Transylvanian/Romanian GEDmatch Results

From Bistrita-Nasaud

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Kit	N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
1	25.45	33.20	14.81	10.26	12.96	0.40	0	0.67	1.49	0	0.64	0	0.11
2	20.55	27.80	18.76	7.73	20.18	2.06	0	2.12	0	0.16	0.16	0.28	0.21

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Compared to others from Bistrita-Nasaud

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N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
28.64	25.43	18.73	8.12	14.30	1.59	0	0.45	2.10	0.29	0.36	0	0
24.90	26.47	18.47	10.71	15.18	1.11	0	0	1.85	0.81	0.47	0	0
27.24	26.47	16.60	8.06	14.40	1.56	1.53	0.40	1.83	0.95	0.68	0.28	0
25.43	22.43	16.63	4.32	20.89	4.34	1.17	1.48	1.06	1.66	0.40	0.19	0
24.96	26.34	15.60	10.60	17.46	1.62	0	0	2.57	0.84	0	0	0

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1

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
2.60787270	Moldova_North
2.76305990	Bosniak
3.25594840	Croat_South
3.30832284	Croat_East
3.70099986	Moldova_Centre
3.88816152	Moldova_average
4.07085986	Serb_north
4.08938871	Croat
4.24937642	Romania_Moldavia_North
4.72126042	Croat_West
5.34607333	Csángó-Ceangău
5.45782008	Serb
5.62168124	Hungarian_Alföld
5.74683391	Serb_central
6.03300920	Székely
6.13576401	Hungarian_Transylvania_Szekely
6.41860577	Romania_Maramures
6.61058243	Hungarian
6.62522452	Croat_North
7.09012694	Ukrainian_Carpathian
7.46442228	Hungarian_Transdanubia+Budapest
7.56649192	Hungarian_Northern
8.11269992	Slovenian
8.32395339	Romania_Crisana
8.77067842	Romania_Moldavia_South

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
2.60787270	Moldova_Nord
3.01458123	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
3.70099986	Moldova_Centru
3.88816152	Moldova_average
4.24937642	Romania_Moldova_Nord
5.34607333	Romania_Moldova_Csango
6.03300920	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
6.38659534	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
6.41860577	Romania_Maramures
7.09012694	Ukrainian_Carpathian
7.39211742	Romania_Ukrainian
7.60121043	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk
8.32395339	Romania_Crisana
8.77067842	Romania_Moldova_Sud
8.93123172	Romania_Transilvania
9.08510870	Moldova_Sud
9.24025433	Romania_average
9.98912409	Romania_Banat
10.35776038	Romania_Oltenia
11.08649629	Romania_Dobrogea
11.55119041	Romania_Muntenia
12.83669739	Bulgarian
15.12762043	Moldova_Gagauzia
16.01924468	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon
17.44971920	Aromanian

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
5.12125961	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian
5.18363772	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
5.20566038	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
5.77678111	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
7.35428447	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
7.62432292	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
7.94889929	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
8.29928310	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
8.67130325	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
8.90628430	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
9.02819473	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
9.16834227	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
9.33284523	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna
9.63730772	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
9.64884967	Romania_Banat_Timis
9.86869292	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
10.21409810	Romania_Crisana_Arad
14.38600709	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
16.01924468	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon

2

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
4.10363254	Bulgaria_Northwestern
4.50457545	Serb_south
4.84252001	Moldova_South
5.40897402	Romania_Dobruja
5.47704300	Pomak_Bulgaria
5.49157537	Romania_Banat
5.62494444	Romania_Wallachia
5.66749504	Romania_average
5.68636967	Romania_Muntenia
5.87538935	Romania_Oltenia
5.96543376	Bulgaria_average
5.99174432	Bulgaria_Northcentral
6.10448196	Bulgaria_Southcentral
6.15512794	Bosniak_Sandzak
6.15849007	Romania_Moldavia_South
6.29138300	Romania_Transylvania
6.35620956	Bulgaria_Southwestern
6.41199657	Montenegrin
6.70961251	Romania_Maramures
7.03943890	Pomak_Greece
7.06278982	Macedonian_North
7.14800672	Romania_Crisana
7.19421295	Serb_central
7.23731995	Serb
7.71501782	Moldova_South_Gagauzia

