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Loki
09-01-2013, 07:08 PM
Do Christians, Muslims and Jews worship the same God? (http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/09/01/do-christians-muslims-and-jews-worship-the-same-god/?hpt=hp_inthenews)

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/130830155448-one-god-story-top.jpg

(CNN) – Sunni and Shia Muslims are killing each other in several nations, most notably in Syria's escalating civil war.

Coptic Christians churches are being torched in Egypt.

In Israel, what passes for peace talks has restarted after years of murder and brutality.

Religion is a common thread in each conflict. But why? Don’t these folks worship the same deity?

After all, Jews, Christians and Muslims all trace their faiths back to a fellow named Abraham, whom they all claim was chosen for special treatment by the Almighty. Why can’t they all get along?

Not academic

The “same God” question is one theologians have hammered at for as long as there have been enough religions for the query to make sense.

The question is hardly academic, though. In fact, a number of politicians, religious leaders and scholars have expressed hope in recent years that a convincing answer on the God question might dampen the violence committed in His name.

.....

Final answer

So do Christians Muslims, and Jews, really all worship the same God?

In two major volumes on the subject recently published by scholars from various faiths and traditions, including Volf’s, the most inclusive response from these scholars is basically: Yes, and it’s our God.

This is not a new way of answering the question.

In 1076, Pope Gregory VII wrote this to a Muslim leader: “We believe in and confess one God, admittedly, in a different way…”

But like many other religious leaders on all sides of the argument, Gregory insisted that his version of the Almighty is the one whom the others are unknowingly and incompletely worshiping.

A less exclusivist set of religions might shrug off the differences. But all three claim to have the only “True Faith.”

So do all three faiths actually worship the same deity, whether they call him God or Allah or Adonai?

God only knows.

Kiyant
09-01-2013, 07:10 PM
Allah just means God in Arabic also christian arabs also pray to Allah my people say Tanri to God.

Shah-Jehan
09-01-2013, 07:12 PM
Yes, according to Islam all people of the book/ dhimmis worship the same God...

Manifest Destiny
09-01-2013, 07:13 PM
Yes, according to Islam all people of the book/ dhimmis worship the same God...

But who authorized Islam to speak for Jews and Christians?

Wadaad
09-01-2013, 07:14 PM
Muslims and Jews worship the same monotheistic divinity.

With Christians it gets murky...

Shah-Jehan
09-01-2013, 07:15 PM
But who authorized Islam to speak for Jews and Christians?

"Say: 'O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah.' If then they turn back, say ye: 'Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah's Will).'" (S. 3:64)

Loki
09-01-2013, 07:15 PM
Muslims and Jews worship the same monotheistic divinity.

With Christians it gets murky...

Good point.

Gorštak
09-01-2013, 07:19 PM
I think that God is one and good.
But people are bad.
It suck when those who pretend to be greatest believers do bad things in the name of faith.
People in the name of God did a lot of bad things during history. Some of them do it even today.

armenianbodyhair
09-01-2013, 07:23 PM
The answer is yes.

Manifest Destiny
09-01-2013, 07:29 PM
"Say: 'O People of the Book! come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than Allah.' If then they turn back, say ye: 'Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to Allah's Will).'" (S. 3:64)

That doesn't answer the question or prove anything.

Hayalet
09-01-2013, 07:43 PM
It is arguable that no two people worship the same god.

Ianus
09-01-2013, 08:22 PM
Yes, they are abrahmitic religions and have a common origin.

Pontios
09-01-2013, 08:23 PM
Of course, but in a different way...

Hadouken
09-01-2013, 08:25 PM
That doesn't answer the question or prove anything.

in the bible and quran it is written about the same god

the main difference is that christians belive in trinity and muslims dont

so calm down

Manifest Destiny
09-01-2013, 08:37 PM
in the bible and quran it is written about the same god

the main difference is that christians belive in trinity and muslims dont

so calm down

The Bible actually says it's about the same god as the Koran? Who knew?

