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Argyll
10-09-2011, 03:03 PM
I don't like metropolises. Usually they aren't close to nature.

Anthropologique
10-09-2011, 03:11 PM
She is. I really don't care if you think it's stupid.

There is no such thing as a "pure Celt" and a true test for Celticity is not available. Celtic is primarily a cultural category. Several genetic markers exist that MAY be associated with Celtic descent, such as R-L21 (found mainly in the British Isles) and S-116 (Iberia and parts of France). R-L21 appears to be a final mutation of S-116. It's complicated and nothing is certain.

Anthropologique
10-09-2011, 03:17 PM
How Celtic are you?

Basically most of Western and Central Europe could call themselves Celtic if they base it on ancient history, it looses it's appeal when it becomes synonymous with 'Generic European'.

Ireland to Turkey, Scotland to Portugal, it's quite a large area.

It comes down to the length of time a region was Celtic dominant, in terms of culture and density of (Celtic) population. Using this criteria, the British Isles and much of France and Iberia currently have some level of Celticity while Turkey clearly does not. A small argument can also be made for a few Alpine regions as well.

Hussar
10-09-2011, 03:31 PM
........... A small argument can also be made for a few Alpine regions as well.


Smalle argument ? Northwest Italy = Cisalpine Gallia

Osweo
10-09-2011, 03:35 PM
It comes down to the length of time a region was Celtic dominant, in terms of culture and density of (Celtic) population.

... and the nature and degree of subsequent demographic layers. In Turkey's case, the poor buggers were swamped and Celticism is utterly smothered.

Albion
10-09-2011, 05:00 PM
Valle d'Aosta claims to be Celtic along with Romandie in Switzerland. They may be the Romanised Helvetians, quite a nice thought to think they've survived in some form.

Damião de Góis
10-09-2011, 06:23 PM
It comes down to the length of time a region was Celtic dominant, in terms of culture and density of (Celtic) population. Using this criteria, the British Isles and much of France and Iberia currently have some level of Celticity while Turkey clearly does not. A small argument can also be made for a few Alpine regions as well.

A lot of places have "a level of Celticity". An area too wide to make this "Celtic thing" not as special as some people like to think.

http://www.medpovrly.cz/en/ImgCont/historie01_en.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/d5/Celts_in_Europe2.png/360px-Celts_in_Europe2.png

Anthropologique
10-10-2011, 02:58 AM
Once more, it is the length of ancient Celtic domination along with population numbers that determine which areas today continue to manifest some level of Celticity.

All cultures are special.

Argyll
10-10-2011, 11:51 AM
Okay, so I am/was reading Celtic Magic (which is a book published by LLEWELYN) and the author, D.J. Conway, says that there were a lot of priestesses in Celtic society, that goddess worhsip was more popular than god worship, hooks up Celtic culture with Wicca, and even says there were special sects of priestesses that worshipped the goddesses, especially Brighid. Not to mention that PRIESTESSES of Scottish Celtic witchcraft were called "queens of elphame" (which is one of Nicnevin's titles). I couldn't help but get seriously pissed at the but also I have/had some great laughs out of it.

Osweo
10-10-2011, 11:55 AM
Christ, kid. Get it into your head that Elf hame is ELF HOME is ALF HEIM is utterly GERMANIC, and using it in the same sentence as 'NicNevin' is just making yourself open to RIDICULE.

Argyll
10-10-2011, 11:56 AM
I know that, Osweo. Why don't you look up Nicnevin and read it for yourself? :lol:

Osweo
10-10-2011, 11:59 AM
I know that, Osweo. Why don't you look up Nicnevin and read it for yourself? :lol:

Because romanticised pseudohistory is a swamp that it is very difficult to find your way out of.

Albion
10-10-2011, 01:58 PM
Christ, kid. Get it into your head that Elf hame is ELF HOME is ALF HEIM is utterly GERMANIC, and using it in the same sentence as 'NicNevin' is just making yourself open to RIDICULE.

Yeah, they sound very Germanic to me. Scots itself is arguably more Germanic than the English language.

Boudica
10-10-2011, 02:14 PM
My best friend Brighid, who happens to ACTUALLY be a pure Celt (she's been tested) lives near there.

"Brighid" is full of shit :wink. And I'm really surprised that you do not understand that there is no such thing as "pure celt" from your being here. You have been told a numerous amount of times by people here who are only speaking common sense, that there isn't such a thing as a "pure celt".. While you seem to be living in some fantasy land.. At least you have changed your claims of being "pure celt" which you made not over a week ago, and apparently made the discovery of being "very slight germanic":rolleyes:.. It is incredible to me how you have done all of this without even having a DNA test which would not be able to tell you the above in such a way anyway.. If you would be so kind, please do tell us all where your "pure celt" friend purchased this test, for I think that we, and every geneticist in Europe would love to know of her discovery..

Get out of fantasy land, and come back to the real world. Study celt history, and the invasions of practically all European people.. Be proud of your ancestry, even if you won't be passing it on.. I'm sorry to snap on you, but it seems like you need some sort of awakening.. I'm really getting tired of your ridiculous claims which spit in the face of European history.. It is insulting to me and surely others as well..

Boudica
10-10-2011, 02:27 PM
I know that, Osweo. Why don't you look up Nicnevin and read it for yourself? :lol:

By the way, your avatar is interesting, could you tell me exactly where that style of art came from? :rolleyes:

Wanderlust
10-10-2011, 02:32 PM
Get out of fantasy land, and come back to the real world. Study celt history, and the invasions of practically all European people.. Be proud of your ancestry, even if you won't be passing it on.. I'm sorry to snap on you, but it seems like you need some sort of awakening.. I'm really getting tired of your ridiculous claims which spit in the face of European history.. It is insulting to me and surely others as well..