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
4.84252001	Moldova_Sud
5.40897402	Romania_Dobrogea
5.49157537	Romania_Banat
5.66749504	Romania_average
5.68636967	Romania_Muntenia
5.87538935	Romania_Oltenia
6.05451897	Bulgarian
6.15849007	Romania_Moldova_Sud
6.29138300	Romania_Transilvania
6.70961251	Romania_Maramures
7.14800672	Romania_Crisana
8.24158359	Moldova_Gagauzia
8.43102603	Moldova_average
8.62536956	Romania_Moldova_Nord
8.85109033	Moldova_Centru
9.09335472	Aromanian
10.17559335	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
11.46209405	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
11.97097323	Moldova_Nord
12.40974617	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
12.59988492	Romania_Moldova_Csango
16.09714882	Romania_Ukrainian
16.19737016	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk
16.95750866	Ukrainian_Carpathian
19.15336524	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
3.71690732	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna
5.19579638	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
5.55113502	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
5.91069370	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
5.93070822	Romania_Banat_Timis
6.29448171	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
6.63073902	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
6.67251827	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
6.71512472	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
6.75179976	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
6.91567061	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
7.20621260	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
7.77674096	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
8.00986267	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
8.43657513	Romania_Crisana_Arad
11.44176560	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
11.50571163	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
13.42766175	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian
19.15336524	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon

From Bistrita-Nasaud

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Kit	N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
1	22.73	28.09	18.01	9.92	16.46	1.66	0.70	0.44	1.79	0	0.19	0	0
2	20.69	30.65	15.54	12.47	15.36	2.35	0	0	2.57	0	0.37	0	0

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Compared to others from Bistrita-Nasaud

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N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
28.64	25.43	18.73	8.12	14.30	1.59	0	0.45	2.10	0.29	0.36	0	0
24.90	26.47	18.47	10.71	15.18	1.11	0	0	1.85	0.81	0.47	0	0
27.24	26.47	16.60	8.06	14.40	1.56	1.53	0.40	1.83	0.95	0.68	0.28	0
25.43	22.43	16.63	4.32	20.89	4.34	1.17	1.48	1.06	1.66	0.40	0.19	0
24.96	26.34	15.60	10.60	17.46	1.62	0	0	2.57	0.84	0	0	0
25.45	33.20	14.81	10.26	12.96	0.40	0	0.67	1.49	0	0.64	0	0.11
20.55	27.80	18.76	7.73	20.18	2.06	0	2.12	0	0.16	0.16	0.28	0.21

</google-sheets-html-origin>
1

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
2.02400593	Moldova_South
2.60944439	Serb_south
2.62509047	Romania_Maramures
2.66587697	Romania_average
2.77077606	Romania_Moldavia_South
2.93899643	Romania_Transylvania
2.98244866	Romania_Banat
3.12237089	Serb
3.44663604	Serb_central
3.58915032	Romania_Crisana
3.61222923	Bulgaria_Northwestern
3.73012064	Romania_Oltenia
3.73685697	Montenegrin
4.09257865	Romania_Dobruja
4.24848208	Romania_Wallachia
4.42637549	Romania_Moldavia_North
4.51629273	Serb_north
4.52128300	Bosniak_Sandzak
4.59649867	Moldova_average
4.66720473	Romania_Muntenia
4.91056005	Moldova_Centre
5.02810103	Bulgaria_Southwestern
5.52447283	Bulgaria_average
5.68705548	Bulgaria_Northcentral
6.10065570	Pomak_Bulgaria

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
2.02400593	Moldova_Sud
2.62509047	Romania_Maramures
2.66587697	Romania_average
2.77077606	Romania_Moldova_Sud
2.93899643	Romania_Transilvania
2.98244866	Romania_Banat
3.58915032	Romania_Crisana
3.73012064	Romania_Oltenia
4.09257865	Romania_Dobrogea
4.42637549	Romania_Moldova_Nord
4.59649867	Moldova_average
4.66720473	Romania_Muntenia
4.91056005	Moldova_Centru
6.10460482	Bulgarian
6.47758443	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
7.33242116	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
8.06656680	Romania_Moldova_Csango
8.19249657	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
8.33758958	Moldova_Nord
8.40289831	Moldova_Gagauzia
10.42654785	Aromanian
13.54350029	Romania_Ukrainian
13.59685993	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk
13.81372868	Ukrainian_Carpathian
16.14967492	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon

