Uhtred's Welsh Course

[Smaug]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/59/Flag_of_Wales_2.svg/80px-Flag_of_Wales_2.svg.png Uhtred's Welsh Course http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/59/Flag_of_Wales_2.svg/80px-Flag_of_Wales_2.svg.png

Finally, the course I promised to the members who wanted to get in touch with the good and old Celtic Languages. I prepared this course with the intention of making it easy to get the basics of the Welsh language, basics that to some extension apply to all the Celtic languages.

The dialect taught here will be the Sothern, since my family hails from that area I feel more comfortable using this variation, that is fortunately, the most commonly used in the Welsh media.

Another important note is that here I’m going to emphasise the Colloquial Welsh rather than the Literary Welsh, that is closer to the form of Welsh standardised by the 1588 translation of the Bible.

Before we get started I’d like to give my special thanks to Mark Nodine with his A Welsh Course and to My Welsh Learning, without which it wouldn’t be possible for me to prepare this course.

[Smaug]

1. The Language

Welsh (Cymraeg or y Gymraeg) is a member of the Brythonic branch of the Celtic languages spoken natively in Wales, by some along the Welsh border in England, and in Y Wladfa (the Welsh colony in Chubut Province, Argentina). Historically it has also been known in English as "the British tongue", "Cambrian", "Cambric" and "Cymric".

The 2011 UK Census counted almost 3 million residents of Wales. Of these, 73% (2.2 million) reported having no Welsh language skills. Of the residents of Wales aged three and over, 19% (562,000) reported being able to speak Welsh, and 77% (431,000) of these (that is, 15% of the total population) were able to speak, read, and write the language. Welsh has about 700.000 worldwide speakers, making of it the most spoken Celtic language.

http://dialectblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/language.png
Percentage of Welsh speakers by region


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPYkYfi_IiM
Speaking Welsh

[Smaug]

2. Alphabet and Pronunciation

The Welsh language is known for having a very phonetic alphabet, that is listed in the table bellow:

A/a) as in "father"
B/b) as in "bat"
C/c) as in "cat"
Ch/ch) as in the Scots "loch" or German "reich"
D/d) as in “dot”
Dd/dd) as 'th' in "they"
E/e) as in "let"
F/f) sounds like a 'v' like in "volcano"
Ff/ff) sounds like an 'f' like in "fake"
G/g) as in "great"
Ng/ng) as the 'ing' in "thing"
H/h) as in "hat"
I/i) as in "pit"
L/l) as in "late"
Ll/l) *1
M/m) as in "mine"
N/n) as in "never"
O/o) as in "lot"
P/p) as in "plate"
Ph/ph) as in "photography"
R/r) trilled sound like the Spanish 'r' in "rato"
Rh/rh) trilled 'r' followed by an aspiration (h) like in "pray"
S/s) *2
T/t) as in "take"
Th/th) as in "thing"
U/u) *3
W/w) as 'oo' in "good"
Y/y) *4

Notes:

1) The ‘ll’ in Welsh is pronounced by putting your tongue in the position of an ‘L’, followed by a blow. See the video bellow for a better explanation:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rU9wGmRZMI&hd=1

2) The ‘s’ in Welsh usually sounds like the English 'z' in the word “size”, however it also sounds like an 'sh', mainly if the ‘s’ is followed by an ‘i’, the sound shifts to the sound of ‘sh’, like siop, that is pronounced as shop.

3) The ‘u’ in the Southern dialect sounds simply like an ‘i’, in the Northern (Gog) dialect it sounds like the German ‘ü’.

4) The ‘y’ can have two different sounds depending on its position within a word. The rule is: if there’s only one ‘y’ in the word, it sounds like the ‘u’ in the English word “up”; if there is more than one ‘y’ in a word, the first sounds like the ‘u’ in “up”, and the others sound like the English ‘ee’ as in “Greek”.

Diphtongs

-ae, ai, au: Sound like an ‘i’ as in “bite”
-ei, eu, ey: Sound like ‘ay’ as in “bay”
-aw: Sounds like the ‘ow’ in “now”
-iw, uw: Sound like the ‘ew’ in “Jew”
-ew: Sounds like the ‘ell’ in “fell”
-ow: Sounds like the ‘oa’ in “boat”
-oe, oi, oy: Sounde like the ‘oy” in “boy”

Accents

Accents compose a very important part of the Welsh language, since they can change deeply the pronunciation of certain words. The accents are:

-Circunflex (^): Causes a vowel to be long where it would normally be short
-Acute (´): Causes stress in the vowel where it wouldn’t exist otherwise
-Umlaut (¨): Breaks a diphthong and makes the vowels be pronounced separately
-Grave (`): Causes a vowel to be short where it would normally be long

Exercise:

Listen to the famous Welsh folk song bellow and try to get the sounds:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nrkgdj0bVAo

Dacw 'nghariad i lawr yn y berllan,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.
O na bawn i yno fy hunan,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.
Dacw'r ty, a dacw'r 'sgubor;
Dacw ddrws y beudy'n agor.
Ffaldi radl idl al, ffaldi radl idl al,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.

