last names

[Aunt Hilda]

where would you think these last names are from If you didn't know the ethnic background of the person


Sudeikis
Birbalaite
Genovaite
Pilypaitis
Levinis
Mileskaite
Petrosius
Lotuzys
Dacka

all of them are lithaunian

[Methmatician]

Some of them look Greek.

[Scholarios]

Sudeikis is 100% Lithuanian
Lotuzys is also?

[Baldur]

lithuanians , but then i happen to know how lithuanian lastnames look like too.

[Aunt Hilda]

Sudeikis is 100% Lithuanian
Lotuzys is also?

yeah, proper spelling would be Lotužys


lithuanians , but then i happen to know how lithuanian lastnames look like too.
you're cheating :p

where would you put them if you didn't know?

[bella1407]

where would you think these last names are from If you didn't know the ethnic background of the person


Sudeikis
Birbalaite
Genovaite
Pilypaitis
Levinis
Mileskaite
Petrosius
Lotuzys
Dackaall of them are lithaunian

Levinis sounds jewish(Levin,Levinson,Levitin...)

[Aunt Hilda]

Levinis sounds jewish(Levin,Levinson,Levitin...)

probably, a lithuanian version of a jewish last name

[bella1407]

where would you think these last names are from If you didn't know the ethnic background of the person


Sudeikis
Birbalaite
Genovaite
Pilypaitis
Levinis
Mileskaite
Petrosius
Lotuzys
Dacka

all of them are lithaunian

from Lithuania or Latvia.
Do u lave Lithuanian last name, Migla?

[Mistel]

The surnames ending in "aite" I would assume are Lithuanian, since I know that is Lithuanian, but maybe I would think Sudeikis and Pilypaitis were Greek. I am not so sure about Lotuzys and Dacka.

[bella1407]

probably, a lithuanian version of a jewish last name

or not:)
because in Poland they have last name non-jewish Lewandowski

[Aunt Hilda]

Do u have Lithuanian last name, Migla?

nope


or not:)
because in Poland they have the last name non-jewish Lewandowski

at the end of the day, its the ending that counts

[bella1407]

The surnames ending in "aite" I would assume are Lithuanian, since I know that is Lithuanian, but maybe I would think Sudeikis and Pilypaitis were Greek. I am not so sure about Lotuzys and Dacka.

"aite" - female
"s"- male (if i am not mistaken :D)

[bella1407]

nope

good for u, coz it's difficult to pronounce lithuanian last names

[Aunt Hilda]

"aite" - female
"s"- male (if i am not mistaken :D)
aye,

Lotuzys and Dacka are the most confusing ones, could they fit into belarus?

[bella1407]

aye,

Lotuzys and Dacka are the most confusing ones, could they fit into belarus?

no.
Lotuzys sounds lithuanian or latvian.
Dacka(i guess its pron. "datska":confused:?) sounds strange..

[SkyBurn]

There's that actor, Jason Sudeikis, and it says that he's of some Lithuanian descent, so that's a pretty good indicator

[Baldur]

In Sweden there are 3,717 persons with the lastname Levin and i doubt they all are jewish.

[bella1407]

In Sweden there are 3,717 persons with the lastname Levin and i doubt they all are jewish.

i know 3 families with lastname Levin - all are jewish.

[Aunt Hilda]

In Sweden there are 3,717 persons with the lastname Levin and i doubt they all are jewish.

Levinis is one of my family names, does that mean I could be partly swedish :p


i know 3 families with lastname Levin - all are jewish.

or jewish :p

[Baldur]

i know 3 families with lastname Levin - all are jewish.

http://sv.geneanet.org/slaktforskning/sv/levin.html

[bella1407]

http://sv.geneanet.org/slaktforskning/sv/levin.html

jews:p

[Linet]

I also though Greek :rose: before to read about Lithouanian...

[Aunt Hilda]

no.
Dacka(i guess its pron. "datska":confused:?) sounds strange..

dacka could be related to Duch an archaic word for german

[SkyBurn]

Levin is a Jewish surname. So is Levine, and Levkovits, and a lot of names starting with "Lev" (which is actually a hebrew first name, it means heart)

[Aunt Hilda]

Levin is a Jewish surname. So is Levine, and Levkovits, and a lot of names starting with "Lev" (which is actually a hebrew first name, it means heart)

you literally just made one of my dreams come true

[bella1407]

Levin is a Jewish surname. So is Levine, and Levkovits, and a lot of names starting with "Lev" (which is actually a hebrew first name, it means heart)

I Always Knew It:D

[Baldur]

The funniest name in Sweden then must be Israelsson...

[Aunt Hilda]

here is another list, what do you guys think?

