Who all here is a Freemason? [Archive] - The Apricity Forum: A European Cultural Community

Freomæg

08-10-2009, 06:14 PM

Indeed. But an atheist is not a theist. ;) What do they have against atheists? :confused: I honestly don't know.
Whatever truths (or lack of) that lie in the conspiracy theories, one thing is for certain and that is that a fundamental part of Freemasonry is the belief in a creator - a grand architect. Though candidates are supposed to pledge upon a holy book of some sort, my guess is that Freemasonry teaches about a new concept of 'god', or at least a new way of woshipping the existing god. Sacred geometry is key, this is why god as sometimes referred to as 'the architect'. This originates with the Templars, who brought back from the middle east with them an advanced understanding of geometry. This can be seen in the advanced gothic architecture of their time, with all the esoteric symbols contained therein.

I have some of my own theories about freemasonry, including that it essentially harks back to the Ancient Egyptians. The pyramids at Giza have encoded in them some extremely advanced conceptions of geometry, physics and astrology. I even tend to believe that the 'ark of the covenant', the word of god, was actually the ultimate knowledge of nature through geometry and that it came from Egypt, then to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem where the Templars came into possession of it and brought it (or at least, the knowledge) back to Europe. When the Knights Templar were outlawed, they continued under the guise of Freemasonry.

All very fascinating, and I've wondered about joining before. But I'd need to be certain about some of my assumptions first.

Allenson

08-10-2009, 06:18 PM

No, I'm not a member. And even if I were, I wouldn't be allowed to tell you much about being one. ;)

I take it that they're not invitation only?

Tolleson

08-10-2009, 06:44 PM

Here is a little bit of information I found on another site.

Fundamentals of Freemasonry by Norman Williams Crabbe, MPS
http://www.theosophy-nw.org/theosnw/world/modeur/ph-crabb.htm

Cheers

Loki

08-10-2009, 06:48 PM

Heimmacht

08-10-2009, 07:12 PM

I'd rather join them> http://www.thule-seminar.org/inhalt_referenz.htm

Baron Samedi

08-10-2009, 07:49 PM

I think the religious requirement is so their members can infiltrate the churches & destroy them from within. Like the Episcopal/Anglican Communion, the Methodists, The Presbyterian, the various reform churches that makeup the United Church of Christ & on & on...

You don't have to be a Christian (in name only). They allow Unitarians. I'm sure there Islamic lodges.

As for conspiracies, it is hard to ignore the fact that Masons played an important role in planning & executing the American Revolution. The signers of the Declaration of Independence is a who's who of 18th century American masonry. Am I wrong in assuming the main participators of the French Revolution were also Masons?

Sounds like, yet, another good reason to join up. :thumb001:

Baron Samedi

08-10-2009, 09:02 PM

I'd rather join them> http://www.thule-seminar.org/inhalt_referenz.htm

What exactly IS this?

I even translated the page, and it made little sense to me.

Ulf

08-10-2009, 09:27 PM

I know a Freemason. That's all I am allowed to say.

Gooding

08-10-2009, 09:39 PM

Interesting..my maternal grandfather was a Scottish Rite 32nd Degree Master Mason in his Lodge in Falls Church.What I know is that they discuss nothing outside of their meetings about their business, they have their own version of the Bible and they really do have a secret handshake with which to identify other members. During the mid twentieth century, membership could only be obtained by an invitation from another member. It seems to have been semi hereditary as all the adult men of families tended to be members of their local Lodges. A belief in a God or Higher Power seems to have been the minimal requirement. That's all I can tell you because that's all I know..

Lahtari

08-10-2009, 10:51 PM

With all the secretiveness, speculation and plain crackpottery surrounding the Masons, I'm still not sure what to make of them. A revolutionary organization masqueraded as a bunch of harmless religious nutters, a platform for the financial and societal elite, or a mystic cult with old, elsewhere lost traditions and horrible age-old secrets?

Even when their code states that a good Mason should not partake in politics or to conspire against rulers, it must be kept in mind that this organization developed in the 18th century pre-revolution France, and the bourgeoisie definitely had a reason to hide their anti-aristocratic intentions. There might as well be a higher-level code for the eyes of initiates of certain degree only, cancelling the previous order and defining societal change as their main purpose. Or maybe not, but anyway, the Masons hardly had a negligible role in the French revolution, as well as in the American one.

Óttar

08-10-2009, 11:50 PM

I'm glad this thread was made. One of my ancestors was a 32nd degree Freemason. I have been sitting on the fence about whether to become a Freemason or not. They draw upon Ancient Egyptian and Jewish allegories namely, the pyramids and the Temple of Solomon. Not surprising considering the Jews probably learned techniques while in slavery in Egypt. Freemasonry is based on symbols. The meaning of the symbols are given to the initiate from many different cultural interpretations. For example, what the symbol meant to the Jews, the Egyptians, the Greeks, the Romans, Christians etc. is imparted to the initiate, but ultimately it is up to him to come to his own conclusion. The symbols are used for contemplation and to provide a compass for how one may become refined, i.e. from rough to cultured, well-bred, courteous etc. A belief in a Supreme Being or perhaps Being(s) is required regardless of one's sect in all lodges except for the French lodges (who historically have also allowed women.)

The source of my hesitation to join is this. Many of the Founding Fathers and other cultured men were Masons, and Freemasonry was later revamped by a brilliant man named Albert Pike, who was a confederate general (born in Boston) who knew 16 languages and was extremely knowledgable in ancient "pagan" religion(s) and cults. His writing Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry(see info at the bottom of the post) is a 1,000 page tome of information about ancient cults and mystery religions.

Despite the fact that Freemasonry has had many brilliant, cultured, refined men of distinction in its ranks, it also has had common men who were not so refined (John Wayne, Louis Armstrong) and I highly doubt the latter had any knowledge of ancient religion and esotericism. Many Scottish Rite lodges have even ceased giving high-ranking members (as was customary in the past) copies of Albert Pike's brilliant work Morals and Dogma on the grounds that it is "too advanced for the common reader" !!!

