Feminist celebrities

[Lux Aeterna]

This is where we list famous people who are feminists or expressed support for feminism. I wasn't sure where to place this thread, but since it's a political ideology I put it here...

I'll start with posting a few people;


Christina Aguilera
http://live.drjays.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Christina-Aguilera-Your-Body-Still-3.jpg

Slash
http://images4.alphacoders.com/233/233724.jpg

Kurt Cobain and Courtney Love
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m70k522ldV1qa2xzlo1_500.jpg

Aretha Franklin
http://lacoastpost.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/aretha-franklin-1.jpg

John Lennon
http://www.johnlennon.com/wp-content/themes/jl/images/home-gallery/2.jpg

Yoko Ono
http://photo.outlookindia.com/images/gallery/20120118/yoko_ono_20120130.jpg

Madonna
http://www.fond-ecran.com/ORIGINAUX/musique/madonna/madonna_004.jpg

Alanis Morissette
http://www.wallpaperextreme.com/Celebrities/Alanis-Morissette/Alanis-Morissette-14.JPG


Feel free to post more! :thumb001:

[Graus]

Great examples of how the patriarchy keeps all women down.

A (part)Swede posting this, so cliche

[Osprey]

many race mixers here....

[Lux Aeterna]

many race mixers here....

You know that your idol Clint Eastwood is a major race mixer, right?

Anyway, this thread is not about race mixing, but feminism, so kindly fuck off.

[Accountant]

http://acelebrationofwomen.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Jane_Fonda.jpg

"Hanoi" Jane Fonda, supporter of Black Panthers and feminism. :picard2:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1a/HJGE.jpg

[Lux Aeterna]

http://acelebrationofwomen.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Jane_Fonda.jpg

"Hanoi" Jane Fonda, supporter of Black Panthers and feminism. :picard2:


The black panthers and feminism doesn't have anything to do with each other, so it's unnecessary to mention it in the same sentence even. But well other than the Panther crap the woman is an icon.

[Osprey]

http://www.maryelise.com/modernwoman_bettyfriedan.jpg
Betty Feridan

[kabeiros]

http://www.maryelise.com/modernwoman_bettyfriedan.jpg
Betty Feridan:eek:

With a face like that, could se be anything else but a feminist?

[Lux Aeterna]

:eek:

With a face like that, could se be anything else but a feminist?

She obviously dedicated her life to something more important than superficial crap. Keep your irrelevant bullshit to yourself.

[Virtuous]

You can be feminist as much as you want, but would you be offended if I was a male chauvinist?

[Kalitas]

Yeah, Kurt Cobain was the best man that has ever existed (along with Layne Staley of course)
Respect and equality for all

[Graus]

Yeah, Kurt Cobain was the best man that has ever existed (along with Layne Staley of course)
Respect and equality for all

Feminism isnt about equality but about preferential treatment

[kabeiros]

Keep your irrelevant bullshit to yourself.
Feminism is like an injection with testosterone, it makes you behave arrogantly

[Kalitas]

Feminism isnt about equality but about preferential treatment

It depends. Really I don't like much the term femininsm either. As you said it sounds like "preferential". I'd rather use the word equality.
But we can't deny that this society has been very chauvinistic. Thank god this has been changing in the last decades. A couple of decades ago it would have been odd to find a woman working as an office manager (at least at my country).
What I do not understand at all are feminists who claim that abortion is a right. It sounds stupid to claim the right of killing your own child :(

[kabeiros]

Women don't want to be absolutely equal with men. They want to have all the rights of men but to keep their special privileges too. For example you will never hear from a feminist that mothers and fathers have equal rights, they think that mothers have more rights in regard to custody, abortion etc.

[Graus]

Indeed, they also dont want to be hold to the same standards, when it comes to criminal justice or the draft.
And they also argue for all kinds of privileges and quotas in education and the work force, despite performing better than men.

[Kazimiera]

Kate Millet
http://www.cynthiamacadams.com/images/katemillett1_88x382.jpg


Germaine Greer
http://www.portrait.gov.au/exhibit/pol/l10.jpg


Drucilla Cornell
http://www.thelondongraduateschool.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/cornell.jpg


Anais Nin
http://www.brainpickings.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/anaisnin1.jpg

[Caismeachd]

John Lennon was abusive and controlling towards women. Even Yoko Ono. He only said idealistic things that people wanted to hear but never followed his own example.

There's a poem on youtube "feminism killed Kurt Cobain".

[Lux Aeterna]

You can be feminist as much as you want, but would you be offended if I was a male chauvinist?

Don't be childish, it's not even comparable. Unlike popular belief among ignorant guys, original feminism isn't about man hate or special treatment, it's about respect and fairness, equality among men and women, something that should be obvious.

Male chauvinism on the other hand is about hate, domination and being superior over women. How can anyone except insecure boys support that?


Feminism isnt about equality but about preferential treatment

Not true, read what I wrote above.


Feminism is like an injection with testosterone, it makes you behave arrogantly

You come into my thread and makes a rude and irrelevant comment, you just wanted to take a piss on a thread you don't approve of, you shouldn't expect me to just let it go unnoticed.



Really I don't like much the term femininsm either. As you said it sounds like "preferential". I'd rather use the word equality.

That works too :)


What I do not understand at all are feminists who claim that abortion is a right. It sounds stupid to claim the right of killing your own child :(

This is an issue that goes both ways. There are plenty of men who refuses to take any responsibility for their children, who makes that clear from the very start, and that puts the woman in a tough spot, and not everyone can deal with that, one need to see it from the woman's perspective too.

Abortion should not be taken lightly on, but it takes two to have a baby, so both need to take their responsibilities!


Women don't want to be absolutely equal with men. They want to have all the rights of men but to keep their special privileges too. For example you will never hear from a feminist that mothers and fathers have equal rights, they think that mothers have more rights in regard to custody, abortion etc.

Regarding the custody question, in my (feminist) opinion the parent best suited should get the custody, or the majority of it, this is just too obvious to discuss further tbh. And to ever reach genuine equality, we should not strip off men the right to their children and to be dads, we should do the opposite and encourage men to be caring fathers and take equal responsibility, establish a strong father-and-child bond, just as strong as the stereotypical female version.

And on the abortion question, as I wrote, it should not be taken lightly on, and both the woman's and the man's opinion should be taken into consideration. But at the end of the day, it's the woman's body, and it's without a doubt the woman that will be the most affected by a baby the first 9 months, the whole pregnancy is on her, so she should have the last word in a decision like this.


Indeed, they also dont want to be hold to the same standards, when it comes to criminal justice or the draft.

Justice should not discriminate one way or the other.



And they also argue for all kinds of privileges and quotas in education and the work force, despite performing better than men.

I don't agree on this, the best (wo)man should get the job, gender should not be considered in this, and the same salary for both. Same opportunities, that's what I am for.


------

Can't say I'm surprised over all the negative posts in this thread, since a majority of the male users on this forum seem to be more or less misogynistic, in this particular thread only Kalitas seem to understand the positive aspects of feminism (equality).

And what many seem to not get is that since feminism is a political ideology, there are different kinds of feminism, and different degrees, even though certain core values are shared. Not all feminists are the same, there are varities within the same group, just like in every other ideology.