Steinis
Grybaitis
Povarpis
Mitulis
Ragauskas
Monividas
Juodis
Korigelis
Krungolcas
Araminas
Rimdzius
Kysgalis
Riauba
Lankielis
Sakalauskas
Landsbergis
Simkus

[Twistedmind]

Levin is a Jewish surname. So is Levine, and Levkovits, and a lot of names starting with "Lev" (which is actually a hebrew first name, it means heart)

Lev is also Russian name, and means Leon. Levković/Levkovič is not derived from Jewish word. It is Slavic surname sometimes used by Jews. :picard1: Levin also could be Russian name, like guy from Anna Karenina.

[Aunt Hilda]

Lev is also Russian name, and means Leon. Levković/Levkovič is not derived from Jewish word. It is Slavic surname sometimes used by Jews. :picard1: Levin also could be Russian name, like guy from Anna Karenina.

considering that its spread out in the area, I think we can safely asume that we don't know the origin

[Twistedmind]

considering that its spread out in the area, I think we can safely asume that we don't know the origin

What you mean?
Levković is Serbian/Croatian surname, also encountered among Ruthenian nobility, hence Jews picked it up. Levin is Russian surname. -suffixes are typically Slavic, much more Slavs had such surnames. I dont know origin of Levine, but so far Slavic surnames are concerned, I am absolutley sure in my words.

[Aunt Hilda]

What you mean?
Levković is Serbian/Croatian surname, also encountered among Ruthenian nobility, hence Jews picked it up. Levin is Russian surname. -suffixes are typically Slavic, much more Slavs had such surnames. I dont know origin of Levine, but so far Slavic surnames are concerned, I am absolutley sure in my words.

swedes have that name as well.....:picard2:

[Twistedmind]

swedes have that name as well.....:picard2:

Off different origin :picard2::picard1:


Русская фамилия Левин образована от отчества из крестильного имени Лев и его производных форм. Это имя, пусть и не часто, применялось в крестьянской среде, давалось священниками. Левин, Левков и другие фамилии от различных кратких форм этого имени имени. Левищев от формы Левище, подобные формы в старину имени уменьшительное значение. Левичев от левич — «сын Льва», а левичев получается его внук. Фамилии Львин, Львовский и определённое число фамилий Львов созданы искусственно в семинарской среде и восходят не к христианскому личному имени Лев, а непосредственно к нарицательному лев (в христианской религии лев — символ святого Марка Евангелиста), а названия животных, не известных на Руси, не употреблялись в качестве прозвищ
Russian family Levin was forme from Patronim of baptizmal name Lev and its pett forms. That name, altough rare in peasant circles, was used for priests. Levin, Levkov and other surnames from various forms of name. Levischev from form Levische, similar forms in ancient times had diminutive conotation. Levičev is from Levich, son of Lev, was givven to Levs grandson. Surnames L'vin annd L'vovskiy and definite form L'vov were artificialy created among seminarians andwere not deducted from chrisitan name, but from name of specie itelf (Symbol of St Mark the Evangelist).

[Aunt Hilda]

Off different origin :picard2::picard1:
levinson Doesn't sound that foreign to sweden, then again I'm not swedish so what do i know



Русская фамилия Левин образована от отчества из крестильного имени Лев и его производных форм. Это имя, пусть и не часто, применялось в крестьянской среде, давалось священниками. Левин, Левков и другие фамилии от различных кратких форм этого имени имени. Левищев от формы Левище, подобные формы в старину имени уменьшительное значение. Левичев от левич — «сын Льва», а левичев получается его внук. Фамилии Львин, Львовский и определённое число фамилий Львов созданы искусственно в семинарской среде и восходят не к христианскому личному имени Лев, а непосредственно к нарицательному лев (в христианской религии лев — символ святого Марка Евангелиста), а названия животных, не известных на Руси, не употреблялись в качестве прозвищ. Лев. Левченко — украинская фамилия. Впрочем, некоторые фамилии могут быть связаны со словом левый, левша
I have no clue what any of that means :picard2::picard1:



anyway

so about these names


Steinis
Grybaitis
Povarpis
Mitulis
Ragauskas
Monividas
Juodis
Korigelis
Krungolcas
Araminas
Rimdzius
Kysgalis
Riauba
Lankielis
Sakalauskas
Landsbergis
Simkus



what do you think?

[Twistedmind]

I have no clue what any of that means :picard2::picard1:

I translated it ;)

[bella1407]

Lev is also Russian name, and means Leon. Levković/Levkovič is not derived from Jewish word. It is Slavic surname sometimes used by Jews. :picard1: Levin also could be Russian name, like guy from Anna Karenina.

The guy from Anna Karenina is Лёвин( letter ё doesn't exist in English.).
Yeah, Lev means leon. "Leo" Tolstoy is actually Lev Tolstoy.:D
In Russia Levin is a jewish last name.