Freemasonic numbers have been dwindling as of late. Lodges are now so desperate for membership that they have lowered the admission age to 18 and some even perform the rituals of the degrees in a cheap, accelerated manner wherein members are initiated en masse by merely being observers of the ritual as opposed to true participants.

There is the Grand Lodge of Massachusetts near me, but alas, I hesitate to knock. Let me explain further. I have an acquaintance who is a Freemason, and I told him my interest and some of my concerns and his spiel runs like, "We're not a religion, we aren't a cult, we are just a group of good people who do charity for our community."

To this I say, "What is my motivation to join a group of common men doing charity work, if I can up and go volunteer for the American Cancer Society?" and further, "I would rather that they were a cult based on the ancient mysteries, because then I would have a reason to join. Another thing is, I don't want to wait 1 year as a novice, being a busboy and doing bitchwork at a lodge, only to receive the rank of Entered Apprentice.

I could go on but I desist for now.

PS I would've attached Albert Pike's Morals and Dogma as PDF, but alas, it exceeds the limit allowed on the forum. One can download a text document of it online by searching Project Gutenberg.

Ulf

08-10-2009, 11:59 PM

I have an acquaintance who is a Freemason, and I told him my interest and some of my concerns and his spiel runs like, "We're not a religion, we aren't a cult, we are just a group of good people who do charity for our community."

This is their standard reply towards non-Masons, unless you join you will not get any other information than that description. That alone would make it seem that they are not just a charity.

Hrafn

08-11-2009, 02:22 AM

I was always asking myself is Demiurge actually Baphomet ?

Hrafn

08-11-2009, 02:27 AM

I'd rather join them> http://www.thule-seminar.org/inhalt_referenz.htm

Regarding Freemasons. I wouldn't join them even if they will be the last remaining group in the world.

EDIT: I am really interested in Thule Seminar and I do find books by Dr. Pierre Krebs thought provoking and very Indo European.

Lulletje Rozewater

08-11-2009, 09:24 AM

I'm interested in becoming a Mason, and I was wondering if any of you fine souls are currently Masons?

Before you can join, you have to be sponsored by someone who is already a mason. They cannot recruit you, but they can answer any questions about masonry except certain secrets, mostly about the content of the initiations. If you tell a mason you want to join the lodge, a committee will be appointed to investigate you and make sure that you are of good character. They will talk to you and speak to character references about you. The masons frown on overindulgence in drink, a criminal record, or any immoral acts. When your application to join is complete, the members of the lodge vote whether or not to accept you and if anyone there knows of a reason you should not be accepted they won't let you in. Mostly everyone is accepted at this point, but again, it's about making sure everybody who joins is an honest and decent person. You do have to profess a belief in God, but you can be of any religion and do not have to go to church.

If your petition to join is accepted, you will have to pass three different initiations, called degrees. You will be coached beforehand by your sponsor or sponsors, who will teach you about masonry, and there are long passages you have to memorize and say during the later degrees. The third initiation has a lot of questions, hence the origin of the term, the third degree.

The masons do really good work in the community and support each other. It's a social group but it's also about learning to be a good man and a responsible citizen. The things you learn are (I'm sure) very interesting and in my opinion, everyone with a passing interest should talk to some masons. Ask them what masonry means to them and that will help you decide whether to join or not.

Do not ask me if I am one.

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 10:43 AM

Loki

08-11-2009, 10:46 AM

It is more male secret sociaty...no females there:(

That is part of the appeal ;)

Vulpix

08-11-2009, 10:52 AM

That is part of the appeal ;)

For gays maybe :P... :laugh:

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 10:52 AM

You mean precondition of all males interested in masonery-no females please:P

Loki

08-11-2009, 10:55 AM

For gays maybe :P... :laugh:

Most men only have sex on the brain when there are women around. When they are absent, we can actually concentrate on matters that are important. :)

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 11:00 AM

I'd rather join them> http://www.thule-seminar.org/inhalt_referenz.htm

Thule für Schwule.

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 11:06 AM

All decent countries banned freemasonry and arrested the lodge masters. Those were the days.

ikki

08-11-2009, 11:22 AM

I was always asking myself is Demiurge actually Baphomet ?

the demiurge is lucifer... the same guy the whole bible is all about, in the beginning there was darkness, and "god" made light.
Lucifer = the lightbringer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_Serrano
"Determined upon a heroic war to reclaim the Demiurge's deteriorating world, the Hyperboreans clothed themselves in material bodies and descended on to the Second Hyperborea, a ring-shaped continent around the North Pole. During this Golden Age or Satya Yuga, they magnanimously instructed the Demiurge's creations (the Black, Yellow and Red races native to the planet) and began to raise them above their animal condition.[16][15] Then disaster struck. Some of the Hyperboreans rebelled and intermingled their blood with the creatures of the Demiurge, and through this transgression Paradise was lost."

ikki

08-11-2009, 11:25 AM

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 11:29 AM

the demiurge is lucifer... the same guy the whole bible is all about, in the beginning there was darkness, and "god" made light.
Lucifer = the lightbringer.

To add...noticed that Baphomet is Christian imagination and my beautifull Templars were accused by Inquistion becouse of him :(

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baphomet

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 11:35 AM

ikki

08-11-2009, 11:39 AM

Around here freemasons are a pathetically small group of old farts who want to get away from their wives for at least one night of the week.

Hard to imagine the impact freemasonry had on the political process behind the scenes in the past when you look at them now.

That would be the illuminati.

Weishaubt born in 1748
1848 !
1948 !
2048?!?

If one does not understand the fundamental shifts in 1848 & 1948, then too bad.

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 11:41 AM

Around here freemasons are a pathetically small group of old farts who want to get away from their wives for at least one night of the week.

Hard to imagine the impact freemasonry had on the political process behind the scenes in the past when you look at them now.

No Phleg, they certainly had and they still have strong political global influence! Lenjin, Staljin, Tito, Madlaine Olbright, Richard Holbrooke, etc etc

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 11:42 AM

That would be the illuminati.

Weishaubt born in 1748
1848 !
1948 !
2048?!?

If one does not understand the fundamental shifts in 1848 & 1948, then too bad.