[sturmwalkure]

Feminism is a manifestation of Judaism.

No one with any interest in preservationism would support such a parasitic ideology.

[sturmwalkure]

Andrea Dworkin... pictures say a thousand words, eh?

http://www.rip-factor.com/formen/andrea_dworkin.jpg

It was such an ugly fat kike bitch, no wonder it was a Feminist.

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/391716_441825179203119_20228210_n.jpg
http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/602462_457358317649805_54057253_n.jpg

Feminism stinks.

[sturmwalkure]

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/188437_418752981513522_136920620_n.jpg
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/536433_458359580883012_838099679_n.jpg
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/561564_458036894248614_576855216_n.jpg
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/263538_457910570927913_1852079445_n.jpg

[Midori]

^If it wasn't for feminism you wouldn't have the rights you have today...

[Virtuous]

PP, feminism hence the name is more of a one sided thing, I'm all for equal rights, but you're wrong about this.

[Virtuous]

^If it wasn't for feminism you wouldn't have the rights you have today...

Equal rights, not feminism.

[Virtuous]

4JA4EPRbWhQ

[Midori]

Equal rights, not feminism.

Yes, but feminists fought for equal rights back in the day.

[Virtuous]

Yes, but feminists fought for equal rights back in the day.

True, back in the days when men could to whatever he wanted to his wife, like beat her etc etc, it sucked, something had to be done, something radical, with a name that should make impact...thus it was called feminism.

Slowly though, feminism not only reached it's goal and succeeded, it also crossed the line, it became the feminization and humiliation of the man, the man became weak.

This is the product of feminism in Sweden, btw.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-g7uMFji2QDY/TzrBHHNPLqI/AAAAAAAACWQ/RyMqv23R4hs/s1600/guidos+swedos+hilarious+italian+dance+club+fake+ta n+bronzer+muscle+milk+steroids+jaeger+bombs+new+ha ircut+blowout+tanorexic+guidowned+homos+clubbing+c lubbin+vince+delmonte+jersey+shore.jpg

[kabeiros]

Spot on, Malta :thumb001:

[Graus]

Don't be childish, it's not even comparable. Unlike popular belief among ignorant guys, original feminism isn't about man hate or special treatment, it's about respect and fairness, equality among men and women, something that should be obvious.

Male chauvinism on the other hand is about hate, domination and being superior over women. How can anyone except insecure boys support that?



Not true, read what I wrote above.



You come into my thread and makes a rude and irrelevant comment, you just wanted to take a piss on a thread you don't approve of, you shouldn't expect me to just let it go unnoticed.



That works too :)



This is an issue that goes both ways. There are plenty of men who refuses to take any responsibility for their children, who makes that clear from the very start, and that puts the woman in a tough spot, and not everyone can deal with that, one need to see it from the woman's perspective too.

Abortion should not be taken lightly on, but it takes two to have a baby, so both need to take their responsibilities!



Regarding the custody question, in my (feminist) opinion the parent best suited should get the custody, or the majority of it, this is just too obvious to discuss further tbh. And to ever reach genuine equality, we should not strip off men the right to their children and to be dads, we should do the opposite and encourage men to be caring fathers and take equal responsibility, establish a strong father-and-child bond, just as strong as the stereotypical female version.

And on the abortion question, as I wrote, it should not be taken lightly on, and both the woman's and the man's opinion should be taken into consideration. But at the end of the day, it's the woman's body, and it's without a doubt the woman that will be the most affected by a baby the first 9 months, the whole pregnancy is on her, so she should have the last word in a decision like this.



Justice should not discriminate one way or the other.



I don't agree on this, the best (wo)man should get the job, gender should not be considered in this, and the same salary for both. Same opportunities, that's what I am for.


------

Can't say I'm surprised over all the negative posts in this thread, since a majority of the male users on this forum seem to be more or less misogynistic, in this particular thread only Kalitas seem to understand the positive aspects of feminism (equality).

And what many seem to not get is that since feminism is a political ideology, there are different kinds of feminism, and different degrees, even though certain core values are shared. Not all feminists are the same, there are varities within the same group, just like in every other ideology.

Well in this case let me treat you as an equal and tell you, your opinion is basically bullshit. I know a thing or two about feminism and despite popular claim its not about equality. Its not even abouts womens rights in general but about the privileges of a certain class of women. Some people are simply a little bit more equal than others...

I am no misogynist, I actually like women and thats one of the reasons I despise feminism, because its so fucking degrading for men and women alike. We are all potential predators and you are all helpless victims. I like to think better of both men and women. I dont think you need preferential treatment.
I believe in equality of opportunity, not in equality of outcome.
And i am not even mentioning all the connections between feminism multi culturalism and cultural marxism.

But you are probably not like that, actually a lot of women who identify themselves as feminists arent. Which is the equivalent of me saying I am a christian but dont believe into the whole Jesus thing.

The ideology behind feminism is vile and repulsive. Patriarchy theory, rape culture and all the other bullshit.
The Quoran is a massage of love and mutual respect compared with radfem literature like the scum manifesto. Equality my ass...

[Virtuous]

FATALITY :D ^

[initpaul]

Emma Goldman:


A famous quote of her's that some may know is "if voting would change the world, it would be illegal" (paraphrased)

http://www.gonzotimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/emma-goldman.png

And...


http://www.radioanywhere.co.uk/upload/74/2676.boudicca.jpg

Boudicca!!!!

[Graus]

Emma Goldman:


A famous quote of her's that some may know is "if voting would change the world, it would be illegal" (paraphrased)

http://www.gonzotimes.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/emma-goldman.png

And...


http://www.radioanywhere.co.uk/upload/74/2676.boudicca.jpg

Boudicca!!!!

Why are you slandering Boudicca? She is a strong female leader in ancient times, with other words: a feminists worst nightmare.

[initpaul]

Why are you slandering Boudicca? She is a strong female leader in ancient times, with other words: a feminists worst nightmare.

lol

Actually I think she would be pretty apt and it isn't slander

The Celts were far more balanced and fair towards women in their society. This is partly what offended the Romans so much it seems when she inherited half of Prasutagus' kingdom.

She was whipped and her two young daughters raped and ye gods she got her revenge.

The nightmare would be for the 'civilised' (sic) Romans. At least initially. :D

[Graus]

lol

Actually I think she would be pretty apt and it isn't slander

The Celts were far more balanced and fair towards women in their society. This is partly what offended the Romans so much it seems when she inherited half of Prasutagus' kingdom.

She was whipped and her two young daughters raped and ye gods she got her revenge.

The nightmare would be for the 'civilised' (sic) Romans. At least initially. :D

Women like her dont exactly fit well with patriarchy theory. You see between the very ancient matriarchal utopias and modern day feminism, women were mere objects to be used as men saw fit.
A strong historical female person, who actually was able to achieve a position of power is more of a problem than a role model, since its against their narrative.

[Osprey]

Brad Pitt and Jolie

[Osprey]

^If it wasn't for feminism you wouldn't have the rights you have today...

What rights? I don't think girls here are sluts.....
And Mary still can type whatever she wants and she does not appear to have been influenced by feminism.....