Dacw’r dderwen wych ganghennog,
Golwg arni sydd far serchog.
Mi arhosaf yn ei chysgod
Nes daw ‘nghariad i ‘ngyfarfod.

Dacw'r delyn, dacw'r tannau;
Beth wyf gwell, heb neb i'w chwarae?
Dacw'r feinwen hoenus fanwl;
Beth wyf nes heb gael ei meddwl?

Translation:

There Is My Love

There is my love down in the orchard,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.
Oh how I wish I were there myself,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.
There is the house and there is the barn;
There is the door of the cow house open.
Ffaldi radl idl al, ffaldi radl idl al,
Tw rymdi ro rymdi radl idl al.

There is the gallant, branching oak,
A vision, lovingly crowned.
I will wait in her shade
Until my love comes to meet me.

There is the harp, there are her strings;
What better am I, without anyone to play her for?
There’s the delicate fair one, exquisite and full of life;
What nearer am I, without having her attention?

[Mark]

Brilliant thread, simply brilliant!

[alb0zfinest]

I really like the sound of welsh. Great thread btw.

[Smaug]

Brilliant thread, simply brilliant!

Thank you boyo!!!

Oh yes everybody, feel free to comment, I can clean the thread each time I update it.

[Incal]

I love this song:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efUTCMd9Do8

Do you know what they say or at least the main idea of the lyrics?

[Smaug]

I love this song:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efUTCMd9Do8

Do you know what they say or at least the main idea of the lyrics?

The song is nice is but hard to understand because the music is louder than the guy singing. By what I could get I think he says that he is "lonely" and "spending time minding his own life", then he says "I answer to the phone and it says revenge", whant brings him back "sour and bad memories".

[Smaug]

3. Verb To Be (Bod)



English
Literary
Colloquial
Southern Dialect


I am
Yr wyf i
Rydw i
Rw i/Rwy


You are
Yr wyt ti
Rwyt ti
Wyt ti


He is
Y mae ef
Mae e
Mae e


She is
Y mae hi
Mae hi
Mae hi


We are
Yr ydych ni
Rydyn ni
Ryn ni


You are (pl)
Yr ydych chwi
Rydych chi
Rych chi


They are
Y maen thwy
Maen nhw
Maen nhw



Important Notes:

In Welsh, the verb always comes before the subject:

1) Rw i'n trïo dysgu Cymraeg

I am trying to learn Welsh

2) Mae'n goch

It is red

The "maen" particle is used only together with the particle "nhw". For other situations in which the plural form is required, the word "mae" is used. It is also important to notice that the "mae" particle can be used as the English "it".

Another important aspect regards the use of the words "chi" and "ti", despite the plural/singular differences presented, the word "chi" can also be used in the singular when the situation in question is very formal.

The verb "bod" in Welsh is used just like the verbs "to be" or "to do" in English, what means it is an auxiliary verb, appearing in many different situations. For example, the particle "Mae" can be used as an equivalent of the English expression "there is/are". In the interrogative tense it becomes "oes", check it out:

Question: Oes banc gerllaw?

Is there a bank near?

Answer: Mae banc gerllaw

There is a bank near.

Interrogative Form



English
Literary
Colloquial
Southern Dialect


Am I?
Aydwyf fi?
Ydw i?
Ydw i?


Are you?
Aydwyf ti?
Wyt ti?
Wyt ti?


Is he?
Aydyw ef?
Ydy e?
Ydy e?


Is she?
Aydyw hi?
Ydy hi?
Ydy hi?


Are we?
Aydyn ni?
Ydyn ni?
Yn ni?


Are you? (pl)
Aydych chi?
Ydych chi?
Ydy chi?


Are they?
Aydyn thwi?
Yn nhw?
Ydy nhw?



