@ Muslim Turks

[Loki]

See poll :)

[arcticwolf]

Can I troll this thread? :D

[Loki]

Can I troll this thread? :D

No :)

[arcticwolf]

No :)

Darn! OK ;)

[Pontios]

A similar thread would be good for Greeks. First Greek or first Orthodox.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

What about Agnostic ,Deist or Pagan Turks?
I guess for this poll we don't make any affect.

[Dengizik]

I am Turkish - Turk and Muslim being equally important

[legolasbozo]

the most important thing is being a good human, then religion and nationality together. i know so many person call them patriot but so dirty for their habitant, or religious peoples but lack of animal love, cruel to cats and dogs. So the most important thing is being a human.

[orangepulp]

I am a Muslim before anything. All proper practicing Muslims regardless of their ethnicity would vote for being a Muslim first.

[tEhSaint]

soz couldn't resist :D

[orangepulp]

soz couldn't resist :D

For what?? :confused:

[tEhSaint]

For what?? :confused:

For thread subscription ofc.

[SKYNET]

this thread is only for turkish people, not for anyone else

[orangepulp]

A similar thread would be good for Greeks. First Greek or first Orthodox.

So what would you pick then?
Greek or Christian first?

[Su]

Some pkk terror supporters are also Muslims. Based on that first Turkish then Muslim. If there was no pkk supporting Muslims then first Muslim then Turkish.

[archangel]

Türkish first,religion irrelevant

[Hoca]

The ones who voted should be see-able. I have a feeling that non-Turks will also vote.

[orangepulp]

The ones who voted should be see-able. I have a feeling that non-Turks will also vote.

Since the ones who voted cannot see the poll it is better that we also write our choice.

[iNird]

Not sure how reliable this is:


More than half of the population of Muslim-majority Turkey opposes members of other religions holding meetings or publishing materials to explain their faith, according to a recently issued survey.


Fully 59 percent of those surveyed said non-Muslims either “should not” or “absolutely should not” be allowed to hold open meetings where they can discuss their ideas. Fifty-four percent said non-Muslims either “should not” or “absolutely should not” be allowed to publish literature that describes their faith.



The survey also found that almost 40 percent of the population of Turkey said they had “very negative” or “negative” views of Christians.


The survey includes significant nuance. While 42 percent of the population agreed with the statement that religious people should be tolerant, 49 percent of those surveyed said they would either “absolutely” or “most likely” not support a political party that accepted people from another religion. But 20 percent of those surveyed said they had “very positive” or “positive” views of Christians – 13 percent “very positive,” and 7 percent “positive.”



At times in Turkey’s history, the government has “manipulated public opinion” by putting forth the message that Turkish Christians are aligned with powers outside of the country that want to divide the nation, said Zekai Tanyar, a Turkish national who has been a Christian for more than 30 years. He is chairman of the Association of Protestant Churches (in Turkey).


http://www.worldwatchmonitor.org/english/country/turkey/12322

I personally think both are intertwined and a Christian,Buddhist, whatever Turk would not be accepted by most Turks. Atheist/Agnostic with Islamic background sure.

[Su]

The ones who voted should be see-able. I have a feeling that non-Turks will also vote.

Non Turks have already voted for lulz. Click on the number in the poll then you will see the name of the voters.

[archangel]

gezz i really dislike these semitic religions,hope they will vanish forever from earth
(and this threat is full of troll just look at the poll)

[orangepulp]

Non Turks have already voted for lulz. Click on the number in the poll then you will see the name of the voters.

I was surprised that 5 Turks voted for the Muslim first option, turns out 3 people who are not Turkish voted!! On anthro forums only few Turks consider Islam as important or even consider themselves as Muslims.

[orangepulp]

gezz i really dislike these semitic religions,hope they will vanish forever from earth
(and this threat is full of troll just look at the poll)

Whatever you say the important thing is most Turks consider themselves as Muslims whether they are practicing or not.

[archangel]

millletin kimlik kağıdında yazıyor diye kimse müslüman olmak veya başka bir dine inanmak zorunda değil bildiğin gibi,bende de müslüman yazıyor ama ilgim alakam yok dine karşı,burada sadece fikrimi belirtiyorum inanan inanır ve beni bağlamaz ancak hiçkimse inandığı şeyi bana dikte edemez.

[orangepulp]

millletin kimlik kağıdında yazıyor diye kimse müslüman olmak veya başka bir dine inanmak zorunda değil bildiğin gibi,bende de müslüman yazıyor ama ilgim alakam yok dine karşı,burada sadece fikrimi belirtiyorum inanan inanır ve beni bağlamaz ancak hiçkimse inandığı şeyi bana dikte edemez.

Sana hic kimse zorla Musluman ol demiyor!! Sana hic kimse inancindan dolayi yadirgamiyor ama sen gelip dunyanin nufusunun cogunun dinine bir nevi lanet ediyorsun, buna ne gerek vardi?

[archangel]

sadece dinler hakkında fikrimi söyledim,sen de çık din kimlikten önce gelir falan yaz beni bağlamaz

[Onur]

There is not any suitable option for me in the poll.

Let alone putting it as first, i wouldn't even put it as last. I see islam as a taint in Turkish history. Yes, our forefathers accomplished a lot of achievements by using islam as a political tool [all powerful nations did that in the past, islamic or christian] but all in all, i would like to see a Turkey without islamic nonsense in the future. I wish for that not only for Turkey but for all the other nations in Europe.