[Midori]

What rights? I don't think girls here are sluts.....
And Mary still can type whatever she wants and she does not appear to have been influenced by feminism.....

Umm.. like using a computer :laugh:

[Mans not hot]

http://www.maryelise.com/modernwoman_bettyfriedan.jpg
Betty Feridan
Anglojew's mother.

[Osprey]

Umm.. like using a computer :laugh:

Read carefully. Mary uses a computer. But she does not seem to be influenced by feminists. And most men don't care if their women use computers, if they are faithful.

[sturmwalkure]

Leni Riefenstahl didn't need Feminism and she directed some of the greatest films ever in the 1930s -- way before the likes of Andrea Dworkin raised their ugly heads. The Third Reich ahead of it's time in many respects did give women rights, but not the same kind of 'rights' Feminists clamor for today. Guess what? Women were happier in Nazi Germany than today's Democratic societies. This is because Nazi Germany kept in tune with the eternal laws of nature. Men, women, and children alike were happy. Too bad international Jewry pushed war on this second Renaissance. All the glory of the ancient Roman empires and of the Occident were reawakened during this twelve glorious years. Most women need to realize they do not need Feminism to be happy.

[Graus]

Its not only not helping the happiness of women, it also seems to be detrimental it. The "liberated" women of today are less happy than their "enslaved" mothers or grandmothers.

[sturmwalkure]

Its not only not helping the happiness of women, it also seems to be detrimental it. The "liberated" women of today are less happy than their "enslaved" mothers or grandmothers.

That is correct. I've noted how unhappy Feminists are. Now why is that? It's not a big secret as to why I think.

[Mary]

...

[Sarmatian]

Don't be childish, it's not even comparable. Unlike popular belief among ignorant guys, original feminism isn't about man hate or special treatment, it's about respect and fairness, equality among men and women, something that should be obvious.

Who cares what original feminism was about? Its important what is it today and today its all about hate and man-bashing.


Male chauvinism on the other hand is about hate, domination and being superior over women. How can anyone except insecure boys support that?

I'm dominating and superior over women because I love them :cool:

Any normal woman need her man to be stronger than herself. No grown up woman likes whimpy immature boys they cannot respect.

[Lux Aeterna]

There's a poem on youtube "feminism killed Kurt Cobain".

People always try to blame something when someone dies, but this must be one of the most ridiculous things :picard1:


Feminism is a manifestation of Judaism.

No one with any interest in preservationism would support such a parasitic ideology.

All things that might have a Jewish origin is not necessarily bad, you're blinded by your Jew hate, you shouldn't condemn everything based on that, it's just stupid.


PP, feminism hence the name is more of a one sided thing, I'm all for equal rights, but you're wrong about this.

You get too hung up on what it's called and not what it really means, it's just a naming as you wrote yourself;


something had to be done, something radical, with a name that should make impact...thus it was called feminism.




Slowly though, feminism not only reached it's goal and succeeded, it also crossed the line,

There are many places in the world that still has a very long way to go before reaching anything even remotely similar to equality. And even in the Western world there are still things to make better, in the US for example, Obama has worked on things for improving women's status, as equal pay legislations etc This is current stuff going on, so everything is not all that perfect yet.



it became the feminization and humiliation of the man, the man became weak.

This is the product of feminism in Sweden, btw.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-g7uMFji2QDY/TzrBHHNPLqI/AAAAAAAACWQ/RyMqv23R4hs/s1600/guidos+swedos+hilarious+italian+dance+club+fake+ta n+bronzer+muscle+milk+steroids+jaeger+bombs+new+ha ircut+blowout+tanorexic+guidowned+homos+clubbing+c lubbin+vince+delmonte+jersey+shore.jpg

No one is forcing guys to look like that, it's called fashion, a metrosexual one that is. And speaking of metrosexuality, it seem to be widely spread in Italy for example, a country that is known for its "macho culture" and despite this the men likes to look gay, hell I might even go as far as saying Italian men are one of the founders of metrosexuality :p


...

What you write is completely alien to me, and does not correlate with feminism in the correct sense, the feminism I believe in, and what the majority of other feminists stands for. What you base your horror on is a small, but loud minority, and judging everyone because of them is just plain retarded! :picard1: There are idiots in all political ideologies, but that doesn't mean the ideology in its core is bad..


Who cares what original feminism was about?

I do, and many other women and men do too.



Its important what is it today and today its all about hate and man-bashing.

No, that's what only a small minority is about, true feminists you won't notice as much, since they focus on getting real things done instead of yelling about senseless shit.



I'm dominating and superior over women because I love them :cool:

I'm sure there are women who likes that too, I'm not one of them though.



Any normal woman need her man to be stronger than herself. No grown up woman likes whimpy immature boys they cannot respect.

Ofcourse no woman wants a whimpy immature guy? The best guys are those calm and secure guys, who have enough self esteem that they don't feel the compulsive need to dominate women and tries to be superior :thumb001:

[Lux Aeterna]

More feminists :thumb001:


Lady Gaga
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-r9h5zDCZL04/UECVqh8URXI/AAAAAAAABt8/qAkM1L0Kb9w/s1600/lady-gaga.jpg

Mos Def
http://gfx.aftonbladet-cdn.se/image/13594514/800/normal/2d247c1929dde/mosdef.jpg

Ashley Judd
http://xtremewalls.com/hollywoodf/ashleyjudd/ashley-judd-103-01.jpg

Diane Keaton
http://glambits.mediacreations.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/diane-keaton-standing.jpg

[Mary]

Most Feminists actually want a guy to oppress them.

[Mraz]

More feminists :thumb001:


Lady Gaga
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-r9h5zDCZL04/UECVqh8URXI/AAAAAAAABt8/qAkM1L0Kb9w/s1600/lady-gaga.jpg



I'm sorry, but how Lady Gaga can be considered as feminist when she basically is raw meat? Being immoral doesn't make you a feminist, or yes?

[Lux Aeterna]

how Lady Gaga can be considered as feminist...

This is a good question, after having looked into it more, she seems a bit confused herself tbh, she probably doesn't have a clear idea of what feminism really is, hence the confusion.

In my opinion she does express feministic views, but then says she's not a feminist, while in other interviews she claims to be one...

habpdmFSTOo

I say she's free to identify how ever she wants :icon_yes:

[initpaul]

Women like her dont exactly fit well with patriarchy theory. You see between the very ancient matriarchal utopias and modern day feminism, women were mere objects to be used as men saw fit.
A strong historical female person, who actually was able to achieve a position of power is more of a problem than a role model, since its against their narrative.

Yeah I believe Boudicca would be more appropriate towards a matriarchy culture than patriarchy (from what little I know of these two).

But how is it that you come to the conclusion that in matriarchal culture women were "mere objects to be used as men saw fit". That to me sounds more like a patriarchal perspective...

Is feminism simply a force to combat patriarchy? Or is it trying to assert matriarchy? I still think Boudicca would be a good role model, however, times have changed substantially and it is very likely that many women - and men - wouldn't be able to relate to her worldview at all.

