Guide gives ‘rude’ Scots a rough ride

[Beorn]

Scots are rude and superstitious, Ben Nevis, Britain’s tallest peak, is a “biggish hill” and Loch Ness is a “dull waterway”. Welcome to Scotland, according to a new guide aimed at American visitors.

Culture Smart! Scotland bills itself as the definitive guide to the country and its customs. However, the book, part of a series covering 60 countries that has sold hundreds of thousands of copies worldwide, paints an inaccurate and unflattering picture of Scotland and its inhabitants.
The guide, which has just gone on sale in America and Canada, dismisses Scots as blunt, intemperate and quick to take offence. “To the unprepared such bluntness may seem downright rude,” it states. “Be warned that these same forthright people can be very touchy and extremely easily offended if you speak to them in the same vein.”

It adds: “Scotsmen can indeed be very intemperate. They often have very firm opinions and are prepared to defend them forcefully.”
The book asserts that the sectarian divide means “some Protestants will not allow green objects in their home”.
Scots are obsessed with the supernatural, it asserts. They refer to fairies as their “guid neighbours” and plant Rowan trees outside their homes to ward off witches, it claims.

Addressing food, the guide informs readers that porridge, followed by Arbroath smokies remains the “standard breakfast” and that “Highlanders have no great love for pork”.
While promising readers advice on how to avoid making gaffes when visiting Scotland, the guide is littered with mistakes. It states that the country was once ruled by the “Steward” dynasty, misspells Shetland’s Viking pageant as “Up Helly Ya” and has the name of the Scottish founder of the Labour party as “Kier” Hardie.

The guide also puts Aberdeen in the Highlands.

Turning its attention to Scottish landmarks and icons, the guide states: “People speak of the ‘mountains’ of Scotland, but by international standards Ben Nevis and Ben Macdhui hardly count as more than biggish hills.” Loch Ness is one of Scotland’s “duller lochs”. Meanwhile, Robert Burns is described as having “nothing much to say about religion”. The poet’s 1785 work, Holy Willie’s Prayer, is widely regarded as one of the most eloquent denunciations of the hypocrisy of organised religion.
Dealing with more contemporary matters, the book declares: “The recession demonstrated how much the success of the Scottish Parliament’s policies was based on subsidy from England. Most Scottish businessmen recognise London as the financial power base without which the Scottish economy would collapse.”

Mike Russell the culture minister, described the guide, which will also be sold in the UK, as “spectacularly ill- informed about the realities of modern day Scotland”.
Last night the book’s author, John Scotney, a former London-based BBC producer and historian, apologised for the inaccuracies.
“One does not like to make mistakes, but I take full responsibility,” he said. “I am not particularly worried about one or two of them, but I’m rather embarrassed about some of the others. I hope the people in Scotland will be kind and not think too badly of me.”

A spokesman for Kuperard, the book’s publisher, said: “These are embarrassing mistakes that will certainly be corrected in the next edition.”


Source (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/scotland/article6879541.ece)


“spectacularly ill- informed about the realities of modern day Scotland”.

:confused: Hang on: "Scots are rude and superstitious", "blunt, intemperate and quick to take offence", "very firm opinions and are prepared to defend them forcefully", "some Protestants will not allow green objects in their home" and “The recession demonstrated how much the success of the Scottish Parliament’s policies was based on subsidy from England. Most Scottish businessmen recognise London as the financial power base without which the Scottish economy would collapse"

I'd say it nearly hits the mark. I say nearly, because I can be 'rude and superstitious' and take offence at the drop of the hat, but then I realised that I was wrong; apologised to myself profusely and looked around to see if anyone wanted to have my seat.

[_______]

did geistfaust write it? :D

[GeistFaust]

did geistfaust write it? :D

Sounds like something I would write the Scottish Brunns and redheads are definitely creating an issue with the population they are too intemperate and wild that they are giving foreigners a bad concept of Scotland. This is because these peoples represent the most primitive and archaic elements of the British Isles and they do not feel happy that their mystique and primitive instinct is being messed around with by tourist who do not quite understand themselves. The Scottish Brunns are the most misunderstood individuals in human history or at least they perceive it to be that way that is why they are inclined to violent outbursts at times to display their frustration with the poor sense of understanding garnered between their less mystical and spiritual British Isle or tourist counterparts.

