Scania (Skåne) - Danish or Swedish?

[Lobotomist]

When Denmark was 'born', it was seaways and straits that bound it together. The natural borders were the German heaths and the Swedish forests. Norway, Holstein, Schleswig, Halland, Blekinge and Skåne was Danish heartland because of an obvious coherent geography.

This is no more. Canute the Great's empire has shrunk. Lost battles, lost wars and one civil war led to Denmark's decimation, and each and every single attempts to fight back every time failed.


What is your opinion?

acmilan87 gave me this idea for thread.

[Lobotomist]

I think that Scania belongs to Denmark, it is culturally and ethnically more Danish than Swedish. My view should not be seen aggressively against Sweden. We are good friends with Sweden, and the friendship is to be maintained. It is not the Swedish democracy that has stolen Skåne from Denmark and robbed Scanians their natural identity. It is domineering warlords who did not even belong to the Swedish nor Danish people.

[Dombra]

If they leave we´ll have no one to joke about :P But I think Scania should stay Swedish, get over your losses :)

[Peikko]

Happened a long time ago and Skåne-folke don't speak Danish and have mixed with Swedes. I'm not gonna vote.

[Baldur]

You be the judge. :thumb001:
http://www.scania.org/activities/council2/illrep/large/Bild03.JPG

[Dombra]

Soon you want Norway too -.-

[Baldur]

Happened a long time ago and Skåne-folke don't speak Danish and have mixed with Swedes. I'm not gonna vote.

The real skånska is a danish dialect.

Scanian used to have many words which differed from standard Swedish. In 1995 Skånska Akademien released Skånsk-svensk-dansk ordbok, a dictionary with 2,711 Scanian words and expressions. It should be mentioned however that not all of these words are in wide use today. While the general vocabulary in modern Scanian does not differ considerably from Standard Swedish, a few specifically Scanian words still exist which are known in all of Scania, occurring frequently among a majority of the speakers. These are some examples:

påg, "boy" (Standard Swedish: pojke, former Danish: poge / pog)
tös, "girl" (Standard Swedish: flicka or tös (archaic), Danish: pige or tøs)
rälig, "disgusting", "ugly", "frightening" (Standard Swedish äcklig, ful, skrämmande/otäck, former Swedish rälig, dialect Danish: rærlig)
vann, "water" (Standard Swedish: vatten, Danish: vand)
hutta, "throw" (Standard Swedish: kasta)
hoe, "head" (Standard Swedish: huvud)
mög, "dirt" (Standard Swedish: smuts, smutsigt, dåligt, Danish: møg)
jue, "jew" (Standard Swedish: jude, Danish: jøde)

There are other Scanian words that are well known in Scania but could be considered old-fashioned or extremely rural in general usage:
pantoffel or pära, "potato" (Standard Swedish: potatis, Danish: kartoffel; pära related to Swedish päron, "pear", Danish: pære "pear").
rullebör, "wheelbarrow" (Standard Swedish: skottkärra, Danish: rullebør, trillebør)
sylten, "hungry" (Standard Swedish: hungrig, Former Swedish svulten, Danish sulten)

[Pallantides]

Denmark should have it and Bohuslän, Jämtland and Herjedalen should go to Norway,

[Dombra]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-RGzm3_tH8

If Scania is lost we will loose this :<

[Baldur]

And half of the swedish football national team.. :D

[alfieb]

Danmark!

[Lobotomist]

Recent polls conducted by newspapers have shown a surprisingly strong orientation towards Denmark. There is majority support for a Skåne reunification with Denmark. One of the newspapers was the Skåne Helsingborg Dagblad whose website on 24. December 2007 released the answers to the question: "Vilket land skulle du helst vilja tillhöra?". A majority of 52.2% said Denmark, 35.4% responded Sweden, while the last said "Inget av dem" 10.7% and "Vet inte": 1.7%.
In the nationwide Swedish newspaper Aftonbladet (from Stockholm), Swedish Internet users 26. December 2007 asked: "Tycker du att vi ska ge bort Skåne till Danmark?", a majority of 50.8% said yes. This is consistent with the readers of Kvällsposten (from Malmo) where 54.5% also answered in favor of reunification.
Politiken asked 26 December 2007 the Danes, if they would have Skåne. They responded as follows: Yes: 63% No: 32% and do not know: 6%.
In Aftonbladet's poll, more than 183,000 people participated. Representative polls questioning is usually only around 1000-1200 voters. They are selected so that they reflect the population the best.
The polls were made without prior political debate in the media.