[bella1407]

anyway

so about these names


Steinis
Grybaitis
Povarpis
Mitulis
Ragauskas
Monividas
Juodis
Korigelis
Krungolcas
Araminas
Rimdzius
Kysgalis
Riauba
Lankielis
Sakalauskas
Landsbergis
Simkus



what do you think?

"s" and "s" : Latvian or Lithuanian:D

[bella1407]

What you mean?
Levković is Serbian/Croatian surname, also encountered among Ruthenian nobility, hence Jews picked it up. Levin is Russian surname. -suffixes are typically Slavic, much more Slavs had such surnames. I dont know origin of Levine, but so far Slavic surnames are concerned, I am absolutley sure in my words.

Levin =Levine
(like Stalin in fremch is Staline, Lenin- Lenine)

[Twistedmind]

The guy from Anna Karenina is Лёвин( letter ё doesn't exist in English.).
Yeah, Lev means leon. "Leo" Tolstoy is actually Lev Tolstoy.:D
In Russia Levin is a jewish last name.

Bella, I know Russian and I know for ё/е distinction. :) But in transcription in English it is same. :) Look at text I pasted from Russian wiki. :)

[inactive_member]

Steinis
Grybaitis
Povarpis
Mitulis
Ragauskas
Monividas
Juodis
Korigelis
Krungolcas
Araminas
Rimdzius
Kysgalis
Riauba
Lankielis
Sakalauskas
Landsbergis
Simkus



what do you think?

Exotic. :rolleyes:

[bella1407]

Bella, I know Russian and I know for ё/е distinction. :) But in transcription in English it is same. :) Look at text I pasted from Russian wiki. :)
:picard1:
because "ё" doesn't exist in English! Gorbachev is actually Gorbachёv, Khrushchev -Khrushchёv etc.

Levin and Lёvin Two Completely Different last names!

[Twistedmind]

Steinis
Grybaitis
Povarpis
Mitulis
Ragauskas
Monividas
Juodis
Korigelis
Krungolcas
Araminas
Rimdzius
Kysgalis
Riauba
Lankielis
Sakalauskas
Landsbergis
Simkus



what do you think?
Some are of German/Swedish origin, some Slavic (Russin, Polish or Ruthenian)
origin.
Sakaluskas - Sokolovski, Ragauskas - Ragovski, Steinis - Stein. Rest are I guess Lithuanian.

[bella1407]

what do u think about these names ?
Kramnik
Guralnik
Melnik
Lennik

[Austo]

what do u think about these names ?
Kramnik
Guralnik
Melnik
Lennik

1 Polish
2 Hispanic
3 Polish

no idea about the last one

[Twistedmind]

what do u think about these names ?
Kramnik
Guralnik
Melnik
Lennik

All sufixes are Slavic, shame Cail got banned, he would know this better. You are probably aware how much words with ending -nik all of us have. :)

Kramnik
http://www.ufolog.ru/names/order/%D0%9A%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BC%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA

Melnik (Мельник) is Ukrainian, one of UNA commanders had such name.
In fact I think all are of Ukrainian origin, since Russian families had standardsied endings -ov, -ev, -ovskiy, -in.

[bella1407]

1 Polish
2 Hispanic
3 Polish

no idea about the last one

the last one is the last name of our(Russia's) first lady.
why hispanic?

[Twistedmind]

:picard1:
because "ё" doesn't exist in English! Gorbachev is actually Gorbachёv, Khrushchev -Khrushchёv etc.

Levin and Lёvin Two Completely Different last names!

It is about stressing. Most people writtie it as e. Same as with o under stress (o) and without it a. :)

[Austo]

the last one is the last name of our(Russia's) first lady.
why hispanic?

just hear the sound of it. nothing slavic about it.

I am 100% shure that Guralnik is spanish(hispanic) last name.

[Twistedmind]

just hear the sound of it. nothing slavic about it.

I am 100% shure that Guralnik is spanish(hispanic) last name.

Nope it is Ukrainian, it means man who makes liquors.


Bela will undesrand this:

Происхождение фамилии Гуральник
Доступные сведения о фамилии Гуральник



Фамилия Гуральник ведет свое начало от прозвища Гуральник. Прозвище Гуральник в переводе с украинского означает «винокур», то есть винодел – человек, изготовляющий спиртные напитки. Таким, образом, фамилия Гуральник представляет собой пример именования по профессии.

[Austo]

Nope it is Ukrainian, it means man who makes liquors.

:

Source?

[Twistedmind]

Source?

http://www.ufolog.ru/names/order/%D0%93%D1%83%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D0%B8%D 0%BA

[bella1407]

just hear the sound of it. nothing slavic about it
agree.

I am 100% shure that[B] Guralnik is spanish(hispanic) last name.

