



Izetbegovic was a fool for doing what he did, practically sacrificed a load of your population for an idea that will never come to fruition.

Izetbegović got what he wanted. Bosnia with over 50% of Bosniak population is already achieved, now it's just a wait game till the Serbs and Croats drip away to Croatia and Serbia, being reduced to more manageable numbers.
I respect Izetbegović because he enabled me to say Bog, Bosna, Bošnjaci and not disappear in a fucking Serbo-communist cell never to be heard again.While the sacrifices of our fallen kin will be lamented for centuries to come, they will be the example what happened to Bosniaks for following any "pan" movements to come.

[Mortimer]

russians are right, EU/NATO is occupying bosnian territory and probably sleep with innocent bosniak woman like @bosnian somewhere in sarajevo

[Mraz]

Term Bosniak and Bosnian language were banned under Kingdom of SHS, while on 4 different occasions the communists denied us Bosnianhood and Bosniaks as an ethnicity precisely for this effect we have right here so that Serbs could say "Lol you didn't call yourself Bosniaks for 100 years, u must be imagnury herp derp"

That communist shit Tito had the entire petitioners of Bosniak Resolutions arrested and every educated officer which promoted Bosnianhood during the "NO"B quickly disappeared in aftermath of war thanks to "counter revisionism" political activities. The communist "freedom fighters" did more damage to Bosniaks than all the Chetniks. At least during the SHS we knew where our enemies lie.



Izetbegović got what he wanted. Bosnia with over 50% of Bosniak population is already achieved, now it's just a wait game till the Serbs and Croats drip away to Croatia and Serbia, being reduced to more manageable numbers.
I respect Izetbegović because he enabled me to say Bog, Bosna, Bošnjaci and not disappear in a fucking Serbo-communist cell never to be heard again.While the sacrifices of our fallen kin will be lamented for centuries to come, they will be the example what happened to Bosniaks for following any "pan" movements to come.

Alija was right, we maybe lost a lot of lives, but if we compare with other wars, it's relatively low. Now we have army and things will not happen like in the past where our disarmed, noble people had to face dark age apes.
So I also respect Izetbegovic for the change.

[mysticism]

Term Bosniak and Bosnian language were banned under Kingdom of SHS, while on 4 different occasions the communists denied us Bosnianhood and Bosniaks as an ethnicity precisely for this effect we have right here so that Serbs could say "Lol you didn't call yourself Bosniaks for 100 years, u must be imagnury herp derp"

That communist shit Tito had the entire petitioners of Bosniak Resolutions arrested and every educated officer which promoted Bosnianhood during the "NO"B quickly disappeared in aftermath of war thanks to "counter revisionism" political activities. The communist "freedom fighters" did more damage to Bosniaks than all the Chetniks. At least during the SHS we knew where our enemies lie.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbvpzqrizq1rix9zco1_400.jpg




Izetbegović got what he wanted. Bosnia with over 50% of Bosniak population is already achieved, now it's just a wait game till the Serbs and Croats drip away to Croatia and Serbia, being reduced to more manageable numbers.
I respect Izetbegović because he enabled me to say Bog, Bosna, Bošnjaci and not disappear in a fucking Serbo-communist cell never to be heard again.While the sacrifices of our fallen kin will be lamented for centuries to come, they will be the example what happened to Bosniaks for following any "pan" movements to come.

Izetbegovic wanted what the Islamic declaration implied for, he wanted a country under the flag he fought for. You got neither, and you have only 1/2 of a state that is under temporary supervision by the big boys.

[RussiaPrussia]

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

russias gdp accounts more than half of all of eastern europe (eu eastern europe, european soviet countries and Balkans).

[Sultan Suleiman]

russias gdp accounts more than half of all of eastern europe (eu eastern europe, european soviet countries and Balkans).

So is Saudia Arabia's one, but you don't see any of that wealth trickling down to the ordinary people or see it used up in social/economic projects.

[Dacul]

I do not need US to "guide" my country destiny,or protect my country from "great evil Russia" ,I do not need jews to teach us what to do!
Norway,Finland,Japan are my model of countries,not Jewunited States of America!
I do not like NATO either and I think they (US and NATO) should let Bosnia alone.
In fact I am praying to God to protect my country from US and Israel and jews and fanatic new-protestants!

[Sultan Suleiman]

Izetbegovic wanted what the Islamic declaration implied for, he wanted a country under the flag he fought for.