[Anglojew]

Denmark.

[Styggnacke]

The real skånska is a danish dialect.
påg, "boy" (Standard Swedish: pojke, former Danish: poge / pog)
Both pojke and påg/pog come from Finnish poika.

tös, "girl" (Standard Swedish: flicka or tös (archaic), Danish: pige or tøs)
Tös and piga have also been part of other Swedish accents.

rälig, "disgusting", "ugly", "frightening" (Standard Swedish äcklig, ful, skrämmande/otäck, former Swedish rälig, dialect Danish: rærlig)
Old Swedish: räþeliker

vann, "water" (Standard Swedish: vatten, Danish: vand)
I'm pretty certain this was the way vatten was pronounced before in other Swedish accents.

hutta, "throw" (Standard Swedish: kasta)
This actually seems to be unique to Skåne.

hoe, "head" (Standard Swedish: huvud)
See the comment about "vann".

mög, "dirt" (Standard Swedish: smuts, smutsigt, dåligt, Danish: møg)
I guess it's related to Standard Swedish mögel.

jue, "jew" (Standard Swedish: jude, Danish: jøde)
See vann and hue.

pantoffel or pära, "potato" (Standard Swedish: potatis, Danish: kartoffel; pära related to Swedish päron, "pear", Danish: pære "pear").
I think they're called jordpäror in Northern Sweden. Either way, potatoes are a pretty new concept in N. Europe, so it's a bit useless to use it in this type of comparision.

rullebör, "wheelbarrow" (Standard Swedish: skottkärra, Danish: rullebør, trillebør)
Seems to be the same case as with hutta.

sylten, "hungry" (Standard Swedish: hungrig, Former Swedish svulten, Danish sulten)
Svulten was pretty common in other Swedish dialects before.

The Nordic languages diverged rather recently, so the commonalities are many. As you see, most of these words which are supposedly "uniquely to Skåne", have been used in other Swedish dialects, but have died out or become extremely rare.

Regarding OP: All my ancestors are from former Danish territory (not all of them are from Skåne, though), but I don't think there would be any point of Skåne joining Denmark. It wouldn't really change anything and definitely less than half of the people here have their whole ancestry from Skåne anyway. Besides, the unhealthy capital city-obsession you have over in Denmark is not something I would want to be part of.

[Mazik]

I think they're called jordpäror in Northern Sweden.


Nahh, maybe they used it in the "bondska", which our ancestors in N.Sweden spoke. But not nowadays :)

edit: the word for potatis in bondska was "perun".

[suip]

Recent polls conducted by newspapers have shown a surprisingly strong orientation towards Denmark. There is majority support for a Skåne reunification with Denmark. One of the newspapers was the Skåne Helsingborg Dagblad whose website on 24. December 2007 released the answers to the question: "Vilket land skulle du helst vilja tillhöra?". A majority of 52.2% said Denmark, 35.4% responded Sweden, while the last said "Inget av dem" 10.7% and "Vet inte": 1.7%.
In the nationwide Swedish newspaper Aftonbladet (from Stockholm), Swedish Internet users 26. December 2007 asked: "Tycker du att vi ska ge bort Skåne till Danmark?", a majority of 50.8% said yes. This is consistent with the readers of Kvällsposten (from Malmo) where 54.5% also answered in favor of reunification.
Politiken asked 26 December 2007 the Danes, if they would have Skåne. They responded as follows: Yes: 63% No: 32% and do not know: 6%.
In Aftonbladet's poll, more than 183,000 people participated. Representative polls questioning is usually only around 1000-1200 voters. They are selected so that they reflect the population the best.
The polls were made without prior political debate in the media.


I would recommend you try a girlfriend than dream about that. It would be easier and less delusional one than Skåne back to Denmark some day. ;) A lot of those polls were tabloid jokes (like that one from the Aftonbladet). It was not serious! Get the facts straight, if not, it will make you a clown here.

Danes reconquering Scania. Haha, the Danish way to win the things :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY_0ujCOjds

[Peikko]

Both pojke and påg/pog come from Finnish poika.

Tös and piga have also been part of other Swedish accents.


In Finnish language the word "piika" means a maid.