[Graus]

With all due respect PowerPaw, what I described is actual feminism. Its an ideology with its very own dogma. Its a little bit more than screaming "girl power", being pro choice and thinking you deserve the same chances as the boys. If those things I described are alien to you, congratualtions you are not a feminist. You are an egalitarian in denial.
I would advice you read some real feminist literature, it should either cure you or push you over the edge and make you a real feminist.

@initpaul I said between (after) those matriarchies and modern day feminism, which basically means patriarchy. Although patriarchy isnt gone yet according to the feminazis, it just got more manipulative and less direct.
According to the feminists is feminism the tool to smash patriarchy. They dont really agree what comes after it: The less hatefull ones dream of a world without any gender roles at all, others want to reverse the roles and many of the radfems want to get rid of men, the less radical radfems want to keep 10% males around for reproduction and dangerous labour.

[initpaul]

With all due respect PowerPaw, what I described is actual feminism. Its an ideology with its very own dogma. Its a little bit more than screaming "girl power", being pro choice and thinking you deserve the same chances as the boys. If those things I described are alien to you, congratualtions you are not a feminist. You are an egalitarian in denial.
I would advice you read some real feminist literature, it should either cure you or push you over the edge and make you a real feminist.

@initpaul I said between (after) those matriarchies and modern day feminism, which basically means patriarchy. Although patriarchy isnt gone yet according to the feminazis, it just got more manipulative and less direct.
According to the feminists is feminism the tool to smash patriarchy. They dont really agree what comes after it: The less hatefull ones dream of a world without any gender roles at all, others want to reverse the roles and many of the radfems want to get rid of men, the less radical radfems want to keep 10% males around for reproduction and dangerous labour.

Hi Graus, apologies for the misread (tired after a day of work).

Hopefully a balanced positioned will find its way to the top of all the feminist options.

Personally I don't like a world without gender roles, men and women excel in some areas of life, it seems stupid to turn this all upside down.

Cheers :)

initpaul

[Lux Aeterna]

With all due respect PowerPaw, what I described is actual feminism. Its an ideology with its very own dogma. Its a little bit more than screaming "girl power", being pro choice and thinking you deserve the same chances as the boys. If those things I described are alien to you, congratualtions you are not a feminist. You are an egalitarian in denial.I would advice you read some real feminist literature, it should either cure you or push you over the edge and make you a real feminist.

That is how you interpret feminism, and you fail really badly on seeing the wide spectrum there actually is in this ideology. You need to widen your perspective on this, everything is not written in stone when it comes to politics, just like not all feminists are the same and wants to erase all gender roles (for example), not all national socialists wants extermination of "undesired" people, and not all US republicans are against gay marriage etc.




They dont really agree what comes after it: The less hatefull ones dream of a world without any gender roles at all, others want to reverse the roles and many of the radfems want to get rid of men, the less radical radfems want to keep 10% males around for reproduction and dangerous labour.

I don't want any of this, in fact I don't even mind some gender roles, as long as it doesn't hold anyone down, and is chosen by free will, nothing should be forced!

[Lux Aeterna]

More feminists coming your way! :thumbs


Salma Hayek
http://fullodia.com/sites-pic/607/1327183347-salma-hayeklarge-.2.jpg

Julia Stiles
http://wallpapers99.com/Julia_Stiles--w1400x1050--0--0--images/wallpaper/1400x1050/Julia_Stiles_35140.jpg

Dalai Lama
http://images.elephantjournal.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Tenzin_Gyatzo.jpg

Zack de la Rocha (Rage Against the Machine)
http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/gallery/100820/GAL-10Aug20-5494/media/PHO-10Aug20-245908.jpg

[Osprey]

i'm sure graus will bone salma hayek, even if she's a feminist :)

[Lux Aeterna]

i'm sure graus will bone salma hayek, even if she's a feminist :)

And you too LOL.

[Pallantides]

Yeah, Kurt Cobain was the best man that has ever existed (along with Layne Staley of course)
Respect and equality for all

Layne was great.:thumb001:
-xQQzi0IdLY

[Partiasn]

Most Feminists actually want a guy to oppress them.

LOL!

Of Course
Its called Job Security! :p

[Graus]

That is how you interpret feminism, and you fail really badly on seeing the wide spectrum there actually is in this ideology. You need to widen your perspective on this, everything is not written in stone when it comes to politics, just like not all feminists are the same and wants to erase all gender roles (for example), not all national socialists wants extermination of "undesired" people, and not all US republicans are against gay marriage etc.




I don't want any of this, in fact I don't even mind some gender roles, as long as it doesn't hold anyone down, and is chosen by free will, nothing should be forced!

I am afraid its actually you who fail and not only regarding feminism but also in describing the essentials of national socialism and the republican party.

There are quite a lot differences between feminists, they range from almost reasonable to batshit insane. You have the radfems and sex positive feminists etc. They are not all the same, just like the westboro baptist church and your everyday christian arent the same, however both will agree on a couple of essentials, otherwise they wouldnt be christians. The same is true for feminism, there is a reason why you posted this thread in the ideology section, its not just a movement. You have to agree on certain (hateful) positions otherwise you are not a legitimate member of the club. One is for example "patriarchy" Which is basically the subjugation of all females to the sole benefit of all males. Feminists also claim were are still living in such a society.
Why dont you explain to me, what you think feminism is about, especially the ideology part? And please in a little bit more details than equality and stuff.

And yes, I would totally bone Salma Hayek!

[mysticism]

Spice Girls

http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/Spice-Girls-the-90s-368077_380_328.jpg

[Partiasn]

Yeah I believe Boudicca would be more appropriate towards a matriarchy culture than patriarchy (from what little I know of these two).

But how is it that you come to the conclusion that in matriarchal culture women were "mere objects to be used as men saw fit". That to me sounds more like a patriarchal perspective...

Is feminism simply a force to combat patriarchy? Or is it trying to assert matriarchy? I still think Boudicca would be a good role model, however, times have changed substantially and it is very likely that many women - and men - wouldn't be able to relate to her worldview at all.

A bit of Background

Boudicca was not a matriarch she was the wife of a regent king, who wanted to retain authority over the her own regions of Roman Briton after the death of her husband. The Romans blew her off, and when she would not stop making trouble they beat and raped her, and her daughters in public.

At that point she apparently was able to rally enough support to start a major riot and burn and loot Roman London. As such the Romans image was on the line and they crushed her and her followers with an iron fist.

But the deal is, the Romans for the most part seen, Germanic Tribes for lack of a better term as “White Niggers”.

What ensued was a “Black hawk Down” sort of situation, where the Romans were out numbered but had superior training and weapons. Needless to say they defeated the Brits and killed thousands of them in them process.

Wikipedia Quote

Tacitus reports that "according to one report almost eighty thousand Britons fell" compared with only four hundred Romans.

Boudicca then escaped the and committed suicide. On the other hand it should be pointed out that “Fighting the Patriarchy” is not on the same level as fighting oppressive murderous Assholes.

Feminism at its root is an expansion of Marxism Ideology and class envy exploration. It exploits stupidity on the part of foolish women, such as PowerPaw, and propagates hate against men.

In sort Feminism is a Leftist Hate Movement!

[Partiasn]

there is a reason why you posted this thread in the ideology section, its not just a movement. You have to agree on certain (hateful) positions otherwise you are not a legitimate member of the club.