I've read his Islamic Decleration, and his "Islamic system of governance" included pretty much what I have in my political description. He wanted a no-party republic where men would be just reflected by his previous actions and his merits rather than the name of the party behind him, another part of his "ISOG" were short 1-2 year mandates depending on level of governance and what probably takes the cake he wanted to introduce gold based currency and full scale Islamic Financing.

There were no mandatory burqas waiting for every thing without a convex genitalia, or stoning or amputations or jiyza tax or dihmis or any other piece of Serb propaganda you have heard.

[The Lawspeaker]

I've read his Islamic Decleration, and his "Islamic system of governance" included pretty much what I have in my political description. He wanted a no-party republic where men would be just reflected by his previous actions and his merits rather than the name of the party behind him, another part of his "ISOG" were short 1-2 year mandates depending on level of governance and what probably takes the cake he wanted to introduce gold based currency and full scale Islamic Financing.

There were no mandatory burqas waiting for every thing without a convex genitalia, or stoning or amputations or jiyza tax or dihmis or any other piece of Serb propaganda you have heard.

Hmm tell me more about that system of governance ?

[Sultan Suleiman]

Hmm tell me more about that system of governance ?

He tried to replicate the First Caliphate republican system, he took some pointers from old Bosnian House system (there for you will find lots of pro Islamic free market fan service and his emphasis on corporations to be the leading force in Bosnia's economy), but modernized and revamped to serve Bosnia's needs.

But pick up original Bosnian to English copy (with Alija Izetbegović's commentaries) rather than an Arab-to-English copy butchered by Arab censourists and state sponsored "commentators".

When reading original Bosnian copy and then comparing it to the Arab "enhanced" copy it feels like it was written by different person on a different world. No bigger mentions of a republic with short spanning mandates or the unhindered free speech in confines of moral decency, just that heavily Islamic influenced cult of the state is put in a much prominent location with great emphasis on loyalty to the state head. But in Arab versions there isn't any mention that a leader should be elected by his peers just blind loyalty to him (and you're gonna have to swallow few cheap Haddiths here and there to showcase the importance of loyalty etc).

When Alija Izetbegović said "that a Muslim state is incompatible with any non-Islamic forms of government" he meant of one party republics, corrupt theocracies, western liberal democracies and monarchies, while he in his book explained how an Islamic society should look like. The Serb propaganda took the bolded part and threw out all the silly speech about republics, Islamic corporate driven free market economies, criticism of current situation in Islamic world, suggestions how to make peace with Israel, glorification of Japanese culture and Europe during the Renaissance and just concentrated on that one single sentience without any context of it.

If you plan on picking it up just take the Haddiths, pan-Ummah crap and Bosnian Sunni tradition with a grain of salt.

[kvarc]

artificial state of Bosnia and Hercegovina is falling apart big time :) .....and it serves it right ;)

[Sultan Suleiman]

artificial state of Bosnia and Hercegovina is falling apart big time :) .....and it serves it right ;)

It's been "falling apart" since the end of the war and in that time half of Croats and 350K of Serbs have left it. I don't understand what you mean that is "serves right".

You didn't manage to brake it in the war when Bosniaks were being threatened by biological extinction, trust me you are not going to do it now.

[Virtuous]

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

KjvrkdFfzx4

[kvarc]

It's been "falling apart" since the end of the war and in that time half of Croats and 350K of Serbs have left it. I don't understand what you mean that is "serves right".

You didn't manage to brake it in the war when Bosniaks were being threatened by biological extinction, trust me you are not going to do it now.

Bosnia is already broken, you just don`t know it yet, bcs you have been brainwashed by Muslim politicians, who earn billions by keeping you politically stupid ;)

HfmJatsur9o

[mysticism]

VV is
http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/05_04/035ostrich_468x538.jpg

[Sultan Suleiman]

Bosnia is already broken, you just don`t know it yet, bcs you have been brainwashed by Muslim politicians, who earn billions by keeping you politically stupid ;)


I know who the thiefs are and there are Quranic ways with which will I want to dispose of that shit when a feasible alternatives.

Till then the kleptocratic shits stay. While 20ish years of stagnation while Bosniaks increase their % compared to a millenia long history of my nation is a good trade off.

