Who, genetically, are the least Slavic of the Slavs?

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Originally Posted by Sora

Idk much about this, but I guess Macedonians, Sorbians, Czecho-Slovakians, Bulgarians & Northern Russians(with some Ural individuals)

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Sorb_Niederlausitz distances using Global25:

Distance to:	Sorb_Niederlausitz
0.01881539	Polish
0.02215482	Ukrainian_Rivne
0.02360879	Ukrainian_Zhytomyr
0.02408517	Ukrainian_Chernihiv
0.02522317	Slovakian
0.02649842	Ukrainian_Lviv
0.02661792	Russian_Belgorod
0.02684454	Ukrainian_Sumy
0.02894551	Russian_Smolensk
0.02977573	Ukrainian_Dnipro
0.03014856	Russian_Voronez
0.03042430	Belarusian
0.03096553	Ukrainian_Zakarpattia
0.03188788	Czech
0.03251820	Russian_Orel
0.03299576	Russian_Kursk
0.03342749	Lithuanian_PA
0.03435604	Moldovan_o
0.03435758	Cossack_Ukrainian
0.03622897	Russian_Kaluga
0.03665267	Lithuanian_VA
0.03745789	German_East
0.03786346	Russian_Ryazan
0.03794417	Russian_Pskov
0.04023662	Polish_Kashubian

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Yes.
The fact is that "Illyrians" were not homogenous people, those in northwestern part are different, while those of southeast Illyricum is closer to "Thracians".
In other words, autosomal genetics of pre-Slavic component of Serbs and Croats are different.
That is fact proven by autosomal genetics.

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Non-Slavic people who participated in ethnogenesis (who are absorbed by Slavs in the middle age) of Herzegovinian, Krajina and other Serbs who are connected with Herzegovina are Mataruge (E-A18844), Kriči (J2b-M205>Y22066), some unidentified R1b-U152 tribe from East Herzegovina etc.

Mataruge were not Albanian tribe like Albo mytomans wrote (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mataruge), their y dna doesn't exist in Albos and in župa Vrm near Trebinje where Mataruge are recorded in the middle age Albos never lived https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-A18844/
In 14th century Mataruge had Slavic names: Bilko father Nikoje (1389), Bijeloje father Bogdan (1389), Bogavče father Desimir (1368), Budoš father Mirko (1389), Vitoje father Kostadin (1389), Vladislav father Kučma (1389), Vladoje (1318), Vukota father Stajko (1389) etc. https://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mataru...aruga_u_14._st
Recently is discovered that Serbian families Crnomarković and Milaš from Vrlika area in Dalmatia belong to Mataruge clan by y dna, Milaši are famous due to Nikodim Milaš https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikodim_Milaš

Kriči are natives of Durmitor mount in Old Herzegovina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kriči

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Originally Posted by Varda

Non-Slavic people who participated in ethnogenesis (who are absorbed by Slavs in the middle age) of Herzegovinian, Krajina and other Serbs who are connected with Herzegovina are Mataruge (E-A18844), Kriči (J2b-M205>Y22066), some unidentified R1b-U152 tribe from East Herzegovina etc.

Mataruge were not Albanian tribe like Albo mytomans wrote (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mataruge), their y dna doesn't exist in Albos and in župa Vrm near Trebinje where Mataruge are recorded in the middle age Albos never lived https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-A18844/
In 14th century Mataruge had Slavic names: Bilko father Nikoje (1389), Bijeloje father Bogdan (1389), Bogavče father Desimir (1368), Budoš father Mirko (1389), Vitoje father Kodradin (1389), Vladislav father Kučma (1389), Vladoje (1318), Vukota father Stajko (1389) etc. https://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mataru...aruga_u_14._st
Recently is discovered that Serbian families Crnomarković and Milaš from Vrlika area in Dalmatia belong to Mataruge clan by y dna, Milaši are famous due to Nikodim Milaš https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikodim_Milaš

Kriči are natives of Durmitor mount in Old Herzegovina https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kriči

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These are good examples how population of Illyrian lands were different and not homogeneous.
J2b-M205 didnt exist in northwestern part of Illyric until Serb migrations to Krajina in 15-16th century.

It is rare haplogroup, the most widespread (cca 5%) among Serbs, central Greeks and Greek Cypriots.
Among our Krajina Serbs it is above Serb average.

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Originally Posted by Dušan

These are good examples how population of Illyrian lands where different and not homogeneous.
J2b-M205 didnt exist in northwestern part of Illyric until Serb migrations.

It is rare haplogroup, the most widespread (cca 5%) among Serbs, central Greeks and Greek Cypriots.
Among our Krajina Serbs it is above Serb average.

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Y dna of Kriči is of East Med/Levantine origin. Their paternal ancestor probably came to the Balkans in late Roman period, maybe he was Roman soldier of Syrian origin. Still Kriči are the oldest known population of Durmitor, older than Drobnjaci.