[orangepulp]

sadece dinler hakkında fikrimi söyledim,sen de çık din kimlikten önce gelir falan yaz beni bağlamaz

Neylen neyi kiyasliyorsun??

Ben sadece Turkten once Musluman oldugumu belirtim ve hic kimseye saygisizlik etmedim. Tabiki Allaha inanan bir insan icin din once gelir.

Sen sadece fikirlerini beyan etmedin ayni zamanda hakaret ettin. Eger sadece Musluman olmadigini belirtseydin sorun olmazdi.

[ümit]

lol,half of the Turks can not vote,where the hell is the forth option for nonbelievers?

[TheMagnificent]

There is not any suitable option for me in the poll.

Let alone putting it as first, i wouldn't even put it as last. I see islam as a taint in Turkish history. Yes, our forefathers accomplished a lot of achievements by using islam as a political tool [all powerful nations did that in the past, islamic or christian] but all in all, i would like to see a Turkey without islamic nonsense in the future. I wish for that not only for Turkey but for all the other nations in Europe.

What does 'using as a political tool' even mean? Our longest-lasting empires/states were islamic ones. For centuries we have been the sword of Islam and we brought the faith into the Balkans.

[Partizan]

Religion can be changed if you want, but blood can't.

So, I'm a Turk before Muslim.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

I voted "I am Turkish - A Turk first, Muslim second"
because I suspect non Turkish people also voted ,we can't see who voted what, but I am not represented in poll .

[Don Arb]

gezz i really dislike these semitic religions,hope they will vanish forever from earth
(and this threat is full of troll just look at the poll)

Your ottoman forefathers are disappointed from you, get back in your real identity ;)

ps. geez means Jesus, you traitor :D

[Annihilus]

millletin kimlik kağıdında yazıyor diye kimse müslüman olmak veya başka bir dine inanmak zorunda değil bildiğin gibi,bende de müslüman yazıyor ama ilgim alakam yok dine karşı,burada sadece fikrimi belirtiyorum inanan inanır ve beni bağlamaz ancak hiçkimse inandığı şeyi bana dikte edemez.

This should chance asap.

[Hoca]

I think WW1 should have learned Turkey to be Turks before Muslim. I see every Turk saying he is Muslim before Turk as a possible traitor. Being Muslim didn't meant anything for Arabs, they backstabed us by siding with the enemy. We are Muslim but we are Turks before Muslim.

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

Seems like some our Ex Ottoman friends still identifiy themselves as Turk and Muslim but Muslim first ..:D

Now isn't that cute :heartbea:

http://i.imgur.com/BMbIDHT.png

[MfA_]

Seems like some our Ex Ottoman friends still identifiy themselves as Turk and Muslim but Muslim first ..:D

http://i.imgur.com/BMbIDHT.png

defend kebab :D

[Azalea]

Seems like some our Ex Ottoman friends still identifiy themselves as Turk and Muslim but Muslim first ..:D

Now isn't that cute :heartbea:

http://i.imgur.com/BMbIDHT.png

:D

[TheMagnificent]

I think WW1 should have learned Turkey to be Turks before Muslim. I see every Turk saying he is Muslim before Turk a possible traitor. Being Muslim didn't meant anything for Arabs, they backstabed us by siding with the enemy.

Fortunately you're not the one to decide who's a traitor and who's not then. I voted 'first Muslim' because in front of God my ethnicity has zero relevance. Doesn't mean I neglect my national identity though.


49:13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).

[American_Hispanist]

why the fuck are pseudo-albo balkan trash voting in this poll. fucking trolls. they are jealous of Turks. :D

[iNird]

why the fuck are pseudo-albo balkan trash voting in this poll. fucking trolls. they are jealous of Turks. :D

I'm jealous of you mexican abdullah.

[American_Hispanist]

I'm jealous of you mexican abdullah.

but I am not Turkish. :D

[Hoca]

Fortunately you're not the one to decide who's a traitor and who's not then. I voted 'first Muslim' because in front of God my ethnicity has zero relevance. Doesn't mean I neglect my national identity though.

You either neglect or don't neglect. First part of your story you say I neglect Turkishness for god and the second part you say I don't. You can't have both.

[Su]

Neylen neyi kiyasliyorsun??

Ben sadece Turkten once Musluman oldugumu belirtim ve hic kimseye saygisizlik etmedim. Tabiki Allaha inanan bir insan icin din once gelir.

Sen sadece fikirlerini beyan etmedin ayni zamanda hakaret ettin. Eger sadece Musluman olmadigini belirtseydin sorun olmazdi.

Yau bos ver, senin cevabini begenmedi, daha dogrusu defensive oldu ondan hakaret etti.

Bos ver, konusmaya bile degmez.

[American_Hispanist]

These Bulgarian, Albanian, and other troll balkan gypsies are really starting to get on my nerves with their trolling. those gypsies should learn to respect, and maybe they will get respect back.

[Hoca]

These Bulgarian, Albanian, and other troll balkan gypsies are really starting to get on my nerves with their trolling. those gypsies should learn to respect, and maybe they will get respect back.

They are at the bottom and trying to pull others down with them. Don't pay attention to them.

[American_Hispanist]

They are at the bottom and trying to pull others down with them. Don't pay attention to them.

:D of course. those gypsies are jealous of Turks. :D

[iNird]

but I am not Turkish. :D

Bro, you got a stache that would make any Balkanite jealous, bro.

:(

[TheMagnificent]

You either neglect or don't neglect. First part of your story you say I neglect Turkishness for god and the second part you say I don't. You can't have both.