Distance to:	Bistrita_1
2.27105702	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
2.38884910	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
2.43185115	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
2.74333738	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
2.84603233	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
2.99056851	Romania_Banat_Timis
3.00118310	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
3.01544358	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
3.03553949	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
3.30260503	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna
3.50267041	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
3.58076807	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
4.35943804	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
5.08587259	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
5.62814357	Romania_Crisana_Arad
7.57466831	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
9.41018066	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian
9.78253546	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
16.14967492	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon

2

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
4.41835942	Moldova_average
4.62736426	Moldova_Centre
5.61580805	Moldova_South
5.67557046	Romania_Moldavia_North
5.96577740	Serb
6.03246218	Romania_Maramures
6.17399385	Serb_north
6.41718007	Bosniak
6.54178875	Serb_central
6.55765964	Moldova_North
6.56697800	Romania_average
6.78192451	Serb_south
6.78392954	Romania_Banat
6.79092777	Romania_Moldavia_South
7.00544788	Bulgaria_Northwestern
7.09629481	Romania_Transylvania
7.36708219	Romania_Dobruja
7.55147006	Romania_Wallachia
7.65091498	Romania_Muntenia
7.67474430	Croat_South
7.69697993	Pomak_Bulgaria
7.71217868	Romania_Oltenia
7.89220502	Romania_Crisana
7.93460774	Montenegrin
8.12860997	Bulgaria_Northcentral

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
4.41835942	Moldova_average
4.62736426	Moldova_Centru
5.61580805	Moldova_Sud
5.67557046	Romania_Moldova_Nord
6.03246218	Romania_Maramures
6.55765964	Moldova_Nord
6.56697800	Romania_average
6.77614935	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
6.78392954	Romania_Banat
6.79092777	Romania_Moldova_Sud
7.09629481	Romania_Transilvania
7.36708219	Romania_Dobrogea
7.65091498	Romania_Muntenia
7.71217868	Romania_Oltenia
7.89220502	Romania_Crisana
8.86149536	Bulgarian
9.15770714	Romania_Moldova_Csango
9.31774114	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
10.05306421	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
10.15914366	Moldova_Gagauzia
12.60964710	Ukrainian_Carpathian
12.82901789	Romania_Ukrainian
12.84837344	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk
13.30510428	Aromanian
19.40117264	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon

Distance to:	Bistrita_2
5.32608674	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
5.51616715	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna
5.81284784	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
6.41101396	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
6.46750338	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
6.54316437	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
6.57236639	Romania_Banat_Timis
6.77189781	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
7.20068052	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
7.20931342	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
7.30766721	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
7.81234920	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
7.92835418	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
8.52170171	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
9.56110349	Romania_Crisana_Arad
9.60908424	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
10.39630704	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian
11.68530273	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
19.40117264	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon

From where do you get such huge amount of samples?

33% B/25% NA is very Moldavian-like. Or maybe part xoxol :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Universe

From where do you get such huge amount of results?

---

I started by contacting my matches on GEDmatch and then expanded from there by looking at their matches. Some are also donated through my website in the signature.
Nowadays, I simply load the full 3k list from one-to-many of one individual and look at most recent uploads.

From Alba

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...omania.svg.png

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Kit	N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
1	31.58	21.50	16.27	8.62	17.14	2.77	0	0.95	0.28	0	0.83	0.07	0
2	25.98	20.49	16.81	13.05	16.10	3.53	0.14	1.16	0	1.14	0.22	0.32	1.06

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Compared to others from Alba (those in blue are academic samples from Reich lab)

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N_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	NE_African	Sub-Saharan
25.79	24.55	19.05	9.12	19.31	0.11	0	0.64	0.58	0	0.86	0	0
25.30	26.72	16.77	10.42	15.77	2.18	0.09	0	0.36	1.87	0.52	0	0
26.53	25.09	15.61	8.87	19.04	1.95	0.33	0.73	0.32	0.57	0.22	0.74	0
24.95	27.37	17.13	9.41	15.89	1.33	0.92	0.22	1.74	1.04	0	0	0
26.75	28.14	17.13	9.94	11.75	2.41	0.27	0	0.77	1.92	0.93	0	0
22.63	26.49	16.79	11.52	20.83	0.83	0	0.28	0.37	0	0.26	0	0
23.93	24.30	20.37	11.76	17.05	0	0	0	0	1.05	1.08	0	0.46
24.37	25.88	18.06	10.39	17.43	0.22	0	2.47	0.72	0.46	0	0	0
25.19	23.82	18.28	11.80	15.18	0.40	1.58	0	1.49	0.87	1.28	0	0.10
24.08	26.00	17.69	9.73	19.18	1.58	0.91	0	0	0.08	0.75	0	0
23.65	25.19	19.88	9.40	15.76	2.95	0	0	3.16	0	0	0	0
25.53	24.30	18.37	9.10	18.27	1.22	0	0.33	1.04	1.60	0.24	0	0
28.28	24.25	16.65	9.21	16.34	1.67	1.68	0	1.75	0	0	0	0.17
21.96	28.66	19.53	10.90	17.01	0	0.72	0.44	0	0.60	0	0.18	0