So what is the difference? Illuminati or Masons?

ikki

08-11-2009, 11:47 AM

So what is the difference? Illuminati or Masons?

masons had been around before, but many of those goals of democracy etc didnt begin happening until after weishaubt. I suppose one could think of Illuminati as a inner party?

Loki

08-11-2009, 12:06 PM

2048?!?

That would be my grandchild, the coming antichrist ;)

Vulpix

08-11-2009, 12:09 PM

Most men only have sex on the brain when there are women around.

Why didn't anyone tell me this before :D? :swl

When they are absent, we can actually concentrate on matters that are important.

Like um... preservation :wink?

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 12:14 PM

masons had been around before, but many of those goals of democracy etc didnt begin happening until after weishaubt. I suppose one could think of Illuminati as a inner party?

weishaubt??? translation needed please

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 12:32 PM

Adam Weishaupt. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Weishaupt)

Loki

08-11-2009, 12:35 PM

Adam Weishaupt. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Weishaupt)

Damn Krauts! ;)

Hrafn

08-11-2009, 12:43 PM

the demiurge is lucifer... the same guy the whole bible is all about, in the beginning there was darkness, and "god" made light.
Lucifer = the lightbringer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miguel_Serrano
"Determined upon a heroic war to reclaim the Demiurge's deteriorating world, the Hyperboreans clothed themselves in material bodies and descended on to the Second Hyperborea, a ring-shaped continent around the North Pole. During this Golden Age or Satya Yuga, they magnanimously instructed the Demiurge's creations (the Black, Yellow and Red races native to the planet) and began to raise them above their animal condition.[16][15] Then disaster struck. Some of the Hyperboreans rebelled and intermingled their blood with the creatures of the Demiurge, and through this transgression Paradise was lost."

Sorry, you got it all wrong. Lucifer is different. The God who is Jahweh is Demiurge (that is also God who is worshipped by Christians, as well as Muslims, Jews etc). He is God who decides who will live and who will die on this planet apparently. Lucifer is a Sun God.
Don Miguel even says here: '' they magnanimously instructed the Demiurge's creations (the Black, Yellow and Red races native to the planet) and began to raise them above their animal condition''.
In Miguel Serrano's Nos, Lucifer is identified as the King of the White gods.
Anyway, i will find who is Baphomet, no worries.
Thank you anyway for your view and comment .:thumb001:

Loyalist

08-11-2009, 12:59 PM

I'm a member of the Orange Order, and many Orangemen, particularly the elderly, are also Freemasons. We use the Freemason Bible at meetings, and take our hierarchy and much symbolism from the organisation. That said, it is not a Christian group, and I'm aware of Jews and Muslims, among others, who are Masons. I was also under the assumption that one had to be nominated and seconded by existing Masons to join, but perhaps that has changed as interest has declined.

If you join, be prepared for much ceremony and ritualism. This includes everything from dress (there is a type of apron-like garment one wears during ceremonies like initiations), to handshakes, and to meetings themselves (opening, closing, etc.). Taking it all in can be quite daunting.

As for these conspiracy theories; while I have no doubt that Masons played a key role in the American and French Revolutions, that was the 18th century. Freemasonry wields no such power now, and instead simply exists as a fraternal and charitable organisation.

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 01:04 PM

Nice try, but we know the Orange Order is a state within the state, with an even uglier face.

Loyalist

08-11-2009, 01:12 PM

Nice try, but we know the Orange Order is a state within the state, with an even uglier face.

Nice try, but you and the swarthoids over at Stirpes know nothing about the Orange Order. I'm always greatly amused by the fear, suspicion, and hatred directed at us by uninvolved individuals who opt to stick their nose in matters pertaining to the British Isles, Protestantism, and other such topics. Northern Ireland doesn't concern Mynydd; he ought to forget about the UDA and worry about the ETA. :thumbs up

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 01:16 PM

ETA is targeting official Spain. Autonomous regions are not their concern.

And why should one fear woefully uneducated pro-Israel loonies in horrible looking orange gear? They all look like construction workers with bowler hats. ;)

Loyalist

08-11-2009, 01:36 PM

And why should one fear woefully uneducated pro-Israel loonies in horrible looking orange gear? They all look like construction workers with bowler hats. ;)

One shouldn't generalise in such a manner; proportionately, there are probably more university graduates in the Orange Order than in Germany. You musn't cheat and consider tattooed individuals in Rangers shirts who turn up at parades as reflective of the organisation.

The pro-Israeli sentiment stems from two sources. The first is of course the Christian basis for the state of Israel, that Jews are the Chosen, etc. Of course, as a Pope-worshipper you would know that. Second, Ulstermen see parallels between their own state and Israel. As the Jews fight to the secure their existence in a nation surrounded by hostile elements, so too do the Protestants of Ulster, who are similarly under threat from internal and external entities looking to undermine their province.

Again, I question why a Spaniard and a German, among others, have such a pathological obsession with matters pertinent to Northern Ireland, or the United Kingdom in general. Canada and Canadians are more relevant to Northern Ireland and the people of Ulster than any native of Spain. In fact, the majority of North Americans, being for the most part of British Isles origin, have more in common with the United Kingdom than any continental European. There are no Orangemen in Madrid or Berlin, so don't worry yourself about it.

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 01:45 PM

It is up to me what matters to me. And as both Israel and the clicque of satanists in orange posing as some kind of Christians both rejoice in suppressing a majority in their own homelands by means of ruthless terror and kangaroo courts and committees they both can count on my opposition, whether you like it or not.

Loyalist

08-11-2009, 01:59 PM

It is up to me what matters to me.

Nobody said it isn't.

And as both Israel and the clicque of satanists in orange

I think it's ironic that a Catholic is denouncing another religious denomination as Satanic. Roman Catholicism is a polytheistic distortion of Christ's teachings which places greater emphasis on the power of Mary and a strange assortment of saints than on Jesus. Then of course there's the worship of graven images, empty confessions, and pedophelia. My personal favourite is the concept that a priest in Vatican City has the right to label himself as the physical embodiment of God on Earth, and make decisions accordingly. By that alone, the Pope fits the criteria of the Antichrist to the letter. I recommend that you address the Satanic elements of your own faith before making such assertions about others.

posing as some kind of Christians both rejoice in suppressing a majority in their own homelands by means of ruthless terror and kangaroo courts and committees they both can count on my opposition, whether you like it or not.