No, I don't say that. Read again.

[American_Hispanist]

Bro, you got a stache that would make any Balkanite jealous, bro.

:(

lol. you FYROMians are cool. :D Gypsie trolls aren't cool. :)

[iNird]

lol. you FYROMians are cool. :D Gypsie trolls aren't cool. :)

Thanks brother Abdullah Rodriguez. Gypsies aren't cool which is why I'm in favor of banning Turkish subsection.

Turks:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7nj6zt4T41rc31g3o1_400.gif

[safinator]

Yeah those damn Non-Turks are ruining the poll.

[American_Hispanist]

Thanks brother Abdullah Rodriguez. Gypsies aren't cool which is why I'm in favor of banning Turkish subsection.

Turks:

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7nj6zt4T41rc31g3o1_400.gif

Turks aren't Gypsies. They are anatolians. Gypsies would be the trolls who are trolling this thread.

[iNird]

Yeah those damn Non-Turks are ruining the poll.

Yes for you 4 individuals, the consequences will never be the same. Wait till you face the wrath of Onur with a long ass rant that is copied over from Wiki. Just you wait.

:mad:

[Siberian Cold Breeze]

Another Self-Devşirme :D

Name :Arbërori
Ethnicity: Turk
Religion Muslim

voted:I am Turkish - A Muslim first, Turk second

http://i.imgur.com/wrxd44k.jpg

[Absinthe]

This poll is completely biased. How about "I am Turkish and I am not religious" and/or "I am Turkish and I follow a different religion"? Many Turks are not represented here, same as many Europeans wouldn't be represented in a poll about Christianity...

[Partizan]

This poll is completely biased. How about "I am Turkish and I am not religious" and/or "I am Turkish and I follow a different religion"? Many Turks are not represented here, same as many Europeans wouldn't be represented in a poll about Christianity...

Poll is specifically about Turkish Muslims :)

[Absinthe]

Poll is specifically about Turkish Muslims :)
Oh right, I hadn't had my coffee yet. Sorry :P

[SKYNET]

non-turkish voted lol

[Cannabis Sativa]

Fortunately you're not the one to decide who's a traitor and who's not then. I voted 'first Muslim' because in front of God my ethnicity has zero relevance. Doesn't mean I neglect my national identity though.

The same God says different,


O Children of Israel! Remember My Favour which I bestowed upon you and that I preferred you to the 'Alamin (mankind and jinns) (of your time-period, in the past).

Surah Al Baqara 122

Or,


Oh the sons of Israel! Remember that i created you superior to all mankind...

Have a nice time with your zionist Allah.

[Onur]

The same God says different,

Or,

Have a nice time with your zionist Allah.
lol, that was a great response!

Allah with his contradictions :thumb001:

Btw, according to many hadits, Allah also considers Arabs as chosen race too, the other semitic cousins of jews. You know, supposedly we will speak Arabic in heaven :) But i wonder which language i will speak in hell? Maybe the Zulu click language?;

MXroTDm55C8

[Illancha]

Hmmm...

[wvwvw]

Religion can be changed if you want, but blood can't.

You can't leave Islam once you're in. Someone who has rejected Islam who was once a Muslim is an "apostate."

Do the words "Whoever changes his religion, kill him" ring a bell? :p

Blood can be changed through transfusion.

[Cannabis Sativa]

lol, that was a great response!

Allah with his contradictions :thumb001:

Btw, according to many hadits, Allah also considers Arabs as chosen race too, the other semitic cousins of jews. You know, supposedly we will speak Arabic in heaven :) But i wonder which language i will speak in hell? Maybe the Zulu click language?;

MXroTDm55C8

Even those hadiths were fabricated by a Tajik(Bukhari) 300 years later of their Prophet's death. And Tajiks are known to be greatest liars in Central Asia. In fact all Sunnis believing a Lunatic Tajik's farts.


More from Judeo-Allah to beloved Muslims:

Surah Al Isra 17:104 says:


And We said after Pharaoh to the Children of Israel, "Dwell in the land, and when there comes the promise of the Hereafter, We will bring you forth in [one] gathering."

This means Allah of the Muslims promising land to Jews. And imagine our dear Muslims worshipping their Jew lover Allah and claiming Jews are cursed. I'm telling you, this Allah is trolling us or something.

[Annihilus]

Arabic in heaven? That sounds like ... hell:eek:

[TheMagnificent]

The same God says different,



Or,



Have a nice time with your zionist Allah.

The status of the Jews was elevated because they obeyed God and his prophets, not the other way around. Whenever they didn't obey, they were punished...


2:61 And remember ye said: "O Moses! we cannot endure one kind of food (always); so beseech thy Lord for us to produce for us of what the earth groweth, -its pot-herbs, and cucumbers, Its garlic, lentils, and onions." He said: "Will ye exchange the better for the worse? Go ye down to any town, and ye shall find what ye want!" They were covered with humiliation and misery; they drew on themselves the wrath of Allah. This because they went on rejecting the Signs of Allah and slaying His Messengers without just cause. This because they rebelled and went on transgressing.


5:65 If only the People of the Book had believed and been righteous, We should indeed have blotted out their iniquities and admitted them to Gardens of Bliss.


7:166 When in their insolence they transgressed (all) prohibitions, We said to them: "Be ye apes, despised and rejected."