[Vasconcelos]

Scandinavians fighting? What has the World come to.

[Wolverine]

When Denmark was 'born', it was seaways and straits that bound it together. The natural borders were the German heaths and the Swedish forests. Norway, Holstein, Schleswig, Halland, Blekinge and Skåne was Danish heartland because of an obvious coherent geography.

This is no more. Canute the Great's empire has shrunk. Lost battles, lost wars and one civil war led to Denmark's decimation, and each and every single attempts to fight back every time failed.


What is your opinion?

acmilan87 gave me this idea for thread.
Troll?

[Loki]

Troll?

LOL, he's not a troll.

[suip]

Scanians does not have a national identification with Denmark anymore. Those of whom do, are minorities, and they are not into independence mood as well. It is more than a cultural and nostalgic thing. What is healthy and beautiful. Scandinavism, was born in Lund in the 19th century.

Besides Scania is one of the strongest holds for Swedish nationalism today. :P

[Wolverine]

LOL, he's not a troll.
How not? He should be banned for saying things like that. And all his arguments for the Scanian dialect is bullshit. You can find words in Polish that are more related to Danish than Scanian in the same way you can find hundreds of English words in Danish. That doesn't mean Denmark has to be English.

[Ushtari]

Skåne je Danmark

[suip]

How not? He should be banned for saying things like that. And all his arguments for the Scanian dialect is bullshit. You can find words in Polish that are more related to Danish than Scanian in the same way you can find hundreds of English words in Danish. That doesn't mean Denmark has to be English.

Saying that one can find words in Polish that are more related to Danish than to the Scanian dialect is the icing on the cake. :D

[Dombra]

Scandinavians fighting? What has the World come to.

Ancient tradition :D

[Dombra]

Scanians does not have a national identification with Denmark anymore. Those of whom do, are minorities, and they are not into independence mood as well. It is more than a cultural and nostalgic thing. What is healthy and beautiful. Scandinavism, was born in Lund in the 19th century.

Besides Scania is one of the strongest holds for Swedish nationalism today. :P

Why would those fighting for our country want to leave it? We need them :<

[Pallantides]

Troll?

Han er ihvertfall ikke en Kurder...:D

[The Lawspeaker]

Jämtland and Herjedalen should go to Norway,
I agree: Jemtland and Herjedalen should become Norwegian. But only after a local referendum.

[Loki]

Skåne je Danmark

Kosovo je Srbija ;)

[Styggnacke]

In Finnish language the word "piika" means a maid.
Yes, but in this case, you seem to have borrowed it from Old Norse instead. And that's also what piga means in modern Swedish.

[arcticwolf]

You guys are not gonna start the second Balkanian front in Scandinavia, are you: :P

Please don't compete with Balkans that will make them mad! LOL

I'm not sure I can survive second Balkan front! Have mercy please! :laugh:

[tEhSaint]

You guys are not gonna start the second Balkanian front in Scandinavia, are you: :P

Please don't compete with Balkans that will make them mad! LOL

I'm not sure I can survive second Balkan front! Have mercy please! :laugh:

:stop

That's nothing compared to Balkan wars... :coffee:

[arcticwolf]

:stop

That's nothing compared to Balkan wars... :coffee:

All great conflicts must start somewhere! An ounce of prevention is better than a ton of cure! Nothing wrong with being paranoid! Just because you're paranoid don't mean some one isn't after you! I've ran out of cliches! :laugh:

[Styggnacke]

How not? He should be banned for saying things like that. And all his arguments for the Scanian dialect is bullshit. You can find words in Polish that are more related to Danish than Scanian in the same way you can find hundreds of English words in Danish. That doesn't mean Denmark has to be English.
Menar du att danska är närmare besläktat med polska än skånska? Väldigt intressant. Något som också är intressant, är att du som dansk deltar och har väldigt starka starka åsikter i en tråd om kurder. Sedan när bryr sig danskar om dem? Skulle jag gissa så är du ett troll, men du kan gärna överbevisa mig genom att svara på mitt inlägg, på danska (och då helst inte Google translate-versionen).

[Lobotomist]

Regarding OP: All my ancestors are from former Danish territory (not all of them are from Skåne, though), but I don't think there would be any point of Skåne joining Denmark. It wouldn't really change anything and definitely less than half of the people here have their whole ancestry from Skåne anyway. Besides, the unhealthy capital city-obsession you have over in Denmark is not something I would want to be part of.