Here we go again. Roman Catholics and/or Irish Republicans are not a majority in Northern Ireland. The situation is exactly the reverse of what you've highlighted; the Protestant and Unionist population is under siege from a clique of left-wing terror factions, and their supporters who deceive the world at large with a false "victim" face.

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 02:00 PM

Quiet please!

I'm trying to catch the point here.

We have>1. Masons
2. Illuminates (may be they don't exists anymore?!)
3. Orange Order (what is that? french mobile operater?)

Who is who then?

Phlegethon

08-11-2009, 02:04 PM

The Orange Order is the Anglo equivalent of the 'deep state' in Turkey. State-sponsored thugs to do the dirty work that the state cannot do officially, disguised as a cultural organization.

Amarantine

08-11-2009, 02:06 PM

Oh, but he is too young to be a member then:O

Loyalist

08-11-2009, 02:23 PM

The Orange Order is the Anglo equivalent of the 'deep state' in Turkey. State-sponsored thugs to do the dirty work that the state cannot do officially, disguised as a cultural organization.

That's strange, as Orange walks are being banned left and right. Orange halls are vandalised and burned down on a regular basis with no real effort to investigate by the police. Politicians, left and right, make no effort to hide their contempt for this most "sectarian" of organisations, and the media hates us. But we're doing dirty work on behalf of a quietly supportive government? Don't make me laugh.

Sally

08-11-2009, 02:58 PM

My grandfather was a Freemason (and also vehemently anti-Catholic), and I also knew many women involved in the Order of the Eastern Star. Growing up, I attended school with several girls who were in Job's Daughters.

For obvious reasons (i.e., I'm Catholic), I have no desire to have anything to do with Freemasonry. :eek:

Frigga

08-11-2009, 03:12 PM

There is a thing around here called Rainbow Girls, which is an offshoot of the Masonic lodges around here. It's girls that are just about junior high age to graduating from high school. They dress in pretty dresses for their meetings, and they do charity work and fundraisers. They have to have a male patron present at their meetings, don't ask me why. I knew a couple of girls who were involved with Rainbow Girls, but they never really talked about it besides that they went to the meetings and had fundraisers.

lei.talk

08-11-2009, 04:14 PM

Youth Organizations
While there are several youth organizations sponsored or supported by the various Masonic organizations, three are the largest and best known.

The Order of DeMolay (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DeMolay_International) is an organization for young men aged 12 to 21. Young men do not need to have a Masonic relative to join the organization. DeMolay was founded in Kansas City, Missouri, in 1919, and is now international in scope. Like the other Masonic Youth Orders, DeMolay Chapters (local groups) usually meet in a room at a local Masonic Lodge. Adult leadership is provided by men (usually Masons) known as Chapter Dads or advisors. The Order takes its name from Jacques DeMolay (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_de_Molay), the last Grand Master of the Templars (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knights_Templar), who was martyred in the Middle Ages for refusing to compromise his honor. The Order teaches the virtues of reverence, love of parents, comradeship, patriotism, courtesy, cleanness, and fidelity. The Order provides many social events and activities, which help to teach social skills and leadership.

The International Order of Rainbow for Girls (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Order_of_the_Rainbow_for_Girls) is an organization for young women aged 11 to 20. It was founded in McAlester, Oklahoma, in 1922. No relationship to a member of the Masonic Order is required for membership. Local groups or Assemblies are generally sponsored by either a Masonic Lodge or a Chapter of the Order of the Eastern Star. Women known as Mother Advisors give adult supervision and guidance. Each of the colors of the rainbow is associated with a particular virtue or source of inspiration. Like the other Youth Orders, Rainbow is deeply involved with local charity and support of education. It teaches character development, planning, leadership, and social skills through training programs and social events.

The International Order of Job’s Daughters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Job%27s_Daughters_International) takes its name from a story in the Biblical Book of Job (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Job). It was organized in Omaha, Nebraska, in 1920. Membership requires the young woman be related to a Mason. The local organization is called a Bethel. The teachings of the Order are Biblically based, and similar virtues are stressed as in the other Masonic Youth Orders. Job’s Daughters places special emphasis on community service. Many Bethels work with drug education programs and with the Hearing Impaired Kids Endowment (HIKE) Program. Membership is for young women age 11 to 20.

The youth organizations are separate and independent organizations that stress the importance of character development, community service and leadership. While members of the youth groups are free to seek membership in Freemasonry (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry) or the Eastern Star (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Eastern_Star), it is a personal choice and not a requirement of membership in a youth order.

- The Masonic Service Association of North America (http://www.msana.com/youth.asp)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b1/Orderamaranth.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Amaranth)

the masonic origins of mormonism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freemasonry_and_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement)
is an interesting topic.

:levitate:

Æmeric

08-11-2009, 04:32 PM

I had heard of the Masonic origins of Mormonism. But I use to know a Mason who had been raised as a member of the LSD Church - he was no longer amember of the LDS Church when he became a Mason. He told me that Mormonism & Masonry were not connected & that the rituals were very different. Though he never went into detail of what those rituals were.

Óttar

08-11-2009, 04:40 PM

It is more male secret sociaty...no females there:(
[/COLOR]

The French lodges have admitted women, and the Masons have their women's auxillary, the Order of the Eastern Star. There are also co-lodges, but their union with the higher bodies of Freemasonic organization I am unsure about.

I think the preservation of all-male fraternities (redundant?:confused:) is incredibly important. Today males have no initiation rites like they did in the past, nor do they have all male forums where they are free to be men. This collapse of the male support system has led to the modern phenomenon of "guys left behind" where men are falling behind in college admission, college graduation etc. Women outnumber men in these categories 61% to 39%, this is an alarming statistic. I think part of it has to do with the past 30 years of pumping up women, telling them how fantastic they are merely on account of their sex. This is coupled with a pervasive culture which puts down men and masculinity. Guys (the mature men of the future) are surrounded by a "men are bad, women are fantastic" ambience which is fed to them by the media and popular culture from the cradle. The downfall of all male schools is another problem as (females being overrepresented as teachers) teachers do not understand how boys learn and instead praise girls because their educational techniques favor girls, and they do not put up with the natural dynamic energy of boys to be innovators and explorers.