Harsh words..What I get from his posts is that he's just a teenager who's going through difficult times. I don't expect him to know everything.

Boudica
10-10-2011, 02:55 PM
Harsh words..What I get from his posts is that he's just a teenager who's going through difficult times. I don't expect him to know everything.

Yes, they were a bit harsh, which I apologize for.. But his claims just became a bit annoying after awhile because he's been told by many people, including my self in a kind way the facts about all of this.. His pure celtic talk in the thread and talks of hating germanics in the cb get people with this ancestry (like my self due to being celtic and germanic) a bit agitated... His talks of things like this have been reoccurring in the thread, while others continue to tell him the facts which leads things way off topic..

As I said, my words were a bit too harsh and I shouldn't have said them, however hopefully you can some what see my point of view. I just think that everyone should be proud of their ancestry and not try to deny what is part of it..

Argyll
10-10-2011, 03:40 PM
"Brighid" is full of shit :wink. And I'm really surprised that you do not understand that there is no such thing as "pure celt" from your being here. You have been told a numerous amount of times by people here who are only speaking common sense, that there isn't such a thing as a "pure celt".. While you seem to be living in some fantasy land.. At least you have changed your claims of being "pure celt" which you made not over a week ago, and apparently made the discovery of being "very slight germanic":rolleyes:.. It is incredible to me how you have done all of this without even having a DNA test which would not be able to tell you the above in such a way anyway.. If you would be so kind, please do tell us all where your "pure celt" friend purchased this test, for I think that we, and every geneticist in Europe would love to know of her discovery..

Get out of fantasy land, and come back to the real world. Study celt history, and the invasions of practically all European people.. Be proud of your ancestry, even if you won't be passing it on.. I'm sorry to snap on you, but it seems like you need some sort of awakening.. I'm really getting tired of your ridiculous claims which spit in the face of European history.. It is insulting to me and surely others as well..

I don't really take what most of the Germanic superiorist seriously. They're too interested in supplanting other European cultures.

Argyll
10-10-2011, 03:44 PM
Because romanticised pseudohistory is a swamp that it is very difficult to find your way out of.

Then I guess you haven't bothered to read these two books:
http://www.amazon.com/Rowan-Tree-Red-Thread-Description/dp/B000E4C7W6/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1318261434&sr=1-1
http://www.amazon.com/Darker-Superstitions-Scotland-Illustrated-Practice/dp/1147013020/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1318261466&sr=1-1

Tarja
10-10-2011, 03:51 PM
Scotland is substantially Germanic, what with all the Anglo (acquired from extensive mixing with the English over many years, I am aware the Anglos didn't conquer Scotland ;)) and Norse admixture over time - Nordic peoples have long been present here and in Britain overall, with most British people having some Scandinavian ancestry. As much as we are Celtic, we certainly aren't the most so of the Celtic nations. For any Scot to claim to be "pure Celt" would be ridiculous, considering how many groups of people we have been invaded by. :P I can almost guarantee that Argyll will have more than just slight Germanic heritage, if he was willing to look for it.


Ps. You posted as I typed this, Argyll, so I apologise for it sounding like I'm talking about you as if you're not there. :D

Argyll
10-10-2011, 04:17 PM
"Brighid" is full of shit :wink. And I'm really surprised that you do not understand that there is no such thing as "pure celt" from your being here. You have been told a numerous amount of times by people here who are only speaking common sense, that there isn't such a thing as a "pure celt".. While you seem to be living in some fantasy land.. At least you have changed your claims of being "pure celt" which you made not over a week ago, and apparently made the discovery of being "very slight germanic":rolleyes:.. It is incredible to me how you have done all of this without even having a DNA test which would not be able to tell you the above in such a way anyway.. If you would be so kind, please do tell us all where your "pure celt" friend purchased this test, for I think that we, and every geneticist in Europe would love to know of her discovery..

Get out of fantasy land, and come back to the real world. Study celt history, and the invasions of practically all European people.. Be proud of your ancestry, even if you won't be passing it on.. I'm sorry to snap on you, but it seems like you need some sort of awakening.. I'm really getting tired of your ridiculous claims which spit in the face of European history.. It is insulting to me and surely others as well..

I never claimed to be a pure Celt. I've always been aware of my Germanic ancestry.

Argyll
10-10-2011, 04:23 PM
If you would be so kind, please do tell us all where your "pure celt" friend purchased this test, for I think that we, and every geneticist in Europe would love to know of her discovery..
I believe it was 23andme or something like it.


Get out of fantasy land, and come back to the real world. Study celt history, and the invasions of practically all European people.. Be proud of your ancestry, even if you won't be passing it on.. I'm sorry to snap on you, but it seems like you need some sort of awakening.. I'm really getting tired of your ridiculous claims which spit in the face of European history.. It is insulting to me and surely others as well..

I am not in "fantasy" land. I have been reading and am reading multiple books about Celtic and British history. I am very well aware that multiple peoples have invaded the lands. I, however, do not believe that the Teutonic and Scandinavian peoples raped every single woman and/or made babies with them. Most history, especially that that is written by Bede (who was famously anti-Celtic), has written by the Germanic peoples. Not many actual Celts got a say in it.