[mysticism]

I know who the thiefs are and there are Quranic ways with which will I want to dispose of that shit when a feasible alternatives.


http://narwhaler.com/img/gf/c/jihad-islamic-derp-GfcxUX.jpg

[Sultan Suleiman]

...

Well I think a choice between forever being bared from entering Bosnia or arm-y chop chop are only things I would want to give to these kleptocrats which fucked over 1,9 million people because both of their incompetence and their greed.

[kvarc]

I know who the thiefs are and there are Quranic ways with which will I want to dispose of that shit when a feasible alternatives.

Till then the kleptocratic shits stay. While 20ish years of stagnation while Bosniaks increase their % compared to a millenia long history of my nation is a good trade off.

no offence but, bosniak nation has it`s anciet root in 1993 :D

....and Muslims or Bosniak are leaving Bosnia, so there numbers aren`t growing, and even if they are, they will not ceartnly live in Republika Srpska

[Sultan Suleiman]

[QUOTE=kvarc;1174628]no offence but, bosniak nation has it`s anciet root in 1993 :D
/QUOTE]

:bored:

[RussiaPrussia]

So is Saudia Arabia's one, but you don't see any of that wealth trickling down to the ordinary people or see it used up in social/economic projects.

no its not
http://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/index.php
gdp nominal 2011 imf

3582 billion dollars (Eastern Europe with Russia) - 1850 (Russia) = 1732 Billion dollars

Saudi arabia = 597 billion
Indonesia = 846 billion biggest muslim economy in the world now.

so you can see russias economy is bigger than all the other eastern european countries together. And its more than 3 times bigger than saudi arabia.

[Sultan Suleiman]

...

I am referring to that the size of the economy isn't a good indicator of how people live :rolleyes:

[wochisu]

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[Albion]

U.S. and EU should also take care of
their business and not get involved in other countries' affairs

Like Russia does? :icon_rolleyes:

[Twistedmind]

Like Russia does? :icon_rolleyes:
Dont get offended, but what bussines UK have here in Bosnia? Russians have oil rafinery, so they have some legitimacy, unlike UK or US which directly intervened in war.

[Albion]

Dont get offended, but what bussines UK have here in Bosnia? Russians have oil rafinery, so they have some legitimacy, unlike UK or US which directly intervened in war.

None. Russians cannot judge though, America and Russia are two of the worst countries when it comes to intervening in the affairs of other countries. An oil refinery isn't much btw, most countries have many of those.

[Twistedmind]

None. Russians cannot judge though, America and Russia are two of the worst countries when it comes to intervening in the affairs of other countries. An oil refinery isn't much btw, most countries have many of those.
In Bosnia there is just one, and it's Russian. Anyway, I dont want to enter in another shitstorm with my Islamic fellow countrymen. There is to much albanians arround, to watch Southern Slavs fighting.

[eeroli]

As a finnish i would not ever trust russia. Ok. its up to you.

[Albion]

In Bosnia there is just one, and it's Russian. Anyway, I dont want to enter in another shitstorm with my Islamic fellow countrymen. There is to much albanians arround, to watch Southern Slavs fighting.

FDI is important to our economies, but this doesn't automatically translate into relations. The UK, France and USA for example are each others largest foreign investors (no matter what France cries about evil Anglos), but then there are also major ones such as Japan to which we only have a loose relationship. UK ties to Japan aren't so strong and are largely just following America's lead and yet it's one of the largest foreign investors here. So Russian FDI doesn't necessarily mean great relations between countries, FDI can be purely based on trade.

[Twistedmind]

Well Serbs and Russians are traditionally allies, which dates back long before US was established, or long before UK had even know for Bosnia. On other hand between 35 and 40% of population of Bosnia are said Serbs, and rest of population are also Slavic. Russians have religious, ethnic, linguistic, economic and cultural relations with that part of world, unlike US which just saws entire Balkans as part of it's playing table for controle of Europe.

[Gospodine]

Actually in our case the US has been a good partner which stayed true to their word. :thumb001:

Come on man... I've never seen you get that naive.

How were they a "good partner" to the Bosnian people?

By passing the 1991 Foreign Appropriations Act which cut off all trade, loans and credits to the Former Yugoslavia; and mandated that the only post-Yugoslav election results that would be recognized by the US State Department/UN as legitimate would be those America personally approved?

By spending close to $77.2 million funding opposition nationalist elements in the Former Yugoslavia up to the year 2000?

