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There was recently a genetic makeup study posted here for all Polish regions. Not one region had half Celto-Germanic results or anything close to it. If it applies to just very few individuals, it's not interesting for the question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Abriekman
In fact many western polish area was repleaced by the very slavic eastern poles after the fall of Prussia.Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
The ones from Balkan.Because some have brown skin and slavic peoples is associated with light skin and light eyes
Phenotype lottery. Some south Slavs are swarthy due to ending up looking closer to pre-Slavic population they mixed with while you have Slavs to thank for Baltoid phenotype, it certanly isn't from Albanians xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Asten
I'm joking though. South Slavs are quite better looking that north Slavs, Slavo-Med combination is estetically quite superior to pure northern features which are pretty unremarkable.
Czechs
As for thread, least Slavic overall are Torbesh (Macedonian muslims who seem to have heavy Albanian admix). From regional Slav groups Pinega Russians are one of least genetically Slavic speakers, they are mostly Slavicized Karelians.
Czechs are more than half Slavic on average, their Germaness is exeggerated although they have significant western Euro admix.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crn Volk
You can think whatever you want. I'm still Albanian and not Slavic. i have come to this forum for learning something new and not for fighting with some stranger.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina
By your point of view if baltic Albanian are Slavic then dinarid Serbo-Croat have Gheg blood
Most Germanic admixed Poles are in now central parts like Greater Poland (real western Poland before border change with original population) and north on Baltic coast (Kashubians). But all of them are still heavily and pred. Slavic genetically.
Baltic phenotype is ofcourse Slavic and alien to pre-Slavic Albanians. You aren't more Slavic than other Albos, probably in range you just inherited Slavic features while you can have swarthy east Med sibling. I just laughed at your comments since darkness of south Slavs comes from mixing with people related with Albanians.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asten
Majority of Baltic pheno can be found around baltic states who are not slavic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina
My father's aunt (but not related to him by blood - she married into the family) was an autochthonous Pole from Kalsko (Kalzig):Quote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalsko
This is almost at the westernmost end of the ethnic Polish area according to 1910 census, I wonder what her results would be:
Green = Polish majority
Orange = German majority
Kalzig (Kalsko) was mixed, slightly >50% German but with very numerous Poles (according to 1910 census):
https://i.imgur.com/6Xly5Cv.png
Balto-Slavs are come from same root just like Celto-Germanics and Balts are even more alien to Albanians than Slavs are. Sorry, your Baltid admix came from Slavic invaders during dark ages, sorry if that hurts your feelings.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asten
There is no point to talk with you, you seems toxicQuote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina
Then we have cases like Kramkowski from East Prussia who discovered he is Polish:
(and AFAIK he has recently returned to live in his native Olsztyn/Allenstein, Poland)
Spoiler!
^^^
His Eurogenes K13:
Admix Results (sorted):
# Population Percent
1 Baltic 40.18
2 North_Atlantic 32.23
3 West_Med 13.81
4 East_Med 6.33
5 West_Asian 3.2
6 Red_Sea 1.48
7 Siberian 1.41
8 Oceanian 0.77
9 Northeast_African 0.6
Single Population Sharing:
# Population (source) Distance
1 South_Polish 4.7
2 Ukrainian_Lviv 6.13
3 Ukrainian 6.15
4 Polish 6.78
5 Croatian 7.71
6 East_German 9.03
(...)
Many "Germans" don't know they are Polish or part Polish until they do a DNA test.
Thanks, good lesson for you to talke a peddal from Slavic threads.Quote:
Originally Posted by Asten
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asten
One the one side I agree with your post, but there are extraordinary cases in each ethnicity. Even here on forum there are atypical looking members for their ethnicity ending with typical genetic results. Looks can be deceptive, if you wanna be sure about your ancestry, DNA test is one of the best solutions
Another example similar to Kramkowski, is Teutonski from our forum.
I don't think it is "central". The whole region is located in the western half of Poland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina
There is Lubusz Voivodeship to the west, but this region is "thin" from west-to-east:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lubusz_Voivodeship
Central Poland is rather Lodz Voivodeship:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C5%81...BA_Voivodeship
If you add "East" before Germans and replace Polish with Slavic, I kind of agree with you. There are not so many Slavic influenced people in Western Germany (I suspect even the Poles that came to Ruhrgebiet are today Germanic-admixed). Most people in Western Germany have nothing to with Slavs though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterski
I would say Poles
Yeah i will try it.Thanks for the tips.Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
Yes, Slavic too. But many also have actual Polish Germanized ancestry.Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
That is the case of Kramkowski from Ermland, a region which had largely ethnically Polish population - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warmia
For example here is the ethnic data for Kreis Allenstein for 1820s-30s:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_P...ious_structure
"(...) Catholic Poles - so called Warmiaks (not to be confused with predominantly Protestant Masurians) - comprised the majority of population, numbering 26,067 people (~81%) in county Allenstein (Polish: Olsztyn) in 1837.[10] (...)"