Medieval Herzegovinian clan Vlahovići is J1-ZS9949 https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-ZS9949/
Vlahovići lived between Ljubinje and Stolac in the middle age near Burmazi clan. Vlahovići participated in migrations of Herzegovinian Serbs to northwest in Ottoman time, for example Milorad Dodik and Dalmatian Serb families Tišma and Sinobad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinobad) are J1-ZS9949 and originated from Vlahovići. Zdravko Čolić who is Herzegovinian Serb is also J1-ZS9949, his father is born in village Vlahovići near Ljubinje. This haplo exist among Bosniaks (Nino was J1-ZS9949 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nino_Rešić), and i think among Croatians as well.
This J1-ZS9949 is probably older in Herzegovina than Slavic presence. Most likely came from the Middle East in Roman period (maybe with Jewish merchants), similar as Kriči (J2b-M205). Both areas of Vlahovići and Kriči are deep in former Illyrian lands.

J2b2 L283 and it subcaldes seems to be main Illyrian marker, found in ancient Dalmatian and notably present in Daunians of Apulia, who were of Illyrian origin. Also various branches of R1b L23.
E-V13 seems notably absent so far from Illyrian related regions and samples but it was highly present among Moesians.

Thus Thracians seem to be highly E-V13.

Modern Albanians are not pure Illyrian, their old Balkan ancestry is mix of Illyrians (J2b2, some R1b) and Thracians, maybe some Greeks as well (E-V13) roughly speaking. This would correspond of central Balkans as transitional Illyrio-Thracian zone as origin of proto-Albanian language, far away from the sea which explains lack of native maritime vocabulary in Albanian language.

Roughly speaking ex Dardania and in close contact with proto-Romanian.

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Originally Posted by Varda

Y dna of Kriči is of East Med/Levantine origin. Their paternal ancestor probably came to the Balkans in late Roman period, maybe he was Roman soldier of Syrian origin. Still Kriči are the oldest known population of Durmitor, older than Drobnjaci.

Medieval Herzegovinian clan Vlahovići is J1-ZS9949 https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-ZS9949/
Vlahovići lived between Ljubinje and Stolac in the middle age near Burmazi clan. Vlahovići participated in migrations of Herzegovinian Serbs to northwest in Ottoman time, for example Milorad Dodik and Dalmatian Serb families Tišma and Sinobad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinobad) are J1-ZS9949 and originated from Vlahovići. Zdravko Čolić who is Herzegovinian Serb is also J1-ZS9949, his father is born in village Vlahovići near Ljubinje. This haplo exist among Bosniaks (Nino was J1-ZS9949 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nino_Rešić), and i think among Croatians as well.
This J1-ZS9949 is probably older in Herzegovina than Slavic presence. Most likely came from the Middle East in Roman period (maybe with Jewish merchants), similar as Kriči (J2b-M205). Both areas of Vlahovići and Kriči are deep in former Illyrian lands.

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Stearsolina denies the influence of Roman colonization, and based on the presence of these haplogroups, it is clear that it took place.

This is reflected in autosomal genetics, meaning the pre-Slavic part was a little more southern than without Roman colonization, which means the proto-Slavic part is about 60% or more.

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Originally Posted by Ajeje Brazorf

There is a possibility that actually the Balkans before the arrival of the Slavs were more west-shifted than modern-day southern Italians, this could also be why Albanians have virtually the same EEF amount as southern Italians despite also having received Slavic input.

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Very interesting observation!

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And there is also the possibility that proto-Slavs had already mixed before reaching the Balkans, and would therefore look more something like Poles with 42 or 43% Baltic rather than Belarusians.

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I'd say they did not, because AV2 in Hungary was Belarusian like, but we'd need more samples.

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Stearsolina denies the influence of Roman colonization, and based on the presence of these haplogroups, it is clear that it took place.

This is reflected in autosomal genetics, meaning the pre-Slavic part was a little more southern than without Roman colonization, which means the proto-Slavic part is about 60% or more.

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Of course I don't deny, there were Romans there, I just see no evidence Romans replaced native gene pool by 50% and more.
And yes, I absolutely don't buy Serbs are over 60% Slavic on average lol, or even close to that figure.

In my estimates Serbs are barely above half Slavic and Croats bit more, but not much more.
Montenegrins are below half Slavic.

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Originally Posted by princeton90

Macedonians.

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Yes

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Stearsolina denies the influence of Roman colonization, and based on the presence of these haplogroups, it is clear that it took place.

This is reflected in autosomal genetics, meaning the pre-Slavic part was a little more southern than without Roman colonization, which means the proto-Slavic part is about 60% or more.

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Of course Roman colonization of Illyrian lands happened. Kriči, Mataruge, Vlahovići, Bukumiri etc. are pre-Slavic population of former Illyrian Herzegovina-Montenegro and they had non-Slavic haplos (Vlahovići and Kriči had Levantine y dna).

These native Vlach tribes of present day Montenegro were probably Dalmatian speakers before slavization, and not East Romance speakers. East Romance speakers were probably Vlach migrants to Montenegro from central and eastern Balkans in the late middle age - Kuči, Bjelopavlići and Piperi.

https://youtu.be/c-V7j4GHww8