By supporting an arms embargo of Bosnia that deprived the nation of the right to self-defence when it needed it most?

By purposefully allowing massacres to happen (giving UN peace keepers rules of engagement tighter than a nun's vagina) and then only stepping in once media saturation of said massacres had reached a sufficient level for America to be able to justify to the world that Serbia is Nazi Germany and needed to bombed back into the stone age come 1999?

By helping smuggle in Mujahideen filth courtesy of Pakistan's ISI (in collaboration with the CIA) which sent Afghan veterans of the Soviet invasion and other Arab misfits from around the world to Zenica where they perpetuated atrocities, discredited a legitimate Bosnian identity with minority extremist views and helped radicalize a generation of youths?

Bosnia and Albania are the two worst cases of Stockholm syndrome I've ever seen.

[RussiaPrussia]

Meh, Russia just needs to take in the fact that the age of USSR is gone and in this day and age they are nothing more than a Saudi Arabia with ever aging nukes and military hardware. :D

haha ?


we are sixth largest economy and third largest military spender

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures

http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.PP.CD?order=wbapi_data_value_2011%20wb api_data_value%20wbapi_data_value-last&sort=desc&display=default

[RussiaPrussia]

None. Russians cannot judge though, America and Russia are two of the worst countries when it comes to intervening in the affairs of other countries. An oil refinery isn't much btw, most countries have many of those.

when did russia ever invaded another country???

The only exception were georgia and moldovia but it was response for an attack on their people.

America and its puppet firends on the other hand made a planed invasion to iraq or afghanistan.

[Illancha]

when did russia ever invaded another country???

The only exception were georgia and moldovia but it was response for an attack on their people.

America and its puppet firends on the other hand made a planed invasion to iraq or afghanistan.
Chechnya?

Or was that an 'internal issue'?

Actually you're right Russia didn't invade Chechnya, it destroyed Chechnya.

[Albion]

haha ?


we are sixth largest economy and third largest military spender

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_military_expenditures

http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.MKTP.PP.CD?order=wbapi_data_value_2011%20wb api_data_value%20wbapi_data_value-last&sort=desc&display=default

It's not what you spend, it's what you spend it on. Britain spends a lot and doesn't have much to show for it in my opinion.


when did russia ever invaded another country???

The only exception were georgia and moldovia but it was response for an attack on their people.

America and its puppet firends on the other hand made a planed invasion to iraq or afghanistan.

Czechoslovakia and Afghanistan are the two most obvious examples. You're successor to the Soviet Union and it was essentially Russia leading it.

[RussiaPrussia]

It's not what you spend, it's what you spend it on. Britain spends a lot and doesn't have much to show for it in my opinion.



Czechoslovakia and Afghanistan are the two most obvious examples. You're successor to the Soviet Union and it was essentially Russia leading it.

:picard2: the soviet union is not russia just as the eu is not germany. The reason why britain and other western defense industry have not much to offer for their money is because their defense industries belong to private companies.
The companies think more about profit rather than security, like any private company they hide their profits into their price for the arms. In russia the state pays itself for new arms.

[RussiaPrussia]

Chechnya?

Or was that an 'internal issue'?

Actually you're right Russia didn't invade Chechnya, it destroyed Chechnya.

its an internal affair, also you made a genocide on russians, almost no one is left there.

[Illancha]

its an internal affair, also you made a genocide on russians, almost no one is left there.
Reverse the truth and sell it to the public in typical Kremlin fashion.

[Albion]

:picard2: the soviet union is not russia just as the eu is not germany. The reason why britain and other western defense industry have not much to offer for their money is because their defense industries belong to private companies.
The companies think more about profit rather than security, like any private company they hide their profits into their price for the arms. In russia the state pays itself for new arms.

Actually it is, legally Russia is the same country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Successor_state

And private companies usually do a better job of things than inefficient government industries. Cost are high because labour prices are high and much of the budget goes to Trident and updating the fleet.

[RussiaPrussia]

Reverse the truth and sell it to the public in typical Kremlin fashion.

ok lets see

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chechnya#Ethnic_groups

1989 24.8% russian

2002 3.7% russian

[Illancha]

ok lets see

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chechnya#Ethnic_groups

1989 24.8% russian

2002 3.7% russian
I never denied that the Russian population has decreased drastically. What I am denying, however, is that there were organised and targeted mass killings or exile of ethnic Russians living in Chechnya. Of course some Chechens did kill Russians, but those are criminals and it certainly was not of the scale you speak, genocide.