Wadaad
09-01-2013, 08:39 PM
The Bible actually says it's about the same god as the Koran? Who knew?
Do you actually have an argument or you just gonna continue being a smart ass?

Pontios
09-01-2013, 08:39 PM
I can see both sides of this though because in all three religions, they describe God a different way... Especially if you compare Islam to Christianity and Judaism.

Krampus
09-01-2013, 08:40 PM
yessss

Manifest Destiny
09-01-2013, 08:42 PM
Do you actually have an argument or you just gonna continue being a smart ass?

I just want proof. I've heard Muslims make this claim many times, but don't know any Christians who feel the same way. Especially since the religions seem so different in what they require of followers. Is their desert god suffering from multiple personalities?

Benacer
09-01-2013, 08:48 PM
Yes and no.

Hadouken
09-01-2013, 08:48 PM
elohim , jesus : "elahi elahi lema shabaqtani" = allah

Benacer
09-01-2013, 08:49 PM
Is their desert god suffering from multiple personalities?
The Abrahamic God always has, actually. It's what you are to expect when you merge the whole Canaanite pantheon into a single entity. :P

Shah-Jehan
09-01-2013, 08:52 PM
I just want proof. I've heard Muslims make this claim many times, but don't know any Christians who feel the same way.
All Abrahamic Gods are to be the same as there is only one God. Go ask Jews if they follow the same God as Christians...the answer will propably be negative, but,Christians claim to worship the same God as Jews, the difference being they also follow Jesus, who is the "son of God" according to Christianity but, not in Judaism...Therefore, the preceding variations of one religion will always claim to worship a different God...

Especially since the religions seem so different in what they require of followers. Is their desert god suffering from multiple personalities?
It's not much different if you look at it in a way, yes, DUH there are several differences but, they all have the characteristics of the Abrahamic Monotheistic religions...

KrashNick
09-01-2013, 08:55 PM
Interesting .... i found this :D


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeR_fU1acjM

Blackout
09-01-2013, 09:19 PM
All Abrahamic Gods are to be the same as there is only one God. Go ask Jews if they follow the same God as Christians...the answer will propably be negative, but,Christians claim to worship the same God as Jews, the difference being they also follow Jesus, who is the "son of God" according to Christianity but, not in Judaism...Therefore, the preceding variations of one religion will always claim to worship a different God...

Christians also believe in the same God however they call Him the 'Father' (سبحانه و تعالى). Where they differ from Jews and Muslims is when they also worship Jesus (عليه السلام) and the Holy Spirit [Trinity].

Mason8
09-02-2013, 01:00 AM
Do Christians, Muslims and Jews worship the same God? (http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/09/01/do-christians-muslims-and-jews-worship-the-same-god/?hpt=hp_inthenews)

http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/130830155448-one-god-story-top.jpg

(CNN) – Sunni and Shia Muslims are killing each other in several nations, most notably in Syria's escalating civil war.

Coptic Christians churches are being torched in Egypt.

In Israel, what passes for peace talks has restarted after years of murder and brutality.

Religion is a common thread in each conflict. But why? Don’t these folks worship the same deity?

After all, Jews, Christians and Muslims all trace their faiths back to a fellow named Abraham, whom they all claim was chosen for special treatment by the Almighty. Why can’t they all get along?

Not academic

The “same God” question is one theologians have hammered at for as long as there have been enough religions for the query to make sense.

The question is hardly academic, though. In fact, a number of politicians, religious leaders and scholars have expressed hope in recent years that a convincing answer on the God question might dampen the violence committed in His name.

.....

Final answer

So do Christians Muslims, and Jews, really all worship the same God?

In two major volumes on the subject recently published by scholars from various faiths and traditions, including Volf’s, the most inclusive response from these scholars is basically: Yes, and it’s our God.

This is not a new way of answering the question.

In 1076, Pope Gregory VII wrote this to a Muslim leader: “We believe in and confess one God, admittedly, in a different way…”

But like many other religious leaders on all sides of the argument, Gregory insisted that his version of the Almighty is the one whom the others are unknowingly and incompletely worshiping.