As Loki pointed out, 'when women are around, all men can think about is sex.' Throughout both high school and college, I was incredibly distracted by females and my grades suffered in both instances because of this (moreso the latter as High School just stressed me out with all the busywork as well as boring the crap out of me.) I take responsibility for my not getting cum laude, but I mention that sexual distractions were a factor.

I told my room-mate who is in law school that I too was moderately considering going to law school but if I did go, I would want to go to an all-male grad school as my grades would be much better and having a strong male network could really help me excel. He told me that there weren't any left (especially around Boston), and so I asked him how he keeps from being distracted with so many young women around, and his only bit of advice was "concentrate really hard, and keep your eyes ahead of you."

Alas our male support networks and forums have been eroded. :(

Hrolf Kraki

08-11-2009, 04:44 PM

Those that cannot give credence to a God must be irreligious libertines, and thus have no true sense of right or wrong.

That makes no sense. Is this your view or are you expressing the view of the Freemasons?

Amarantine

08-12-2009, 11:42 AM

The French lodges have admitted women, and the Masons have their women's auxillary, the Order of the Eastern Star. There are also co-lodges, but their union with the higher bodies of Freemasonic organization I am unsure about.

I think the preservation of all-male fraternities (redundant?:confused:) is incredibly important. Today males have no initiation rites like they did in the past, nor do they have all male forums where they are free to be men. This collapse of the male support system has led to the modern phenomenon of "guys left behind" where men are falling behind in college admission, college graduation etc. Women outnumber men in these categories 61% to 39%, this is an alarming statistic. I think part of it has to do with the past 30 years of pumping up women, telling them how fantastic they are merely on account of their sex. This is coupled with a pervasive culture which puts down men and masculinity. Guys (the mature men of the future) are surrounded by a "men are bad, women are fantastic" ambience which is fed to them by the media and popular culture from the cradle. The downfall of all male schools is another problem as (females being overrepresented as teachers) teachers do not understand how boys learn and instead praise girls because their educational techniques favor girls, and they do not put up with the natural dynamic energy of boys to be innovators and explorers.

As Loki pointed out, 'when women are around, all men can think about is sex.' Throughout both high school and college, I was incredibly distracted by females and my grades suffered in both instances because of this (moreso the latter as High School just stressed me out with all the busywork as well as boring the crap out of me.) I take responsibility for my not getting cum laude, but I mention that sexual distractions were a factor.

I told my room-mate who is in law school that I too was moderately considering going to law school but if I did go, I would want to go to an all-male grad school as my grades would be much better and having a strong male network could really help me excel. He told me that there weren't any left (especially around Boston), and so I asked him how he keeps from being distracted with so many young women around, and his only bit of advice was "concentrate really hard, and keep your eyes ahead of you."

Alas our male support networks and forums have been eroded. :(

Oh, Ottar :( I never heard that so young man as you talk like that. Well, I never heard that men are distracted from us...why we are not distracted from males then?! Are you males are so vulnerable? ( I doubt).

Baron Samedi

08-12-2009, 03:56 PM

That makes no sense. Is this your view or are you expressing the view of the Freemasons?

Look it up yourself.

Hrolf Kraki

08-12-2009, 04:06 PM

Look it up yourself.

:rolleyes:

Ok, I take it it´s a freemason thing since I don´t see how I can look up your opinions online.

Óttar

08-12-2009, 09:03 PM

:rolleyes:

Ok, I take it it´s a freemason thing since I don´t see how I can look up your opinions online.

I think you can infer... You know, him being the Satanist and all. He is a Satanist, right?:confused::D

Æmeric

08-12-2009, 09:24 PM

I've considered joining a fraternity in the past, but unfortunately no atheists are allowed to become Freemasons. You have to be religious. :rolleyes2:
But isn't it wrong to want to join a fraternity that discriminates against women? What's the difference, so what if thay have a vagina instead of a penis?:rolleyes:

Óttar

08-12-2009, 10:05 PM

@Amarantine

Why did you have my "and having a strong male network could really help me excel" outlined in bold? What is so particularly noteworthy about that tidbit?

If you haven't noticed, women have support networks. Usually much larger ones in fact.

Lulletje Rozewater

08-13-2009, 07:23 AM

I'm also quite interested in masonery, mostly becouse of conspiracy theories, and very strong political influence in the last 100 years (may be even more). And I didn't know that you have to be theist, I alwaysed thought you should be atheist ?!

It is more male secret sociaty...no females there:(

Another thing is, well some masons in this area of Europe people equalized with Jews, some with Communists, and the recent information (yesterday, what a coincidency:)) someone told me about Cionists (I'm don't know what is that and how to write in English, even I heard for that term still don't know the real meaning).

:)

http://www.womenfreemasonsusa.com/history.html

Conditions
1.Very good looking,but with buckteeth
2.Be prepared for an awesome foursome
3.Must have false teeth,men do not want the chop off the top
4.Initiated for a more rounded off entrance
5.Must know the Kama Sutra in side out and outside in.
6.Must have an expanded vagie
:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Amarantine

08-13-2009, 07:53 AM

lol

So is Masonary good or bed?

Or we couldn't considered them in that so simple frame?

Lulletje Rozewater

08-13-2009, 08:38 AM

lol

So is Masonary good or bed?

Or we couldn't considered them in that so simple frame?

I think it is a good thing.
They help each other, in any which way, first.
The "secret" signs and passes, are irrelevant,it is the heart what counts and the deeds.
Do not get the idea that a son could follow a father into the Masons.

If you really want to read about secret societies read this by a Dutchman(dom donner heheheh)
http://letsrollforums.com/did-you-know-pope-t17063.html?

Amarantine

08-13-2009, 11:46 AM

Phlegethon

08-13-2009, 11:56 AM

I am a perrymason.