What is this "capital city-obsession" you're talking about? Never heard of it. Danes are not obsessed with CPH or even Seeland in general. Quite the contrary actually. That's why most people from Seeland at some point in their life move to Jutland.

Scanians have been separated from their natural area. Something they did not desire, as they have resisted and something which separated them from their natural cohesion. This happened in the 1600's, times where a king could decide over a whole population and nationality. Today, we believe that people's self-determination must be the crucial factor (That is what UN is also for, guys), and the choice of national identity of the people in Skåne has never been given to them.


I would recommend you try a girlfriend than dream about that. It would be easier and less delusional one than Skåne back to Denmark some day. ;) A lot of those polls were tabloid jokes (like that one from the Aftonbladet). It was not serious! Get the facts straight, if not, it will make you a clown here.

Danes reconquering Scania. Haha, the Danish way to win the things :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY_0ujCOjds

Second time you posted that video now, and it is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

Danes reconquering Scania? It's not really a conquest. It's about skåningerne and their choice of national identity, they never had the option to be Danish or Swedish. I'm not arguing over the sake of land, but about the residents. If you actually took the time researching and browsing the web, you would quickly find out that the whole idea about Scania being on Danish territory once again is not a bad idea - even based on skåningernes opinion.

And i thought national identity was a human right nowadays..

Who are you to judge if it was a serious poll or not? I think it was. If otherwise, then prove it.


How not? He should be banned for saying things like that. And all his arguments for the Scanian dialect is bullshit. You can find words in Polish that are more related to Danish than Scanian in the same way you can find hundreds of English words in Danish. That doesn't mean Denmark has to be English.

I should be banned for disagreeing with your views. Sad.

My arguments for the Scanian dialect? I haven't argued shit about the dialects.

[Dacul]

Considering how Middle-Easterners from there are breeding,it seems soon will be Middle-Easterner,lol.
(Malmo is having 25% of the population Middle-Easterners now, :laugh: ).

[suip]

Second time you posted that video now, and it is completely unrelevant to this discussion.

Danes reconquering Scania? It's not really a conquest. It's about skåningerne and their choice of national identity, they never had the option to be Danish or Swedish. I'm not arguing over the sake of land, but about the residents. If you actually took the time researching and browsing the web, you would quickly find out that the whole idea about Scania being on Danish territory once again is not a bad idea - even based on skåningernes opinion.

And i thought national identity was a human right nowadays..


The problem is that the region does not identify itself more with the Denmark anymore. Those of whom do, are more for historical and cultural respect and also a tad of nostalgia than by a need to join Denmark. Really Scanians have their differences in relation to the rest of Sweden, but also, it has Gotland or Lappland.

Skåne is the region where the SD has the greatest popularity, people think in Sweden as a whole, not in more as being part of Denmark, although everyone is aware of the region's historical relationship with its country.

[Lobotomist]

The problem is that the region does not identify itself more with the Denmark anymore. Those of whom do, are more for historical and cultural respect and also a tad of nostalgia than by a need to join Denmark. Really Scanians have their differences in relation to the rest of Sweden, but also, it has Gotland or Lappland.

Skåne is the region where the SD has the greatest popularity, people think in Sweden as a whole, not in more as being part of Denmark, although everyone is aware of the region's historical relationship with its country.

Only a referendum will be fair for the Scanians.

Scanians had been Danish for 800 years, most of it can't be gone by now already.
Swedes invaded the country and imposed them to be Swedish - fy fan! They were subjugated, mistreated and their cities burned down.
It would be a direct ticket to the Tribunal today!
United States has apologized for their massacre of Natives, as they stole their land - It is time for Sweden to face yours!

[Furnace]

Only a referendum will be fair for the Scanians.

Scanians had been Danish for 800 years, most of it can't be gone by now already.
Swedes invaded the country and imposed them to be Swedish - fy fan! They were subjugated, mistreated and their cities burned down.
It would be a direct ticket to the Tribunal today!
United States has apologized for their massacre of Natives, as they stole their land - It is time for Sweden to face yours!

I think Norway and Denmark should invade territories that were originally ours, they stole the regions of Jämtland and Härjedalen from us in 1645. Operation swedeback is in order!

http://www.realestatescandinavia.com/images/counties/J%C3%A4mtland/H%C3%A4rjedalen_full.png

[Lemon Kush]

Scania je Denmark.