A less exclusivist set of religions might shrug off the differences. But all three claim to have the only “True Faith.”

So do all three faiths actually worship the same deity, whether they call him God or Allah or Adonai?

God only knows.

I think it's overly simplistic, but probably coming from a decent place. His summary of Jewish theology was woefully incomplete and simplistic, almost to the point of sheer incorrectness, which makes me question his summaries of Christian and Muslim theology also. And he utterly neglects to point out that the "one true faith" controversy is purely between Islam and Christianity, as we don't have the concept of "one true faith for all humanity."

But he's right that the idea of "do we all worship the same God" is a debate of long standing. I think it would've been nice if he had emphasized a little more strongly the degree to which the majority of all three religions affirm that they all do worship the same God, and had a little less emphasis on the competitiveness between the religions as institutions (once again leaving out that that competition is largely one from which Judaism is absent).

But on the whole, for a piece of mainstream American blogging, it's not that bad. I've seen much worse.

1stLightHorse
09-02-2013, 01:33 AM
This is a really complex issue. It can be oversimplified because on the front the 3 religions have strong connections.

I say it's really complex because of this:

There are ways to prove from scripture that all 3 share the same God.
There are ways to prove from scripture that Christianity and Judaism share a different God than Islam.
There are ways to prove from scripture that Islam and Judaism share a different God than Christianity.
There are ways to prove from scripture that etc etc etc ...

A clever person can create very convincing and strong arguments for any of the combinations above that would make even the most devout adherent question their own belief. I'm not exaggerating. That's why i don't apply myself to any 3 of them. Studying them sure is enjoyable though.

Wadaad
09-02-2013, 01:48 AM
I think it's overly simplistic, but probably coming from a decent place. His summary of Jewish theology was woefully incomplete and simplistic, almost to the point of sheer incorrectness, which makes me question his summaries of Christian and Muslim theology also. And he utterly neglects to point out that the "one true faith" controversy is purely between Islam and Christianity, as we don't have the concept of "one true faith for all humanity."

But he's right that the idea of "do we all worship the same God" is a debate of long standing. I think it would've been nice if he had emphasized a little more strongly the degree to which the majority of all three religions affirm that they all do worship the same God, and had a little less emphasis on the competitiveness between the religions as institutions (once again leaving out that that competition is largely one from which Judaism is absent).

But on the whole, for a piece of mainstream American blogging, it's not that bad. I've seen much worse.

Do you know or have Jewish sources on what the Banu Nadir and Qaynuqa Rabbis said to Mohammed when he first attempted to proselytize and declared his prophethood to them?

alb0zfinest
09-02-2013, 03:53 AM
Just saying..........
http://www.theapricity.com/forum/group.php?groupid=519

Mason8
09-02-2013, 10:31 AM
Do you know or have Jewish sources on what the Banu Nadir and Qaynuqa Rabbis said to Mohammed when he first attempted to proselytize and declared his prophethood to them?

There is actually no evidence that such communities ever existed. I'm sure there were run-ins between early Muslims and Jews, wherein the Jews had to turn down the offer to convert to Islam. But no communities of Jews in the Arabian peninsula at that time were known to bear such names. And, indeed, at that time, there were few enough communities of Jews in that part of Arabia at that time-- most nearby communities were in Babylonia.

Leliana
09-02-2013, 11:53 AM
No, and Mary is in Catholicism almost as important as Jesus and God. We have the trinity, too.

Muslims worship a degenerated 'image' of God, a demon.

Loki
09-02-2013, 01:57 PM
No, and Mary is in Catholicism almost as important as Jesus and God.

Which makes Catholicism less Christian than Protestant variants, if you think about it. Mary worship is unscriptural.

Ice
09-02-2013, 02:13 PM
No, and Mary is in Catholicism almost as important as Jesus and God. We have the trinity, too.