Really?Well Guralnik is last name of my uncle(aunt's husband).He is a jew:D.

[Austo]

http://www.ufolog.ru/names/order/%D0%93%D1%83%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%8C%D0%BD%D0%B8%D 0%BA

This site says something else :

http://worldnames.publicprofiler.org/Default.aspx

[bella1407]

Twistedmind is right about Melnik:). Melnik (Мельник) is Ukrainian last name means "miller" :). We have Melnikov(-a) in Russia. My best friend's last name is Melnikova.

[Veneda]

what do u think about these names ?
Kramnik
Guralnik
Melnik
Lennik

Kramnik (http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/kramnik.html) - 32 people in Poland have such name, so rather non Polish origin

Guralnik - doesn't exist in Poland, Góralnik (http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/g%25C3%25B3ralnik.html) ('u' and 'ó' sound the same in Polish) - there are only 4 persons, so the name is not Polish

Melnik (http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/melnik.html) or rather in the form Mielnik (http://www.moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/mielnik.html) - can be Polish

Lennik - such name does not exist in the register of Polish names

[bella1407]

Kramnik is also a jewish last name. Famous Russian chessplayer Vladimir Kramnik(jew:))http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vladimir_Kramnik

[Twistedmind]

This site says something else :

http://worldnames.publicprofiler.org/Default.aspx

Well, I am sure in Russian, espcially since Gural'nik have meaning in Ukrainian language. :) Root (Gural') possibly could be of non-Slavic origin, but suffix is Slavic, and it is word from one Slavic language. Russian Ashkenazim used mostly Russian names (altough offten verry specific), same like German had German, and Polish ones Polish.

[Skomand]

There is not just one form of Lithuanian surnames, they are declined!!.

adult male: MISTER RIMKUS

RIMKUS
RIMKAUS
RIMKUI
RIMKų
RIMKUMI
RIMKUJE
RIMKAU

young male: RIMKUS Junior

N. Rimkūnas, Rimkaitis
G. Rimkūno, Rimkaičio
D. Rimkūnui, Rimkaičiui
A. Rimkūną, Rimkaitį
I. Rimkūnu, Rimkaičiu
L. Rimkūne, Rimkaityje
V. Rimkūnai! Rimkaiti!

married woman: MRS RIMKUS

Rimkuvienė, Rimkuvienės, Rimkuvienei, Rimkuvienę, Rimkuviene, Rimkuvienėje, Rimkuviene

unmarried woman: MISS RIMKUS

Rimkutė, Rimkutės, Rimkutei, Rimkutę, Rimkute, Rimkutėje, Rimkute

This is 28 endings in the singular alone. Since there is also plural, you must double this and you will get 56 forms of a Lithuanian name.

As I'm blessed myself with a Prussian-Lithuanian name I can add the dual forms (for pairs of people), which unfortunately have not preserved all 7 cases of Lithuanian but are reduced to four cases each: this is another 16 forms.

Which leaves me with a total of 72 forms of my name.

[Austo]

Well, I am sure in Russian, espcially since Gural'nik have meaning in Ukrainian language. :) Root (Gural') possibly could be of non-Slavic origin, but suffix is Slavic, and it is word from one Slavic language. Russian Ashkenazim used mostly Russian names (altough offten verry specific), same like German had German, and Polish ones Polish.

But here we are not talking about Gural'nik, we are talking about Guralnik.

[Twistedmind]

But here we are not talking about Gural'nik, we are talking about Guralnik.

Well, when Ukrainian Гуральник is usually transcribed as Guralnik, altugh more correct yould be Gural'nik or Guraljnik or Guralynik :) Ask any Spanish member, I doubt they know someone with such name. Anyway, all names Bella posted had meaning of some kind of craftsmen in Ukrainian, since Jews were offten craftsmen it is no surprise some fo them ended with such names.

[bella1407]

But here we are not talking about Gural'nik, we are talking about Guralnik.

in Russian Гуральник letter ь doesn't exist in English.

[Austo]

Well, when Ukrainian Гуральник is usually transcribed as Guralnik, altugh more correct yould be Gural'nik or Guraljnik or Guralynik :) Ask any Spanish member, I doubt they know someone with such name.

Still. Guralnik is of spanish/hispanic heritage my friend :)

[bella1407]

Still. Guralnik is of spanish/hispanic heritage my friend :)
what about my uncle Joseph Guralnik?:D He is a JEW.

[Sikeliot]

Some of them do look Greek.

[Twistedmind]

what about my uncle Joseph Guralnik?:D He is a JEW.

Descendant of Ukrainian Jew, who was distilling drink for living. ;)

[Austo]

what about my uncle Joseph Guralnik?:D He is a JEW.

maybe he had 100 years back a hispanic anchestor, and the name survived.