Besides why would a Russian want to live there anymore when Russia itself is dropping bombs on them? If I was a Russian I would escape before the war even started.

[RussiaPrussia]

Actually it is, legally Russia is the same country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Successor_state

And private companies usually do a better job of things than inefficient government industries. Cost are high because labour prices are high and much of the budget goes to Trident and updating the fleet.

yeah and now they are guilty for all the crazy marxists who guided the country,who werent even russians like lenin or stalin for eternity like the germans?? And all other post soviet countries are not??

And private companies are as long as efficient as long as they have competition, but defense industry is different. There is no competion one company makes the tank the other the cruiser. And they produce arms which are supposed to work for decades, there is no market who reacts fast to say whats better because the market is the governments budget.

[Albion]

yeah and now they are guilty for all the crazy marxists who guided the country,who werent even russians like lenin or stalin for eternity like the germans?? And all other post soviet countries are not??

Correct. Russians were the ones that adopted Communism and imposed it on other countries, they didn't have to listen to a few degenerates but they did.
Britain is held to account for the British Empire and the actions of its Norman-derived aristocracy ], Russia too is judged by its actions.


And private companies are as long as efficient as long as they have competition, but defense industry is different. There is no competion one company makes the tank the other the cruiser.

Well in the UK there is one major company, BAE but the government can and often does buy foreign equipment. Instead of Eurofighter it could have gone with Gripen or Rafale which are cheaper. So I don't think the defence industry lack competition.


And they produce arms which are supposed to work for decades, there is no market who reacts fast to say whats better because the market is the governments budget.

Well there are always foreign countries to sell to. Some countries will sell their old equipment to others (such as Britain selling ships to Chile) and buy new, or in some cases the other countries will buy new, but cheaper equipment.

[SKYNET]

when did russia ever invaded another country???

The only exception were georgia and moldovia but it was response for an attack on their people.

America and its puppet firends on the other hand made a planed invasion to iraq or afghanistan.




Jesus fucking Christ







Wars involving Russia



Grand Duchy of Moscovy (1283–1547)

Great stand on the Ugra river (8 October 1480)

First Muscovite-Lithuanian War (1492-1494)

Russo-Swedish War (1495–1497)

Second Muscovite-Lithuanian War (1500-1503)

Third Muscovite-Lithuanian War (1507-1508)

Fourth Muscovite-Lithuanian War (1512-1522)

Fifth Muscovite-Lithuanian War (1534-1537)





Tsardom of Russia (1547–1721)

Livonian War (1558-1583)

Russo-Turkish War (1568–1570)

Russo-Swedish War (1590–1595)

Polish–Muscovite War (1605–1618)

Ingrian War (1610-1617)

Smolensk War (1632-1634)

Russian–Manchu border conflicts (1652-1689)

Russo-Polish War (1654–67)

Russo-Swedish War (1656–1658)

Russo-Turkish War (1676–1681)

Russo-Turkish War (1686–1700) Part of the Great Turkish War

Great Northern War (1700-1721)





Russian Empire (1721–1917)

Russo-Persian War (1722–1723)

War of the Polish Succession (1733-1738)

Russo-Austrian-Turkish War (1735–1739)

Russo-Swedish War (1741–1743) Part of the War of the Austrian Succession

War of the Austrian Succession (16 December 1740 - 18 October 1748)

Seven Years' War (1756-1763) Russian involvement until 1762

War of the Bar Confederation (1768-1772)

Russo-Turkish War (1768–1774)

Russo-Turkish War (1787–1792)

Russo-Swedish War (1788–1790)

Polish–Russian War of 1792

Persian Expedition of 1796

War of the Second Coalition (1799-1802) Russia left the coalition in 1799

War of the Third Coalition (1803-1806)

Russo-Persian War (1804–1813)

War of the Fourth Coalition (1806-1807)

Russo-Turkish War (1806–1812)

Finnish War (21 February 1808 - 17 September 1809)

French invasion of Russia (24 June 1812 - 14 December 1812)

War of the Sixth Coalition (1813-1814)

War of the Seventh Coalition (20 March 1815 - 8 July 1815)

Russo-Persian War (1826–1828)

Battle of Navarino 20 October 1827 Part of the Greek War of Independence

Russo-Turkish War (1828–1829)