The answer should be pretty obvious.
She is a true believer and a die hard ideologue. And in defense of her ideology she is willing to slide around the plate until she finds stable ground to keep her ideology form degenerating any further.

Unfortunately she and her feminist pals are not yet at the bottom of this well and there are plenty of more inconvenient surprises for her ideology to encounter. All of which WILL NOT agree with her “Official Position”.



One is for example "patriarchy" Which is basically the subjugation of all females to the sole benefit of all males.

Feminist say that about the “Evil Patriarchy”, but in reality it is a buzz word, that allows them to propagate their hate. It is the same as using the term bourgeois, for conservatives. Feminism is modeled on Marxism.



Feminists also claim were are still living in such a society.
Why dont you explain to me, what you think feminism is about, especially the ideology part? And please in a little bit more details than equality and stuff.

Ok well the problem with this argument is “Female Oppression” is a pretty relative thing don't you think.
Were White upper class women oppressed in the old south when black male slaves were harvesting the crops and building the roof over their heads?

I think we can make a pretty good case that white women in the western world have not been oppressed by the “Patriarchy”.



And yes, I would totally bone Salma Hayek!

LOL!
If you are into Mexican Women I am about 99.99% sure I can hook you up with one that 1) more attractive and 2) NOT a Feminist.

[Graus]

I am willing to give most women who loosely identify themselves with feminism the shadow of the doubt. Many of them genuine dont seem to know what its about.

Patriarchy is a bullshit concept, just like rape culture. Both are basically lesbo marxist pipe dreams. I simply tried to give a short summary what feminists mean, when talking about patriarchy.

Women werent opressed at all, quite the contrary actually. The few rights men may have had more in the past had to be earned with a lot more responsibilities. Besides only men of wealth and status had any real rights to speak of .
You are basically preaching to the choir here.

Thanks for the offer man but I am content with my white fiancee. Its more about not letting ideology getting in the way of casual sex.
We arent all from Texas, some people like me grew up in rather liberal places. Which makes getting laid rather easy but finding a decent girl rather difficult.

[Partiasn]

I am willing to give most women who loosely identify themselves with feminism the shadow of the doubt. Many of them genuine dont seem to know what its about.

Patriarchy is a bullshit concept, just like rape culture. Both are basically lesbo marxist pipe dreams. I simply tried to give a short summary what feminists mean, when talking about patriarchy.

Agreed!
Most of the women that follow feminism are Air Heads, the few that have some sort of cognitive ability are generally the leaders. I guess that is why the leaders are generally Jewish Bs.



Women werent opressed at all, quite the contrary actually. The few rights men may have had more in the past had to be earned with a lot more responsibilities. Besides only men of wealth and status had any real rights to speak of .
You are basically preaching to the choir here.

LOL!
Well In making that point, I ether had to reply to you or to “PowerPuff”, and for some reason I get the idea she is not open to suggestion.




Thanks for the offer man but I am content with my white fiancee. Its more about not letting ideology getting in the way of casual sex.
We arent all from Texas, some people like me grew up in rather liberal places. Which makes getting laid rather easy but finding a decent girl rather difficult.

LOL!
Ok, well honestly man some of them are not bad looking, and unfortunately many of the white ones seem to have priced themselves out of the marked these days, and are massively F-ed up in the Feminist context. Congratulations on finding a good one. :thumb001:

[Lux Aeterna]

I am afraid its actually you who fail and not only regarding feminism but also in describing the essentials of national socialism and the republican party.

I brought up two examples that is often associated with those ideologies.



There are quite a lot differences between feminists, they range from almost reasonable to batshit insane. You have the radfems and sex positive feminists etc. They are not all the same, just like the westboro baptist church and your everyday christian arent the same, however both will agree on a couple of essentials, otherwise they wouldnt be christians.

So if you realise there are different kinds of feminists, then what are you whining about? Why are you bitching on me just because some other feminist kicked you in the nuts?



The same is true for feminism, there is a reason why you posted this thread in the ideology section, its not just a movement. You have to agree on certain (hateful) positions otherwise you are not a legitimate member of the club. One is for example "patriarchy" Which is basically the subjugation of all females to the sole benefit of all males. Feminists also claim were are still living in such a society.

Patriarchy is still present today, if you deny that you're blind. Or can you honestly say women have equal power in society? No I didn't think so.



Why dont you explain to me, what you think feminism is about, especially the ideology part? And please in a little bit more details than equality and stuff.

Equality actually sums it up pretty well, but to split it up there are three main categories equality is to be established/maintained; politically, economically and socially.



And yes, I would totally bone Salma Hayek!

She'd take you from behind with a strap-on! :laugh:



------


I will not give Partiasn any of my time, I've seen what he's all about in "Should women be allowed to vote?"-thread among others, a very off-putting individual.

[Lux Aeterna]

Many celebs are for women's rights and equality between the genders, here are a few more;


Angelina Jolie
http://www.deviantart.com/download/184501220/angelina_jolie_as_a_blonde_by_undertheearth-d31ui1w.jpg

Kate Winslet
http://static.go4celebrity.com/wallpapers/Kate-Winslet/Kate-Winslet-050.jpg

Eddie Vedder (Pearl Jam)
http://i2.listal.com/image/485284/936full-eddie-vedder.jpg

Barack Obama clearly has his negative sides, but you have to admit he's quite women friendly!
http://halanscott.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/tumblr_m1988tSjGc1rsoxj5o1_400.jpg

[mysticism]

http://www.sonypictures.com/homevideo/charliesangelsfullthrottle/images/pr1035076.jpg

[evon]

Feminism isnt about equality but about preferential treatment

Well, seems someone forgot to read the history books again..



Women don't want to be absolutely equal with men. They want to have all the rights of men but to keep their special privileges too. For example you will never hear from a feminist that mothers and fathers have equal rights, they think that mothers have more rights in regard to custody, abortion etc.

Feminism like anything else has a broad spectrum, and now you are talking as if the extremes are all that is, which is of course wrong.

you can sum it by watching the older woman whom via skype participates in this debate against a radical/extremist whom has just published a nonsensical book:

http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/end-men-0022365

6GWtIvVGSJA


Feminism is a manifestation of Judaism.

No one with any interest in preservationism would support such a parasitic ideology.

Spoken like a true nut job :picard1:


PP, feminism hence the name is more of a one sided thing, I'm all for equal rights, but you're wrong about this.

Its not, its about equality from a female perspective, if you had been the suppressed gender i am sure you would label it thus too if fighting an uphill battle, plus try and guess who gave it the name feminism?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Fourier#Reference-idGoldstein1982

Yes, a man..


What rights? I don't think girls here are sluts.....
And Mary still can type whatever she wants and she does not appear to have been influenced by feminism.....

Mary is a women who professes ideas contrary to feminism while using all the rights she (women) has gained from the fight of Feminism, like a true extremist, much like extreme jihadis who use freedom's they would lack in their utopia to express themselves.. she is a walking talking contradiction like most haters..