[Mazik]

I think Norway and Denmark should invade territories that were originally ours, they stole the regions of Jämtland and Härjedalen from us in 1645. Operation swedeback is in order!

http://www.realestatescandinavia.com/images/counties/J%C3%A4mtland/H%C3%A4rjedalen_full.png

They should become their own country if any ;)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Jamtland

Their national anthem:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bT1_0AGaMoY

[suip]

Only a referendum will be fair for the Scanians.

Go worry in keeping the Greenland and all of that oil in the Union. It would be smarter for part of the Danish elites than dreaming about Scania. :p

Scanians will not want to miss their rich agricultural and industrial subsidies they already earn from the Swedish State. Being a part of Denmark things would be hardly to Scanians, Denmark is not that as an industrial exporter nation as Sweden is.



Scanians had been Danish for 800 years, most of it can't be gone by now already.
Swedes invaded the country and imposed them to be Swedish - fy fan! They were subjugated, mistreated and their cities burned down.
It would be a direct ticket to the Tribunal today!
United States has apologized for their massacre of Natives, as they stole their land - It is time for Sweden to face yours!

Oh, really. In fact the Scanians residents during the Battle of Lund joined the national Swedish forces because they realized that the Danes were to plunder us. Denmark when felt had lost it, began to destroy the cities, plunder and burn crops. Read more about the Scanian wars, there is no saints. No even the Scanians themselves, many fought with each other for to chose which side to support.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scanian_War

[suip]

I think Norway and Denmark should invade territories that were originally ours, they stole the regions of Jämtland and Härjedalen from us in 1645. Operation swedeback is in order!


Well, you guys were pussies and lost the war to Sweden. :shrug:

[sgc2009]

Go worry in keeping the Greenland and all of that oil in the Union. It would be smarter for part of the Danish elites than dreaming about Scania. :p

Scanians will not want to miss their rich agricultural and industrial subsidies they already earn from the Swedish State. Being a part of Denmark things would be hardly to Scanians, Denmark is not that as an industrial exporter nation as Sweden is.
You seem really concerned about the thought of giving Scanians the right to choose for ourselves, and you go on about SD support and agricultural subsidies yada yada... SD support in Scania can be explained by the fact that Scania has traditionally been conservatively minded (atleast compared to Sweden), although SD have their strongholds in more rural areas, those are ironically also the ones most likely to be pro-Scanian/Danish.

The vast majority of ethnic Scanians do have a strong Scanian identity and do feel an attachment to various degrees with Denmark. If Scanian history and Swedish crimes against Scania would not be as (intentionally) neglected in schools, the support for a unification would just grow.



Oh, really.
Yes, really.

I posted this in another thread, but I guess it deserves to be posted here aswell:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eoXP4C9fT0c

[suip]

Tror nu nok lige der er noget de Skånske Svenskere ikke har tænkt over. De ville nok ikke være så vilde hvis det virkeligt kom til stykket.

1. Mindre end 3 uger efter Skåne kom under Danmark, kom der nye nummerplader fra Dk som skulle monteres. Dog skulle der lige betales en lille ekstra reg.afgift først på lad os sige 180%.

2. Mange ældre biler i Skåne, skulle skrottes, pga det Danske bilsyn jo er noget mere strikse end de Svenske.

3. Momsen på fødevarer hæves til 25%

:D

[Baluarte]

Voted Denmark just because of the terrible image I have of Sweden

[suip]

Voted Denmark just because of the terrible image I have of Sweden
Just out of curiosity, where are you from? Why such hate against Swedes? Have us done something with your people?

[Baluarte]

Just out of curiosity, where are you from? Why such hate against Swedes? Have us done something with your people?

Nope, nothing like that.
Just the image of feminized society and ultraliberalism.

Nothing ethnic nor visceral.

[suip]

Nope, nothing like that.
Just the image of feminized society and ultraliberalism.

If it the issue, I don't see what Denmark is different so. :cool: Don't worry I'm myself culturally ultraliberal. Economically social democrat.



Nothing ethnic nor visceral.

But where do you hails from?

[sgc2009]

Tror nu nok lige der er noget de Skånske Svenskere ikke har tænkt over. De ville nok ikke være så vilde hvis det virkeligt kom til stykket.