Muslims worship a degenerated 'image' of God, a demon.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haqq-Muhammad-Ali

Dandelion
09-02-2013, 03:41 PM
Which makes Catholicism less Christian than Protestant variants, if you think about it. Mary worship is unscriptural.

Depends. Catholicism follows the 'holy tradition' where 'sola scriptura' is a protestant dogma. You have to have a protestant bias to think Catholicism is less christian because of Mary veneration or veneration of saints is unscriptural. So this is fairly relative.

armenianbodyhair
09-02-2013, 03:43 PM
Which makes Catholicism less Christian than Protestant variants, if you think about it. Mary worship is unscriptural.
Loki are you trying to bait her or do you actually think they worship Mary?

randomguy1235
09-02-2013, 03:45 PM
No, and Mary is in Catholicism almost as important as Jesus and God. We have the trinity, too.

Muslims worship a degenerated 'image' of God, a demon.

So, you're basically saying that you worship/revere two other entities besides God? How is that monotheistic?

armenianbodyhair
09-02-2013, 03:48 PM
Please don't make me defend Catholicism, I really don't want to.

Dandelion
09-02-2013, 04:02 PM
So, you're basically saying that you worship/revere two other entities besides God? How is that monotheistic?

Well, muslims also revere Muhammad. The only difference lies in the taboo of symbolising him in any way.

randomguy1235
09-02-2013, 04:04 PM
Well, muslims also revere Muhammad.

She claimed that "Mary is almost as important as Jesus and God". Muslims don't equate Muhammad's status to that of God, nor do they revere him in that manner.

Dandelion
09-02-2013, 04:06 PM
She claimed that "Mary is almost as important as Jesus and God". Muslims don't equate Muhammad's status to that of God, nor do they revere him in that manner.

But still, he's mentioned quite often in the Qur'an and many hardliners in the faith of Islam go out of their way in even using violence just to protect their most important prophet.

Shah-Jehan
09-02-2013, 04:08 PM
But still, he's mentioned quite often in the Qur'an and many hardliners in the faith of Islam go out of their way in even using violence just to protect their most important prophet.

He's mentioned only 4 times by name in the Qura'n...

armenianbodyhair
09-02-2013, 04:10 PM
She claimed that "Mary is almost as important as Jesus and God". Muslims don't equate Muhammad's status to that of God, nor do they revere him in that manner.
Catholics don't equate Mary with Jesus or God, she is almost as important but still not, but she is above normal saints, which makes sense.

randomguy1235
09-02-2013, 04:11 PM
But still, he's mentioned quite often in the Qur'an and many hardliners in the faith of Islam go out of their way in even using violence just to protect their most important prophet.

Moses is the most frequently mentioned prophet in the Quran; Doesn't mean that Muslims attribute divinity/holiness to a particular prophet. Muslims who incite and instigate violence for something that superfluous are also deemed zealous/fanatical by other Muslims.

Shah-Jehan
09-02-2013, 04:14 PM
Moses is the most frequently mentioned prophet in the Quran; Doesn't mean that Muslims attribute divinity/holiness to a particular prophet. Muslims who incite and instigate violence for something that superfluous are also deemed zealous/fanatical by other Muslims.

All messengers of God are to be treated equally and clearly stated in the Qur'an...Only the Hadith centers of Muhammad's(PBUH) traditions but, is not equal to God...

The Messenger has believed in what was revealed to him from his Lord, and [so have] the believers. All of them have believed in Allah and His angels and His books and His messengers, [saying], "We make no distinction between any of His messengers." And they say, "We hear and we obey. [We seek] Your forgiveness, our Lord, and to You is the [final] destination."(2:285)

Loki
09-02-2013, 04:29 PM
Loki are you trying to bait her or do you actually think they worship Mary?

Do you deny that Catholics pray to Mary, as if she's a deity? They also pray to some saints. These practices are totally forbidden in Protestantism, and in the Bible.

riverman
09-02-2013, 04:32 PM
Catholics don't equate Mary with Jesus or God, she is almost as important but still not, but she is above normal saints, which makes sense.