[Bari]

My favorite feminist celebs from Ukraine:

http://cryptome.org/2012-info/femen-wef/pict4.jpg

:thumb001:

[The Lawspeaker]

I do not agree with modern feminism while I think that the original ideas (equality and a right to vote for women. Even the self-ownership of ones own body even though I find abortion to be quite repugnant) are nothing but fair. Women are not the man's servants - they are our partners and should be treated as such.

And Veslefrikk. I may not like those extremist sluts but the writings on the first one are nonetheless correct: "Poor. Because of you." And "Crisis. Made in Davos." There is not a single lie in that statement.

[Graus]

I brought up two examples that is often associated with those ideologies.



So if you realise there are different kinds of feminists, then what are you whining about? Why are you bitching on me just because some other feminist kicked you in the nuts?



Patriarchy is still present today, if you deny that you're blind. Or can you honestly say women have equal power in society? No I didn't think so.



Equality actually sums it up pretty well, but to split it up there are three main categories equality is to be established/maintained; politically, economically and socially.



She'd take you from behind with a strap-on! :laugh:



------


I will not give Partiasn any of my time, I've seen what he's all about in "Should women be allowed to vote?"-thread among others, a very off-putting individual.


There is the buzz word, so you drank the kool aid after all. I said you cant be a real feminist without believing in the dogma but thats not an issue anymore. I strongly disagree with those dogma, so yes some feminists are more reasonable than others but more reasonabale is pretty relative.

I dont associate myself with legitimate feminists but I will argue against a pathetic ideology like I would against communism, multi culteralism, Islam etc.

And not only do I deny partiarchy nowadays, I am also deying its existence in the past, at least the way most feminists would describe it. And its not about equal power but about equal opportunities. Which dont exist btw the opportunities strongly favour women nowadays. Most of our political parties or big companies bend over backwards in order to find qualified females for high positions. And all kinds of employers are willing to lower the bar quite a lot.
They dont find them, while the feminists cry foul and sexism in their "social sciences" classes.


Seeing a small woman like Selma being able to manhandle a guy of my seize and expertise in this way. Would probably be worth the humiliation.

[Partiasn]

Its not, its about equality from a female perspective, if you had been the suppressed gender i am sure you would label it thus too if fighting an uphill battle, plus try and guess who gave it the name feminism?

Sorry I guess I just missed HOW women and specifically how the White Western female was ever “Oppressed”.

Note I'm not saying that all women have always had easy lives, which is certainly not the case. But when history is averaged out, women and specifically the white western female has never been significantly MORE oppressed than any, or all groups of men. About the only argument she can make is she lags behind her white male counterparts with the rise of the industrial Revelation.

But then again we fail to integrate the “Princess Ego Complex” here.


you can sum it by watching the older woman whom via skype participates in this debate against a radical/extremist whom has just published a nonsensical book:

http://stream.aljazeera.com/story/end-men-0022365

Sorry they both look like extremist to me. One pushing more Feminist Class Hate Crap, and the other Attempting to “Save the Hate Moment”.





Mary is a women who professes ideas contrary to feminism while using all the rights she (women) has gained from the fight of Feminism, like a true extremist, much like extreme jihadis who use freedom's they would lack in their utopia to express themselves.. she is a walking talking contradiction like most haters..

Feminism was never a fight in the first place, but more a globing on to the Labor Movement of men that happened at the turn of the 19th century.

But yes I will grant you, due to their lack of objective thought and the fact they are constantly seeking a new level to “Keep the Movement Alive”. The problem Feminist have is they are at the root a jealous hypocritical hate movement. As such they have to constantly revise the bunk they teach.

Some how I think you are wrong on both accounts.
Jihadis are extremist stirred up and created by western powers for the purpose of resource theft.

Comparing women who oppose a leftist hate movement to radical militias created by the same bunch of western Marxist governments is a bit far out don't you think?

I think the real problem is you have these sides reversed. It is the Feminist Hate Mongers that are the real jihadist here, and any one but ESPECIALY if the PERSON is FEMALE that opposes them they fly off the handle.

[Midori]

Patriarchy is still present today, if you deny that you're blind. Or can you honestly say women have equal power in society? No I didn't think so.


True, that's one of the things I hate about Eastern Europe.

[Partiasn]

True, that's one of the things I hate about Eastern Europe.

I guess this is fortunate for Feminist then, because as a general rule it is elitist men that advance them to power without having qualifications. In Essence feminist are the equivalent of political prostitutes.

On the flip side Eastern Europe as well as all of the West seem to be sliding toward a backlash against women because of feminist policy put in place by ideological idiots.

Eastern Europe if Im not right under the USSR was MORE Feminist than the West?

[evon]

deleted..

[evon]

Sorry I guess I just missed HOW women and specifically how the White Western female was ever “Oppressed”.

Note I'm not saying that all women have always had easy lives, which is certainly not the case. But when history is averaged out, women and specifically the white western female has never been significantly MORE oppressed than any, or all groups of men. About the only argument she can make is she lags behind her white male counterparts with the rise of the industrial Revelation.

But then again we fail to integrate the “Princess Ego Complex” here.


Ok, i lost the original posts i made, but i will try and find the material and repost them in a single post;

Women have for the most time if not always been subject to discrimination based on their sex, we see this as a red line through history, since you seem to be hung up on "white women" i will use Europe as an example and contrast that to Saudi Arabia which is a fairly conservative and sexist country.

Looking at classical Greece one is struck at how similar their treatment and view of women is to modern day Saudi Arabia, a good summery can be found here (http://www.datehookup.com/content-the-life-of-a-woman-in-ancient-greece-and-rome.htm), and here is a good quote on mens opinion on women as reflected by historical sources from the era:



The man's opinion was what mattered in ancient Greece and Rome. Their role was to run the government, among other various jobs. Men believed that wives should be seen and not heard. They often kept separate rooms in the house because male visitors weren't allowed in the rooms where the wives and children regularly were. Their opinions about women were the only opinions that mattered and often times women were treated no better than a domestic slave.


Now as an historian with allot of experience with Greece i can say this page seems to be good and historical correct, but i should also note that of course there are local and regional differences, one such example is the contrast between Women in Athens and Sparta ect, but on the whole, the trend was one of very conservative and sexist attitudes. We seem the same cultural pattern in Roman society, but with different trends reflective of their uniqueness.



Feminism was never a fight in the first place, but more a globing on to the Labor Movement of men that happened at the turn of the 19th century.

But yes I will grant you, due to their lack of objective thought and the fact they are constantly seeking a new level to “Keep the Movement Alive”. The problem Feminist have is they are at the root a jealous hypocritical hate movement. As such they have to constantly revise the bunk they teach.



Now moving forward in time to the days just before and after the industrial revolution, in the pre-industrial era it was common for women to do the same job as men and then take care of children ect on the side, the Twin burden", in this era most people were farmers and so the whole family worked the fields.