1. Mindre end 3 uger efter Skåne kom under Danmark, kom der nye nummerplader fra Dk som skulle monteres. Dog skulle der lige betales en lille ekstra reg.afgift først på lad os sige 180%.

2. Mange ældre biler i Skåne, skulle skrottes, pga det Danske bilsyn jo er noget mere strikse end de Svenske.

3. Momsen på fødevarer hæves til 25%

:D

Duh, the cheap booze would make up for all of that ;)

[arcticwolf]

You need practice! Balkans would have 100 pages by now. Up your game, or you never gonna catch up to the pros! :laugh:

[Lobotomist]

Oh, really. In fact the Scanians residents during the Battle of Lund joined the national Swedish forces because they realized that the Danes were to plunder us. Denmark when felt had lost it, began to destroy the cities, plunder and burn crops. Read more about the Scanian wars, there is no saints. No even the Scanians themselves, many fought with each other for to chose which side to support.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scanian_War

Danish king Christian V had indeed allowed his soldiers three hours of plunder after the capture of the town - which turned out to be a bad move obviously. If anything, Sweden is known for its plundering and expensive taxation of newly gained land. Swedish state ultimately proved unable to support and maintain its army in a prolonged war. Campaigns had been proposed on the basis that the army would be financially self-supporting through plunder and taxation of newly gained land.

There are more incidents of residents helping Danes than Swedes - even some Swedish soldiers helped Danish ones. Which happened on Bornholm where Swedish Colonel Platzensköld got killed.

Example: The Danish recapture of Scania, Danish king Christian V brought 15,000 troops against a defending Swedish army of 5,000 men, which were spread out over the province.
Initially the operation was a great success. Large parts of the local peasantry sided with Denmark and the outnumbered Swedish troops were in bad shape.

[Lobotomist]

Tror nu nok lige der er noget de Skånske Svenskere ikke har tænkt over. De ville nok ikke være så vilde hvis det virkeligt kom til stykket.

1. Mindre end 3 uger efter Skåne kom under Danmark, kom der nye nummerplader fra Dk som skulle monteres. Dog skulle der lige betales en lille ekstra reg.afgift først på lad os sige 180%.

2. Mange ældre biler i Skåne, skulle skrottes, pga det Danske bilsyn jo er noget mere strikse end de Svenske.

3. Momsen på fødevarer hæves til 25%

:D

Nu må du ikke udelade alle de positive ting.

Antallet af indvandrere er signifikant lavere end i Sverige (især ikke-vestlige), kvalitet frem for pris (økologiske varer) osv.

http://www.nationmaster.com/compare/Denmark/Sweden/

Ja, nu kan det godt være at, Sverige er højere rang end Danmark på listen, men hvis man ser på de ting som betyder noget for den enkelte borger (altså ikke militær osv.) fører Danmark (sundhed, kriminalitet, GDP capita, uddannelse, benzinpriser, miljøet).

[suip]

I'm not going to go into the history, I could quote the bloody uprisings that Scanians had against the Danes during the medieval ages, but we'll leave that as is.

If you think it should go back to Denmark again, so if it happen, Sweden needs to be compensated (well Sweden won a war for have it), in this case I'll support the annexation of Finland (Österland) to Swedish helm. ;)
And also Greenland and Faroes Islands should be returned to Norway, along with Iceland. You stole it of them. Do not forget that. ;)

[suip]

And also return much of tip Southern Danish territory for the Northern Frisians or what remained of them there. ;)

[Dacul]

To Lobotomist:
Dude what is wrong with you,are you really Dane?
Or are you Balkanic born in Denmark that you come with such non-sense polls to seed discord between Swedes and Danes?
Anyway,there is Nordic Council in which both Denmark and Sweden are,what matters to which country is Scania?

[Baldur]

To Lobotomist:
Dude what is wrong with you,are you really Dane?
Or are you Balkanic born in Denmark that you come with such non-sense polls to seed discord between Swedes and Danes?
Anyway,there is Nordic Council in which both Denmark and Sweden are,what matters to which country is Scania?

Why is it a non sense poll? I've seen far more non sense polls in this forum that was just plain stupid this one is interesting atleast. Also there is some people here who would like to see an independent Scania or a danish Scania but we all know that wont happen but i dont see why one cant ask the question.