...:confused:theres no way your catholic.

armenianbodyhair
09-02-2013, 04:43 PM
Do you deny that Catholics pray to Mary, as if she's a deity? They also pray to some saints. These practices are totally forbidden in Protestantism, and in the Bible.
They don't pray to them they pray through them.


...:confused:theres no way your catholic.
Where would anyone get the idea that I was? I don't like it or them, but if people are going to use this propaganda against them I kind of feel like I should defend the truth.

riverman
09-02-2013, 04:53 PM
Where would anyone get the idea that I was? I don't like it or them, but if people are going to use this propaganda against them I kind of feel like I should defend the truth.

No, you are prolly unfamiliar with the 'truth' as it pertains to the c. church, you're merely defending your own opinions/ knowledge/or lack of it.

Blackout
09-02-2013, 05:22 PM
Mary (وسلم عليه ولها) is highly respected in Islam, and has a chapter named after her in the Holy Quran aswell.

Behold! the angels said: "O Mary! Allah hath chosen thee and purified thee - chosen thee above the women of all nations.

Surah 3 (Al Imran), Ayah 42

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virgin_Mary_in_Islam

armenianbodyhair
09-02-2013, 05:25 PM
No, you are prolly unfamiliar with the 'truth' as it pertains to the c. church, you're merely defending your own opinions/ knowledge/or lack of it.
What that I said was so incorrect it offended you this much? LOL.

Insuperable
09-02-2013, 05:27 PM
Do you deny that Catholics pray to Mary, as if she's a deity? They also pray to some saints. These practices are totally forbidden in Protestantism, and in the Bible.

Catholics don't pray to Mary or the saints as to a deity. Just as someone can ask someone to pray for her/him so Catholics ask the Saints or Mary to do the same.

1. Yes, some if not many Catholics pray directly to them even though they shouldn't. They either have no idea or don't see anything wrong in it.
2. Yes, even this praying on behalf has no basis(?) in the Bible when it comes to praying to Mary or the Saints

However in Revelation there are some verses where 24 Elders (?) and angels offer to God prayers of Gods people.

Loki
09-02-2013, 05:34 PM
Just as someone can ask someone to pray for her/him so Catholics ask the Saints or Mary to do the same.


Bizarre to me, since they are long dead.

Insuperable
09-02-2013, 05:46 PM
Bizarre to me, since they are long dead.

You asked something which has to do something about religion and I gave you an answer from a religious point of view. IRL if you want to call like that we can say whatever we want.

Blackout
09-02-2013, 05:52 PM
Bizarre to me, since they are long dead.

Some Muslims also do this. It is their belief that God will listen to the prayers of Saints / Disciples (may God bless them) more so than to them. This is wrong however because God takes everyone seriously, no matter how insignificant one may be. Also by praying to others, you are indirectly putting them in between you and God (although this is most likely not the intention of the believer). Everyone has a direct connection to God.

Loki
09-02-2013, 05:55 PM
You asked something which has to do something about religion and I gave you an answer from a religious point of view. IRL if you want to call like that we can say whatever we want.

:confused:

Albion
09-02-2013, 08:55 PM
Why do Muslims not seem to get upset when atheists attack god?

Loki
09-02-2013, 10:43 PM
Why do Muslims not seem to get upset when atheists attack god?

They do ... even more than Christians I think.

riverman
09-03-2013, 02:00 PM
What that I said was so incorrect it offended you this much? LOL.


Didn't offend me, but I have doubts that you know enough about the c. church to be taking a stance in arguments, hey, whatever it's your prerogative.

armenianbodyhair
09-03-2013, 02:05 PM
Didn't offend me, but I have doubts that you know enough about the c. church to be taking a stance in arguments, hey, whatever it's your prerogative.
I know enough to to know that what was being said about them was BS.

wvwvw
09-03-2013, 05:14 PM
Muslims often complain that Islam is being misunderstood. But this claim contradicts the Quran. The Quran says repeatedly that it is a “clear book” (5:15) “easy to understand” (44:58, 54:22, 54:32, 54:40), “explained in detail” (6:114) “conveyed clearly” (5:16, 10:15) … and with “no doubt” in it (2:2).