During the industrial revolution women started working in other jobs, one of them was coal mining, during those jobs they were exposed to many problems given their sex, including frequent rape (they had to work i near nudity due to the heat in the mines) and high mortality rates, and earned less wages then their male counterparts, here is a good summary of the problem in that laws were erected to halt this development;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mines_and_Collieries_Act_1842


At the beginning of the 19th century methods of coal extraction were primitive and the workforce, men, women and children, laboured in dangerous conditions. In 1841 about 216,000 people were employed in the mines. Women and children worked underground for 11 or 12 hours a day for smaller wages than men.[1] The public became aware of conditions in the country's collieries in 1838 after a freak accident at Huskar Colliery in Silkstone, near Barnsley. A stream overflowed into the ventilation drift after violent thunderstorms causing the death of 26 children; 11 girls aged from 8 to 16 and 15 boys between 9 and 12 years of age.[2] The disaster came to the attention of Queen Victoria who ordered an inquiry.[1]

If you want to see womens lives from the industrial age, i would suggest these two movies, one from Ireland (fiction) and another little later from France and is based on a true story;

y5b4c5x0SIk


bvDFPjx-uBU




Some how I think you are wrong on both accounts.
Jihadis are extremist stirred up and created by western powers for the purpose of resource theft.

Comparing women who oppose a leftist hate movement to radical militias created by the same bunch of western Marxist governments is a bit far out don't you think?

I think the real problem is you have these sides reversed. It is the Feminist Hate Mongers that are the real jihadist here, and any one but ESPECIALY if the PERSON is FEMALE that opposes them they fly off the handle.



Actually Jihadi's are not something new, they have been around since the advent of Islam, more commonly known as Ghazi then Jihadi.

Feminism is about equality and the right to choose, fundamental rights dont you think..

[Partiasn]

Feminism is about equality and the right to choose, fundamental rights dont you think..

Ahh!

NO I don't think so!

I would say your problem here Evon is you continue to post the same diatribe that feminist have been coming off with for quite some time. Just because the Leftist Establishment accepts a certain party line really does not mean jack shit.

Relating that OMG women were Raped in the past, or they have lousy Jobs, or they were not allowed to do XYZ, fill in the blank, automatically means they were systematically MORE oppressed than anyone else on the Planet is mere Bull Shit, and you should know it.

So if other groups of men have the same sort of oppression your entire argument pretty much falls through the floor.

The “Evil Patriarchy Argument is even more hilarious because modern feminist DEPEND on exploiting Mangina Elites privilege to elevate themselves.

So once again I did not state that women have had better lives than men, but as a general rule; NO, THEY have not been Oppressed beyond any or all other groups of men.

1) First Wave Feminism was Lower Class women tagging onto the Men's Labor movements of the early 19th Century.
The Legal Reforms included things such as child labor laws, womens voting rights and State enforced minim wage and working conditions. In Essence a general Human Rights movement started my lower class men for the benefit of all. NOT JUST WOME.
2) Second Wave Feminism was more or less bored House Wives in the US and more so teen aged girls that read Bull Shit from Betty Friedan, and decided they were “Oppress by the Patriarchy”.
It should also be pointed out that, eastern Euro's in the USSR seen a brilliant opportunity to promote any form of social movement in the US they could to weaken their primary enemy.
3) Third Wave Feminism is where the Hate really kicks in though, because in this context we are talking about Gen Y women, who for the most part are the product of years of propaganda and indoctrination. They have nether the morale direction of the earlier feminist or the intelligence.

As such at this point women become totally separated from their Lower Class start and attempt to connect themselves With the Elites themselves and if they can, become the oppressors, even if it means giving serious head to the Mangina in charge.

I think that is pretty easy to prove!
So now let's get on with it then.


QUOTE FROM EVON SOURCE

The man's opinion was what mattered in ancient Greece and Rome. Their role was to run the government, among other various jobs. Men believed that wives should be seen and not heard. They often kept separate rooms in the house because male visitors weren't allowed in the rooms where the wives and children regularly were. Their opinions about women were the only opinions that mattered and often times women were treated no better than a domestic slave.

Not sure about Greece but I am sure about Rome, and for Rome one of the last Emperor's was indeed a women and a pretty lousy one at that. It was due to her stupidity and Intrigue and pitting one of her generals against the other that basically resulted in the Barbarians overrunning what was left of Imperial Rome. There is good evidence both Historical as well as modern that women make lousy government leaders. As such Rome if I'm not right lasted for some 900 years as one of the most powerful nations on earth. And like most Empires of that magnitude was built by men.


The Good of the Feminist does not outweigh the good of the many, including the lower class men.


Now moving forward in time to the days just before and after the industrial revolution, in the pre-industrial era it was common for women to do the same job as men and then take care of children ect on the side, the Twin burden", in this era most people were farmers and so the whole family worked the fields.

During the industrial revolution women started working in other jobs, one of them was coal mining, during those jobs they were exposed to many problems given their sex, including frequent rape (they had to work i near nudity due to the heat in the mines) and high mortality rates, and earned less wages then their male counterparts, here is a good summary of the problem in that laws were erected to halt this development;

I hope you are not trying to give the rise of the industrial revolution to the slave labor of women. Because if you are that would be one hell of a misrepresentation of history. The real story here though IS NOT WOMEN but child labor which was who was exploited the most.Funny you seem to beam right into “Women Oppressed Mode”. This was way more a Child Labor Issue than a Woman Issue, and on top of that it was a Male Slave Labor Issue. Because it was workers generally men that the whole foundation was built. INCLUDING 1st Wave Feminism.

The Good of the Feminist does not outweigh the good of the the Child.

What is even more hilarious is the denial of who the Feminist backers of that era really were.
Wealthy White Industrialist Wives. Who I might add lived in opulence that the vast majority of people alive at the time could not even imagine, male or female.


QUOTE FROM EVON SOURCE

Albert Nobbs Trailer Official 2012 [HD] - Glenn Close, Mia Wasikowska


"Coco Before Chanel" - Official Trailer [HQ HD]

Ok I'm sorry I just fail to see how ether of these two movies are relevant to Femininism, and they are for sure not relevant to modern feminism.
A movie about a women that dresses like a man?
Sorry is Lesbianism, now Womens Rights?

But the Bottom Line is Life is not fair for ether gender of person. But this does not mean men have been systematically oppressing women since the beginning of time.

[evon]

Ahh!

NO I don't think so!

I would say your problem here Evon is you continue to post the same diatribe that feminist have been coming off with for quite some time. Just because the Leftist Establishment accepts a certain party line really does not mean jack shit.

Relating that OMG women were Raped in the past, or they have lousy Jobs, or they were not allowed to do XYZ, fill in the blank, automatically means they were systematically MORE oppressed than anyone else on the Planet is mere Bull Shit, and you should know it.

So if other groups of men have the same sort of oppression your entire argument pretty much falls through the floor.

The “Evil Patriarchy Argument is even more hilarious because modern feminist DEPEND on exploiting Mangina Elites privilege to elevate themselves.

So once again I did not state that women have had better lives than men, but as a general rule; NO, THEY have not been Oppressed beyond any or all other groups of men.

1) First Wave Feminism was Lower Class women tagging onto the Men's Labor movements of the early 19th Century.
The Legal Reforms included things such as child labor laws, womens voting rights and State enforced minim wage and working conditions. In Essence a general Human Rights movement started my lower class men for the benefit of all. NOT JUST WOME.
2) Second Wave Feminism was more or less bored House Wives in the US and more so teen aged girls that read Bull Shit from Betty Friedan, and decided they were “Oppress by the Patriarchy”.
It should also be pointed out that, eastern Euro's in the USSR seen a brilliant opportunity to promote any form of social movement in the US they could to weaken their primary enemy.
3) Third Wave Feminism is where the Hate really kicks in though, because in this context we are talking about Gen Y women, who for the most part are the product of years of propaganda and indoctrination. They have nether the morale direction of the earlier feminist or the intelligence.