https://i.imgur.com/r7tpiZL.png
And here ethnic data for towns/villages of Southern Ermland in 1910:
https://docplayer.org/25809174-Sprac...ittschell.html
https://i.imgur.com/51CpVQ9.png
https://i.imgur.com/Zrxvth5.png
https://i.imgur.com/NsGE1pz.png
https://i.imgur.com/42F2QyP.png
https://i.imgur.com/9FNNNbn.png
https://i.imgur.com/ln0n7f2.png
I see that you often post individual cases and I never know what to make of it because I don't know how well they represent the situation overall. For example, how do you know how many of those Poles that were in Warmia today live in Germany as "Germans"? Many maybe never left Poland? I mean only Germans had to leave after WW2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterski
Lots of them left already during the evacuation of East Prussia:Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
(which was when the Red Army was attacking since late 1944)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evacua...f_East_Prussia
Most of the civilians were evacuated - regardless of ethnicity.
Macedonians and Bulgarians
Ok but the problem is that there is no data where those people really end up living. I believe that you are right that some may today live in Germany not knowing about their roots but I would not assume that it's a huge number. East Prussia wasn't densely populated anyway and only part of people of polish background may have ended up in Germany(and of those not everyone necessarily forgot about their roots).Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterski
Well, all Germans east of the Oder-Neisse have admixture from Polish Slavic tribes, which were part of the Early Medieval Polish Kingdom.Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
See, here are the borders of the Polish Kingdom under the Piast Dynasty in 1138 and 1250 (the 2nd one after the loss of West Pomerania):
https://www.geographiapolonica.pl/ar...item/9928.html - article in English
http://rcin.org.pl/Content/53298/WA5...-Eberhardt.pdf
https://i.imgur.com/KdZhDYH.png
https://i.imgur.com/SGmdkmh.png
https://i.imgur.com/PctaNpg.png
On the other hand, Germans from the Elbe-Oder area have indeed ancestry from Slavic tribes like Polabians and Sorbs, not "Poles proper".
Check this book for example (in German), about the origins of German Silesians:Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
Karl Weinhold, "Die Verbreitung und die Herkunft der Deutschen in Schlesien" (1887):
https://archive.org/details/bub_gb_CqpCAAAAIAAJ
Very interesting, for example he mentions surnames of original Polish Lower Silesians:
https://i.imgur.com/KT8GiUE.jpg
More fragments:
https://i.imgur.com/RAabwco.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/HCVyCO7.jpg
that dna autosomal is a big hoax, majority of people use portuguese language in Brazil (and in Africa) but they aren't called Portuguese, majority of people speaking "Slavic" language in Russia etc. ... what if the real Slavs are Bulgarians... and Bosnians?
Yes. I believe it's an interesting but also complex topic because big parts of Germany was Slavic territory and big parts of Poland was Germanic territory in the past so some mixing over time was ineveitable. However, if we look at genetics today as much as we can tell from the data that exists, that mixing was not huge and both populations are not very close when viewing whole populations. Western Germany shows no significant Slavic shift while East Germany is Slavic shifted in comparison but still not very close to the Polish average.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterski
We also already have Early Medieval Germanic and Early Medieval Slavic samples for comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by rero
I uploaded to DNA Land the sample KRA001 from Krakauer Berg (Slavic town in Sachsen-Anhalt):
https://www.pz-news.de/weltweit_arti...id,519899.html
^^^ About Krakauer Berg settlement (near present-day Bernburg): "Das Dorf sei im 9. Jahrhundert entstanden - in einer slawischen Gegend. Die Siedlung mit etwa 200 Menschen existierte rund 400 Jahre lang und wurde im 14. Jahrhundert aufgegeben."
https://dna.land/
Sample KRA001 got 80% "North Slavic" in DNA Land:
https://i.imgur.com/jk5v6gz.png
Answer: The country that bore the least baby Genghises.
Kalsko and Stołuń were to the west of the pre-war Polish border (red line):Quote:
Originally Posted by Peterski
https://i.imgur.com/No5ABef.png
https://i.imgur.com/O30dYAl.png
I agree. Poles and Russians are nothing alike other than in the language family.Quote:
Originally Posted by RogueState
This is very innacurate. There is genetic continuity between Poland and Russia, this is core of Slavic genetics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chocolate_Hound
Probably the Macedonians.
Poles are about as pureblood Slav as they come. Moreso than other slavic peoples I would bet.
I would actually be surprised to see a fully Polish person with a drop of any non-Slavic admixture.
No, they are in the same percentage proto-Slavic as Serbs, only they have additional Celtic-Germanic component, and smaller percentage paleo-Balkan.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomenable
Not. Slovenians are more Slavic than Serbs. Modeling with Ukrainians and deep south Italians is incorrect. Early Slavs were between Lithuanians and Belarusians, not like Ukrainians.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dušan
Neither Serbs have much Paleo Balkan at all according to old outdated models some of you use (and of course they should have plenty)
Thraco-Illyrians were not like Greek Islanders or deep south Italians genetically, even with Romanization.
How did they look like, honestly never saw a result? Honestly I was thinking they were very southern like Greek islanders too?Quote:
Originally Posted by Stearsolina