One interesting aspect of the Welsh language is the lack of simple "yes" or "no" answers. Those answers are given by using the verb "bod", like here:

1) Question: Wyt ti? (Are you?)
Answer: Ydw (Yes [I am])

2) Question: Ydych chi? (Are you? [pl])
Answer: Ydyn (Yes [we are])

Sentence examples:

1) Question: Wyt ti'n trïo dysgu Cymraeg?
Are you trying to learn Welsh?

Answer: Ydw. Rw i'n trïo dysgu Cymraeg
Yes. I am trying to learn Welsh

2) Question: Ych chi'n derbyn cardiau credyd?
Do you accept credit card?

Answer: Ydyn.
Yes

To give simple negative answers, all you have to do is add the particle "nag" in front of what would be the positive answer:

Question: Wyt it? (Are you?)
Answer: Nag ydw (I am not)

Negative Form



English
Welsh


I am not
Dydw i ddim


You are not
Dwy ti ddim


He is not
Dydy e ddim


She is not
Dydy hi ddim


We are not
Dydyn ni ddim


You are not (pl)
Dydych chi ddim


They are not
Dydyn nhw ddim



Very easy, just take the Interrogative Form, add a 'D' in front of the verb and a "ddim" in front of the subject.

Example:

1) Dydw i ddim twp
I am not stupid

2)Dwy ti ddim yn Caerdydd
You are not in Cardiff

Exercises:

1) Translate the sentences bellow to Welsh:

A) Maen nhw yma
B) Rydyn ni mewn pryd
C) Rydw i
D) Mae hi Aberystwyth
E) Rydych chi yna
F) Mae e
G) Rydych chi gartre

2) Translate the sentences bellow to Welsh:

A) Dydw i ddim mewn pryd
B) Dydy e ddim yma
C) Dydych chi ddim yn Aberystwyth
D) Dydyn ni ddim gartre
E) Dwyt ri ddim yna
F) Dydy hi ddim mewn pryd
G) Dydyn nhw ddim yn Aberystwyth

3) Answer to the questions using giving both negative and positive answers:

A) Ydy e gartre?
B) Ydyn nwh yna?
C) Wyt ti yma?
D) Ydy hi?
E) Ydych hi?
F) Ydw i yn Abertystwyth
G) Ydyn ni mewn pryd?

Vocabulary needed:

chi - you (plural and polite)
e (fe) - he
gartre - at home
hi - she
i (fi) - I
mewn pryd - in time
nhw - they
ni - we
ti - you (familiar)
yma - here
yna - there
yn Aberystwyth - in Aberystwyth

ANSWERS (http://www.cs.cf.ac.uk/fun/welsh/Answers02_main.html#Answers for Lesson 2)

[Smaug]

4. Articles

Differently than English, in Welsh we don’t have the indefinite article ("a", "an"), only the definite article ("the"), that comes in three different forms:

- If the preceding word ends in a vowel = 'r
- Else if the next word starts with a vowel = yr
- Otherwise = y

Note: The letter 'h' is considered a vowel in Welsh, and 'w' in the beginning of a word is considered a consonant.

Examples:

- y gwely – the bed
- yr achog – the cause
- mae’r gwely – the bed is here

[DarkSecret]

Is welsh going to be an endangered language? 100.000 of 3.000.000 welsh speak it??

[Smaug]

Is welsh going to be an endangered language? 100.000 of 3.000.000 welsh speak it??

Acutally 500.000 out of 3.000.000 people speak it, and the number is rising.

[armenianbodyhair]

Subscribing.

[Smaug]

5. Adjectives

In Welsh the adjectives come after nouns, just like in the Romance languages. It is also important to have in mind that in Welsh adjectives agree with the nouns they change both in gender and in number.

Example:

Gwely bach
Little bed*

Da iawn
Very good**

* "Bach" is also a slang for "girl" in Welsh English
** Adverbs come after adjectives

In most of cases. In order to turn an adjective into an adverb, one just needs to add the "yn" in front of the adjective.

Example:

Adjective: Araf (Slow)
Adverb: Yn araf (Slowly)

[Fear Fiain]

5. Adjectives

In Welsh the adjectives come before nouns, just like in the Romance languages. It is also important to have in mind that in Welsh adjectives agree with the nouns they change both in gender and in number.


no, they come AFTER the noun, like in romance and celtic languages. and like romance languages and unlike gaelic, they conjugate in agreement with the noun they modify.

[Smaug]

no, they come AFTER the noun, like in romance and celtic languages. and like romance languages and unlike gaelic, they conjugate in agreement with the noun they modify.

True. I made a little confusion, thank you for pointing it out.