[Tarja]

Are you sure it wasn't a spoof? Sounds like spoof material.

[GeistFaust]

I have read this a lot must be the Norse influences in the Scottish people that have made them like this Scotch Irish and Ulster Scots had similar temperates to the Scottish people. I know for the Scotch Irish and the Ulster Scots this temperament was necessary in being able to found the USA and get it off the launching pad. There were some Scots who emigrated to Prussia and they explained how the Prussian/Scottish mix produced a very internally passionate individual who was not expressive of their deep spiritual fervor but who took their opinions very ferociously and would defend them even to the point of violent outbursts. This stereotype with the Scottish people is sort of true but I think its more of a positive than a negative personality trait because they are very territorial and are not afraid to speak on behalf of their traditions and cultural opinions more people should emulate the Scots. :thumbs up

[Peasant]

GeistFaust you are batshit insane.

[GeistFaust]

GeistFaust you are batshit insane.

Yes I know I was just trying to find a anthropological sub type in Scotland for the above listed issues tourist had with Scottish people I doubt it would be the Halstatts, North Atlantics, Tronders so I thought I would blame it on a Cro Magnon variant since everyone is blaming the Cro Magnons for being too violent or criminally oriented.

[Jack B]

Yes I know I was just trying to find a anthropological sub type in Scotland for the above listed issues tourist had with Scottish people I doubt it would be the Halstatts, North Atlantics, Tronders so I thought I would blame it on a Cro Magnon variant since everyone is blaming the Cro Magnons for being too violent or criminally oriented.

No, no they're not. People in the real world rarely if ever mention European racial sub types, much less work them into their fantasy image of social and political issues.

[GeistFaust]

No, no they're not. People in the real world rarely if ever mention European racial sub types, much less work them into their fantasy image of social and political issues.

I was just joking around I think this topic is sort of spoofish and I was just trying to show those who are familiar with my Anthropological romanticism the typical obsession I have with sub types and attitudes and behaviors.

[Argyll]

Not accurate at all. But the male Scots having super opinions....sounds like me!

[Turkey]

I owned a back packer hostel in perth(australia) about 10 years ago and the ugliest woman I've ever met stayed there. She was a Scot.:)

[Turkey]

^She was really interested when some Maoris from next door walked past. She said they didn't have "coloured" people where she came from.
I thought that was hilarious.

I didn't realize that non-whites were pouring into Scotland(and everywhere) until about a year or two ago. Then I became racist.:)

[Argyll]

I was just joking around I think this topic is sort of spoofish and I was just trying to show those who are familiar with my Anthropological romanticism the typical obsession I have with sub types and attitudes and behaviors.

Geist, the only places in Scotland that would have Norse influences would be in the Northern Isles.

[Albion]

Ben Nevis, Britain’s tallest peak, is a “biggish hill”

The land around it is quite high making it appear low. The same is true of many mountains in England.
Our mountains aren't spectacular in terms of height but are interesting places in their own right.
They go from barren, sub-Arctic conditions in the Cairngorms to moutains dropping suddenly into the sea at Snowdonia and mountains interspersed by beautiful lakes and valleys in the Lake District.

Britain's mountains are comparable to other low ranges such as those of Central Germany.


Loch Ness is a “dull waterway”.

Well it is. ;) Windermere, Ennerdale or Derwent aren't nearly as big but have nice landscapes and good towns around them.


They refer to fairies as their “guid neighbours” and plant Rowan trees outside their homes to ward off witches, it claims.

What a load of rubbish. I doubt many believe this. Many people in my town plant Rowan trees in front of their houses, because they're superstitious? No, because they like trees and the berries feeding the birds in winter! :rolleyes:


“People speak of the ‘mountains’ of Scotland, but by international standards Ben Nevis and Ben Macdhui hardly count as more than biggish hills.” Loch Ness is one of Scotland’s “duller lochs”.

When people speak of Scotland's mountains they are really talking about its empty semi-wilderness.
The mountains maybe low, but who cares when you've basically got a near-empty country with a right to roam which means you can wonder around almost anywhere?!