Albion
10-10-2011, 04:28 PM
Celts: Ireland, Scotland, Wales, IoM, Cornwall and Wales.


Germanics: England, Germany, Netherlands, Flanders, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Switzerland et al...

Germanics - fuck yeah! :D

Argyll
10-10-2011, 04:32 PM
Celts: Ireland, Scotland, Wales, IoM, Cornwall and Wales, Germany, Northern Italy, Switzerland, Turkey, Hungary, Romania, Spain, et al.......


Germanics: England, Germany, Netherlands, Flanders, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, Switzerland et al...

Germanics - fuck yeah! :D

*corrections :)

Albion
10-10-2011, 04:40 PM
*corrections :)

Lol, and none of them are Celtic now because the Romans, Germanics, Dacians and others took them over or forced them out.

I don't see the attraction of the Celtic FRINGE to be honest.

Mordid
10-10-2011, 04:40 PM
I might be partly Celtic since Celts did made it to Silesia, Southern Poland.

Albion
10-10-2011, 04:41 PM
*corrections :)

Argyll
10-10-2011, 04:43 PM
Lol, and none of them are Celtic now because the Romans, Germanics, Dacians and others took them over or forced them out.

I don't see the attraction of the Celtic FRINGE to be honest.

You also forgot France, especially Brittany. Also, Galacia or however it is spelled, in Spain, would also have a high Celtic population, not purely Celtic, though, but Celtic nonetheless.

Albion
10-10-2011, 04:57 PM
You also forgot France, especially Brittany. Also, Galacia or however it is spelled, in Spain, would also have a high Celtic population, not purely Celtic, though, but Celtic nonetheless.

Yes, I did. Your "countries" suck, you're England's, Spain's and France's bitch. Doesn't that make you mad?! :D

Boudica
10-10-2011, 04:58 PM
I never claimed to be a pure Celt. I've always been aware of my Germanic ancestry.

Argyll, do you REALLY wish to say that you never claimed that when there was a vast amount of people in the cb when you did? So many that told you that you were wrong and even belittled you (when I didn't) that there is probably quite a few online at this very moment.. Ugh as to your other post, I'm not even going to respond to such ridiculousness.. I'll let Osweo or one of the others, because I'm arguing with a child.. The 23andme thing was hilarious though, because a majority of members including myself here have 23andme... I'm sure they'll be glad to hear about being able to find out if they are "pure celtic" from 23and me.. I'm done buddy..
:rolleyes2:

Boudica
10-10-2011, 05:00 PM
Lol, and none of them are Celtic now because the Romans, Germanics, Dacians and others took them over or forced them out.

I don't see the attraction of the Celtic FRINGE to be honest.

Did he seriously just add those countries to celtic countries.. omg..

Argyll
10-10-2011, 05:02 PM
Did he seriously just add those countries to celtic countries.. omg..

Look at the initial post. Those were places where the Celts settled.

Sahson
10-10-2011, 11:54 PM
Look at the initial post. Those were places where the Celts settled.

Hungary has no celtic blood. the people are Germanic ethnically, but the majority speak a Uralic language. They probably spoke a gothic, considering that Attilla in Attilla the hun, means Father. I can cross reference this the best surviving version of Gothic we have which uses Atta as father.

Also I've just decided I R PUERE NORDIK!!! nevermind about the R1b M222 Y-dna, 23andme got it wrong. I know I'm R1a1a2. :mad:

Argyll
10-11-2011, 11:40 AM
Hungary has no celtic blood. the people are Germanic ethnically, but the majority speak a Uralic language. They probably spoke a gothic, considering that Attilla in Attilla the hun, means Father. I can cross reference this the best surviving version of Gothic we have which uses Atta as father.

The Celts SETTLED THERE.


Also I've just decided I R PUERE NORDIK!!! nevermind about the R1b M222 Y-dna, 23andme got it wrong. I know I'm R1a1a2. :mad:

That's being childish.

Argyll
10-11-2011, 11:42 AM
Argyll, do you REALLY wish to say that you never claimed that when there was a vast amount of people in the cb when you did? So many that told you that you were wrong and even belittled you (when I didn't) that there is probably quite a few online at this very moment.. Ugh as to your other post, I'm not even going to respond to such ridiculousness.. I'll let Osweo or one of the others, because I'm arguing with a child.. The 23andme thing was hilarious though, because a majority of members including myself here have 23andme... I'm sure they'll be glad to hear about being able to find out if they are "pure celtic" from 23and me.. I'm done buddy..
:rolleyes2:

Please post evidence of this.

Sahson
10-11-2011, 12:16 PM
The Celts SETTLED THERE.

Yes, and your point? the culture is no longer there... the genes can barely be traced to the Celt's, because there's no celtic DNA or evidence of such a thing. There's a better chance of a Hungarian being related to ötzi the iceman, then there is of finding Celtic blood.

I'll show you Hungarian culture if I have to, to show you that it's more Uralic than anything. So there's no nonsense about whether it's Germanic or Celtic, because the culture is more akin to Urgic cultures.


That's being childish.

Nowhere near as childish as your faggotry in this thread.

Argyll
10-11-2011, 11:00 PM
Yes, and your point? the culture is no longer there... the genes can barely be traced to the Celt's, because there's no celtic DNA or evidence of such a thing. There's a better chance of a Hungarian being related to ötzi the iceman, then there is of finding Celtic blood.