How should i know.

[Sikeliot]

What you mean?
Levković is Serbian/Croatian surname, also encountered among Ruthenian nobility, hence Jews picked it up. Levin is Russian surname. -suffixes are typically Slavic, much more Slavs had such surnames. I dont know origin of Levine, but so far Slavic surnames are concerned, I am absolutley sure in my words.

Levin is a Slavicized version of Levy.

[bella1407]

Some of them do look Greek.

Which one? Linnik maybe:confused:

[Twistedmind]

Levin is a Slavicized version of Levy.

Not at all. It is derived from male name Lev (translation of Greek Leon). Due stressing it is pronounced as Lyovin, that confused Bella.

[bella1407]

maybe he had 100 years back a hispanic anchestor, and the name survived.

How should i know.

lol. -nik is atypical "for hispanic anchestor":D

[bella1407]

Not at all. It is derived from male name Lev. Due stressing it is pronounced as Lyovin, that confused Bella.
:picard1:

[Sikeliot]

Not at all. It is derived from male name Lev. Due stressing it is pronounced as Lyovin, that confused Bella.

Well everyone I know with the last name Levin is Jewish.

[Twistedmind]

Well everyone I know with the last name Levin is Jewish.

Different origins. Russian name was used for priests. Jews could not be Orthodox priests. Also Levin from Anna Karenina was rich noble, not Jew.

[Sikeliot]

Different origins. Russian name was used for priests. Jews could not be Orthodox priests. Also Levin from Anna Karenian was rich noble, not Jew.

Well I'll also add everyone I've ever met with the first name Lev has been Jewish too .

[bella1407]

Different origins. Russian name was used for priests. Jews could not be Orthodox priests. Also Levin from Anna Karenina was rich noble, not Jew.

:picard1:
Lёvin, not Levin.

[Aunt Hilda]

Some are of German/Swedish origin, some Slavic (Russin, Polish or Ruthenian)
origin.
Sakaluskas - Sokolovski, Ragauskas - Ragovski, Steinis - Stein. Rest are I guess Lithuanian.

Sakaluskas - Sokolovski ( nope, based on sakalas(lith. eagle)
Ragauskas - Ragovski (nope, based on Ragas (lith. Horn)
Steinis - Stein (probably, thats not the point, I was asking what you the spelling made you think of the name, not what the origin is :picard1:)

[Twistedmind]

Well I'll also add everyone I've ever met with the first name Lev has been Jewish too .
You dont live in Russia for start
:picard2:
Lev Tolstoy. not Jew.
Lev of Galicia. not Jew
Lev Gumilev. Not Jew.
Look at Wikipedia, it is as Jewish name as Albert.

[bella1407]

Well I'll also add everyone I've ever met with the first name Lev has been Jewish too .

Lev Tolstoy was Russian.:p

[Twistedmind]

:picard1:
Lёvin, not Levin.

http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9B%D0%B5%D0%B2%D0%B8%D0%BD_%28%D1%84%D0%B0%D0% BC%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B8%D1%8F%29
Look verry carefully who is on end under:
Вымышленные персонажи

[Twistedmind]

Sakaluskas - Sokolovski ( nope, based on sakalas(lith. eagle)
All Lithuanian names on -uskas are derived from Slavic on ovski. And it is sokol in Slavic languages (remember, our languages are closely related). Just slight correction it is hawk not eagle.



Ragauskas - Ragovski (nope, based on Ragas (lith. Horn)
In Slavic languages horn is rog. And again -uskas.

As you know, Lithuania was in personal union with Poland for hundreds of years, and many nobles got Polonized, so it is not strange to encounter family names of Slavic origin.



Steinis - Stein (probably, thats not the point, I was asking what you the spelling made you think of the name, not what the origin is :picard1:)
Made me think about hawk and horns? Are you staisfied?

[bella1407]

Stein sounds jewish.

[Veneda]

Sakaluskas - Sokolovski ( nope, based on sakalas(lith. eagle)
Ragauskas - Ragovski (nope, based on Ragas (lith. Horn)
Steinis - Stein (probably, thats not the point, I was asking what you the spelling made you think of the name, not what the origin is :picard1:)

Sokolovski - from 'sokol' - falcon, hawk in all Slavic languages
Ragovski - from 'rag/rog' - horn in all Slavic languages

[Aunt Hilda]

Sokolovski - from 'sokol' - falcon, hawk in all Slavic languages
Ragovski - from 'rag/rog' - horn in all Slavic languages

isn't it just as likely those names evolved simultaneously.
in particular because of the affix as in Sakalauskas, Ragauskas is exclusively feature of the baltic languages, it would make sense since lithuanian last names evolved during the XVI - XVIII centuries, while in neighbouring poland it was XVIII–XIX centuries