Amarantine

08-13-2009, 11:58 AM

I am a perrymason.

what is that?

Loki

08-13-2009, 12:00 PM

But isn't it wrong to want to join a fraternity that discriminates against women? What's the difference, so what if thay have a vagina instead of a penis?:rolleyes:

No it isn't. A fraternity is a sort of a social club, not an electoral body that decides on laws binding on everyone in the country. :rolleyes: There are all-female social organisations as well, nothing wrong with that.

Phlegethon

08-13-2009, 12:05 PM

what is that?

This. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perry_Mason)

Amarantine

08-13-2009, 12:11 PM

This. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perry_Mason)

hahah, I heard, tho I never watched.

Æmeric

08-13-2009, 01:13 PM

No it isn't. A fraternity is a sort of a social club, not an electoral body that decides on laws binding on everyone in the country. :rolleyes: There are all-female social organisations as well, nothing wrong with that.

But a lot of political decisions happen behind closed doors in private clubs - like the Masons. It's no coincidence that many past political leaders have been Masons.

Amarantine

08-13-2009, 01:56 PM

But a lot of political decisions happen behind closed doors in private clubs - like the Masons. It's no coincidence that many past political leaders have been Masons.

That part is interesting for me!

Lulletje Rozewater

08-14-2009, 02:34 PM

hm he made the whole mess there, connecting Catholic Church with Skulls and Bones, Maltesian Knights, etc etc he somehow mixed all in one. Not clear to me still.

btw, I didn't know for some kind of hatred bewteen Catholics and Protestant (except in Ulster), hm, very strange ineed.

Apparently there was some sort of mistrust decades ago in Holland,not hate as such.
Than again the Protestant Settlers in South Africa did leave Holland long ago,because of the friction.

That whole thread on the Cath. and Skull and bones was unclear,but interesting.You can not blame the people for mistrusting the Cath. Church

Hrolf Kraki

08-14-2009, 09:55 PM

hahah, I heard, tho I never watched.

The jury never gets to decide. The criminal ALWAYS confesses in some overly dramatic way at the end in the middle of the courtroom, because Perry Mason outsmarts them. I´ve seen like one episode, but probably 20 endings. The endings are all the same.

Hrolf Kraki

08-14-2009, 09:57 PM

You can not blame the people for mistrusting the Cath. Church

I´ll say! The Catholic Church has been lying to people since when? 1054? Give us money or you don´t go to heaven!!!

Phlegethon

08-14-2009, 10:00 PM

Give me money or you will go straight to hell!

Tolleson

08-14-2009, 10:56 PM

Give me money or you will go straight to hell!

OK...:rolleyes: :fear:

Óttar

08-14-2009, 11:57 PM

Oh, Ottar :( I never heard that so young man as you talk like that. Well, I never heard that men are distracted from us...why we are not distracted from males then?! Are you males are so vulnerable? ( I doubt).

A man's sexual peak is between 19 - 21, women don't reach theirs until 36.

Frigga

08-15-2009, 01:20 PM

Off topic, but yes, I have read that that is true. Elizabeth Davis in Women's Sexual Passages says that it is very possibly due to men at a young age peaking with their testosterone then and are much more aggressive in bed, and as they approach middle age, they have a lesser supply of it, so the estrogen has more of a chance to express itself. Men in their middle age sometimes tend to be more affectionate and demonstrative with their feelings. Whereas women have more estrogen in their younger years, probably due to being of an optimum age for child bearing. The closer they get to menopause, the more estrogen and progesterone slacks off, and testosterone has more of a chance to express itself. Elizabeth says that testosterone actually increases in pre-menopausal women. Women tend to be more aggressive sexually than in their teens and twenties. She also speculates that that is why there is the stereotype that older men like younger women, and older women like younger men- sugar daddy and cougar respectively.

Alright, back to your previous discussion. :D

Óttar

08-16-2009, 05:06 PM

men at a young age peaking with their testosterone then and are much more aggressive in bed, and as they approach middle age, they have a lesser supply of it, so the estrogen has more of a chance to express itself.

That's funny, my ex-girlfriend is super-aggressive sexually, but alas, it's probably more due to the fact that she's a spoiled brat. :D

Phlegethon

08-16-2009, 05:51 PM

Nothing a drug cocktail or a taser can't fix. And then there's ropes, handcuffs and bedposts. ;)

Piparskeggr

08-16-2009, 10:35 PM

When I joined, there was no overt recruiting allowed by members of any Lodge. My wife and I were invited to a picnic and conversation led to talk of Freemasonry. My curiosity was piqued, and I eventually asked for a membership petition.

I entered as an Apprentice in Speculative Masonry on 18 November 1987...
I passed into being a Fellow of the Craft on 23 March 1988...
I was raised to the Sublime Degree of a Master Mason on 27 April 1988...
I was further educated and became a Master of the Royal Secret, 32nd Degree, in the Scottish Rite on 11 November 1988.

I am a Life Member of both my home Lodge and the Scottish Rite Temple back there in the Omaha, Nebraska area.

I was Chaplain of my Lodge from May 1988 until I moved to Ohio in late 1992.

I am the first Freemason that I know of in my immediate family line, they being Roman Catholic. Upon my mother asking why I joined the Masons instead of the Knights of Columbus; my reply was that I would never take a loyalty oath to any Pope. This was the first, major, indicator to her that I had broken away from "Holy Mother Church."

At the time I joined the Masons I was not yet Asatru, but had been Pagan for several years. The men in the Lodge knew this, but were very supportive of freedom of personal conscience when it came to one's relationship to That Which Is Holy. Once I had chosen Asatru as the belief set, which most closely followed my own, a copy of Havamal was on the altar with the Christin Bible.

The purpose of Masonry, as it was explained to me, is to help good men become better. This is done by the moral and philosophical lessons one learns from both the ceremonials and study of Masonic/related reading materials. This emphasis on the inner workings of a man is why Freemasonry is called Speculative, as opposed to Operative, wherein one actually works with brick, mortar and stone.

The tools of Stonemasonry amongst others, are used as symbolic, mnemonic devices, which help one to recall the teachings.