I'll show you Hungarian culture if I have to, to show you that it's more Uralic than anything. So there's no nonsense about whether it's Germanic or Celtic, because the culture is more akin to Urgic cultures.



Nowhere near as childish as your faggotry in this thread.

J2ust because you're anti-Celtic sprang't mean everything revolves arpund your ideals :cool:
And you're calling MY stuff faggotry??? :rotfl:

Sahson
10-12-2011, 12:24 AM
J2ust because you're anti-Celtic sprang't mean everything revolves arpund your ideals :cool:
And you're calling MY stuff faggotry??? :rotfl:

No, on the contrary. I admire the Celts for they brought to society. I like their culture much more than the Roman culture. If it wasn't for the celts we wouldn't be using the georgian calendar, since it was inspired off of the Coligny calendar.

The Celts were very scientific minds of their time, and innovative. However the Hungarians today are not Celtic. Yes everything revolves around my ideas, when in fact it is you whom is entrapped in a bubble of fantasy. Also I personally don't appreciate you claiming my hungarian ancestry is something that it is not.

Imagine if I went to you and said "oh you're slavic because the slavs once lived where you are from?" I bet you'd love it too. The issue is Argyll is you're the one who has an emotional attachment to the Celts and believing everything your eyes consume that you are void of any rationale or able to allow other ideas and thoughts come into consideration from what you have read. It's like your actually in a religion!

Celtic art being inspired by Germanic?!? oh my perish the thought! :eek: But backtracking to my point about the Hungarians. It is an Ugric culture, with Germanic and some slavic genetic input among the populace of Hungary. There was nothing Celtic about them. Yes Celts were there, but not any more, and the people there today aren't from that antiquated Continental Celt s.

Let me show you some of the Traditional hungarian folk dress.

http://www.folk-art-hungary.com/images/magyar_folk_kalocsa.jpg
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/50/136491114_22c93414eb.jpg
http://www.vivid.ro/images/98/IMG_0270.jpg
http://www.visualphotos.com/photo/1x6947642/farmers_with_traditional_hungarian_dress_big_plain _m33-545610.jpg
http://www.visualphotos.com/photo/1x6947634/farmer_with_traditional_hungarian_dress_and_oxen_m 33-545602.jpg
http://www.wordsareimportant.com/photos/h41.JPG


What's Celtic about these?

Argyll
10-12-2011, 12:31 AM
Holy good gods, do I have to beat it into your head with a fucking two by four??? I said fucking SETTLED. SETTLED!!!!!!!1 I did not say that Hungarians are part Celtic.

And really? Does everyone's art have to be inspired by someone else's????

AussieScott
10-12-2011, 03:15 AM
Our cities aren't huge, I don't think. Anyway yeah most of Scotland is countryside, the Highlands are well worth a look, especially if you can get a car. Driving through the mountains and forests. :)

There's a Scottish lass down the road who married an Australian farmer, she had to live in the town to begin with as the lack of people was a culture shock coming from the city of Glasgow. Now she is able to live in the bush, where your neighbour could be 3 to 5 km away. :thumbs up

AussieScott
10-12-2011, 03:19 AM
I preferred it out in the Highlands and islands, personally--but the cities were nice too, of course. I was able to get a good dose of both quiet seclusion out yonder and culture/nightlife in the cities.

As I've said before, I grew up/live deep in the coutryside here, so that sort of setting is second nature to me. The Middle of Nowhere is just fine. I was there on a bit of a spiritual quest and I found the most rewarding locales (that I visited anyway) were Trotternish on Skye, Glen Etive and the moors around the little village in Perthshire that my paternal line came from.

I didn't make it to Inverness, although I considered it. I got hung up longer than I should have in Fort William waiting for Ben Nevis to clear off (never did) and then once I got out to Skye, I found it hard to leave. I also spent more time in Glasgow that I thought I would have. A woman can do that to a fellow. ;)

I'd have to bring my family, so it would be quite expensive for me, I keep forgetting to ask Granddad about the cousins I have in the Isle of Sky. :rolleyes:

I'm very jealous as it sounds like a great time. I like the cold more then the Australian heat.

AussieScott
10-12-2011, 03:31 AM
Lol, I remember someone saying what's considered a medium town in Scotland would be a large village in England. :D Some would say that's good thing.



Forests are nice so long as they're not carr, scrub or some ugly foreign conifer plantation (which many in Scotland are).
Scotland's native woodlands are nice, the Scots Pine forests and the temperate rainforests on the west coast (guess why they're called that :D)

Mountains are good, I can't stand lowlands which is what the Southern / Midland two thirds of England is.
I like Moorland and rocky outcrops, crags and all that. Dark Peak is my country.

The vast seas of rough, featureless grass though which cover large areas of Wales ("the desert of Wales") and some areas of Scotland and England are very boring though. They're high up but just very dull, you can see for miles, it's like a steppe or prairie, a wet one.

If you ever visit Australia you would love South West Australia, full of green grass, granite out crops, Granite islands that pop out of the sea like they have been masoned into ovals and native temperate rain forest, with trees that grow up to 70m in height. The only place that has higher trees in Aussie land is Tasmania where they grow to 85m. Nice and cool down there to.

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel/Australia_and_Oceania/Australia/State_of_Western_Australia/Walpole-1868457/Things_To_Do-Walpole-TG-C-1.html

http://www.rainbowcoast.com.au/

Lots of hippies down there to though. :)

Sahson
10-12-2011, 04:27 AM
Holy good gods, do I have to beat it into your head with a fucking two by four??? I said fucking SETTLED. SETTLED!!!!!!!1 I did not say that Hungarians are part Celtic.