November Uprising (29 November 1830 - 21 October 1831)

Crimean War (1853-1856)

January Uprising (22 January 1863 - 11 April 1864)

Russo-Turkish War (1877–1878)

Boxer Rebellion (2 November 1899 - 7 September 1901)

Russo-Japanese War (8 February 1904 - 5 September 1905)

World War I (1914 - 1918)

Russian Civil War (1917 - 1922)





Russian Soviet Federative Socialist Republic (1917-1922)

Polish-Soviet War (February 1919 - March 1921)




Soviet Union (1922–1991)

Sino–Soviet conflict 1929

Soviet invasion of Xinjiang 1934

Islamic rebellion in Xinjiang 1937

Battle of Lake Khasan (1938-1938)

Soviet–Japanese Border Wars (1932-1939)

World War II (1939-1945) includes the Winter War

Soviet–Japanese War (1945)

Hungarian Revolution of 1956

War of Attrition (1967 - 7 August 1970)

Warsaw Pact invasion of Czechoslovakia (20 August 1968 - 20 September 1968)

Sino–Soviet border conflict (2 March 1969 - 11 September 1969)

Soviet war in Afghanistan (27 December 1979 - 15 February 1989)






Russian Federation

Civil war in Tajikistan (1992–1997)

First Chechen War (1994–1996)

Second Chechen War (1999–2002)

Russo-Georgian War (2008)

[Petersburg]

Jesus fucking Christ
you're talking the way like it's something bad lol

[Virtuous]

"Bosnia we will get you......RRRREMOVE KEBAB".

[Loki]

Chechnya?

Or was that an 'internal issue'?

Actually you're right Russia didn't invade Chechnya, it destroyed Chechnya.

Russia invested heavily in Chechnya thereafter. See how nice Grozny is now.

[SKYNET]

you're talking the way like it's something bad lol


what do you mean?

[Gospodine]

Russia invested heavily in Chechnya thereafter. See how nice Grozny is now.

LOLOLOL. Invested heavily in Kadyrovtsy, yes.

[Illancha]

Russia invested heavily in Chechnya thereafter. See how nice Grozny is now.
Yes, Loki, but at what expense? All the nice construction work going on in Grozny is a facade. It's there to give visitors or media an impression that things have stablised and life has returned to normal, but in reality there is an awful lot of bad blood behind it all. Corruption is rife at the top levels, the so called President is a blatant criminal. He doesn't even make an effort to hide it. If anyone speaks out against him, they disappear and their bodies are found ditched in the middle of a forest a few weeks later. Instead of rehabilitating the veterans of the two wars and helping them integerate back into society, he hunts them down and tortures them in his own personal jail. The top authorities do not care about the population, only about amassing a fortune at our expense and showing it off.

And the Kremlin does nothing about it because he's keeping things in check for now. He's a godsend for the Kremlin and so was his father, someone in a position of authority who would willingly spill the blood of his own people.

That's not even counting the drastic psychological toll the conflict has had on us. Mental health and stability is probably the greatest issue facing Chechens.

Of course development and progress is positive, but there are more fundamental societal issues that need to be tackled first. After all, what is more important, a pile of stones arranged in an elegant fashion, cars, clothes, guns and money or human beings?

[RussiaPrussia]

Jesus fucking Christ

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_United_States

You also dont get that when russia made all this wars back then it was part of the norm. Every one had to make wars to be able to compete with other european powers like britain or france otherwise russia would be a colony. And many times russia was attacked or provoked and its integrity was in danger. Its also clearly the older country therefor having more wars.

America is one of the safest countries when were you ever really attacked?? Its only the Independence war, some mexico, 1812 because of war hawkish policies to UK, ???. All other american wars were clearly invasions to other countries.

These days russia made only wars when it was attack like the 3 you mentioned and the two chechen wars were like civil wars. Its not the norm to make any wars anymore or invasions, but america still does. How can you even compare ww2 or napoleons invasion to the iraq war which was bush desire to play god??

[Illancha]

Accidental post.

[Petersburg]

Accidental post.

You wrote "death to Russians" and deleted :p:D:)

[Illancha]

You wrote "death to Russians" and deleted :p:D:)
Oh God you found out? I guess I didn't delete it fast enough.

[Albion]

Oh God you found out? I guess I didn't delete it fast enough.

It'll appear in email notifications.