The Genomic History Of Southeastern Europe

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Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

Bronze Age Montenegrin sample is somewhere at the Albanian and Bulgarian cluster.

It's just ONE sample, either way, if we had more samples of similar genetic background it would most likely plot inside Albanians or Bulgarians. I put the dot in the centre of the Albanian cluster, it could be wrong by a few pixels but still roughly tells the point.

Albanian average is the red dot, we have many Albanians levitating towards the Bulgarian cluster, too. Eurogenes V2K15:

http://i.imgur.com/45aNfuo.png

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Based on what? Why are you saying random shit? In the PCA I provided they're clearly with Iberians, if you have counter evidence, provide it. One sample? All these samples in this study cluster with N. Italians and will soon actually be shown to cluster inbetween N. Italians and Iberians, some with Iberians.

That K15 plot has nothing to do.. with anything.

I was the one who made this:

http://oi67.tinypic.com/egtlch.jpg

then was later convinced it's inaccurate because it's a modern calc being used on ancient samples. It's only accurate for the later samples like the Hinxton Britons/Anglo-Saxons and the neolithic farmers, everything else, especially BA Hungary, Sintashta(Sintashta are east Ukrainian like, not Scandinavian), etc). Need to use PCA or an ancient calc. I'm not biased and I admitted I was wrong, you should do the same.

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Originally Posted by Litvin

I2a2 is not Germanic.

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More importantly, Y-DNA makes up less than 1-2% of your genome. An African American with I1 is not "Germanic".

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Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

Based on what? Why are you saying random shit? In the PCA I provided they're clearly with Iberians, if you have counter evidence, provide it. One sample? All these samples in this study cluster with N. Italians and will soon actually be shown to cluster inbetween N. Italians and Iberians, some with Iberians.

That K15 plot has nothing to do.. with anything.


then was later convinced it's inaccurate because it's a modern calc being used on ancient samples. It's only accurate for the later samples like the Hinxton Britons/Anglo-Saxons and the neolithic farmers, everything else, especially BA Hungary, Sintashta(Sintashta are east Ukrainian like, not Scandinavian), etc). Need to use PCA or an ancient calc. I'm not biased and I admitted I was wrong, you should do the same.

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I don't give a fuck what you think piss of shit, we are right between Tuscans, Thessaly & Bulgaria.
Plotting near North Italians or Spanish would be the last thing happening for an Albanian so shut your fucking mouth, sperging negropolreby.

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Originally Posted by nightrider+

I never said they plot with Bulgarians. I said they plot with Tuscans or like Balkan farmer shifted Bulgarians. Btw keep in mind that all those Bulgarians samples are from far southern Bulgaria, northerners would probably plot closer to Romanians and to European core. The fact that you're focusing on N. Italians (or even Iberians, lol) is bordering on propaganda, it's what you want to see.
The Balkan Chalcolithic samples are also more or less on the same cline.
As for the fact that Bulgarians are more "eastern" and not so much modern Slavs shifted compared to the Bronze Age and Neolithic Balkans (if we assume that Slavic migrations are responsible for their "northern" shift), it might have something to do with influence from Peloponnese Neolithic (E-V13 could be there) or Anatolian related populations, which would be supported by their modern y-dna distribution. Another possibility is influence from the North after Bronze Age collapse.

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You forget that my original post you first responded to was simply telling an Albanian who claimed "Balkanites have 100% autosomal continuity from the Bronze Age" he was wrong.

"Farmer shifted Tuscans" 3 of them are, yes, the other 5 red squares are closer to N. Italians than Tuscans, but "farmer shifted Tuscans" is just nitpicking here and you're basically agreeing with my point. The copper age ones are all N. Italian.

There are literally no samples from southern Bulgaria, not sure why you said that. They're all on the Romanian border, and there's not much difference between Bulgarian samples and far northern Croatian ones.

I didn't claim modern Balkanites are BA Balkanites+Turks, those are Faklon's words. I didn't even suggest a source. All I said was they were N. Italian, or not modern Balkanites. You basically agreed you can't get modern Bulgarians from BA Bulgarians+modern Balto-Slavs, so we're on the same page. Lots of potential other populations. Yamnaya(although seems unlikely as the initial Yamnaya push had already happened and Yamnaya didn't exist in the late bronze age anymore), the Iron Age Scythian from Hungary who was pretty south-eastern compared to Europeans, copper age Anatolians, etc. Doesn't have to be Turks, doesn't make them anyless southern shifted though.

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Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

I don't give a fuck what you think piss of shit, we are right between Tuscans, Thessaly & Bulgaria.
Plotting near North Italians or Spanish would be the last thing happening for an Albanian so shut your fucking mouth, sperging negropolreby.

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I haven't once talked about where modern Albanians plot. Moron.

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Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

I haven't once talked about where modern Albanians plot. Moron.

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Bronze Age Balkan sample JAZ1 is nowhere close North Italy or Spain due to Northern/Eastern Steppe influence. Now, back the fuck off.

You have been sperging this nonsense for several pages.


http://s32.postimg.org/s3yba4u6t/PCA_JAZ1.png

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Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

You forget that my original post you first responded to was simply telling an Albanian who claimed "Balkanites have 100% autosomal continuity from the Bronze Age" he was wrong.

"Farmer shifted Tuscans" 3 of them are, yes, the other 5 red squares are closer to N. Italians than Tuscans, but "farmer shifted Tuscans" is just nitpicking here and you're basically agreeing with my point. The copper age ones are all N. Italian.

There are literally no samples from southern Bulgaria, not sure why you said that. They're all on the Romanian border, and there's not much difference between Bulgarian samples and far northern Croatian ones.

I didn't claim modern Balkanites are BA Balkanites+Turks, those are Faklon's words. I didn't even suggest a source. All I said was they were N. Italian, or not modern Balkanites. You basically agreed you can't get modern Bulgarians from BA Bulgarians+modern Balto-Slavs, so we're on the same page. Lots of potential other populations. Yamnaya(although seems unlikely as the initial Yamnaya push had already happened and Yamnaya didn't exist in the late bronze age anymore), the Iron Age Scythian from Hungary who was pretty south-eastern compared to Europeans, copper age Anatolians, etc. Doesn't have to be Turks, doesn't make them anyless southern shifted though.

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Again, I'm not sure what you are looking at. Balkan Chalcolithic is close to Anatolian and other farmers. The only samples that plot right with N.Italians there are Vatya.

Also I wasn't talking about the ancient Bulgarian samples but the modern ones when I said they are all from the south.

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Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

More importantly, Y-DNA makes up less than 1-2% of your genome.

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http://emotikona.pl/emotikony/pic/2glowawmur.gif

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Originally Posted by Feiichy

R1b-L23 in Croatia too ? From which period of time ?

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from vucedol culture

Where I2a1b most likely expanded from:
http://s25.postimg.org/ytxbq3pfj/cu_...s_22102015.jpg