And really? Does everyone's art have to be inspired by someone else's????

That's not the point. the original point of Albion's post was highlighting the regional extent of the cultures today in the modern world, not from years beyond. look at it here (http://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?p=551795#post551795).

He was talking about the areas Germanics and celts settled but where they have settled and where the culture continues to breathe in Europe. if we wanted to talk about where Germanics settled we could mention Russia, Romania, Hungary, Scilly parts of the balkans. But the Germanics there have little to no significance there. You're just throwing a red herring fallacy into this argument derailing the intention of the original post of the extension of Celtic and Germanic culture.

Celtic culture is non-existant there, but even before the roman empire expanded you are truly scrapping round the bucket for any celtic impact in hungary. meanwhile in Spain you have the Tartessian culture.

also so more food for thought, about Celts not being pure celtic.


The genetic evidence shows that three quarters of our ancestors came to this corner of Europe as hunter-gatherers, between 15,000 and 7,500 years ago, after the melting of the ice caps but before the land broke away from the mainland and divided into islands. Our subsequent separation from Europe has preserved a genetic time capsule of southwestern Europe during the ice age, which we share most closely with the former ice-age refuge in the Basque country. The first settlers were unlikely to have spoken a Celtic language but possibly a tongue related to the unique Basque language.

Source: Prospect Magazine (http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/2006/10/mythsofbritishancestry/)

Further scientific reading - clicky (http://killarney-ireland.info/genealogy/dark-irish-celt-genealogy.html)


If you ever visit Australia you would love South West Australia, full of green grass, granite out crops, Granite islands that pop out of the sea like they have been masoned into ovals and native temperate rain forest, with trees that grow up to 70m in height. The only place that has higher trees in Aussie land is Tasmania where they grow to 85m. Nice and cool down there to.

Lots of hippies down there to though. :)

Yes the south-west of WA is rather nice. I like Pemberton area the most. the rolling hills, the tall Karri trees, and the lovely weather is so much nicer than Perth's med.

AussieScott
10-12-2011, 05:03 AM
Yes the south-west of WA is rather nice. I like Pemberton area the most. the rolling hills, the tall Karri trees, and the lovely weather is so much nicer than Perth's med.

Oh yeah the temperature is great, that's why I wanted to live down there, plus the obvious wonderful, bountiful country side, at the time due to the mining boom it was just to expensive. The subtropical temperatures where I live now are a bit to hot for my liking, though I'm acclimatised now, have been for a long time.

I find Perth cold in the shade on a pleasant summers day now.

Argyll
10-12-2011, 12:00 PM
The genetic evidence shows that three quarters of our ancestors came to this corner of Europe as hunter-gatherers, between 15,000 and 7,500 years ago, after the melting of the ice caps but before the land broke away from the mainland and divided into islands. Our subsequent separation from Europe has preserved a genetic time capsule of southwestern Europe during the ice age, which we share most closely with the former ice-age refuge in the Basque country. The first settlers were unlikely to have spoken a Celtic language but possibly a tongue related to the unique Basque language.

Besides, I believe the Celts originated in the British Isles somewhere anyway. I believe they came from the Megolithic peoples. But, seeing as I'm religious, I take most scientific stuff with a grain of salt. Evidence? In "Who Were The Celts?" by Kevin Duffy, he notes that spiral pattterns on New Grange, which is more ancient than the set time of the Celts comming over to the British Isles, shares the same spiral pattern that Celtic women wore on their jewelry.
So, I'm pretty much done arguing with anyone in this thread. I didn't mean to get the Teutonics in such a tizzy and get their knickers twisted.

Mordid
10-12-2011, 12:01 PM
Today I'm gonna get laid with redhair chick, so I'm pretty Celtic.

Peasant
10-12-2011, 12:13 PM
Besides, I believe the Celts originated in the British Isles somewhere anyway.

WIKIPEDIA NOW! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celts

Anthropologique
10-12-2011, 12:57 PM
WIKIPEDIA NOW! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celts

The Celts may have originated in SW Iberia, according to the Atlantic School. More than likely there were two Celtic homelands, Central Europe and the Atlantic Facade region.

Osweo
10-12-2011, 07:33 PM
Besides, I believe the Celts originated in the British Isles somewhere anyway. I believe they came from the Megolithic peoples. But, seeing as I'm religious, I take most scientific stuff with a grain of salt. Evidence? In "Who Were The Celts?" by Kevin Duffy, he notes that spiral pattt erns on New Grange, which is more ancient than the set time of the Celts comming over to the British Isles, shares the same spiral pattern that Celtic women wore on their jewelry.
So, I'm pretty much done arguing with anyone in this thread. I didn't mean to get the Teutonics in such a tizzy and get their knickers twisted.

Is cake-mix 'a cake'? Is flour or sugar the ancestor of the cake!?

Stop talking shite.


The Celts may have originated in SW Iberia, according to the Atlantic School. More than likely there were two Celtic homelands, Central Europe and the Atlantic Facade region.
You see the Atlantic Facade as a secondary expansion point?

I'm not buying this SW Iberia stuff. Doesn't explain how Celtic culture came to dominate Gaul, Bohemia and the Danube valley, and yet leave Iberia so diverse as it was.

Argyll
10-12-2011, 07:50 PM
The Celts may have originated in SW Iberia, according to the Atlantic School. More than likely there were two Celtic homelands, Central Europe and the Atlantic Facade region.