Scotland's charm is in its landscapes, flora, fauna and emptiness, not in silly "who is better than who" statistics competitions.
Scotland may not win in many areas, but it has a lot to offer. One statistic it does come highest on is Moorland, a intermediate habitat between Tundra and Forest - Britain as a whole has 75% of the world's moorland, most of it in Scotland but also large areas in England and Wales too.


Dealing with more contemporary matters, the book declares: “The recession demonstrated how much the success of the Scottish Parliament’s policies was based on subsidy from England. Most Scottish businessmen recognise London as the financial power base without which the Scottish economy would collapse.”

At least it has got something right even if most Scots would dispute this.

I wonder how bad those books would talk about England, the writer seems quite arrogant.

[Argyll]

Faeries though, Albion, are called good neighbours sometimes and some people may carry that on.

[Albion]

Faeries though, Albion, are called good neighbours sometimes and some people may carry that on.


They refer to fairies as their “guid neighbours” and plant Rowan trees outside their homes to ward off witches, it claims.

Argyll, have you ever heard of the English expression "Away with the fairies" (http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/away+with+the+fairies.html) by any chance? :D

[Graham]

Scots are rude and superstitious, Ben Nevis, Britain’s tallest peak, is a “biggish hill” and Loch Ness is a “dull waterway”.
Ben Nevis is more like a big Rock, not the prettiest. That area of the Highlands is beautiful though. God's country.

The guide, which has just gone on sale in America and Canada, dismisses Scots as blunt, intemperate and quick to take offence. “To the unprepared such bluntness may seem downright rude,” it states. “Be warned that these same forthright people can be very touchy and extremely easily offended if you speak to them in the same vein.”

It adds: “Scotsmen can indeed be very intemperate. They often have very firm opinions and are prepared to defend them forcefully.”

I'd act the same, if that wank came here and started moaning.

Nice people get treat nicely. Arsehole's get treat like Arsehole's etc..

The book asserts that the sectarian divide means “some Protestants will not allow green objects in their home”.
Not a problem on the East coast/Highlands/central Scotland or Borders.


Scots are obsessed with the supernatural, it asserts. They refer to fairies as their “guid neighbours” and plant Rowan trees outside their homes to ward off witches, it claims.
The man has based his tourist guide on the Wicker Man film I think. This is what happened to the last Ungrateful tourist.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tr4SPVNnvO0/TaZVi4g1aPI/AAAAAAAAAnU/e-sEnRhhtbc/s1600/TheWickerMan1973B.png
http://www.dca.org.uk/uploads/lg_The-Wicker-Man.jpg
http://www.heyuguys.co.uk/images/2010/11/The-Wicker-Man-1.jpg



Addressing food, the guide informs readers that porridge, followed by Arbroath smokies remains the “standard breakfast” and that “Highlanders have no great love for pork”.
eh? :eek:

Last night the book’s author, John Scotney, a former London-based BBC producer and historian, apologised for the inaccuracies.


Southerner, there's a suprise :rolleyes:

[Argyll]

Argyll, have you ever heard of the English expression "Away with the fairies" (http://www.usingenglish.com/reference/idioms/away+with+the+fairies.html) by any chance? :D

....do I want to :( I'm sorry I believe in the supernatural.....

[Morrigan]

You don't want to mess with the Scots.

Black Watch Regiment anyone?

[Tarja]

....do I want to :( I'm sorry I believe in the supernatural.....


:D Here...


Meaning
Not facing reality; in a dreamworld.

Origin
This phrase has its basis in the Scots/Irish Gaelic tradition of belief in a set of folk myths, the cartoon version of which is a belief in the existence of 'the little people'.

In a mythology that compares with the current fad for stories of abduction by aliens, Irish folklore had the alien role played by the Sidhe, a dominant, supernatural clan of fairies. The stories involved the Sidhe appearing from some hidden place, either their underground lair or from an invisible world, equivalent to contemporary science's notion of a parallel dimension, and spiriting people away. In another link to current scientific understanding of relativity, the stories usually involved the victim returning after what seemed like a few hours only to find that many years had passed in the world of humans.

The everyday belief in a nether world populated by fairies, elves, pixies, leprechauns, goblins and the like was commonplace in mediaeval Europe, as was the belief in their interaction with the real world. A letter to the Scottish poet William Drummond, dated October 1636, contained the following:

As for the Fairy Queen, of whom you wrote to me, her Apparitions of late have bewitched so many, that I find sundry ready to dance with the fairies.