6:83 That was Our argument which We gave to Abraham (to use) against his people: We raise whom We will, degree after degree: for thy Lord is full of wisdom and knowledge.
6:84 We gave him Isaac and Jacob: all (three) We guided: and before him, We guided Noah, and among his progeny, David, Solomon, Job, Joseph, Moses, and Aaron: thus do We reward those who do good:
6:85 And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the Righteous:
6:86 And Ismail and Elisha, and Jonah, and Lot: and to all We gave favor above the nations:
6:87 (To them) and to their fathers, and progeny and brethren: We chose them, and we guided them to a straight Way.
6:88 This is the Guidance of Allah. He giveth that guidance to whom He pleaseth, of His worshippers. If they were to join other gods with Him, all that they did would be vain for them.
6:89 These were the men to whom We gave the Book, and authority, and prophethood: if these (their descendants) reject them, Behold! We shall entrust their charge to a new People who reject them not.

And as you can read, they were not eternally favoured. So how does that make Allah a Zionist (when he even sent Muhammad [pbuh] to rectify the corruptions of among others the Jews and to complete his religion)?

And no need to get personal with that last sentence, is it?

[Cannabis Sativa]

Still doesn't change that Mohammad claimed Abraham's heritage(which makes Mohammad a Jew too) and superior to your kind. Thus, your prophet also claimed Jewish heritage. Allah is practicing Jewish supremacism in his book however no other nation's name is in the holy Qur'an. I can't kneel in front of Allah promising land to Jews and referring the Jews to the superior species. And you're Sunni as far as i know, can you send me some of your ridicolous hadiths or may i post them myself? Moreover you call other Jewish kings "prophet" and introducing Jewish Kings(Especially Isa-Yeshua) as prophet is a suicide but nothing else.

And that's what i think about your so called holy prophets Bunyamin, David etc...
v
v
V

‎"Yahudi krallarını peygamber diye Türk milletine telkin ederek milli mefahiri unutturmak suretiyle İsrailiyyatı hayat ve ahlak sistemi diye öne sürmek milli bir cinayettir."

-Hüseyin Nihal Atsız-

[Partizan]

You can't leave Islam once you're in. Someone who has rejected Islam who was once a Muslim is an "apostate."

Do the words "Whoever changes his religion, kill him" ring a bell? :p

Blood can be changed through transfusion.

Can you show me verse please?


And when those come to you who believe in Our verses, say, "Peace be upon you. Your Lord has decreed upon Himself mercy: that any of you who does wrong out of ignorance and then repents after that and corrects himself - indeed, He is Forgiving and Merciful."

http://quran.com/6


"For you is your religion, and for me is my religion."

http://quran.com/109

BTW I am a Turk and I can't change my part-Turanid face(except aesthetic operation), my DNA etc. I am a Turk before everything else.

[TheMagnificent]

lol, that was a great response!

Allah with his contradictions :thumb001:

Btw, according to many hadits, Allah also considers Arabs as chosen race too, the other semitic cousins of jews. You know, supposedly we will speak Arabic in heaven :) But i wonder which language i will speak in hell? Maybe the Zulu click language?;

MXroTDm55C8

It only shows how alienated you are from your own people by mocking what is holy to them. The belief in/authenticity of hadiths is another discussion, but one should respect the beliefs of others (even if you find it nonsense yourself) as long as they don't impose it on you.

And I don't see atheist Greeks on this forum making openly fun of the Orthodox beliefs of their believer compatriots. I wished we could do the same.

[Partizan]

It only shows how alienated you are from your own people by mocking what is holy to them. The belief in/authenticity of hadiths is another discussion, but one should respect the beliefs of others (even if you find it nonsense yourself) as long as they don't impose it on you.

And I don't see atheist Greeks on this forum making openly fun of the Orthodox beliefs of their believer compatriots. I wished we could do the same.

Agreed. They even defend Orthodoxy against us, politically.

[orangepulp]

Islam does not favor Arabs over non-Arabs:

O people! Your God is one and your forefather (Adam) is one. An Arab is not better than a non-Arab and a non-Arab is not better than an Arab, and a red (i.e. white tinged with red) person is not better than a black person and a black person is not better than a red person, except in piety.

Narrated in Mosnad Ahmad, #22978


Verses in the Quran regarding the Arabs:

The Arabs are the worst in Unbelief and hypocrisy, and most fitted to be in ignorance of the command which Allah hath sent down to His Messenger
[9:97]

The desert Arabs round about you are hypocrites
[9:101]


Regarding the Jews, they were only chosen to convey the message of God, not that they were racially superior. When Jews went astray God took this privilege from them and cursed them many times in the Quran.

[We had already taken the covenant of the Children of Israel and had sent to them messengers. Whenever there came to them a messenger with what their souls did not desire, a groups (of the Messengers) they denied and another party they killed.] - al Maa'idah 5/70

[Cannabis Sativa]

but one should respect the beliefs of others (even if you find it nonsense yourself)

Yok, ben ölüye pamuk tıkayana saygı gösterirsem ölmezden önce bana da pamuk tıkamaya kalkışırlar. O yüzden pamukçulara hoşgörü yok, benden göreceğiniz hoşgörü ancak Timur'un Sivas'a gösterdiği hoşgörü kadardır.

[TheMagnificent]

Still doesn't change that Mohammad claimed Abraham's heritage(which makes Mohammad a Jew too) and superior to your kind. Thus, your prophet also claimed Jewish heritage. Allah is practicing Jewish supremacism in his book however no other nation's name is in the holy Qur'an. I can't kneel in front of Allah promising land to Jews and referring the Jews to the superior species. And you're Sunni as far as i know, can you send me some of your ridicolous hadiths or may i post them myself? Moreover you call other Jewish kings "prophet" and introducing Jewish Kings(Especially Isa-Yeshua) as prophet is a suicide but nothing else.