Or maybe we will never know where the Celts came from. We don't have to know everything ;)

Allenson
10-12-2011, 11:05 PM
Today I'm gonna get laid with redhair chick, so I'm pretty Celtic.

Just oozing Celtishness.

Osweo
10-12-2011, 11:19 PM
Just oozing Celtishness.

or celti-ness... :tongue

Piparskeggr
10-12-2011, 11:35 PM
Not having been raised in a Celtic culture, I'll have to say 0%.

If we are just looking at blood lines, 25%.

Anthropologique
10-12-2011, 11:56 PM
Is cake-mix 'a cake'? Is flour or sugar the ancestor of the cake!?

Stop talking shite.


You see the Atlantic Facade as a secondary expansion point?

I'm not buying this SW Iberia stuff. Doesn't explain how Celtic culture came to dominate Gaul, Bohemia and the Danube valley, and yet leave Iberia so diverse as it was.

At the present time, no one can be certain where Celticity developed initially.

Iberia was not culturally diverse along the far west. In that region, nearly all of the population was Celtic or Proto-Celtic at one time. I think that Celticity spread along the Atlantic Facade through extensive trade networks. Gaul also had an impact on Iberia.

Anthropologique
10-12-2011, 11:57 PM
So what does Celtic ooze look like?:wink

Peasant
10-13-2011, 11:52 AM
I'm so Celtic I drink Guinness.


So what does Celtic ooze look like?:wink

Green.

Albion
10-13-2011, 05:35 PM
If you ever visit Australia you would love South West Australia, full of green grass, granite out crops, Granite islands that pop out of the sea like they have been masoned into ovals and native temperate rain forest, with trees that grow up to 70m in height. The only place that has higher trees in Aussie land is Tasmania where they grow to 85m. Nice and cool down there to.

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel/Australia_and_Oceania/Australia/State_of_Western_Australia/Walpole-1868457/Things_To_Do-Walpole-TG-C-1.html

http://www.rainbowcoast.com.au/

Lots of hippies down there to though. :)

Tasmania looks god, I've been interested in there before. The western and southern wilderness areas of the island are nice.


He was talking about the areas Germanics and celts settled but where they have settled and where the culture continues to breathe in Europe. if we wanted to talk about where Germanics settled we could mention Russia, Romania, Hungary, Scilly parts of the balkans. But the Germanics there have little to no significance there. You're just throwing a red herring fallacy into this argument derailing the intention of the original post of the extension of Celtic and Germanic culture.

Indeed. No body cares where the Celts have been, we care where the Celtic culture is now.
Germanic culture occupies a large and very influential block of countries in NW Europe, Celtic culture occupies the periphery of Europe, countries historically downtrodden by England, France or Spain.


Celtic culture is non-existant there, but even before the roman empire expanded you are truly scrapping round the bucket for any celtic impact in hungary.

:thumb001:

The Roman Emoire and Germanic expansion were the death of Celtic culture outside of the British Isles and a few Peninsulas on the edge of Europe (Brittany).
Even in France, the strongest of the Celts - the Gauls have been romanised.


I believe they came from the Megolithic peoples.

Stonehenge was ancient to the Celts and was here before their culture was.

The "Celts" of Britain and indeed the "Germanics" (English) largely descend from the stone age colonists who came here after the LGM ("Ice Age") anyway.
They came from two directions - the Basque country and a smaller migration into eastern England and Scotland from the Rhine Delta (which explains some of the pre-Germanic genetic similarities between E. England and the Netherlands).

That means they pre-date even the megaliths which came a few millennia latter, probably as a adopted cultural phenomenon.

Celtic culture latter spread to the British Isles via small migrations and finally so too did Germanic culture which was spread by more substantial migrations into the east of England.

However most Brits are still descended from the first colonisers with Celtic and Germanic cultures simply being just superimposed on an existing population.

Argyll
10-13-2011, 05:44 PM
Tasmania looks god, I've been interested in there before. The western and southern wilderness areas of the island are nice.



Indeed. No body cares where the Celts have been, we care where the Celtic culture is now.
Germanic culture occupies a large and very influential block of countries in NW Europe, Celtic culture occupies the periphery of Europe, countries historically downtrodden by England, France or Spain.



:thumb001:

The Roman Emoire and Germanic expansion were the death of Celtic culture outside of the British Isles and a few Peninsulas on the edge of Europe (Brittany).
Even in France, the strongest of the Celts - the Gauls have been romanised.



Stonehenge was ancient to the Celts and was here before their culture was.

The "Celts" of Britain and indeed the "Germanics" (English) largely descend from the stone age colonists who came here after the LGM ("Ice Age") anyway.
They came from two directions - the Basque country and a smaller migration into eastern England and Scotland from the Rhine Delta (which explains some of the pre-Germanic genetic similarities between E. England and the Netherlands).

That means they pre-date even the megaliths which came a few millennia latter, probably as a adopted cultural phenomenon.

Celtic culture latter spread to the British Isles via small migrations and finally so too did Germanic culture which was spread by more substantial migrations into the east of England.

However most Brits are still descended from the first colonisers with Celtic and Germanic cultures simply being just superimposed on an existing population.

Well, I believe that Celtic culture evolved from those megalithic peoples.

Sahson
10-13-2011, 06:31 PM
Stonehenge was ancient to the Celts and was here before their culture was.

