Are light traits in Southern Europe due to the northern European admixture ?

Printable View

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

05-09-2013, 04:44 PM
Peyrol

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfieb

I love how yet another map totally disses Malta. Won't even shade them black! Just leaves them off entirely while including Tunis. lol.

That's because a romance language developed from V to IX centuries in the whole Maghreb...a language totally disappeared, erased by arabic invasion and berber cultural genocide.

Maghrebi arab dialect still hold some romance words...''Quasr'' for ''City'' (from castrum) and Quas for ''cheese'' (from caseus, tuscan and old italian cacio).
05-09-2013, 04:46 PM
ABest

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyrol

I thought that tessaliots and epiriots were the taller/lighter, while dodecanesians and cyclades the ''darker''.

I've read that too. A lot of this is in Dienekes' articles btw! Also, I've read about the Pelopponesian pigmentation average being similar to that of Crete's overal average. Or that might have been about them clustering near each other genetically, I'm not sure! Also, it really depends on the island, but I think that, on average, hair/eye color of islanders is a bit darker than Epirotes, but not darker than some other mainlanders.

LOL, I have to go through these studies again, I've forgotten some of the details. But yeah, go through Dienekes' data if you're interested in Greece.
05-09-2013, 04:50 PM
Peyrol

Quote:

Originally Posted by ABest

I've read that too. A lot of this is in Dienekes' articles btw! Also, I've read about the Pelopponesian pigmentation average being similar to that of Crete's overal average. Or that might have been about them clustering near each other genetically, I'm not sure! Also, it really depends on the island, but I think that, on average, hair/eye color of islanders is a bit darker than Epirotes, but not darker than some other mainlanders.

LOL, I have to go through these studies again, I've forgotten some of the details. But yeah, go through Dienekes' data if you're interested in Greece.

All the times i'm in Dodecanese, people there look like sicilians or calabrese...it's amazing...i don't know if some Dodecanesian island sent colonist in Sicily in the Second Expansion, but probably yes.
05-09-2013, 04:50 PM
Kastrioti1443

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikeliot

I thought so too. Everyone I know from Epirus is blue eyed and fair, although with darker hair.

Epirots are not taller, but very light in eyes, tosk albanians have evan more light eyes than gheg highlanders.

These 2 albanian footballers come from Laberia, region of albanian Epirus:

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/5716/gericipijp8.jpg

http://answers.bettor.com/images/Art...zio-128346.jpg
05-09-2013, 04:53 PM
Sikeliot

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyrol

All the times i'm in Dodecanese, people there look like sicilians or calabrese...it's amazing...i don't know if some Dodecanesian island sent colonist in Sicily in the Second Expansion, but probably yes.

I don't frankly think mainland Greeks (except some southern Peloponnesians) look anything like Sicilians and Calabrese. But islanders do.
05-09-2013, 05:01 PM
Peyrol

I found only that the sicilian City of Naxos was colonized by (obviously) naxos islanders.

( if someone can read italian this is the page http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Storia_della_Sicilia_greca )
05-09-2013, 05:03 PM
ABest

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sikeliot

I don't frankly think mainland Greeks (except some southern Peloponnesians) look anything like Sicilians and Calabrese. But islanders do.

Islanders definitely do. However, I always perceived Peloponnesians and islanders as relatively similar looking. Maybe it's just me.

Anyway, there are pigmentation average differences between Greeks but not nearly as big as in bigger countries like Spain and Italy, I would assume.

Plus, the averages I posted about Macedonians and Pontic Greeks from the 19th century-early 20th century kinda support my point, since they don't really manifest any sort of great blondness at all.

I actually want to email Dienekes about this issue, I wonder what his opinion is.
05-09-2013, 05:04 PM
Sikeliot

I think it's either

1) a higher retention of ancient Greek genes in Sicilians/Calabrese and Greek islanders versus high Albanian and/or Slavic influence in parts of mainland Greece AND Pontians being Hellenized Caucasians and Cypriots Hellenized Levantines

or

2) The Neolithic wave of migration that hit the Greek islands also got southern Italy but missed mainland Greece.

For the record Cypriots also appear more "familiar" in comparison to Sicilians than do mainland Greeks.
05-09-2013, 05:04 PM
alfieb

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyrol

I found only that the sicilian City of Naxos was colonized by (obviously) naxos islanders.

( if someone can read italian this is the page http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Storia_della_Sicilia_greca )

I spent a week in Naxos so I'm embarrassed to say I don't remember the story all that well, but I believe it was destroyed and repopulated by others, hence why it is Giardini-Naxos, similar to Calatafimi-Segesta.
05-09-2013, 05:05 PM
ABest

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peyrol

I found only that the sicilian City of Naxos was colonized by (obviously) naxos islanders.

( if someone can read italian this is the page http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Storia_della_Sicilia_greca )

I see. BTW, I always thought that ancient Greeks looked a bit darker than modern Greeks. Would you agree?

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page