Generally speaking slavic borrowings can have the ending askas but they are generally reserved for surnames that stated to evolve from nicknames like Vasiliáskas

[Twistedmind]

isn't it just as likely those names evolved simultaneously.
in particular because of the affix as in Sakalauskas, Ragauskas is exclusively feature of the baltic languages, it would make sense since lithuanian last names evolved during the XVI - XVIII centuries, while in neighbouring poland it was XVIII–XIX centuries

Generally speaking slavic borrowings are can have the ending askas but they are generally reserved for surnames that stated to evolve from nicknames like Vasiliáskas

I dont remmeber any surname of Lithauanian Grand Dukes ;).
Anyway, like I said surnames on uskas were Lithuanian versions of Polish and Russian surnames on ovski/ovskiy. Kazlauskas is Koslovski etc. Kozel is goat in Russian, I believe Poles have verry similar word.

[Aunt Hilda]

I dont remmeber any surname of Lithauanian Grand Dukes ;).
Anyway, like I said surnames on uskas were Lithuanian versions of Polish and Russian surnames on ovski/ovskiy

lithuania was part of poland(in theory they both were equal but we know thats nonsense), polish kings were the grand dukes in XVI - XVIII.



I dont remmeber any surname of Lithauanian Grand Dukes ;).
Anyway, like I said surnames on uskas were Lithuanian versions of Polish and Russian surnames on ovski/ovskiy

there are many suffixes of Slavic origin , like -auskas, -avičius, -evičius,

the suffixes were the product of the Polonization of the population

[Aunt Hilda]

Kazlauskas is Koslovski etc. Kozel is goat in Russian, I believe Poles have verry similar word.

names like Kazláuskas start appearing in XVII century documents, they were translations of nicknames, Kazláuskas is based in Ožys, Ožẽlis

[Austo]

Stein sounds jewish.

why?

It is the german word for stone.

Many people in the german speaking area have this last name.

[bella1407]

why?

It is the german word for stone.

Many people in the german speaking area have this last name.

thank for the info.:rolleyes:

[Aunt Hilda]

All Lithuanian names on -uskas are derived from Slavic on ovski. And it is sokol in Slavic languages (remember, our languages are closely related). Just slight correction it is hawk not eagle.


In Slavic languages horn is rog. And again -uskas.

but its Sakalauskas and ragauskas not sokolauskas or Rogauskas



As you know, Lithuania was in personal union with Poland for hundreds of years, and many nobles got Polonized, so it is not strange to encounter family names of Slavic origin.


I'm surprised there aren't more, to be honest





Made me think about hawk and horns? Are you staisfied?
Stein made you think of that?:rolleyes:

[Veneda]

names like Kazláuskas start appearing in XVII century documents, they were translations of nicknames, Kazláuskas is based in Ožys, Ožẽlis
Polish surname Kozlowski (http://www.houseofnames.com/Kozlowski-history?A=54323-292) begins to appear in documents much earlier, in XIVth century (1370).
http://www.genealogia.okiem.pl/kozlowski.htm

[Aunt Hilda]

Polish surname Kozlowski (http://www.houseofnames.com/Kozlowski-history?A=54323-292) begins to appear in documents much earlier, in XIVth century (1370).
http://www.genealogia.okiem.pl/kozlowski.htm

not in lithuania it doesn't, at least not on a noticeable scale

[Twistedmind]

but its Sakalauskas and ragauskas not sokolauskas or Rogauskas

That surnames got lithuanized. For ilustration, Greek Γεώργιος (Georgios) in English become George (with quite different pronounciation). When words are going from one language to other, there are numerous changes. ;) That is one of basic things to know in linguistics.




Stein made you think of that?:rolleyes:
Not, Sakalauskas and Ragauskas did. :bored:

[Veneda]

not in lithuania it doesn't, at least not on a noticeable scale
Sure, Kozlowski surname origin predates the Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth :)

[Aunt Hilda]

That surnames got lithuanized. For ilustration, Greek Γεώργιος (Georgios) in English become George (with quite different pronounciation). When words are going from one language to other, there are numerous changes. ;) That is one of basic things to know in linguistics.


sakalas and ragas are not loan words but share a common origin with sokol and rog, you know the balto-slavic thing

[Twistedmind]

sakalas and ragas are not loan words but share a common origin with sokol and rog

Yes, but surname endings on uskas usually point on Slavic origin of surnames. Since verry similar sounding words, of same meaning and origin existed in Lithuanian it was easy to be changed in such way. :) Anyway, it is not big deal. It was happening in entire Europe. Scotish Sinclaire is of French origin (Saint Claire).

[Veneda]

but its Sakalauskas and ragauskas not sokolauskas or Rogauskas
The difference between 'sakal'-'sokol' and 'rag'-'rog' can be the result of Slavic linguistic feature called 'akanie', ie. pronunciation the vowel 'o' as 'a'.

