How would the world be different if World War One was won by Germany

[Frigga]

I think that World War One is a much more pivotal war than World War Two, but most of what we hear about is the Second Great War.

I personally feel that Germany should have been the victors in the First World War. There would have been no Hitler, or Third Reich in my opinion, and America would not have had the previous history of breaking the Isolationist precept that it had had for so long. I think that things would have been much better in the long run if Germany and its allies had won that first war.

What are your thoughts?

[SwordoftheVistula]

There would certainly have been no Hitler/NSDAP etc, though similar movements may have arisen in Britain and France if those were the defeated powers. Germany would have had a smoother transition away from a monarchy, probably along the path followed by Britain with the monarchy fading into a ceremonial position and power becoming vested in the parliament.

The 'eastern front' resolution is easy to predict, since Germany actually beat Russia and forced it to surrender and sign the 'Treaty of Brest-Litovsk', which was later annulled after Germany surrendered to the western allies some months later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Brest-Litovsk

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8a/Armisticebrestlitovsk.jpg/386px-Armisticebrestlitovsk.jpg

Germany would have become the dominant power in central/western Europe, and would probably had some sort of a 'Cold War' with the USSR while simultaneously trying to prevent a resurgence/rearmament of France and to some extent Britain as well.

Austria-Hungary may have been on its last legs anyways and split up following the war, but the transition would likely have been more orderly.

The most probable way for Germany to have won WWI is if the US did not intervene, given this, the US would likely have remained isolationist, especially since Germany as the dominant European power had no interest in the western hemisphere.

With a weakened Britain, Ireland may have been able to include the entire island at independence and subdue the Ulster area, especially with assistance from Germany and/or the US.

[Liffrea]

From a British perspective a German victory would have been disastrous, which is why Britain really had to fight in 1914, in contrast to 1939 when we ended up in a war we didn’t need to fight at that time. If Germany had taken some of it’s opportunities to break through on the Western front she would have rolled up France but the British army would no doubt have been easily evacuated. It’s difficult to see what peace terms Germany could have imposed on England, she was in no position to invade England and her overseas colonies were already in British and allied hands, probably an end to hostilities is all Germany could have realistically hoped for.

German success would have meant north-eastern France and Belgium dominated by the German Empire, given that British foreign policy regarding Europe for the previous couple of centuries had largely been to prevent a single power dominating the Channel and Rhine estuary, this alone would have been a serious issue for British security, remember that despite the “pan-Teutonic” cobblers put out by the “betrayed” Germans, Germany was no friend of Britain’s and one of it’s main rivals, the others being the USA and Russia. The German navy was second only to the Royal Navy and with a defeated France would have had unrestricted access to the Atlantic. Germany’s industrial base, already significantly ahead of England’s, would have been given a major boost by the acquisition of the industrialised French north-east.

Austria-Hungary would have been finished anyway, as would have been the Ottoman Empire, it’s doubtful that the Germans would have tolerated the Communists in Russia. Essentially there would have been a Cold War between England and Germany with America waiting to pick up the pieces if war broke out like they did post 1945.

[Atlas]

Ces boches n'auront jamais l'Alsace et la Lorraine goddamnit !

[The Lawspeaker]

Ces boches n'auront jamais l'Alsace et la Lorraine goddamnit !
Der Elzas und Lothringen sind Deutsch ! ;) (en Zuid Vlaanderen Vlaams)

[Atlas]

And Lille is flemish, Toulouse is spaniard, Lyon is swiss and Nice is italian. :cool:

[The Lawspeaker]

And Lille is flemish, Toulouse is spaniard, Lyon is swiss and Nice is italian. :cool:
Exactly. I think that 1870-1871 and WW2 served the French right in a way. We have a saying here that arrogance leads to downfall.
With arrogance I mean the situation during and after Louis XIV and Napoleon where France basically tried to take over Europe.

But Toulouse should indeed be Catalan, Rijssel Flemish, Nice used to be Italian and Lyon was never Swiss. Although there were some border towns and villages that used to be part of the Old Swiss Confederacy.

[Jimbo Gomez]

And Lille is flemish, Toulouse is spaniard, Lyon is swiss and Nice is italian. :cool:

On appelle cette ville 'Rijssel' dans le monde civilisé. ;)

[Atlas]

On appelle cette ville 'Rijssel' dans le monde civilisé. ;)

Tu penses que quelqu'un qui se fait surnommer "Dronckaert" ne le sait pas ? :p

[The Lawspeaker]

But on a more serious note. I wonder whether a German victory would have led to anything good. The Germans committed numerous war crimes in Belgium and Northern France- acting very much like the "Huns".
The Germans were "led" by the same banking cartels as the Allies were and they would of course have demanded a say in post-war Europe.

So apart from a more dominant Germany and a weaker France, and a re-united Flanders (more workforce for the Walloon overlords) there would not have been too much of a difference I think.

[Thorum]

Arrogance = America ? I think so...

[Psychonaut]

Arrogance = America ? I think so...

What? You're not a proponent of American exceptionalism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_exceptionalism)? What would Bill the Butcher say...

[ikki]

Russia was already defeated by the time germany capitulated.
What would be different tho, is that those lands, ukraine etc... would be having german prices as kings.
Like väinö I, married and everything.. palace waiting here in finland ;) Then ended up as a botanical garden.

Anyway, communism would still be rising.

Meanwhile in the west, the lowlands were already earlier pressured into joining germany... and now it would likely have become irresistable. Along with some kind of northern and eastern grab of france.

The alternative soviet union, lacking a good great deal of its industry and minerals, would likely be peery at provoking the german allied states.


France had its paris commune, and could have ended up communist, and allied with the lesser soviet union.. busy decrying imperialism and warmongering as a terrible evil. Germany would have a terrible time dealing with its own communists, and if they would end up folding...!!
So a ww2 would have come even sooner, by 1930 latest. This time a soviet+france vs rebellion ridden germany + britain + young kingdoms.


usa would never have had a great depression, no hooverwilles or new deal. Who knows if this arising red threat would cause mobilisation... even against beloved france..
Otoh likely ten times the immigration problems as escalating prosperity kept on luring. But also all those terrible doctrines from ww1 of human waves "tactics".

[Comte Arnau]

http://i25.tinypic.com/2rzau05.jpg

[Nationalitist]

http://i25.tinypic.com/2rzau05.jpg

No way.

[ikki]

oh yes.. a gigantic hungary :D

But the russia map is all wrong.
Also unlikely serbia or bosnia would be allowed to exist. Likely handed back to the turk...

Austria just might grab venice... and who knows... maybe end up joing with germany..
Also worth asking if there would be a ressurrected poland. Ukraine there would be, along with the baltic states and finland tho ;)

Also there just might be pre-empted strikes into the soviet union, so while the war might have ended in 1917-1918... the war against communism gong on for another decade... with ultimately the whole of russia broken up into smaller realms.

[LouisFerdinand]

Wilhelm II would not have abdicated in 1918.
He would have continued to have been the Emperor.
The Crown Prince would have succeeded him as Emperor Wilhelm III.