The belief in people being taken away by the fairies was very well-established by the time that the phrase 'away with the fairies' first came to be used - which isn't until the 20th century. This earliest example of the expression that I can find in print is in the New Zealand newspaper The Otautau Standard and Wallace County Chronicle, May 1909. This retells a story from Ireland, in which a Michael Coyne attempts to convince onlookers that he hadn't murdered his rival, James Bailey:

[Coyne] "Don't mind your son; that is not him you see there." Bridget Bailey understood that he meant that her brother was away with the fairies.

The phrase didn't begin to be used in its current figurative sense until the late 20th century. This item from The Washington Post, June 1987, is typical of the examples of the phrase that are commonly found from the 1980s onward:

"Still away with the fairies, the fey and gentle Incredible String Band epitomised the hippie ideals of the Sixties."

[Libertas]

Geist, the only places in Scotland that would have Norse influences would be in the Northern Isles.

Don't forget Norse influence in the Western Isles (Hebrides).
The isle of Lewis has more Norse than Gaelic place names.

[johngaunt]

I owned a back packer hostel in perth(australia) about 10 years ago and the ugliest woman I've ever met stayed there. She was a Scot.:)

There is hardly any difference between all the isles groups, although I laughed when you said that, as the ugliest girl/woman I know is Scottish. Honestly, her face is f''''''', never seen anything like it.

[Argyll]

Don't forget Norse influence in the Western Isles (Hebrides).
The isle of Lewis has more Norse than Gaelic place names.

Yep, that's true, unfortunately. I actually saw a genetic map that showed that there were hardly any Norse genes there. It makes sense, however, because only men came there, and they were a minority. They did mix and make 'the foreign Gaels' (there's a Gaelic name for them, more official). And if they mixed with the more pure Gaels, the Norse genes would have eventually died out or become extremely recessive.

[Albion]

Yep, that's true, unfortunately. I actually saw a genetic map that showed that there were hardly any Norse genes there. It makes sense, however, because only men came there, and they were a minority. They did mix and make 'the foreign Gaels' (there's a Gaelic name for them, more official). And if they mixed with the more pure Gaels, the Norse genes would have eventually died out or become extremely recessive.

There's nothing unfortunate about it. Without the Vikings Scotland wouldn't exist quite as it does today.
To deny them is to deny part of your history.

Many of the clan chiefs descend directly from the Norse, the Clan Macleod of Lewis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Macleod_of_Lewis) - they descend from the Norse rulers of the Kingdom of Mann and the Isles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_of_Mann_and_the_Isles).


Clan MacLeod is a fascinating case study. From a sample of the DNA of 45 Macleod Y chromosomes almost half, 47 per cent, clearly show social selection at work in that they descend from one individual. If this statistic is projected amongst the total number of MacLeods, it means that almost 10,000 men alive today are descended from this man. Among the remaining 53 per cent, researchers have found only nine other lineages present, showing that MacLeod men married women who were unfailingly faithful to them.

Nevertheless, the MacLeods do not carry the M17 marker group. Theirs is a recently discovered sub-group labelled S68. It is found in Lewis, Harris and Skye, core Macleod territory, but also in Orkney, Shetland and Norway, with a few examples in Sweden. Despite extensive screening, S68 is very specifically located, showing up only once in the east of Scotland and once in England. This is a classic pattern for a Viking marker in Britain, but one much rarer than M17. MacLeods determinedly claim descent from a common name father, a Norse aristocrat called Ljot, a relative of Olaf, King of Man. They are probably right to continue to claim that – science for once supporting tradition.

This page may interest you. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandinavian_Scotland)


The Viking invasions may have inadvertently played a role in the creation of modern Scotland. Their destructive raids initially weakened Pictland, Strathclyde and Dal Riata, but these "harassed remnants" eventually became a united front and Norse aggression thus played a significant role in the creation of the kingdom of Alba, the nucleus from which the Scottish kingdom expanded as the Viking influence waned, just as in the south the Kingdom of Wessex expanded to become the kingdom of England.