Masonry is not, as in older times, a secret society. Though it is a society with secrets, like any group meant for a particular grouping of people. One doesn't talk all about one's most intimate moments at home all about town...

Masonry does hold to some old traditions, such as women not being allowed to join. Many Grand Jurisdictions are still whites only, as one of the requirements to become a Mason is that one is Freeborn of Freeborn parentage.

The cultures from which Masonry borrows its teaching materials are from a wide range of antiquity.

As to the conspiracy theorists...go into most any Lodge today and you'll have trouble getting all members to decide upon a bowling alley so they might have an evening's enjoyment.

As for the charitable work, it is estimated that Masonic bodies of all sorts raise and spend an average of several million US dollars every day. The directors and trustees of Masonic charities are volunteers, so the administrative overhead is much lower than average.

At one time, Freemasons and other such fraternities and sororities were the social safety net, as were churches, craft guilds, mutual benefit societies and so forth.

I do still support a couple of Masonic charities, but have not been to Lodge in a few years. The illnesses I've had, well, have been a drag on my interest beyond the confines of taking care of my wife, doing my job every day and keeping some contact within my faith community. If I had more mental and emotional reserves, I do think I'd participate as I did in the past; was a member of the Master's Degree team in my old Lodge. I liked the ritual work.

Just a few thoughts...

Amarantine

08-17-2009, 06:47 AM

well, really nice post.

What a pitty I expected some more "secretly moments, connections, special secret books with also special rituals" and everything with the elements of SF, a little scary and adventure:):):) and of course with a bit of fairy dust:)

Lulletje Rozewater

08-17-2009, 07:32 AM

instead of the Knights of Columbus;

I was with the Knights of Da Gama

Piparskeggr

08-17-2009, 10:08 AM

I was with the Knights of Da Gama

Ah, Vasco de Gama, a Prince amongst navigators during the Age of Sail.

Pip (an American wh remembers some of his world history education ,-)

Lulletje Rozewater

08-17-2009, 11:00 AM

Amarinthe's quote: What a pitty I expected some more "secretly moments, connections, special secret books with also special rituals" and everything with the elements of SF, a little scary and adventure:):):) and of course with a bit of fairy dust
:)Read between the lines.:thumbs up and for secret books read this on Columbus
Was he a Portuguese or Spaniard ????????????
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_theories_of_Christopher_Columbus

Ullarsskald Ah, Vasco de Gama, a Prince amongst navigators during the Age of Sail.

Pip (an American who remembers some of his world history education ,-)Those incredible Spice lovers.

Nosi

09-12-2009, 08:30 PM

Freemasonry is Judaism. Why do you want to associate yourself with that? http://www.nicenetruth.com/home/2009/02/freemasonry-and-the-noachide-laws.html

Poltergeist

09-12-2009, 08:35 PM

I worked as a mason once, to earn some money. But freemason? no

RoyBatty

09-12-2009, 08:37 PM

Am personally not too keen on... uhm.......secret societies and elitist organisations which work for the benefit of the few by enslaving and exploiting the many.

ikki

09-12-2009, 08:58 PM

Nothing a drug cocktail or a taser can't fix. And then there's ropes, handcuffs and bedposts. ;)

seduction by chloroform :p

Germanicus

09-12-2009, 09:18 PM

Joining the Freemasonry? hmm no, but joining the Original "Hellfire club" that sounds cool...:thumbs up

The Hellfire Club was the popular name for a number of supposed exclusive clubs for high society rakes established all over Britain and Ireland in the 18th century. These clubs were rumoured to be the meeting places of "persons of quality who wished to take part in immoral acts, and the members were often very involved in politics. Neither the activities nor membership of the club are easy to ascertain.

The very first Hellfire Club was founded in London in 1719, by Philip, Duke of Wharton and a handful of other high society friends. The most infamous club associated with the name was established in England by Sir Francis Dashwood, and met irregularly from around 1749 to around 1760, and possibly up until 1766. Other clubs using the name "Hellfire Club" were set up throughout the 18th century. Most of these clubs were set up in Ireland after Wharton's was dispelled.

The club motto was Fais ce que tu voudras (Do what thou wilt), a philosophy of life associated with François Rabelais' fictional abbey at Thélème and later used by Aleister Crowley.

Mesrine

09-12-2009, 09:28 PM

I worked as a mason once, to earn some money. But freemason? no

What? You don't want to build temples for Virtue, and dark prisons for Vice, brother?

Hweinlant

09-12-2009, 09:47 PM

Freemasonry is Judaism. Why do you want to associate yourself with that? http://www.nicenetruth.com/home/2009/02/freemasonry-and-the-noachide-laws.html

Freemasonry is not Judaism. Atleast not in Finland. Freemasons are patriotic people, usually from upper middle class. They also are dying out, middle age being over 60 yrs. Masonic ritual is bit silly, basically old biblical story about Solomon and 3 crooks and Jesus. Masons are very patriotic and not "Zionist conspiracy". Opening music of any Masonic lodge in Finland is Finlandia Hymn and oath to the flag. Basically Masonry is for old geesers with "family pedigree" and for those wishing to have family pedigree. Those old buggers are no threat to anyone.

Poltergeist

09-13-2009, 04:20 AM

What? You don't want to build temples for Virtue, and dark prisons for Vice, brother?

no, brother

Building temples for abstractions doesn't appeal to me.

lei.talk

11-05-2009, 10:58 AM

Originally Posted by Óttar http://www.theapricity.com/forum/images/kiddo/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=81734#post81734)
A man's sexual peak is between 19 - 21, women don't reach theirs until 36.

Originally Posted by Frigga'sSpindle http://www.theapricity.com/forum/images/kiddo/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=81869#post81869)
Off topic, but yes, I have read that that is true...
The closer they get to menopause, the more estrogen and progesterone slacks off, and testosterone has more of a chance to express itself. Elizabeth (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1T4GZAZ_enUS281US281&q=Elizabeth+Davis+Women%27s+Sexual+Passages&aq=f&oq=&aqi=) says that testosterone actually increases in pre-menopausal women. Women tend to be more aggressive sexually than in their teens and twenties.