Furthermore, why only Islam is misunderstood and other religions are not? Shouldn’t the reverse be true? Didn’t Islam come allegedly to clarify all the misunderstandings in other religions?

Islam is perfectly clear. It is its apologists that try to confuse others because they are embarrassed of the truth.

The claim that Muhammad is the last Prophet is also nonsense. Muhammad said all previous prophets preached Islam and then their followers corrupted it so God sent him as the last prophet to set the records straight. First of all at no time Jews or Christians, let alone Zoroastrians or Buddhists practiced or believed anything resembling Islam. Muslims claim all these faiths were originally like Islam and changed later by the believers. This is a bogus claim. The burden of proof is on Muslims. Where is the proof?

Secondly, if God had allowed all his previous religions become corrupted, why Islam should be exempt? Doesn’t this person say that Islam can be easily misunderstood? So if it is so easily misunderstood, why should we believe that it is not corrupted already?

I can say with certainty that there are no two philosophies, teachings, doctrines or beliefs that are more contradictory than Christianity and Islam. The message of Jesus revolves around love. The message of Muhammad revolves around fear. The cores of these two faiths are diametrically opposed to each other. As the result, all the ramifications are different. Yes both faiths are theistic, and rehash the Zoroastrian eschatology of heaven and hell, but they worship different gods. Allah is not the same God of Jesus. It does not have the same characteristics. Sugar and cyanide share some similarities. Both come in granulated form and are white. But there ends the similarity. The same is true about the God envisioned by Jesus and the deity that Muhammad made up.

Jesus never mentioned Muhammad. Again the burden of proof is on Muslims to show where Jesus talked about Muhammad? The only thing Jesus said is that many false prophets will come and will seduce multitudes. He said you’ll recognize them by their fruits. The teachings and deeds of a prophet are his fruits. You can say also his followers are his fruits. Look at the actions of Muhammad. He was a mass murderer, an assassin, a thief, a deceiver. Look at his teachings! They are full of hatred and violence. Look at his followers! They are the most backward and wretched people in the world. They are deceivers who lie about their faith and fabricate phony miracles to attribute to their prophet and to his book of hate and ignorance. It is easy to see Muhammad was a false prophet when we analyze his fruits.


While Prophet Muhammad – The Last Prophet and Messenger of Allah did his duty and by Allah’s command to clean and clear Jesus and his mother Maryam (Mary) from false accusations.

Clear Jesus’s name of what? Was Jesus a raider, a plunderer, a rapist, a pedophile, a slave maker, an assassin or a mysogynist and woman beater? Of what Jesus’s name had to be cleared? I tell you whose names Muhammad cleared? He cleared the names of Genghis Khan, Hitler, Mao, Stalin and Conte de Dracula. Whatever crimes these monsters committed Muhammad did worse. He reserved for himself the title of the most evil man in history. So no one before or after him can be called that. He cleared the names of all the evil people who have ever existed and were born after him.

Jesus does not need Muhammad to clear his name. If really a man like Jesus existed and did and said things that are attributed to him, he must have been a superior human, the best person who ever graced the earth. Why would such a holy being need his name to be cleared by a villain like Muhammad? What a preposterous pretense! The worst man is to clear the name of the best man? The absurdity of the Muslim mind is beyond belief.


In Al-Quran there are at least 3 chapters refer to the story of Jesus (Surah Al-Maidah), his mother Maryam (Surah Maryam) and the story of Jesus Family (Surah Al-Imran) which cannot be found in Christian’s Bible. “

The Quran is wrong about Mary. Muhammad was so ignorant that he confused Mary, mother of Jesus with Miriam, sister of Moses and Aaron who lived at least 1500 years earlier. How could he make such a mistake? It is because in Arabic both names are written and pronounced Maryam. The illiterate prophet, whose only source of knowledge about Christianity and Judaism was the sermons of Christian preachers such as Qis ibn Sa’ada, the bishop of Nijran, during the annual market fair of Okaz, thought the two Maryams are the same. This illiterate man did not realize that when the bishop was talking about Maryam he was talking about two different women.