[Fear Fiain]

True. I made a little confusion, thank you for pointing it out.
failte romhat

[DarkSecret]

Welsh is close to ancient English?

[Smaug]

Welsh is close to ancient English?

No, completely unrelated.

[Longbowman]

No, completely unrelated.

Well, not quite. They're both Indo-European. Western Indo-European, at that. Beyond that there's no close rlationship, Welsh being a Celtic language and English a Germanic one.

[Smaug]

Well, not quite. They're both Indo-European. Western Indo-European, at that. Beyond that there's no close rlationship, Welsh being a Celtic language and English a Germanic one.

You know what I meant.

[Longbowman]

You know what I meant.

Indeed I did! :)

[rhiannon]

Subscribing.

Me too :thumb001:

[rhiannon]

What are the differences between Gaelic and Brythonic Celtic languages/culture?

[Smaug]

What are the differences between Gaelic and Brythonic Celtic languages/culture?

Gaelic and Brythonic share similar grammatics and syntax, the main difference between them lies in the vocabulary and on the writting system. Brythonic languages have a very phonetic writting system while Gaelic has a very confusing one. Other than that, Brythonic is a P-Celtic language, while Gaelic is Q-Celtic, what means Brythonic preserved p*/b* sounds while in Gaelic it shifted to g*/k*/c*.

[Rosier12]

Swydd dda!

[Weedman]

@Uhtred how similar is modern Welsh to Old British?

...and to Cumbric?

how many changes have taken place since it was widely spoken in Britain?

[Weedman]

Gaelic and Brythonic share similar grammatics and syntax, the main difference between them lies in the vocabulary and on the writting system. Brythonic languages have a very phonetic writting system while Gaelic has a very confusing one. Other than that, Brythonic is a P-Celtic language, while Gaelic is Q-Celtic, what means Brythonic preserved p*/b* sounds while in Gaelic it shifted to g*/k*/c*.

ex. Gaelic-Mac, means "son of" as in MacDonald
Welsh-Map, means "son of" shortened to Ap' as in Ap'Howell/ Powell

Welsh-Pen "head" as in Pendragon (head dragon)
Gaelic Cenn" head" as in Kennedy (head like a helmet)

this is where the phrase "mind your p's and q's " originally came from, so I've heard

[Smaug]

@Uhtred how similar is modern Welsh to Old British?

...and to Cumbric?

how many changes have taken place since it was widely spoken in Britain?

Many changes took place, but all in all Brythonic remained quite a preserved language since Antiquity. Most of influences in Old Brythonic comes from Latin, from the times of the Roman Invasion of Britannia. Maybe that's why I find so many similarities between my Romance language (Portuguese) and Modern Welsh.

[Longbowman]

The Celtic languages are the closest living relation to the Romance or Italic languages. They are considered part of the Italo-Celtic family. Which is why there's a lot of similarity between them and languages derived from vulgar Latin.

Cumbric was basically Welsh. In fact, it was Welsh.

[Black Wolf]

I have some 2nd cousins in Wales who are native Welsh speakers. Their grandmother and my grandmother were sisters born in Ireland. Their grandmother (my great aunt) married a Welshman and moved there.

[Fear Fiain]

Well, not quite. They're both Indo-European. Western Indo-European, at that. Beyond that there's no close rlationship, Welsh being a Celtic language and English a Germanic one.

not sure that's accurate, I think there's a large breton-celtic lexicon in modern english. and a large english loanword lexicon in modern welsh.

[Longbowman]

not sure that's accurate, I think there's a large breton-celtic lexicon in modern english. and a large english loanword lexicon in modern welsh.

You'd think, but actually there's very, very little Celtic influence in modern English, surprisingly. The reverse is less true. For example, famously (in England) the Welsh word for 'microwave' is 'popty ping' BUT in reality they just say 'microwave.'

[Merida]

Great post!! Very clear and interesting!! :)

Welsh is such a cool language. It sounds really nice to my ears!

Thanks for posting this!

[Smaug]

Great post!! Very clear and interesting!! :)

Welsh is such a cool language. It sounds really nice to my ears!

Thanks for posting this!

Thank you very much! I see you also have Welsh ancestry.

[Merida]

Thank you very much! I see you also have Welsh ancestry.

And very proud of it!! :D

Cymru am byth!

