Scytho-Turkic Z93 branch Z2125 vs. Indo-Aryan migration theory

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Originally Posted by Foreigner

Did they exagerate how light these peoples were, because Romans were even more Gypsy looking(darkies I mean) than modern Italians(if somehow possible)?

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would an Italian describe Russian group of barbarians as light?

And you got the answer :D

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Originally Posted by Foreigner

Vir, do you think Alans were basically Ossetes and what do you think was the ethnogenesis of the Scytho-Sarmatian peoples like? And how come even Alans looked so light to the Romans?

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alans were probably diverse looking people who assimilated various non-iranic tribes during their migrations. I think the orginial alans were predominately r1a like other scythians or sarmartians but they assimilated a huge number of caucasian people when they settled in the caucasus. Alans more in the north and far away from the caucasus had probably more r1a and were lighter. Alans were nomadic people and nomadic people often incorporated defeated tribes into their own tribal confederations. So many alans had probably also caucasian ancestry and some tests have shown that medieval alans carried already haplogroup G2 like modern ossetians. Haplogroup G2 is in this case clearly of caucasian and not of iranic origin because the oldest iranic people were almost entirely dominated by r1a and haplogroup G2 is very common among non-iranic caucasian people.

After the turkic and mongolic invasion most alans were either killed or assimilated by turks. Only the few alans who stayed in more mountainous regions survived this genocide and here they again mixed much with caucasians so that only few of them carry r1a today

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Originally Posted by gültekin

yet another, "Golden Woman" Scythian princess found in Kazahstan Terekti
description on the comb shows a war between Scythians and Iranians. so that's a big evidence, Scythians can't be fucking iranians
http://onturk.org/2014/08/20/altin-g...din/#more-4639
https://onturk.files.wordpress.com/2...=700&h=&crop=1
https://onturk.files.wordpress.com/2...=700&h=&crop=1

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It shows war between the Scythians and Persians who tried to conquer Scythia.

There was also war between Medes and Persians when Persians under Cyrus attended to take the power over the Median Empire. You probably never heard of "Brotherwar"?

Let me remind you on the Ottoman/Timurid wars. So going by your logic (if you ever had something called logic to begin with). Ottomans can't have been Turkic, right?

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Originally Posted by Demhat

Turkic Speakers are the result of an East Iranic tribe, the Tur (Turan= land of the Tur) mixing with early Altaic groups.

The Pashtuns or Tajiks are as high in Haplogroup R1a z93 as any Turkic speakers. Since there is not much diversity of R1a1a in Turkic speakers they all probably descend from one single source(the Tur). It is not yet clear if Andronovo was the Proto Indo_iranian homeland, or just a very early settlements of the Proto Indo_iranians.

The Mitanni were probably proto Indo_Iranian speakers who were not yet diverged in the Iranic and Indo_Aryan branches.

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pashtuns and mountain tajiks/pamiri have much more r1a turkic people. Only kyrgyz have also so much r1a like them but this seems to be the result of a founder effect and only in one region kyrgyz people had very much r1a.

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Originally Posted by Vir9

alans were probably diverse looking people who assimilated various non-iranic tribes during their migrations. I think the orginial alans were predominately r1a like other scythians or sarmartians but they assimilated a huge number of caucasian people when they settled in the caucasus. Alans more in the north and far away from the caucasus had probably more r1a and were lighter. Alans were nomadic people and nomadic people often incorporated defeated tribes into their own tribal confederations. So many alans had probably also caucasian ancestry and some tests have shown that medieval alans carried already haplogroup G2 like modern ossetians. Haplogroup G2 is in this case clearly of caucasian and not of iranic origin because the oldest iranic people were almost entirely dominated by r1a and haplogroup G2 is very common among non-iranic caucasian people.

After the turkic and mongolic invasion most alans were either killed or assimilated by turks. Only the few alans who stayed in more mountainous regions survived this genocide and here they again mixed much with caucasians so that only few of them carry r1a today

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There is a Zaza tribe called Alan, that's also interesting.

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Originally Posted by Instinct

There is a Kurdish tribe called Alan, that's also interesting.

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I guess, it's a Zaza tribe.

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Originally Posted by Alphawolf

I guess, it's a Zaza tribe.

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Indeed. They are Zaza speakers from Tunceli.

Fixed

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Originally Posted by Duke

you turks are retarded, in east europe and steppe ,horsmen were main type of warrior, but you are not Indo europeans, early turks are mongoloid, and you guys today are primarily anatolian, with minor mongol admix

Scythians were light haired people with Indoeuropan genes, and as study has shown they were not similar to Caucasus people

Ancient Y-DNA data was finally provided by Keyser et al in 2009. They studied the haplotypes and haplogroups of 26 ancient human specimens from the Krasnoyarsk area in Siberia were dated from between the middle of the 2nd millennium BC and the 4th century AD (Scythian and Sarmatian timeframe). Nearly all subjects belong to haplogroup R-M17. The authors suggest that their data shows that between Bronze and Iron Ages the constellation of populations known variously as Scythians, Andronovians, etc. were blue- (or green-) eyed, fair-skinned and light-haired people who might have played a role in the early development of the Tarim Basin civilization. Moreover, this study found that they were genetically more closely related to modern populations of eastern Europe than those of central and southern Asia.[38] The ubiquity and utter dominance of R1a Y-DNA lineage

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I don't know of any study which has yet published Scythian or Sarmatian aDNA. But what I know is eye and hair color is not a sign of DNA. ancient WHG people were dark skinned while modern people of pred. WHG ancestry are light skinned. The first ever Steppe invader from Hungary was genetically in between North Caucasians and Ukrainians ending somewhere in "no mans land".

Taking into Account that all Indo_Iranians have a good chunk of ANE as well ENF and signs by Lazaridis that earlier Yanmaya people where like West Asian farmers and Northeast European H&G. I doubt that they had no close genetic connection to North Caucasians. Allot of people speculate 35% ANE 45% ENF and 20% WHG. Thats roughly in between North Caucasian and Russian DNA. Don't take modern genetic landscape of European Steppes as representative of ancient Steppes. The Steppes today are heavily affected by the Slavic(European Steppes) and Altaic(Asian Steppes) expansions.

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Originally Posted by Alphawolf

I guess, it's a Zaza tribe.

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You poor little troll. There is a Kurdish tribe of Alans in Sirnak, Van, Mahabad and Iraqi Kurdistan and Zaza are a Kurdish tribe. But I understand your butthurtness took over your mind once again.

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Originally Posted by gültekin

http://s27.postimg.org/yrvx97cz7/kurt_680557.jpg

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he has r1a like the earliest indo-iranian people and scythian and which real mongolic haplogroup you have??? E, G, or J ?