As such at this point women become totally separated from their Lower Class start and attempt to connect themselves With the Elites themselves and if they can, become the oppressors, even if it means giving serious head to the Mangina in charge.

I think that is pretty easy to prove!
So now let's get on with it then.


I have shown you evidence that women have been oppressed during the industrial revolution, and all you do in return is say i am wrong without any evidence to the contrary. So how can i take you serious then?

Your own argument regarding the status of society sounds like you are saying that all people had limited rights and thus women were not suppressed more then men, you fail to realize the reality here, yes life was limited for all regardless of sex, but women were excluded from the few opportunities that most men had, and working class women had to work alongside raring children and were thus exposed to as i said before, "the twin burden" = Work and then rare children after work.

Here are a few examples taken from history (both middle class and working class):

Franziska Tiburtius 1843-1927, an middle class woman:

"Graduating at sixteen and needing to support herself, Tiburtius had few opportunities. A young woman from a "proper" background could work as a governess or a teacher without loosing her respectability and spoiling her matrimonial prospects, but was about it."

Some interviews collected by the Ashley mines commission in 1841-42:

Isabel Wilson 38 years old, coal putter:

""when women have children thick [fast] they are compelled to take them down early. I have been married 19 years and have had 10 bairns [Children]; seven are in life. When on Sir John's work was a carrier of coals, which caused me to miscarry five times from the strains, and i was gai [very] ill after each. Putting is no so oppressive; last child was born on Saturday morning, and i was at work on on the Friday night..."

Both taken from:A History of Western Society. McKay. Hill. Buckler. Crowson. Weisner-Hanks. 2008.

I can also quote more such stories if you need them?

the creator of Feminism if you like was actually a man:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Fourier

and the very definition of the term reads as follow:



fem·i·nism
[fem-uh-niz-uh m] Show IPA
noun
1.
the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.


http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/feminism







Not sure about Greece but I am sure about Rome, and for Rome one of the last Emperor's was indeed a women and a pretty lousy one at that. It was due to her stupidity and Intrigue and pitting one of her generals against the other that basically resulted in the Barbarians overrunning what was left of Imperial Rome. There is good evidence both Historical as well as modern that women make lousy government leaders. As such Rome if I'm not right lasted for some 900 years as one of the most powerful nations on earth. And like most Empires of that magnitude was built by men.


The Good of the Feminist does not outweigh the good of the many, including the lower class men.


What :confused: Female emperor, now i really need some sources from you!

I will not debate the reasons for Romes rise and fall as iknow it will lead us OT, but i can say i totally disagree with your sexist notion of womens fault.



I hope you are not trying to give the rise of the industrial revolution to the slave labor of women. Because if you are that would be one hell of a misrepresentation of history. The real story here though IS NOT WOMEN but child labor which was who was exploited the most.Funny you seem to beam right into “Women Oppressed Mode”. This was way more a Child Labor Issue than a Woman Issue, and on top of that it was a Male Slave Labor Issue. Because it was workers generally men that the whole foundation was built. INCLUDING 1st Wave Feminism.

The Good of the Feminist does not outweigh the good of the the Child.

What is even more hilarious is the denial of who the Feminist backers of that era really were.
Wealthy White Industrialist Wives. Who I might add lived in opulence that the vast majority of people alive at the time could not even imagine, male or female.


See my first reply..





Ok I'm sorry I just fail to see how ether of these two movies are relevant to Femininism, and they are for sure not relevant to modern feminism.
A movie about a women that dresses like a man?
Sorry is Lesbianism, now Womens Rights?

But the Bottom Line is Life is not fair for ether gender of person. But this does not mean men have been systematically oppressing women since the beginning of time.



They are a good real life representation of life in their time, thats why they are good to show how women was oppressed for being women. she dressed as a man to get a decent wage, please i implore you, watch the movies before you judge them!

Life is not fair, but as i said before, women have had it harder then men, and men have for the most part been the creators of womens oppressed status, by giving them less wages for same jobs as those performed by men, lack of political opportunities as those of men, ect..

[Partiasn]

Your own argument regarding the status of society sounds like you are saying that all people had limited rights and thus women were not suppressed more then men, you fail to realize the reality here, yes life was limited for all regardless of sex, but women were excluded from the few opportunities that most men had, and working class women had to work alongside raring children and were thus exposed to as i said before, "the twin burden" = Work and then rare children after work.

Even if women were oppressed more than men, this would not prove that men or the “Patriarchy” has had a consented effort to oppressed women through history.


I have shown you evidence that women have been oppressed during the industrial revolution, and all you do in return is say i am wrong without any evidence to the contrary. So how can i take you serious then?

What you showed me was this.

Mines and Collieries Act 1842
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mines_and_Collieries_Act_1842

Which boils down to a legislation in Victorian England to curb abusive companies attempting to turn a buck by hiring “Cheap Labor” which in those days was women and sometimes children.

This in NO WAY proves there is or ever was a conspiracy by the Patriarchy to enslave women in mens jobs. Which I find somewhat ironic because at the same time women or should we say feminist are demanding “Equality” in the placement of “Mens Jobs”.

Women CANNOT have to both ways, ether they get “Equality” or they get “Privilege”.
Sad fact here is when it is a crappy or dangerous male Job they want men to keep doing them. On the other hand if it is a cushy and mangina type job they want to claim inequality.

Here is a Fact for you, Tomas Edison was a man, and so was Albert Einstein, and Werner Von Bran. So were the Wright Brothers, or Henry Ford, and Lindberg.
In fact just about every figure in the Industrial revelation were men and so was the MALE laborer that built the Golden Gate Bridge and the many that died in the process.

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2012/05/25/kcbs-cover-story-men-who-gave-their-lives-building-golden-gate-bridge/


That is the industrial revolution hard core for you my friend.


Well you list yourself as a Scandinavia, well then what about Scandinavia, as Scandinavian women just rushing in to crawl around in the dirt and fix the plumbing. I'm betting they would rather have a Male Nigger do it. Am I right? But they will take the Doctor, or Lawyer Job because that is “Empowering”.


Here is an interesting Video I found on YouTube, since you list yourself as Norwegian you might be interested.

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Life is not fair, but as i said before, women have had it harder then men, and men have for the most part been the creators of womens oppressed status, by giving them less wages for same jobs as those performed by men, lack of political opportunities as those of men, ect..


NO WOMEN have NOT had it harder than men, in any age 9 out of 10 times it was men doing the crap work. And for that sometimes we got respect but most of the time we didn't.

The Men that did get the Respect were as a general rule Alpha Elites. Like it or not.

Did women have the political power No, but not directly at last, and nether should they have had it.

But here is the deal my Friend, even in the times when she was supposedly “Oppressed” the average woman would get better treatment than the majority of men.

And why you say?
Because she is a women.