And that's what i think about your so called holy prophets Bunyamin, David etc...
v
v
V

‎"Yahudi krallarını peygamber diye Türk milletine telkin ederek milli mefahiri unutturmak suretiyle İsrailiyyatı hayat ve ahlak sistemi diye öne sürmek milli bir cinayettir."

-Hüseyin Nihal Atsız-

Muhammad (pbuh) was certainly a Semite by being a descendant of Ismael (pbuh), yes, not a Jew. The Israelites are descendants of Isaac, according to the Islamic teaching.

And no-one is superior to anyone with regard to ethnicity. Only piety, good deeds, determine your status in front of God. I quoted this verse before...


49:13 O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honored of you in the sight of Allah is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).

Abraham (pbuh) in Islamic teaching was a Hanif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanif) by the way, not a Jew.

[TheMagnificent]

Yok, ben ölüye pamuk tıkayana saygı gösterirsem ölmezden önce bana da pamuk tıkamaya kalkışırlar. O yüzden pamukçulara hoşgörü yok, benden göreceğiniz hoşgörü ancak Timur'un Sivas'a gösterdiği hoşgörü kadardır.

Ölünce bana pamuk tikamayin diye vasiyet edersin olur biter.

[orangepulp]

It only shows how alienated you are from your own people by mocking what is holy to them. The belief in/authenticity of hadiths is another discussion, but one should respect the beliefs of others (even if you find it nonsense yourself) as long as they don't impose it on you.



Exactly!!! Very well said. This is exactly what I was trying to show everybody about Onur.

Onur is a very interesting figure. He is a very nationalist and patriotic person, no one defends the Turks as he does but if a Turk is a Muslim he segregates them. His discrimination towards Muslim Turks shows his hypocrisy. No one expects him to adhere to the Islamic fate but at least he should respect his peoples choice of beliefs and not mock them

And I don't see atheist Greeks on this forum making openly fun of the Orthodox beliefs of their believer compatriots. I wished we could do the same.

Another good point. The atheist Greeks don't go around insulting their own peoples religion. At least they are not hypocrites in this regards.

[Cannabis Sativa]

Abraham (pbuh) in Islamic teaching was a Hanif by the way, not a Jew.

Abraham was a Jew, Hanif was his religion. End of the story.

[Cannabis Sativa]

Ölünce bana pamuk tikamayin diye vasiyet edersin olur biter.

Bir de bir şey soracağım, ölen erkek olunca göte parmak yemek hoş bir şey değil be gülüm, hayatım boyunca götü kaptırmadım şu saatten sonra da kaptırmaya niyetim yok. Hayırlısı diyelim şimdiden. Krematoryumların sayısı artar zaten o zamana kadar. Bu arada buraya pamukseverler dolmuş iyiden iyiye, uzun zamandır uğraşmadıydım birazcık uğraşayım akşam gelince.

[Dengizik]

Herkesin götü kendine beyler, sakin.

[Partizan]

Herkesin götü kendine beyler, sakin.

Aynen ya :)

p25GpLu3qbo

[TheMagnificent]

Herkesin götü kendine beyler, sakin.

Aynen! :D We better end this discussion here. Too many vultures around on this forum we would be making happy otherwise.

[Onur]

It only shows how alienated you are from your own people by mocking what is holy to them. The belief in/authenticity of hadiths is another discussion, but one should respect the beliefs of others (even if you find it nonsense yourself) as long as they don't impose it on you.

And I don't see atheist Greeks on this forum making openly fun of the Orthodox beliefs of their believer compatriots. I wished we could do the same.

Agreed. They even defend Orthodoxy against us, politically.
I am sorry, i cant defend islam while i don't believe in any abrahamic religion myself. This would be against my own ideas.

There are people who performs mamba-jumbo, hokes-pokus dances and rituals on top of some fake graves, especially in Eyup, Istanbul in the name of islam. Do you want me to respect to their so-called holy beliefs and remain silent? Sorry, i cant do that either.



The atheist Greeks don't go around insulting their own peoples religion. At least they are not hypocrites in this regards.
They are the hypocrite ones if they support orthodoxy ideas while they dont believe themselves. I would never support something i dont believe. I am a honest person. I wouldn't lie and pretend like "islam is a good thing" just because people in Turkey believe it.

If Greeks are doing like that, then it`s just their hypocrite behavior, not mine.

[orangepulp]

They are the hypocrite ones if they support orthodoxy ideas while they dont believe themselves. I would never support something i dont believe. I am a honest person. I wouldn't lie and pretend like "islam is a good thing" just because people in Turkey believe it.

If Greeks are doing like that, then it`s just their hypocrite behavior, not mine.

Who asks you to defend Islam?? This is not the issue, the issue is you insult Islam and even the Turks who are Muslims. If you were arguing maturely about Islam being a true religion or not that is okay. Problem is you do not respect out choice as Turks and discriminate us for being Muslims yet claim to be patriotic.

[Su]

They are the hypocrite ones if they support orthodoxy ideas while they dont believe themselves. I would never support something i dont believe. I am a honest person. I wouldn't lie and pretend like "islam is a good thing" just because people in Turkey believe it.

If Greeks are doing like that, then it`s just their hypocrite behavior, not mine.