[Peikko]

I'm not going to go into the history, I could quote the bloody uprisings that Scanians had against the Danes during the medieval ages, but we'll leave that as is.

If you think it should go back to Denmark again, so if it happen, Sweden needs to be compensated (well Sweden won a war for have it), in this case I'll support the annexation of Finland (Österland) to Swedish helm. ;)
And also Greenland and Faroes Islands should be returned to Norway, along with Iceland. You stole it of them. Do not forget that. ;)
If you want Finland, you're gonna have to fight for it. We already know what would be the outcome of such a battle, don't we. :lol00002:


Why is it a non sense poll? I've seen far more non sense polls in this forum that was just plain stupid this one is interesting atleast. Also there is some people here who would like to see an independent Scania or a danish Scania but we all know that wont happen but i dont see why one cant ask the question.
Hear, hear. This is one of few interesting threads. Not everything needs to roll around Balkans.

[Peyrol]

I Not everything needs to roll around Balkans.

Yep, that's for sure. At least it's an interesting discussion and not the daily topic ''bosniaks master race'' or ''Turkey better country in the Wolrd, all the other countries are ruled by little girls'' or similar discussions.

Btw, this would be a matter of autodetermination, so...what the majority of scanian (i mean true ethnic swedes from Scania, not the 2nd-3rd generation balkanic or arab immigrants) think about this topic?

[Baldur]

Yep, that's for sure. At least it's an interesting discussion and not the daily topic ''bosniaks master race'' or ''Turkey better country in the Wolrd, all the other countries are ruled by little girls'' or similar discussions.

Btw, this would be a matter of autodetermination, so...what the majority of scanian (i mean true ethnic swedes from Scania, not the 2nd-3rd generation balkanic or arab immigrants) think about this topic?

I think we have a very strong pride in our region and you should read about the "försvenskningen" what really was like a genocide on the scanian people.

[Styggnacke]

I think we have a very strong pride in our region and you should read about the "försvenskningen" what really was like a genocide on the scanian people.
That's a myth, really. Here are some good articles about the subject:
http://www.sydsvenskan.se/kultur--nojen/myten-om-det-kuvade-skane/
http://www.svd.se/kultur/understrecket/att-gora-svenskar-av-skaningar_911003.svd

[suip]

If you want Finland, you're gonna have to fight for it. We already know what would be the outcome of such a battle, don't we. :lol00002:

We would attach you, we all know that without massive Swedish money, weapons and material support, you wouldn't have lasted a day against the USSR in the 40s. So, chill out 'badass'. Of course it was a hypothetical situation, why should Sweden give Scania to Denmark, if happens, Finland should go back to Sweden.

[Peikko]

We would attach you, we all know that without massive Swedish money, weapons and material support, you wouldn't have lasted a day against the USSR in the 40s. So, chill out 'badass'. Of course it was a hypothetical situation, why should Sweden give Scania to Denmark, if happens, Finland should go back to Sweden.
Oh yeah? It would have helped more, if you had sent your soldiers too, instead of just sipping tea in the background. Do you guys even have an army??

[Mazik]

Oh yeah? It would have helped more, if you had sent your soldiers too, instead of just sipping tea in the background. Do you guys even have an army??

We sent you the biggest volunteer army from one country the world has ever seen:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tor6ajdISOo

"Finlands känslor av tacksamhet och aktning skola aldrig förblekna" - C.G.E Mannerheim

[Styggnacke]

It would be nice if sgc commented the articles I posted. :)

[Baldur]

How much truth is there to this then do you think?
http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/kolumnister/hermanlindqvist/article11667454.ab

[Peikko]

We sent you the biggest volunteer army from one country the world has ever seen:

Swedish government didn't send anyone, they we're volunteers. And besides, Swedish army would have been 200 000 men at least, and only less than 9000 participated so I'd say that's pretty weak. Men tackar hyr som helst.

[Styggnacke]

How much truth is there to this then do you think?
http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/kolumnister/hermanlindqvist/article11667454.ab
Herman Lindqvist is known to be a pseudo-historian. The guys who wrote the articles I posted, were a ph.d. respectively a professor at Lund University.


Btw, you should have this Winter War talk somewhere else. It's interesting, but it doesn't belong to this thread.

[sgc2009]

Herman Lindqvist is known to be a pseudo-historian. The guys who wrote the articles I posted, were a ph.d. respectively a professor at Lund University.