“Allah had honored Jesus, Maryam and his family in The Holy Quran especially Allah put Maryam’s name as one of Quranic Chapter which is chapter 19 – Chapter Maryam. Such the great honor to such devoted and righteous servant of Allah even she was a WOMAN.


“Even though she was a WOMAN?” Wow! Even though she was a filthy woman, deficient in intelligence and inferior, she was mentioned in the Quran? These benighted people really believe women are inferior creatures. But Allah made an exception and honored Mary by mentioning her in the Quran even though she was a woman. He even capitalizes the word woman to highlight her low status.

Do I need to add anything more? Just see for yourself the depravity of the mind of this Muslim (not that other Muslims are any better). This is Islam for ya.

Who will tell this servant of Allah that there is no shame in being a woman and also Mary does not need her name mentioned in the Quran and that is no honor? Other Suras of the Quran are named The Cow, Livestock, Ants, Spider and Spoils (stollen property).

Monotheism This claim is nonsense. People in Americas, in East Asia and in Africa did not have monotheistic religion. Monotheism is an invention of Akhenathen or Zoroaster. Jews were influenced by these creeds and that is how Christianity and Islam became monotheistic.

Muhammad at one point praised Al Lat, Al Uzza and Al Manat, the daughters of Allah in order to gain the support of the Quraish. He had no problem embracing polytheism when he thought it may be politically convenient. Then changed his mind when he realized he needed to keep up the hostility and divide the community, in order to rule. He then said those verses that that acknowledged the three goddesses were satanic verses. Muhammad adopted monotheism out of convenience because it suited his purpose. If politheism was more convenient, he would have chosen polytheism. If atheism would have made him more successful he would have promoted atheism. Monotheims was only a tool for power.

Furthermore, there is no proof that monotheism is true. There is no evidence of the existence of God. Many rational people are either deists, or pantheists or atheists.

wvwvw
09-03-2013, 05:27 PM
She claimed that "Mary is almost as important as Jesus and God". Muslims don't equate Muhammad's status to that of God, nor do they revere him in that manner.

Muhammad was a pathological narcissist. One must not be fooled by his fake pretense of modesty. Here are a few passages where he exhorted his followers to worship him.

Truly, Allâh and His angels send praise and blessings [forever] upon the Prophet. O you who believe! Praise and bless the Prophet with utmost laud and blessing. (Q.33:56)
And you (stand) on an exalted standard of character. (Q.68:4)
You [Muhammad] are a lamp with spreading light. (Q.33:46)
You of Faith, say not (to the Prophet) words of ambiguous import like ‘Listen to us,’ but words of respect; and obey (him): To those who don’t submit there is a grievous punishment. (Q. 2:104)
He who obeys the Messenger obeys Allah. (Q. 4:80)
He who disobeys the Apostle after guidance has been revealed will burn in Hell. (Q. 4:114)
You [Muhammad] may have whomever you desire; there is no blame. (Q. 33:51)
Allah gives his Messenger Lordship and Power over whomever He wills. (Q.59:6)
Blessed is He who holds the reins of Kingship. (Q. 67:1)
You [Muhammad] are an exalted character of tremendous morality. Soon you will see, and they will see, which of you is afflicted with madness. (Q. 68:4)
Verily this is the Word (brought by) a most honorable Messenger imbued with power, the Lord of the Throne, Mighty, One to be obeyed. (Q. 81:19)
The most egregious claim, in my opinion, is the claim that God promised him to forgive all his future sins. “Lo! We have given thee (O Muhammad) a clear victory. That Allâh may forgive thee of thy sin that which is past and that which is to come.” (Q.48:1-2)

Maybe that is why he lived such a despicable life. There is hardly any crime he didn’t commit. Was he under the delusion that his future sins will be forgiven and that he won’t have to respond for them? Can possibly a sane god make such an offer to anyone?