Without the Vikings England may not have found a unifying Scottish state, but instead a collection of weak states easier to conquer.

You cannot really deny the role of the Scandinavians in neither early English nor Scottish history.
Scandinavians weakened both the Scottish and English petty kingdoms and pushed the two regions towards forming into larger states. In England the identity was already there but the Vikings enabled it by killing off Mercia and Northumbria which allowed Wessex to create a unified England.

In Scotland the Vikings weakened the Pictish kingdoms and Strathclyde, allowing the Kingdom of Scotland to form.

Scandinavians are one of the main Germanic influences on Scotland.

[Albion]

On second thoughts I change my mind - damn Vikings! If it wasn't for them Scotland would be ours! :D ;)

[Argyll]

On second thoughts I change my mind - damn Vikings! If it wasn't for them Scotland would be ours! :D ;)

How :confused:

[Argyll]

There's nothing unfortunate about it. Without the Vikings Scotland wouldn't exist quite as it does today.
To deny them is to deny part of your history.

Many of the clan chiefs descend directly from the Norse, the Clan Macleod of Lewis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Macleod_of_Lewis) - they descend from the Norse rulers of the Kingdom of Mann and the Isles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_of_Mann_and_the_Isles).



This page may interest you. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandinavian_Scotland)



Without the Vikings England may not have found a unifying Scottish state, but instead a collection of weak states easier to conquer.

You cannot really deny the role of the Scandinavians in neither early English nor Scottish history.
Scandinavians weakened both the Scottish and English petty kingdoms and pushed the two regions towards forming into larger states. In England the identity was already there but the Vikings enabled it by killing off Mercia and Northumbria which allowed Wessex to create a unified England.

In Scotland the Vikings weakened the Pictish kingdoms and Strathclyde, allowing the Kingdom of Scotland to form.

Scandinavians are one of the main Germanic influences on Scotland.

Yeah, that's true. I wouldn't deny them as a part of Scotland's history as they played a huge part in it. However, when people start claiming Scotland as Germanic due to the viking invasions is what ticks me off.

[Argyll]

There's nothing unfortunate about it. Without the Vikings Scotland wouldn't exist quite as it does today.
To deny them is to deny part of your history.

Many of the clan chiefs descend directly from the Norse, the Clan Macleod of Lewis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Macleod_of_Lewis) - they descend from the Norse rulers of the Kingdom of Mann and the Isles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_of_Mann_and_the_Isles).



This page may interest you. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scandinavian_Scotland)



Without the Vikings England may not have found a unifying Scottish state, but instead a collection of weak states easier to conquer.

You cannot really deny the role of the Scandinavians in neither early English nor Scottish history.
Scandinavians weakened both the Scottish and English petty kingdoms and pushed the two regions towards forming into larger states. In England the identity was already there but the Vikings enabled it by killing off Mercia and Northumbria which allowed Wessex to create a unified England.

In Scotland the Vikings weakened the Pictish kingdoms and Strathclyde, allowing the Kingdom of Scotland to form.

Scandinavians are one of the main Germanic influences on Scotland.

The Vikings didn't really weaken the Pictish kingdoms- they were battling and ultimately unified with the Gaels, forming the Kingdom of Alba.

[Albion]

How :confused:

Because Scotland would be weak, divided countries in the same way Ireland was. The main difference would be it would be easier for a powerful, unified England to conquer these since there is no sea between Scotland and England and no formidable natural barriers.

The unification of Scotland is what prevented England encompassing the whole of Great Britain.


However, when people start claiming Scotland as Germanic due to the viking invasions is what ticks me off.

I understand.

[Argyll]

Because Scotland would be weak, divided countries in the same way Ireland was. The main difference would be it would be easier for a powerful, unified England to conquer these since there is no sea between Scotland and England and no formidable natural barriers.

The unification of Scotland is what prevented England encompassing the whole of Great Britain.



I understand.

Oh yes, 'tis true, 'tis true.

What is funny, to me, is that the Hebrides are one of the most uber Celtic areas in Britain, yet the Norse owned it for some time, that is, politically, not culturally and people wise. What I read in Scotland: A History, was that Gaelicization occured during the those early days and anything, people and cultural, wasn't Gaelic, was wiped out. Scotland has just a fascinating history.