I think what she means is: Even atheist Greeks show respect for fellow Greeks who happened to be Orthodox Christian and they avoid insulting their fellow Greeks due to different believes regarding religion while non-Muslim Turks are passionate about insulting Turkish Muslims which is ODD.

[Su]

@Loki, for the sake of the statistics, can you delete all the votes done by non-Turks in the poll?

[Su]

Hem ayrica sunu fark ettim, Musluman olanlarimiz kafirlerden hangisine nezaman kufur etti? Neden hep kafir Turkler inancli Turklere illaha kufur edecek? Heralde bizim inancli olmamiz kafirleri rahatsiz ediyor, yoksa bizim tarafimizdan bir kufur edilmeden, kafirler hep kufure basliyor.

NOT: Kafir demek Allah inanmayandir.

[Loki]

@Loki, for the sake of the statistics, can you delete all the votes done by non-Turks in the poll?

Will be done :) but you can as well, being a mod :)

Ps: you;re no longer a longer a mod please report the posts :)

[Cannabis Sativa]

Hem ayrica sunu fark ettim, Musluman olanlarimiz kafirlerden hangisine nezaman kufur etti? Neden hep kafir Turkler inancli Turklere illaha kufur edecek? Heralde bizim inancli olmamiz kafirleri rahatsiz ediyor, yoksa bizim tarafimizdan bir kufur edilmeden, kafirler hep kufure basliyor.

NOT: Kafir demek Allah inanmayandir.

Yanlış farketmişsin be gülüm, o kadar da Allahsız değilim. Hele de benim favori surem var. Her zaman kafa güzelken açıp okuyorum.

Kaf Suresi Ayet-7(Diyanet Meali):


Yeryüzünü de yaydık ve orada sabit dağlar yerleştirdik. Orada her türden iç açıcı çift bitkiler bitirdik.

Gördünüz ya işte, yaradanın hikmetinden sual olunmuyor. Ben biraz iç açıcı bitkilerimle uğraşmaya gidiyorum.

[Onur]

I think what she means is: Even atheist Greeks show respect for fellow Greeks who happened to be Orthodox Christian and they avoid insulting their fellow Greeks due to different believes regarding religion while non-Muslim Turks are passionate about insulting Turkish Muslims which is ODD.

Hem ayrica sunu fark ettim, Musluman olanlarimiz kafirlerden hangisine nezaman kufur etti? Neden hep kafir Turkler inancli Turklere illaha kufur edecek? Heralde bizim inancli olmamiz kafirleri rahatsiz ediyor, yoksa bizim tarafimizdan bir kufur edilmeden, kafirler hep kufure basliyor.
Yunan dindarlarla Türkiyedeki dindarları zaten karşılaştıramayız. Yunanistanda en ultra-nationalist kesimler hep dindarlar ve dini görevliler sınıfı olmuştur. Türkiyede ise bunun tam tersi söz konusu. Ne kadar Türklüğü, cumhuriyeti, Atatürk`ü reddeden ve küfür eden kesim varsa hepsi islamcı takımındandır. Yani Yunanistanda din adamları Yunanistan için çalışırken, Türkiyede islamcılar sürekli Türkiye cumhuriyetinin altını oymak için çalışmıştır, bu milli mücadele yıllarından beri böyledir.

Türkiyede islamcılar Yunan askeri işgale geldiğinde onlarla işbirliği yapanlardır;
http://www.delinetciler.net/forum/portal/dosya/32943d1352908016-ixdivisiongreeksandottozs9.jpg/

Orada oturan sarıklılar Yunanla işbirliği yapıp, onlar gittikten sonrada Kubilay`ın kafasını kesen Menemen`li Bülent Arınç`ın dedeleri.


Yunanistanda bir papazın böyle şeyler yaptığını hiçbir zaman duyamazsınız ama Türkiyede islamcılar budur. Bu 1920`lerden beri böyle.

Türkiyede islam, bu cumhuriyet düşmanı hain toplulukların kontrolü altındadır. mesela Yunanistanda ortodoks din adamlarının yetiştirdiği insanlar yunan milliyetçisi olurken, Türkiyede islamcıların propagandasına mazur olan insanlar Anadolucu, kendini "müslüman" diye tanımlayan, Türk-cumhuriyet-Atatürk ve devlet düşmanı olarak yetişir.

Benim islamcı karşıtlığımda bu yüzden, yoksa sizinle bir alakası yok.

[Dandelion]

Another good point. The atheist Greeks don't go around insulting their own peoples religion. At least they are not hypocrites in this regards.

Disagree. Also, you said yourself that any serious Muslim would put his religion before his ethnicity, due to the international nature of religion. I think this also goes for philosophy or irreligiosity. Generally, a religion doesn't belong to a people.
If one seriously dislikes a religion I think a person shouldn't hide it and be honest about it.

Mayhap one wouldn't see an atheist Greek insult Greek-orthdoxy that readily, but to find a Western European insulting Catholicism or Protestantism on the other hand (and even in our pretty much irreligious society abusive bishops (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Vangheluwe) are still protected due to their powerful status, all because people irrationally attribute extra respect to religion). Anyway, wishing for a religion to vanish is a true and honest opinion and not just a gratuit insult.

[Partizan]

Yunan dindarlarla Türkiyedeki dindarları zaten karşılaştıramayız. Yunanistanda en ultra-nationalist kesimler hep dindarlar ve dini görevliler sınıfı olmuştur. Türkiyede ise bunun tam tersi söz konusu. Ne kadar Türklüğü, cumhuriyeti, Atatürk`ü reddeden ve küfür eden kesim varsa hepsi islamcı takımındandır. Yani Yunanistanda din adamları Yunanistan için çalışırken, Türkiyede islamcılar sürekli Türkiye cumhuriyetinin altını oymak için çalışmıştır, bu milli mücadele yıllarından beri böyledir.

Türkiyede islamcılar Yunan askeri işgale geldiğinde onlarla işbirliği yapanlardır;
http://www.delinetciler.net/forum/portal/dosya/32943d1352908016-ixdivisiongreeksandottozs9.jpg/

Orada oturan sarıklılar Yunanla işbirliği yapıp, onlar gittikten sonrada Kubilay`ın kafasını kesen Menemen`li Bülent Arınç`ın dedeleri.


Yunanistanda bir papazın böyle şeyler yaptığını hiçbir zaman duyamazsınız ama Türkiyede islamcılar budur. Bu 1920`lerden beri böyle.

Benim islamcı karşıtlığımda bu yüzden

Yaşar Nuri Öztürk gibi bir yürekten Kemalist'e ne diyeceksin hocam? Ya da Rıfat Börekçi gibi Atatürk'e kalpten bağlı birine?

Bu arada bu da yobaz olarak lanse edilen M.Akif:


''Mısır'da 11 yıl kaldım ama 11 saat daha kalsaydım çıldırırdım..
İnsanlık da Türkiye'de, hürriyet de Türkiye'de!
Eğer varsa, Allah benim ömrümden alıp MUSTAFA KEMAL'e versin.''


…O gün Sultan Ahmet’de bir kahveye oturduk:Ne oluyoruz konuşacaktır.Halbuki o,kabahati yakalanmış çocuk gibi önüne bakıyor,utanıyor,susuyordu,bir aralık gözünden sakalına bir damla çizgi uzandı:Ağlıyordu.

O,ömründe bir tek defa bir saadete vukuundan evvel inandı:İstiklal Zaferine

Doğacaktır Sana Vaadettiği günler hakk’ın,Kim bilir,Bel ki yarın Belki yarından da yakın.

-Bu sefer nasıl inandın?

-Başımızdaki kumandanı kim görse inanırdı! dedi (Mithat Cemal Kuntay -“Mehmet Akif” sayfa:200 )

Ha, gene de Kurtuluş Savaşı konusunda haklısın. Ama şunu da unutmayalım, Vahidettin için "hain" diye bağırılan TBMM'de, o sarıklı din adamları da vardı ve sanırım Diyarbakır mebusu Hacı Şükrü, Vahidettin'i taşa tutmayı bile önermişti.

[Onur]

Yaşar Nuri Öztürk gibi bir yürekten Kemalist'e ne diyeceksin hocam? Ya da Rıfat Börekçi gibi Atatürk'e kalpten bağlı birine?

Bu arada bu da yobaz olarak lanse edilen M.Akif:
Onlar üniversitelerden yetişmiş çok küçük bir azınlık. Zaten Türkiyedeki islamcı kesim Yaşar Nuri`den falan nefret eder. Türkiyedeki islami kesimin büyük çoğunluğu cumhuriyet düşmanıdır.

Zaten ben illa kemalist olsunlar demiyorum. Cumhuriyetin altını oymasınlar yeter, ama durum böyle değil.

Ben sana cumhuriyet düşmanı 1000`lerce islamcı örnek sayarım Türkiyeden. Sen bana Yunanistandan bir tane 1821`de kurulan Yunan devletine düşman papaz göster, "evet haklısın" diyeceğim sana, ama bir örnek bile gösteremezsin.


Al bir örnek daha. Türkiyede islamcı budur;
http://img03.blogcu.com/images/a/h/m/ahmetdursun374/a603db34d0b447b66f4efacdaa0cea3e_1322696364.jpg

İstersen bu başlığın altını doldurabilirim bu tip örneklerle.

[Hoca]

Ilk once Turkluk. Ondan sonra Islamcilik. Ilk once muslumanim diyenler zaten hainlik vardir.

[Dandelion]

ps. geez means Jesus, you traitor :D

I remember reading The Chosen by Chaim Potok once. Apparently even Orthodox Jews say 'Jesus' as an interjection of annoyance.

[Partizan]

Onlar üniversitelerden yetişmiş çok küçük bir azınlık. Zaten Türkiyedeki islamcı kesim Yaşar Nuri`den falan nefret eder. Türkiyedeki islami kesimin büyük çoğunluğu cumhuriyet düşmanıdır.

Zaten ben illa kemalist olsunlar demiyorum. Cumhuriyetin altını oymasınlar yeter, ama durum böyle değil.

Ben sana cumhuriyet düşmanı 1000`lerce islamcı örnek sayarım Türkiyeden. Sen bana Yunanistandan bir tane 1821`de kurulan Yunan devletine düşman papaz göster, "evet haklısın" diyeceğim sana, ama bir örnek bile gösteremezsin.


Al bir örnek daha. Türkiyede islamcı budur;
http://img03.blogcu.com/images/a/h/m/ahmetdursun374/a603db34d0b447b66f4efacdaa0cea3e_1322696364.jpg

İstersen bu başlığın altını doldurabilirim bu tip örneklerle.

Yok yani hocam, hain İskilipli gibiler yüzünden "İslam"ı topa tutmak yanlış yani. İslamcılığı istediğin kadar itin bir yerine sok çıkart, lafım yok. Ama karşında ecnebi varsa hiç değilse olumsuz birşey söyleme ya da, "he ikisine de inanmıyorum da hıristiyanlık çok mu iyi" diye laf sok(bunu yaptığın da oluyor gerçi, onu takdir ediyorum).