The following are some of the claims Muhammad made about himself.

The very first thing that Allâh Almighty ever created was my soul.[1]
First of all things, the Lord created my mind.[2]
I am from Allâh, and the believers are from me.[3]
Just as Allâh created me noble, he also gave me noble character.[4]
Were it not for you, [O Muhammad] I would not have created the universe.

Can one worship God without Muhammad? Not according to Muhammad. So he made himself an indispensable partner with God. Islam is shirk, it is Muhammadism. The submission is to Muhammad, not to God. Allah was Muhammad’s alter ego.

The Quran is made up by Muhammad. He put these words in the mouth of his imaginary god when he lusted after the wife of his adopted son. He made Allah say he is not the father of his adopted son so it is okay for him to marry his daughter in law. All the verses of the Quran are made for Muhammad to satisfy his needs. After seeing that any time Muhammad wanted something, a verse came from Allah granting Muhammad’s wish Aisha remarked, “I feel that your Lord hastens in fulfilling your wishes and desires.”[Bukhari, 6: 60:311] Looks like Muhammad’s “lord” was between his legs or at least very much concerned about that body part.

It is foolish to believe the Quran is the word of God when one can find so many absurdities and errors in it. Sometimes there are several errors in one verse alone. The confusion between Mary and Miriam is just one of thousands.

The megalomaniac deceiver made a lot of bogus claims like this, but he never gave any proof. We have proof that the Quran is full of errors. It is impossible that the maker of this universe be as ignorant as it appears in the Quran.

Muslims have circular reasoning. They confuse the claim with the proof. If you ask them for the proof they show you the Quran.

Muslims claim that the original message of Moses, Jesus and all other prophets was Islam, which was then corrupted by the believers. But where is the proof? When these messages became corrupted? At least it appears that Muhammad believed at his time many Jews and Christians had been expecting his coming by reading their scriptures. So up to that time the Bible must have not been corrupted. But we don’t find any reference to Muhammad in the Old or New Testaments. Muslims’ explanation: These books are corrupted. How could all the copies of the Bible become corrupted after Muhammad? Waraqa, Khadijah’s cousin was a transcriber or interpreter of the Bible. He must have had the original version since Muhammad claimed he had recognize him as a prophet because of his familiarity with the scriptures. What happened to his copy of the Bible?

There are books left from early Christian writers such as Ignatius, bishop of Antioch, Tertullian, an apologist of Christianity, Dionysius, a pope of the Coptic Orthodox Church, Donatus Magnus, a bishop of Carthage, and Thomas Aquinas. None of these authors had written anything resembling Islam. Islam resembles Arab Paganism. All its rituals are borrowed from Pagans.

Islam does not mean peace. It means surrender. There is a twist in this also. In Islam peace can be attained only through surrender. So when Muslims talk about peace they mean peace through subjugation of other nations.

The surrender is not to God. It is to Muhammad. Allah is only a sock puppet of Muhammad.

Intelligence only demonstrates that Islam is a lie. A Muslim is one who surrenders his intelligence to Muhammad and blindly believes in any nonsense, out of fear. Fear is the tool of the psychopath to control his victims. Intelligence rejects Islam and that is why Muslim countries censor all critical discussion of Islam, including my sites. They know that through intelligence Islam will be destroyed. Islam can survive only when people are kept in ignorance.

Islam is nothing but deception. Once the truth about this false religion is revealed to the world this faith of hate and lies will me destroyed. Such a thing was not possible before because Muslims eliminated any person who dissented. Now they can’t do that easily. They can block sites critical of Islam but that is a futile attempt. Truth is spreading fast and there is no way they can stop it. http://alisina.org/blog/2011/12/08/was-jesus-a-prophet-of-islam/