The "Celts" of Britain and indeed the "Germanics" (English) largely descend from the stone age colonists who came here after the LGM ("Ice Age") anyway.
They came from two directions - the Basque country and a smaller migration into eastern England and Scotland from the Rhine Delta (which explains some of the pre-Germanic genetic similarities between E. England and the Netherlands).

That means they pre-date even the megaliths which came a few millennia latter, probably as a adopted cultural phenomenon.


Actually I had a word with Dr. Daniel Bradley about this recently, I'll quote him word for word.


Dear Mr Walløe,

I am of limited help as we have not been very active in this area of late, and things move on. I'll attach a recent paper. My own view is that we really won't know much more about origins until the database of ancient DNA specimens begins to fill out, as it surely will.

best wishes

Dan Bradley

While some data suggest R1b is from North africa other matches up the Kurgan hypothesis, so... if the kurgan is right, than that makes Celtic all more IE, as well as Germanic - thus no Germanic substrate :(

However thats the thing Celtic has a better legitimacy of being IE than Germanic languages do. So while the people might not be Aryans, they still speak an IE language. xD

Albion
10-13-2011, 06:31 PM
Well, I believe that Celtic culture evolved from those megalithic peoples.

I very much doubt it.

Anyway, if we want to talk of Celtic migrations there was one - of the Belgae into southern England.

Sahson
10-13-2011, 06:40 PM
I very much doubt it.

Anyway, if we want to talk of Celtic migrations there was one - of the Belgae into southern England.

http://www.stclairresearch.com/images/pathR1b.jpg

Albion
10-13-2011, 07:54 PM
http://www.stclairresearch.com/images/pathR1b.jpg

What is the purpose of this?

Osweo
10-13-2011, 09:50 PM
Anyway, if we want to talk of Celtic migrations there was one - of the Belgae into southern England.
Fir BOLG! ;)

Albion
10-13-2011, 10:06 PM
Fir BOLG! ;)

...is corrupted folk memory of the actual post-LGM and subsequent settlements of Britain in my opinion.

Osweo
10-13-2011, 10:45 PM
...is corrupted folk memory of the actual post-LGM and subsequent settlements of Britain in my opinion.

In IREland? :confused:

Albion
10-13-2011, 10:50 PM
In IREland? :confused:

I meant to say British Isles.

Osweo
10-14-2011, 12:40 AM
I meant to say British Isles.

But why go on about glaciations in the case of the Fir Bolg? It's a pretty straightforward case of recentISH Iron Age folk memory, n'est pas?

Anthropologique
10-14-2011, 06:33 PM
Stange map.

Sahson
10-14-2011, 08:42 PM
Stange map.

I don't think so, it makes some sense to Dan Bradley's R1b projections it also correlates to the Kurgan hypothesis and help explain R1b. the came from the caspian sea, then there was the LGM so R1b's retreated to the penisula, and then after expanded.

Albion
10-15-2011, 04:23 PM
But why go on about glaciations in the case of the Fir Bolg? It's a pretty straightforward case of recentISH Iron Age folk memory, n'est pas?

I highly doubt that it is so, Iron Age migrations were largely insignificant - especially in Ireland. As you may be able to tell, no I don't support that the Irish came from Galicia.
I go with the theory that Q-Celtic came first and then changed to P-Celtic over much of its range due to contact between the Celtic tribes of these areas.

I think the Irish settlement myths explain more than just the Iron Age, I think they start after the LGM and end at the Iron Age with the arrival of the Belgae in England.

A casual analysis:


Before the flood

Flood of water or ice (glaciation)? Britain was inhabited before the last "Ice Age" as we all know.


A second tradition, a variant of the Cessair legend he found in the Book of Druimm Snechta, said that the first inhabitants of Ireland were led by a woman called Banba, who gave her name to the island. She came with a hundred and fifty women and three men, who lived there for forty years before they all died of plague, two hundred years before the flood. Another tradition he records, but does not source, is that Ireland was discovered by three fishermen from Iberia who were washed there by a storm. They returned to Iberia, brought their wives and settled in Ireland a year before the flood, when they were drowned

Iberia: Post-LGM re-settlement of Britain was mainly from Iberia.

Flood: Rising sea levels after LGM. Most importantly, folk memory of the Storegga Slide (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Storegga_slide) (which anhialated Doggerland and caused an incredible Tsunami).


He also says that, according to "some of our authors", the Fomorians, led by Cichol Gricenchos, settled in Ireland a hundred years after the flood and lived there for two hundred years until they were defeated by Partholón and his followers in the Battle of Mag Ithe. The Fomorians are said to have lived on "fish and fowl",[7]

Hunter Gatherers who settled Britain after the LGM who would have had a similar diet and existence to the tribes of British Colombia and in some places maybe permanent settlements too.


and Partholón is said in the Lebor Gabála to have introduced cattle and houses to Ireland:

Arrival of farming with a few immigrants, early Megaliths?


Said to have been a descendant of Magog, son of Japheth, son of Noah, Partholón is said to have sailed from Greece, via Sicily, to Iberia, and from there to Ireland. He landed at Imber Scéne (Kenmare, County Kerry). His four oxen were the first cattle in Ireland. One of his followers, Brea, was the first to build a house, and another, Samailiath, was the first to brew ale

Farmers


Four more plains were cleared during Partholón's lifetime, and seven lakes burst from the ground. He and all his followers – five thousand men and four thousand women – died of plague in a single week, with one exception – Tuan mac Cairill, who, like Fintan, survived through a series of transformations and told the story of his people to St Finnian.[9]

Deterioration of climate. Climate becomes colder and wetter which we know happened.
The British Isles climate peaked at a warm temperature range and then declined from there leading to the spread of moorland, bogs ('seven lakes burst from the ground') and rough grassland (plains).
We also know of this because Lime trees stopped germinating in large numbers in England, they need some warmth.
Plague would have been set on by overpopulation and famine caused by the deterioration of large areas of the country leading to food shortage.