[Partizan]

Deleted non-Turkish votes(their names still appear though, you can see Balkanites who defend kebab! :D)

[Cannabis Sativa]

Ben sana cumhuriyet düşmanı 1000`lerce islamcı örnek sayarım Türkiyeden. Sen bana Yunanistandan bir tane 1821`de kurulan Yunan devletine düşman papaz göster, "evet haklısın" diyeceğim sana, ama bir örnek bile gösteremezsin.

Ben sana burada göstereyim örneklerini, uzağa gitmeye gerek yok. Türkiye'de özgürlüğümü yaşayamıyorum diye Arap ülkesine kaçanı bile var hatta. Başları dara girdiğinde 1.5 milyar inananı olan bir dini nasıl aşağılarsın diye müdafaa ediyorlar, bokun üstüne de milyar küsür sinek konuyor tabii ki onu da bilimsel olarak açıklayamazlar.

[Hoca]

Sen Turkceyi nasil biliyorsun?

[Böri]

Muslim first, then Turkish. Muslim Turks are like tribe, the ummah is the nation. If I say Turk first then Muslim, this means a non-Muslim Turkish closer than non-Turkish Muslim and saying this not very correct Islamically. Arab imam of Mecca closer to me than to Aziz Nesin or Nazım Hikmet (Turkish atheists)

[poiuytrewq0987]

Given how Turkish identity is centered around Islamism, it doesn't make sense for Turks to be Turkish first and Muslim second. A great majority of Turks (90%) do not descend from Turkic invaders from the Altay. That's not to claim they don't have Asiatic blood because they do but in a heavily diluted form.

[DarkSecret]

Human>Turk>Secular>Muslim

[Ryujin]

Given how Turkish identity is centered around Islamism

Source

[alb0zfinest]

Honestly way too many Turks chose 1 and 3. Here I am thinking they are irreligious.

[Profileid]

"Making an ‘O’ with your thumb and forefinger (as if to say “OK!”) is rude because you are making the gesture for a hole - which has connotations referring to homosexuality in the Turkish psyche."
http://wikitravel.org/en/Turkey#Respect

lol turkey

[poiuytrewq0987]

Source

Only 10% of the Turkish population are directly descended from the Turkic invaders (going by paternal haplogroup statistics) so it makes sense that the Turkish identity is centered around Islamism because there's no other glue.

[Ryujin]

Only 10% of the Turkish population are directly descended from the Turkic invaders (going by paternal haplogroup statistics) so it makes sense that the Turkish identity is centered around Islamism because there's no other glue.

Do you know what the term stands for? your posts are so retarded no wonder you look like one anyway

[Böri]

The question of Loki isnt directed to all Turks or to all citizens of the Rep of Turkey. He refers to Turks who are Muslims. Also I don't understand the thumbs down to my previous post. it's my personal view. I don't say everyone must think the same way. I don't impose it on anyone, I also don't care what others would think about. I am guardian of my own soul and it's my choice.

[Böri]

Only 10% of the Turkish population are directly descended from the Turkic invaders (going by paternal haplogroup statistics) so it makes sense that the Turkish identity is centered around Islamism because there's no other glue.

This is wrong. All Oghuz people who came from Central Asia were Turkic and they were circa 70% Caucasian as they left East of Caspian to come here a thousand years ago. Two thousands years ago Turks were in Altay. What happened with Scythians was heavier than what happent with native Anatolians.

[Böri]

Honestly way too many Turks chose 1 and 3. Here I am thinking they are irreligious.

Being a Turk plays also for me of course, it's racial similarity. But it's not everything. Option 2 means as a Turk you feel closer to an Atheist Turk than to a Muslim other, it's Islamically problem. I also feel closer to other Turks than to other Muslims but if only the Turk is Muslim.

[Pennywise]

"Making an ‘O’ with your thumb and forefinger (as if to say “OK!”) is rude because you are making the gesture for a hole - which has connotations referring to homosexuality in the Turkish psyche."
http://wikitravel.org/en/Turkey#Respect

lol turkey

what it has to do with the thread and what is so "funny" about it?

[DarkSecret]

"Making an ‘O’ with your thumb and forefinger (as if to say “OK!”) is rude because you are making the gesture for a hole - which has connotations referring to homosexuality in the Turkish psyche."
http://wikitravel.org/en/Turkey#Respect

lol turkey

Yes true it means ball and ball means homo.

[Pennywise]

Yes true it means ball and ball means homo.

no, "top" is referring to transsexuality, not homosexuality.

[DarkSecret]

no, "top" is referring to transsexuality, not homosexuality.

Sure...

[poiuytrewq0987]

This is wrong. All Oghuz people who came from Central Asia were Turkic and they were circa 70% Caucasian as they left East of Caspian to come here a thousand years ago. Two thousands years ago Turks were in Altay. What happened with Scythians was heavier than what happent with native Anatolians.

Central Asia was already a mixed region populated by Scythians, Arabs and Persians before the Turkic peoples arrived from Mongolia/China. The ORIGINAL Turkics carried Asiatic haplogroups, not Central Asian haplogroups like R1a, which is Iranic. My point I tried to make was that only 10% of Turks of Turkey are directly descended from Turkics of Mongolia/China going by haplogroup data. That means a population of 5-10 million out of 70 million.