Originally Posted by Óttar http://www.theapricity.com/forum/images/kiddo/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=82492#post82492)
That's funny, my ex-girlfriend is super-aggressive sexually,
but alas,
it's probably more due to the fact that she's a spoiled brat. :Dif your girl-friend was a teen-ager,
her insatiable craving of sexual activity
was more likely due to her hormone-levels peaking
as they do in teen-aged males.

additionally, post-orgasm production of prolactin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolactin)
has opposite affects on the two sexes:

in males, it diminishes testosterone
and encourages sleep; :yawn:

in females, it diminishes œstrogen -
which raises the relative level of testosterone
and the desire for more sexual activity. :eek:

a smart man would be sure
his girl-friend has dozens of orgasms
before he has one. :nod:

any unexpended oxytocin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxytocin) will demand attention.

hormone-levels do not rise with age - they diminish, but,
the testosterone (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone)/œstrogen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estrogen) ratio changes -

unless, one consciously manipulates one's diet and exercise-levels
to enhance health (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone#Secretion_patterns) and, consequently,
improve one's capacities. :swl

Amarantine

11-10-2009, 08:51 AM

if your girl-friend was a teen-ager,
her insatiable craving of sexual activity
was more likely due to her hormone-levels peaking
as they do in teen-aged males.

additionally, post-orgasm production of prolactin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolactin)
has opposite affects on the two sexes:

in males, it diminishes testosterone
and encourages sleep; :yawn:

in females, it diminishes œstrogen -
which raises the relative level of testosterone
and the desire for more sexual activity. :eek:

a smart man would be sure
his girl-friend has dozens of orgasms
before he has one. :nod:

any unexpended oxytocin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxytocin) will demand attention.

hormone-levels do not rise with age - they diminish, but,
the testosterone (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testosterone)/œstrogen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estrogen) ratio changes -

unless, one consciously manipulates one's diet and exercise-levels
to enhance health (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Growth_hormone#Secretion_patterns) and, consequently,
improve one's capacities. :swl

Why you need to explain some so magnificant moments, in so...medical way?! :(:rolleyes2:

Phlegethon

11-10-2009, 09:22 AM

And what does that have to do with freemasonry?

Amarantine

11-11-2009, 08:25 AM

And what does that have to do with freemasonry?

In conspiracy and secret sociaties, everything could be, at least freemasonery:wink:D

P.S. are you trying to say may be we are a little bit off topic...:coffee:

Trencavel

11-13-2009, 10:42 PM

Here goes my take on it.

There are different types of Masons so it's difficult to have a general explanation. Everything is symbolic so you´ll have to comprehend beyond concepts and images.
The visual symbolism resembles the tools of the construction worker. This serves a dual purpose : 1. The reconstruction of Solomon's temple and 2. The work on one's self.
So, with every "grade" you get a deeper understanding of reality (in their own esoteric tradition called "the work of the great architect"). This means a better understanding of yourself.
As you advance through the grades you become a more "skilled" worker for the order's purpose and receive bigger responsabilities.
As far as I know, you need an invitation for a serious consideration within the lodge. This has a direct relationship with your proffesion. There are lodges for politicians, educators, doctors, salesmen, bankers, etc.
Then there's a bigger lodge where everyone goes.
And... There are some "elite" lodges too.

Now... Try to figure it out ! he he

Murphy

11-13-2009, 10:44 PM

Dead Masons equal fun Masons.

Regards,
The Papist.

Trencavel

11-13-2009, 10:45 PM

Sorry, you got it all wrong. Lucifer is different. The God who is Jahweh is Demiurge (that is also God who is worshipped by Christians, as well as Muslims, Jews etc). He is God who decides who will live and who will die on this planet apparently. Lucifer is a Sun God.
Don Miguel even says here: '' they magnanimously instructed the Demiurge's creations (the Black, Yellow and Red races native to the planet) and began to raise them above their animal condition''.
In Miguel Serrano's Nos, Lucifer is identified as the King of the White gods.
Anyway, i will find who is Baphomet, no worries.
Thank you anyway for your view and comment .:thumb001:

:thumbs up

This issue deserves another whole thread ! Is there something related ?

Óttar

11-13-2009, 11:05 PM

If a Freemasonic lodge is peopled by Royalists, then that lodge will be Royalist. If a Freemasonic lodge is peopled by left-wing revolutionaries, then that lodge will be left-wing and revolutionary. There were Freemasons on both sides of many wars and conflicts. It seems few of them took their oath of loyalty to aid their brothers too seriously if it jeopardised their political interests.

.
As far as I know, you need an invitation for a serious consideration within the lodge.

The saying in regards to this is "to be one, ask one." There are Freemasons everywhere. There is no "tapping on the shoulder" and until recently, and then only in a few isolated incidents, any public attempts at recruitment (pamphlets, commercials, open houses) is/was highly discouraged, one of the cornerstones (no pun intended) of Freemasonry being that one comes of their own "free will and accord."

Trencavel

11-13-2009, 11:24 PM

Fred

11-20-2009, 07:55 PM

Pythagoras would have a field day with this group...

Loki

10-31-2013, 07:59 PM

One shouldn't generalise in such a manner; proportionately, there are probably more university graduates in the Orange Order than in Germany. You musn't cheat and consider tattooed individuals in Rangers shirts who turn up at parades as reflective of the organisation.

The pro-Israeli sentiment stems from two sources. The first is of course the Christian basis for the state of Israel, that Jews are the Chosen, etc. Of course, as a Pope-worshipper you would know that. Second, Ulstermen see parallels between their own state and Israel. As the Jews fight to the secure their existence in a nation surrounded by hostile elements, so too do the Protestants of Ulster, who are similarly under threat from internal and external entities looking to undermine their province.

Again, I question why a Spaniard and a German, among others, have such a pathological obsession with matters pertinent to Northern Ireland, or the United Kingdom in general. Canada and Canadians are more relevant to Northern Ireland and the people of Ulster than any native of Spain. In fact, the majority of North Americans, being for the most part of British Isles origin, have more in common with the United Kingdom than any continental European. There are no Orangemen in Madrid or Berlin, so don't worry yourself about it.

Great stuff :laugh: