German GEDmatch results

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Leto

I think several million people were expelled from those lands soon after the end of WW2, so that's not a small percentage. I'm not talking out of my ass, I've heard and read many Germans mentioning such refugees in their families.

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That's true, but that it's not like every second west German has eastern roots.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stearsolina

That's true, but that it's not like every second west German has eastern roots.

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Agree, probably one in five or so.

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With at least[275] 12 million[96][276][277] Germans directly involved, possibly 14 million[258][278] or more,[279] it was the largest movement or transfer of any single ethnic population in European history[277][280][281] and the largest among the post-war expulsions in Central and Eastern Europe (which displaced 20 to 31 million people in total).[276]

The exact number of Germans expelled after the war is still unknown, because most recent research provides a combined estimate which includes those who were evacuated by the German authorities, fled or were killed during the war. It is estimated that between 12 and 14 million German citizens and foreign ethnic Germans and their descendants were displaced from their homes. The exact number of casualties is still unknown and is difficult to establish due to the chaotic nature of the last months of the war. Census figures placed the total number of ethnic Germans still living in Eastern Europe in 1950, after the major expulsions were complete, at approximately 2.6 million, about 12 percent of the pre-war total.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight...the_expulsions

West Germany had 50 million people in 1950 (after the expulsion)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Leto

Agree, probably one in five or so.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight...the_expulsions

West Germany had 50 million people in 1950 (after the expulsion)

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Well how would you weight the average then?

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Originally Posted by Creoda

Well how would you weight the average then?

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I can't be sure. Those Eastern Germans may not have been homogeneous. But let's consider this:
- West Germany had a population of 50 m (1950) 25% of which were the refugees
- East Germany had 18 m (1950)

At least 40% of the samples should be Eastern German. I know that sounds like a lot.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Leto

I can't be sure. Those Eastern Germans may not have been homogeneous. But let's consider this:
- West Germany had a population of 50 m (1950) 25% of which were the refugees
- East Germany had 18 m (1950)

At least 40% of the samples should be Eastern German. I know that sounds like a lot.

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Maybe NW & South x3, East x2 then. (1/4 rather than 1/5)

A lot of those 'Germans' are largely East Euro too, I'm not sure that mixed diaspora should take precedence.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Creoda

Maybe NW & South x3, East x2 then. (1/4 rather than 1/5)

A lot of those 'Germans' are largely East Euro too, I'm not sure that mixed diaspora should take precedence.

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What mixed diaspora? The Moustache Man was waging war on their behalf, they spoke German and identified as German at any rate. And got kicked out of Poland and Czechoslovakia for being German. Now those people are mostly dead but their children and grandchildren are fully assimilated, unlike the repatriates from the former Soviet Union in which case they are indeed much less pure ancestry-wise. Around 2 million Aussiedler (incl. family members) have migrated from Russia, Kazakhstan and Ukraine over the past 30 years.
At least one quarter of the samples should be fully East German.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Leto

What mixed diaspora? The Moustache Man was waging war on their behalf, they spoke German and identified as German at any rate. And got kicked out of Poland and Czechoslovakia for being German. Now those people are mostly dead but their children and grandchildren are fully assimilated, unlike the repatriates from the former Soviet Union in which case they are indeed much less pure ancestry-wise. Around 2 million Aussiedler (incl. family members) have migrated from Russia, Kazakhstan and Ukraine over the past 30 years.
At least one quarter of the samples should be fully East German.

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Not only Germany from Poland and Czech Republic arrived after 1945. Huge amount of Danube Swabians arrived too, and many (not all) of those very heavily mixed with locals. Also Transylvanian Germans etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Creoda

Maybe NW & South x3, East x2 then. (1/4 rather than 1/5)

A lot of those 'Germans' are largely East Euro too, I'm not sure that mixed diaspora should take precedence.

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They're indeed mixed, but so are East Germans...

I think Germans should decide this, but it seems there are hardly any Germans here, the ones that are here aren't into this stuff.
Teutone once said for him Eastern European Germans are as German as any other Germans.

From Stade district near Hamburg, checked her Gedcom, only NW German ancestors:

Spoiler!