[Aunt Hilda]

Yes, but surname endings on uskas usually point on Slavic origin of surnames. :) Anyway, it is not big deal. It was happening in entire Europe. Scotish Sinclaire is of French origin (Saint Claire).

the ending auskas, is the product of Polonization of the population, not migration. (remember the feudal system was still in practice at the time)


Yes, but surname endings on uskas usually point on Slavic origin of surnames. Since verry similar sounding words, of same meaning and origin existed in Lithuanian it was easy to be changed in such way. :)
makes sense.


The difference between 'sakal'-'sokol' and 'rag'-'rog' can be the result of Slavic linguistic feature called 'akanie', ie. pronunciation the vowel 'o' as 'a'.
thats not supported by linguistic research (waterbody names show that it must be a common origin, rather a loan word)

[Twistedmind]

the ending auskas, is the product of Polonization of the population, not migration. (remember the feudal system was still in practice at the time)

I said surname was of Slavic origin. I dont know how it arrived in Poland. Anyway, nobles themselves were Polonized, and before that Ruthenised. Remember, it was Lithuanian dinasty which captured Rus' cities and latter got elected on Polish throne. It was not forcefull, rather assimilation of Lithuanian Nobility into Polish. For their part it was voluntary.

[Aunt Hilda]

I said surname was of Slavic origin.
nope
http://www.lki.lt/LKI_LT/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=330&Itemid=22




I dont know how it arrived in Poland.
Its highly unlikely it 'arrived' in poland, The most likely senario, is that it came about simultaneously


Anyway, nobles themselves were Polonized, and before that Ruthenised. Remember, it was Lithuanian dinasty which captured Rus' cities and latter got elected on Polish throne. It was not forcefull, rather assimilation of Lithuanian Nobility into Polish. For their part it was voluntary.

thats exactly the point, since they still had the feudal system, most peasants were tied to a certain noble family. which, in turn, polonized the peasants

[Twistedmind]

nope
http://www.lki.lt/LKI_LT/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=330&Itemid=22

Nice paperback, but I dont get it. :p



Its highly unlikely it 'arrived' in poland, The most likely senario, is that it came about simultaneously
Lapsus tastaturae, I meant how it arrived in Lithuania. In any case -uskas surnames denote previous Slavic formes, used, mostly by nobles, priests and other people of higher social status who were participating in polish culture between XV and XIX century.

[Aunt Hilda]

Nice paperback, but I dont get it. :p

there is a english section


Lapsus tastaturae,

huh?


I meant how it arrived in Lithuania.

again, its unlikely it arrived in lithuania, but rather came about under similar circumstances, simultaneously


In any case -uskas surnames denote previous Slavic formes

fits the time frame



used, mostly by nobles, priests and other people of higher social status who were participating in polish culture between XV and XIX century.

now you're just helping to make my case

[Twistedmind]

there is a english section
Ok and? Insitute for Lithuanian language.



huh?

Latin language ;)



again, its unlikely it arrived in lithuania, but rather came about under similar circumstances, simultaneously

Lol it has typicall Slavic ending pronounced in Lithuanian way. I said, I dont know, if it arrived with settlers or people who accepted Polish surname at some point, and latter their descendants Lithuanized surname. :) Do you understand me now?



quite the contrary it shows polonization, ( migration was incredibly difficult at the time)
Do you have clue how much different ethnicites lived in Vilnus? Poles, Lithuanians, Russians, Ruthenians, Tatars, Ashkenazi Jews, Sephardi Jews, Czechs, Germans, French, Scotsmen ;) etc.
Anyway, Lithuanized Slavic suffix show Polonisation. lol (I am not making fun, but you did not chose happiest example.




now you're just helping to make my case
Not really. You are not reading what I am saying :) Re-read again, I am acctually not contradicting you. ;)

[Aunt Hilda]

Latin language ;)

balto-slavic would be my guess



Lol it has typicall Slavic ending pronounced in Lithuanian way. I said, I dont know, if it arrived with settlers or people who accepted Polish surname at some point, and latter their descendants Lithuanized surname. :) Do you understand me now?

my guess, would be that the original form of the nickname, sakalis, sakalas, was polonized in the commonwealth



Do you have clue how much different ethnicites lived in Vilnus? Poles, Lithuanians, Russians, Ruthenians, Tatars, Ashkenazi Jews, Sephardi Jews, Czechs, Germans, French, Scotsmen ;) etc.
Anyway, Lithuanized Slavic suffix show Polonisation. lol (I am not making fun, but you did not chose happiest example.


the name mostly appears in samogitia not vilnius. You have to take feudalism into account, migration in samogitia was very restricted, especially compared to Vilnius



Not really. You are not reading what I am saying :) Re-read again, I am acctually not contradicting you. ;)

........