If anything, those articles poted by you are pseudo-historic. The article in Sydsvenskan doesn't really contain anything refuting a violent Swedification of Scania, and it's obvious the author behind the SVD article is biased, f.ex. following paragraph:

"Myten om en brutal försvenskning har det senaste decenniet varit starkast och flitigt brukats av extrema politiska grupper i Skåne, grupper som har hävdat en skånsk nationalitet och särskilt utmärkt sig genom främlingsfientlig högerpopulism. Man har annekterat det moderna begreppet ”etnisk rensning” och menar att skåningarna utsattes för en sådan, vilket skulle ge Skåne rätt till regionalt självstyrelse och avvisande av ”icke-skåningar” idag. Dessa grupper har ofta lycktas väl med att komma ut i medierna och deras tolkning låg 2006 till grund för SVT-produktionen ”Snapphanar”. Den forskning som har bedrivits de senaste åren visar emellertid en annan bild."

When what could be equated to ethnic cleansing with population transfer/replacement happened, Scanian farms and estates were confiscated and Swedes were transferred to Scania for settlement while thousands of Scanians were forcefully recruited and transferred to the Baltics.

I guess this (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?77468-Crimes-of-your-nation&p=1544785#post1544785) SVT documentary is also bogus according to you.

Though I'd argue the mass murder against the Scanian civilian population during the wars was clearly the most despicable act by Sweden, with forced Swedification coming in later...

[suip]

There has never been a mass muder of Scanian civilians. The greatest lie ever, of course there have been murders of opponents of the annexation. Most of the Scanians supported the annexation by Sweden, since it meant the end of serfdom.

[sgc2009]

There has never been a mass muder of Scanian civilians. The greatest lie ever, of course there have been murders of opponents of the annexation. Most of the Scanians supported the annexation by Sweden, since it meant the end of serfdom.
Oh, burning down villages and slaugthering thousands of innocent civilians including women and kids is just collateral damage now? I see.

[Styggnacke]

If anything, those articles poted by you are pseudo-historic.
No, because the guys who wrote those articles are serious historians, which can't be said about Herman Lindqvist, who don't even have a degree in history.

The article in Sydsvenskan doesn't really contain anything refuting a violent Swedification of Scania, and it's obvious the author behind the SVD article is biased, f.ex. following paragraph:
The only reason I included the Sydsvenskan article was because you otherwise would whine about "Stockholm propaganda" if I only linked the SvD article.

When what could be equated to ethnic cleansing with population transfer/replacement happened, Scanian farms and estates were confiscated and Swedes were transferred to Scania for settlement while thousands of Scanians were forcefully recruited and transferred to the Baltics.
I have heard these claims so many times, and they always sound extremely different depending on who you're hearing them from. Give me some scientific articles and studies about it, and not of the "popular historian" type à la Herman Lindqvist.

I guess this (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?77468-Crimes-of-your-nation&p=1544785#post1544785) SVT documentary is also bogus according to you.
It does seem that, actually. For example, the Danish man in the beginning talks about this supposed "iron curtain", which Harald Gustafsson commented in his article:

Knud Fabricius menade att det sänkte sig en järnridå i Öresund, men alla tecken tyder på att denna ridå hade stora rosthål. Kvinnliga handlande i Helsingborg kände sig trakasserade av de nya tullbestämmelserna men fortsatte trots det sina turer till Helsingør. Ännu efter kriget förekom flyttningar från Danmark till Skåne, inte bara av hemvändande flyktingar. En man skrev 1699 till den svenska guvernören om en häst han köpt i Köpenhamn och berömde sig av att ha infört en bra stridshäst i riket. Det är typiskt för kommunikationen från invånarna till den nya överheten, där det inte framkommer någon rädsla för att nämna kontakter med Danmark eller den danska tiden, och ingen ängsligt påtagen demonstrativ svenskhet. Vardagslivet påverkades föga.
After that, I didn't bother to continue watching.

[Lobotomist]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSn3_4hg8UU

[Lobotomist]

If getting Skåne back to Danish ownership, also includes getting all the immigrants (f.x 37% of Malmö are immigrants) - it will not be accepted. ;)

[Baluarte]

You can always them pass a law of expulsion if needed.
Just like the Czechs did with the Sudeten Germans.