1 North_Atlantic 51.54
2 Baltic 22.27
3 West_Med 10.53
4 West_Asian 7.79
5 East_Med 5.57
6 Oceanian 1.21
7 South_Asian 0.54
8 Northeast_African 0.54

# Population (source) Distance
1 Southeast_English 4.6
2 Irish 4.83
3 West_Scottish 4.85
4 North_Dutch 4.86
5 Orcadian 4.9
6 Danish 5.09
7 Southwest_English 5.57
8 North_German 6.29
9 Norwegian 7.09
10 South_Dutch 8.28

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 94.2% West_Scottish + 5.8% Lebanese_Druze @ 3.16
2 94.4% West_Scottish + 5.6% Iranian_Jewish @ 3.22
3 94.3% West_Scottish + 5.7% Assyrian @ 3.25
4 94.5% West_Scottish + 5.5% Kurdish_Jewish @ 3.26
5 94.3% West_Scottish + 5.7% Armenian @ 3.28
6 94.4% West_Scottish + 5.6% Georgian_Jewish @ 3.29
7 94.2% West_Scottish + 5.8% Kurdish @ 3.31
8 93.8% West_Scottish + 6.2% Azeri @ 3.36
9 94.3% West_Scottish + 5.7% Iranian @ 3.38
10 94.2% West_Scottish + 5.8% Lebanese_Muslim @ 3.4

From Kassel district, the northernmost part of Hessen:

Spoiler!

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 50.36
2 Baltic 24.82
3 West_Med 11.15
4 East_Med 6.33
5 West_Asian 4.48
6 Red_Sea 1.04
7 Oceanian 0.76
8 East_Asian 0.66
9 Amerindian 0.24
10 Northeast_African 0.16

# Population (source) Distance
1 North_Dutch 3.43
2 Southeast_English 3.44
3 Danish 3.7
4 Orcadian 4.11
5 North_German 4.93
6 Irish 5.18
7 West_Scottish 5.24
8 Southwest_English 5.59
9 Norwegian 5.62
10 South_Dutch 7.28

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 95.4% North_Dutch + 4.6% Italian_Jewish @ 2.57
2 50.3% North_Dutch + 49.7% Southeast_English @ 2.61
3 91% North_Dutch + 9% Spanish_Murcia @ 2.62
4 95.8% North_Dutch + 4.2% Tunisian_Jewish @ 2.64
5 96.9% North_Dutch + 3.1% Yemenite_Jewish @ 2.64
6 54% Southeast_English + 46% Danish @ 2.64
7 92.3% Southeast_English + 7.7% La_Brana-1 @ 2.65
8 95.5% North_Dutch + 4.5% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.65
9 91.3% North_Dutch + 8.7% Spanish_Valencia @ 2.66
10 95.9% North_Dutch + 4.1% Libyan_Jewish @ 2.66

From Nürnberg, Franconia:

Spoiler!

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 40.73
2 Baltic 27.24
3 West_Med 14.71
4 East_Med 11.91
5 West_Asian 4.22
6 Amerindian 1.03
7 Oceanian 0.16

# Population (source) Distance
1 Austrian 5.93
2 West_German 6.19
3 South_Dutch 7.33
4 East_German 7.46
5 Hungarian 9.1
6 North_German 9.95
7 French 10.33
8 Southeast_English 10.96
9 Danish 11.66
10 North_Dutch 11.91

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 55.4% Southeast_English + 44.6% Serbian @ 3.78
2 63.8% West_German + 36.2% Hungarian @ 4.15
3 58.2% North_Swedish + 41.8% North_Italian @ 4.15
4 55.6% Hungarian + 44.4% Southeast_English @ 4.18
5 57.4% South_Dutch + 42.6% Hungarian @ 4.21
6 84% West_German + 16% Belorussian @ 4.32
7 52.2% Austrian + 47.8% West_German @ 4.34
8 84.2% West_German + 15.8% Estonian_Polish @ 4.34
9 71.4% French + 28.6% Belorussian @ 4.35
10 81.1% West_German + 18.9% Ukrainian @ 4.35

Half from Donau-Ries district + half Sudetengerman:

Spoiler!

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 34.71
2 Baltic 26.3
3 West_Med 19.15
4 East_Med 11.37
5 West_Asian 7.19
6 Sub-Saharan 0.46
7 Oceanian 0.4
8 Amerindian 0.37
9 Siberian 0.04

# Population (source) Distance
1 Austrian 6.5
2 Hungarian 8.06
3 East_German 8.43
4 Serbian 8.77
5 West_German 9.42
6 South_Dutch 10.61
7 French 10.97
8 Romanian 11.69
9 Croatian 11.89
10 Moldavian 12.1

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 86.8% Austrian + 13.2% Sardinian @ 2.35
2 66.4% East_German + 33.6% North_Italian @ 2.43
3 57% Croatian + 43% Spanish_Cataluna @ 2.46
4 57% Spanish_Valencia + 43% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 2.57
5 59.9% Spanish_Cataluna + 40.1% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 2.57
6 53.5% South_Polish + 46.5% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.72
7 71.6% Hungarian + 28.4% Spanish_Andalucia @ 2.79
8 54.7% Spanish_Andalucia + 45.3% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 2.8
9 69.7% Hungarian + 30.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 2.8
10 71.7% East_German + 28.3% Tuscan @ 2.81

^^^^Very useful, shows northern Hesse is north German like, at least this person is. There may be big genetical divide inside Hesse itself.