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View Full Version : What should happen to Subkarpatia?



Szegedist
05-06-2013, 07:16 PM
The lands of Transcarpatia for a long time were part of the Kingdom of Hungary(since 895) which eventually transformed into the Hungarian part of Austria-Hungary until the latter's demise at the end of World War I. This region was briefly part of the short-lived West Ukrainian National Republic in 1918. The region was soon annexed by Romania by the end of that year, mostly the eastern portion such as Rakhiv and Khust.

It was later recaptured by Hungarian Soviet Republic in the summer of 1919. Finally, under the name Subcarpathian Rus (Czech: Podkarpatská Rus), after the Paris Peace Conference of 1919 it was annexed to Czechoslovakia with a supposedly equal level of autonomy as Slovakia and Bohemia-Moravia-Czech Silesia (Czech lands). Nevertheless, such autonomy was granted as late as in 1938, after detrimental events of the Munich Conference; until then this land was administered directly from Prague by the government-appointed provincial presidents (zemští prezidenti) and/or elected governors (guvernéři).

During the World War II German occupation of Czechoslovakia, the southern part of the region was awarded to Hungary under the First Vienna Award in 1938. The remaining portion was constituted as an autonomous region of the short-lived Second Czechoslovak Republic. After the occupation of Bohemia and Moravia on March 15, 1939 and the Slovak declaration of an independent state, Carpathian Ruthenia declared its independence as the Republic of Carpatho-Ukraine, but was immediately occupied and later annexed by Hungary.

In October 1944 the Sub-Carpathian Ukraine was occupied by the Red Army. In June 29, 1945, Czechoslovak President Edvard Beneš formally signed a treaty ceding the area and the next month it was united with the Ukrainian SSR through the "Manifest for unification with the Soviet Ukraine" that was accepted by the 1st Congress of People's Committees of Sub-Carpathian Ukraine without any knowledge of common people. It was then incorporated or better said annexed into the Ukrainian SSR as Zakarpattia Oblast. After the break-up of the Soviet Union, it became part of independent Ukraine.

After the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991, Ukraine held an independence referendum in which the residents of Zakarpattia were asked about the Zakarpattia Oblast Council's proposal for self-rule.
About 78% of the oblast's population voted in favor of autonomy; however, it was not granted. There were also propositions of separating from Ukraine to rejoin Czechoslovakia, but after Czechoslovakia's dissolution into the Czech Republic and the Slovak Republic (1993), these ideas have been rendered largely moot.

On October 25, 2008, delegates to the Congress Of Carpathian Ruthenians declared the formation of the Republic of Carpathian Ruthenia. The prosecutor’s office of Zakarpattia region has filed a case against Russian Orthodox Church priest Dmytro Sidor and Yevhen Zhupan, an Our Ukraine party deputy of the Zakarpattia regional council and chairman of the People’s Council of Ruthenians, on charges of encroaching on the territorial integrity and inviolability of Ukraine.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/Map_of_Ukraine_political_simple_Oblast_Transkarpat ien.png

Szegedist
05-06-2013, 07:27 PM
I would support Autonomous area within Hungary.

Swearengen
05-10-2013, 06:54 AM
It should and will stay within Ukraine.

It's linguistically, culturally, and ethnically ukrainian. Kind of a dumb question.

Szegedist
05-10-2013, 03:11 PM
It should and will stay within Ukraine.

It's linguistically, culturally, and ethnically ukrainian. Kind of a dumb question.

It is not historically Ukrainian, and the population there are Rusyns, not Ukrainians.

Swearengen
05-10-2013, 04:55 PM
It was originally slavic before it became part of hungary. How far back in history should we go? It makes absolutely no sense for it to be part of any country other than ukraine.

80.5% Ukrainian
0.8% Rusyn
0.5% Slovak
0.3% German
12.1% Hungarian
2.6% Romanian
2.5% Russian
1.1% Gypsy
0.4% Other

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carpathian_Ruthenia

Do you even know what Rusyns are? They're ethnic Ukrainians who wanted to keep their name. They have always spoken a dialect of Ukrainian. However, as you can see, most Rusyns now identify as Ukrainian.


Carpatho-Rusyns descend from a minority of Ruthenians who did not adopt the use of the ethnonym "Ukrainian" in the early twentieth century.


Until the middle of the 19th century, ethnic Ukrainians referred to themselves as Ruthenians ("Rusyns" in Ukrainian, "Rutén" in Hungary)... Today a minority group continues to use the ethnonym Rusyn for self-identification. These are primarily people living in the mountainous Transcarpathian region of western Ukraine and adjacent areas in Slovakia who use it to distinguish themselves from Ukrainians living in the central regions of Ukraine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rusyns

Windischer
05-12-2013, 01:26 PM
it would be good for them to join slovakia as an autonomous region (slovakia should have more autonomous regions, or administrative branch autonomies).
it would be bad for slovakia, though - poor, very sovietized and ukrainized region would be a massive burden.

the whole argument with rusyn-ukrainian name change is invalid in this matter. am eager to see your analogy for slavs, since some slavs still identify as slavs while others do not. i think results of this analogy would be quite laughable.

also good luck posting deformed ukrainian census data. LOL in (post)soviet ukraine, you dont make a census. census makes you. literally.