Thirty years later another group, led by Nemed, arrived. The Lebor Gabála describes them as Greeks from Scythia, and says they sailed with forty-four ships, but only one ship survived to reach Ireland. Four lakes burst from the ground in Nemed's time, twelve plains were cleared, and three battles won against the Fomorians. Nemed eventually died of plague, and his descendants were subjected by the Fomorian leaders Morc and Conand, who demanded two-thirds of their children, wheat and milk as tribute.

Beaker culture and small migrations?


The next invaders were the Fir Bolg, who first established kingship and a system of justice in Ireland. One of their kings, Rinnal, was the first to use iron spear-points[citation needed]. According to a controversial theory of T. F. O'Rahilly, they represent a genuine historical people, the Builg or Belgae, associated further with the Iverni.

Arrival of a few Celtic immigrants who spread the culture to Ireland (which would have fused with the native one).


The Fir Bolg were displaced by the Tuatha Dé Danann or "Peoples of the goddess Danu", descendants of Nemed, who either came to Ireland from the north on dark clouds or burnt their ships on the shore to ensure they wouldn't retreat. They defeated the Fir Bolg king, Eochaid mac Eirc, in the first Battle of Magh Tuiredh, but their own king, Nuada, lost an arm in the battle. As he was no longer physically perfect he lost the kingship, and his replacement, the half-Fomorian Bres, became the first Tuatha Dé High King of Ireland.

...

The Tuatha Dé are said to have brought chariots and druidry to Ireland.


Internal migrations of tribes between Britain and Ireland - Galloway and Ulster and England or Wales and Leinster (Brigantes).


The Tuatha Dé Danann were themselves displaced by the Milesians, descendants of Míl Espáine, a warrior who travelled the ancient world before settling in Iberia. Míl died without ever seeing Ireland, but his uncle Íth saw the island from a tower and led an advance force to scout it out. The three kings of the Tuatha Dé, Mac Cuill, Mac Cecht and Mac Gréine, had Íth killed. After his body was returned to Iberia, Míl's eight sons led a full-scale invasion.

Roman adventurers who establish tribes and petty kingdoms. (Compare to Normans) Yup, controversial eh?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mythological_Cycle

Those are just my casual observations anyway, no doubt you'll pick fault. :D

Lábaru
10-16-2011, 01:29 PM
The language is Spanish, but this will interest Falkata and other Europeans, I think.

Celtic legacy in Galicia.

Ut1CCvmM3Nc


------> http://www.elmundo.es/elmundo/2011/10/14/ciencia/1318603610.html

Belenus
03-15-2012, 11:27 PM
I have a question that maybe someone here can help me with. Was there an actual Celtic phenotype, or were the Celts a more diverse grouping of European types? For instance, my family comes from Ireland and Scotland, with some possible distant Viking heritage (based on a surname that sprung up in Waterford when the Vikings founded it and which translates as 'raider/plunderer'). So it's fair to say I'm about as close to a pure Celt as you can get. But my phenotype is predominantly Atlantid. I look like an indigenous western European, as does my mother. My looks are apparently comparable to those of Portuguese and Spanish, etc.

I'm just wondering if I should really consider myself a Celt or something older, predating Celtic settlement of the British Isles...

Osweo
03-15-2012, 11:41 PM
I'm just wondering if I should really consider myself a Celt or something older, predating Celtic settlement of the British Isles...

You're both.

Belenus
03-15-2012, 11:46 PM
You're both.

Heh, fair enough. It's a shame that so little cultural inheritance remains of the pre-Celtic inhabitants of western Europe. But countries with significant Atlantid blood have been some of the most powerful and successful in European history, so whatever - I guess that's all the heritage that counts.

Bobby Martnen
02-22-2018, 06:14 AM
Slightly over 1/4

A_Magnus7
02-22-2018, 06:19 AM
North Eastern Italian Celtics->Venetics, Rhaetians and Carni

Bobby Martnen
02-22-2018, 06:49 AM
:celtic::celtic::celtic::celtic::celtic::celtic:

Stearsolina
02-22-2018, 06:56 AM
Some small percent, maybe around 5-8 %, mostly from southern German ancestry.

Bobby Martnen
02-22-2018, 07:02 AM
WE WUZ CELTZ N SHEEEEEEIT!!!!!

oszkar07
02-22-2018, 08:53 AM
Considering I am half British I would expect I should be partly Celtic but I really have no idea as to how much ... on any calculator I dont generally cluster too closely to Celtic populations .

Are there any specific gedmatch calcs or others that give good indication ?

Creoda
06-07-2021, 03:11 PM
I don't consider myself Celtic, nor identify with it. Celtic languages and culture are alien to me and I don't have a lot of affinity for it. I have lots of 'Celtic' ancestry and heritage, but then so does most of Western Europe. It ceased to be a cohesive ethno-cultural grouping 2000+ years ago.

Gaelic specifically is a bit different, I am heavily Gaelic in blood and looks as well as my surname, so I do identify with it, but still I am removed from that culture, and it feels largely alien.

Veljo
06-07-2021, 03:13 PM
100%