[DarkSecret]

You'd think, but actually there's very, very little Celtic influence in modern English, surprisingly. The reverse is less true. For example, famously (in England) the Welsh word for 'microwave' is 'popty ping' BUT in reality they just say 'microwave.'

it's a technical term or a device though... For example we say televizyon to television. But actually in Turkish it should be dalga-görüş or tele-görüş something. And many language has the same word for computer but there is an acceptable word for computer. We don't say komputer for example we say "bilgisayar". It means "data-counter" lol. It was made up but society embraced the word so nobody says komputer...

[turkojew]

it's a technical term or a device though... For example we say televizyon to television. But actually in Turkish it should be dalga-görüş or tele-görüş something. And many language has the same word for computer but there is an acceptable word for computer. We don't say komputer for example we say "bilgisayar". It means "data-counter" lol. It was made up but society embraced the word so nobody says komputer...

They call it kompüter in old movies though. Like Turist Ömer.

[uuiiioo]

I'm Welsh and lived in Wales all my life. Being born in the capital I'm now upset that I cannot really speak Welsh at all! Teachers in school were terrible, and I find it hard to teach myself. I know the obvious basics, of course. Many of my Welsh speaking friends don't even fully understand the language themselves so they say they cannot help me much.

I can't see to find many Welsh courses available. I did apply for one in a college near me months ago, but they never got back to me. Guessing it isn't running. It's pretty depressing haha. The language is sort of dying, they want people to learn but don't really give you the resources for it. Would love the government to run courses/classes. Preferably for free, but beggars can't be choosers haha.

[Guapo]

Cymru am byth!

Yeah, what she said

[Merida]

Yeah, what she said

Our son could speak Welsh :)

[Smaug]

I'm Welsh and lived in Wales all my life. Being born in the capital I'm now upset that I cannot really speak Welsh at all! Teachers in school were terrible, and I find it hard to teach myself. I know the obvious basics, of course. Many of my Welsh speaking friends don't even fully understand the language themselves so they say they cannot help me much.

I can't see to find many Welsh courses available. I did apply for one in a college near me months ago, but they never got back to me. Guessing it isn't running. It's pretty depressing haha. The language is sort of dying, they want people to learn but don't really give you the resources for it. Would love the government to run courses/classes. Preferably for free, but beggars can't be choosers haha.

You and me are going to get along just fine.

[Longbowman]

I'm Welsh and lived in Wales all my life. Being born in the capital I'm now upset that I cannot really speak Welsh at all! Teachers in school were terrible, and I find it hard to teach myself. I know the obvious basics, of course. Many of my Welsh speaking friends don't even fully understand the language themselves so they say they cannot help me much.

I can't see to find many Welsh courses available. I did apply for one in a college near me months ago, but they never got back to me. Guessing it isn't running. It's pretty depressing haha. The language is sort of dying, they want people to learn but don't really give you the resources for it. Would love the government to run courses/classes. Preferably for free, but beggars can't be choosers haha.

Eh, speakership amongst the younger generation is actually increasing, just not in the industrial Southern regions. Even my grandparents' place in Ystradfellte is Anglophone. But I hear Ystradgynlais and other areas are Welsh-speaking.

Go to Snowdonia, speak it every day, learn it by immersion.

You'll have to make do with living in a very small village though. The larger towns are primarily English speaking. Lloegyr ym bath.

[Smaug]

Eh, speakership amongst the younger generation is actually increasing, just not in the industrial Southern regions. Even my grandparents' place in Ystradfellte is Anglophone. But I hear Ystradgynlais and other areas are Welsh-speaking.

Go to Snowdonia, speak it every day, learn it by immersion.

You'll have to make do with living in a very small village though. The larger towns are primarily English speaking. Lloegyr ym bath.

am byth*

Those Saesneg...

[Hithaeglir]

Grabs notebook.

[fenix978]

How big is difference between northern and southern dialect, and how many percent of Welsh speakers speak southern dialect?

[Smaug]

How big is difference between northern and southern dialect, and how many percent of Welsh speakers speak southern dialect?

There isn't a very big difference, but enough to be noticed. All in all the southern dialect is tad simpler than the northern variation, mainly becasue it is the north that holds the most well-preserved variation of the Welsh language. It is also worth mentioning that it is the southern dialect which is considered "standard Welsh" and is therefore used in media.

[Smaug]

By the way, now it is "Smaug's Welsh Course". That's right. Smaug is Welsh. Actually I amq the red dragon on Wales' flag :P

[♥ Lily ♥]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAw7zYX3eVI

[♥ Lily ♥]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufKf4eORcKA

[♥ Lily ♥]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHxO0UdpoxM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3b2F-bkAdM