[Aunt Hilda]

Anyway, Lithuanized Slavic suffix show Polonisation. lol (I am not making fun, but you did not chose happiest example.


It does.... slavic suffices(-auskas, -avičius, -evičius) were added to lithuanian nicknames(latter became surnames)
most of the names that display "slavicness" start appearing in written records only. they were not used by everyday people.
In the process of polonization, slavic suffices would be added to baltic words
example.; Andreas Kotkun → Kotkunowicz;Joannes Lankielis → Lankiewicz

footnotes http://www.delfi.lt/news/daily/lithuania/kokios-yra-musu-pavardes.d?id=31451957
http://giminesmedis.blogas.lt/pavardziu-keliones-306.html

[Aunt Hilda]

I would assume all of them are Lithuanian, except for the ones that end in -s which I would think are Greek.

since when, do people know what lithuanian names look like? :confused:

[Aunt Hilda]

Since they (and other Slav scum) began flooding the UK
There's barely any of them here in the UK. Surely most people don't notice them as much as poles or romanians,

FYI they aren't slavic. More importantly there's nothing wrong with slavs

there's a lot of things you could call scum: Nazis, NeoNazis, commies, bodybuilders :rolleyes:....

[Aunt Hilda]

They're Slavs in denial


how is that even a thing, their language isn't slavic.....



I've never seen any Lithuanian who doesn't look Slavic

they mostly look like polish, german, danish, norwegian people(the last two I can't explain)

I've yet to meet a lithuanian person, who would instantly make me think he's a slav. then again, almost all lithuanian people I know are students.

[bella1407]

Arthas, don't troll. lithuanians are not slavic.

[Twistedmind]

how is that even a thing, their language isn't slavic.....



they mostly look like polish, german, danish, norwegian people(the last two I can't explain)

I've yet to meet a lithuanian person, who would instantly make me think he's a slav. then again, almost all lithuanian people I know are students.

And what Poles are? Anyway, dont you think it is impossible there is no Lithuanians who look like Russians and Belarusians? Given simple fact that two countries are closer than Denmark.
Anway, Balts are not Slavs, but linguistically they are verry close to us.

[Aunt Hilda]

Anyway, dont you think it is impossible there is no Lithuanians who look like Russians and Belarusians?

There are liths who look like the stereotypical Russian but they are rare. Don't know about Belarusians since I have never seen one....


Given simple fact that two countries are closer than Denmark.

I'm merely basing this on my personal experiences



Anway, Balts are not Slavs, but linguistically they are verry close to us.

yes, the balto-slavic thing I know

[Twistedmind]

There are liths who look like the stereotypical Russian but they are rare. Don't know about Belarusians since I have never seen one....

What is stereotypicall Russian? There is 120,000,000 of them. And, from anthropological perspective, Northern Russians significantly overlap with Baltic peoples.



I'm merely basing this on my personal experiences

Yes it is obvious. ;)

[Aunt Hilda]

What is stereotypicall Russian? There is 120,000,000 of them. And, from anthropological perspective, Northern Russians significantly overlap with Baltic peoples.


well genetics wise, lithuanians are closer to finns, then they are to Russians but thats besides the point, since the "look" of the nations is also influenced by the environment and nutritional habits


What is stereotypicall Russian?


thats him :P
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9f/G%C3%A9rard_Depardieu_Cannes_2010.jpg/200px-G%C3%A9rard_Depardieu_Cannes_2010.jpg

[Twistedmind]

well genetics wise, lithuanians are closer to finns, then they are to Russians but thats besides the point, since the "look" of the nations is also influenced by the environment and nutritional habits
Since Russians are biggest European nation, it is pointless to generalize them. Northern Russians are anthropologicaly (genentically) verry close to all of them.



thats him :P
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9f/G%C3%A9rard_Depardieu_Cannes_2010.jpg/200px-G%C3%A9rard_Depardieu_Cannes_2010.jpg
:D
He is Montenegrin as well. Pan Slavic look :D

[inactive_member]

well genetics wise, lithuanians are closer to finns

A Lithuanian claiming kinship to Finns. I like reading that.

[bella1407]

New!

Teras
Akhmetov
Alekhno
Farion
Shufrich

[Lisa]

well genetics wise, lithuanians are closer to finns...

not a fact
http://s06.radikal.ru/i179/1302/17/8d687f4e6f1e.png (http://www.radikal.ru)

[Lisa]

...Northern Russians significantly overlap with Baltic peoples.

Northern Russians closer to Finns. Central Russians similar to Lithuanians..

[12345]

I guessed those as Lithuanian despite only ever knowing one person from there. Thing is, I don't know *why* I guessed right. Weird!