</google-sheets-html-origin>
1

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Alba_1
6.82812566	Italian_Friuli_VG
8.19695065	Romania_Crisana
8.43560905	Montenegrin
8.89419474	Romania_Transylvania
8.90946126	Italian_Trentino
8.91383195	Bosniak_Sandzak
9.14973224	Romania_Moldavia_South
9.34820838	Romania_Oltenia
9.38602152	Székely
9.40800723	Hungarian_Transylvania_Szekely
9.55422420	Swiss_French
9.79348253	Romania_average
9.86600223	Bulgaria_Southwestern
10.05464569	Italian_Veneto
10.24226049	Romania_Maramures
10.24458882	Romania_Banat
10.27468734	Serb_south
10.37661313	France_Provence
10.41134958	Romania_Wallachia
10.42505156	Serb_central
10.62993885	Romania_Dobruja
10.84132833	Macedonian_North
10.84556130	Serb
10.85000461	Romania_Muntenia
10.98096080	Bulgaria_Northeastern

Distance to:	Alba_1
8.19695065	Romania_Crisana
8.35619531	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon
8.89419474	Romania_Transilvania
9.14973224	Romania_Moldova_Sud
9.34820838	Romania_Oltenia
9.38602152	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
9.52142846	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
9.79348253	Romania_average
10.24226049	Romania_Maramures
10.24458882	Romania_Banat
10.62993885	Romania_Dobrogea
10.85000461	Romania_Muntenia
11.22960819	Romania_Moldova_Csango
11.26095911	Romania_Moldova_Nord
11.26929457	Bulgarian
11.37192156	Moldova_Sud
12.48667690	Aromanian
12.50565072	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
13.18408890	Moldova_Centru
13.20737673	Moldova_average
13.69669668	Moldova_Gagauzia
16.06916924	Moldova_Nord
18.77410451	Romania_Ukrainian
19.32473803	Ukrainian_Carpathian
19.33012157	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk

Distance to:	Alba_1
6.25638873	Romania_Crisana_Arad
7.70579652	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
7.80205742	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
8.01398153	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
8.35619531	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon
8.99447052	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
9.27972521	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
9.30570255	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
9.42526923	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
9.49766287	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
9.50893790	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
9.75235356	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
10.08875116	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
10.15444238	Romania_Banat_Timis
10.63940318	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
11.92779527	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
12.58363620	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian
12.77250954	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
13.12605043	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna

2

Spoiler!

Distance to:	Alba_2
5.80477390	Bulgaria_Northeastern
6.09635137	Bulgaria_Southwestern
6.45430089	Montenegrin
6.47443434	Bosniak_Sandzak
6.48631637	Romania_Oltenia
6.86257240	Romania_Wallachia
6.95630649	Romania_Transylvania
7.04555888	Bulgaria_average
7.06340569	Romania_Muntenia
7.11438683	Romania_Dobruja
7.14787381	Romania_Moldavia_South
7.21740951	Romania_average
7.21840010	Romania_Banat
7.48735601	Romania_Crisana
7.64267623	Bulgaria_Northcentral
7.68998049	Bulgaria_Southcentral
7.70410929	Macedonian_North
7.81874031	Bulgaria_Southeastern
7.92504259	Macedonian_South
7.96963613	Macedonian
8.34269141	Bulgaria_Northwestern
8.58884160	Vlach(Aromanian)_average
8.60675897	Moldova_South
8.76313300	Serb_south
8.96663817	Moldova_South_Gagauzia

Distance to:	Alba_2
6.48631637	Romania_Oltenia
6.95630649	Romania_Transilvania
7.06340569	Romania_Muntenia
7.11438683	Romania_Dobrogea
7.14787381	Romania_Moldova_Sud
7.21740951	Romania_average
7.21840010	Romania_Banat
7.32220595	Bulgarian
7.48735601	Romania_Crisana
8.48516352	Moldova_Gagauzia
8.58884160	Aromanian
8.60675897	Moldova_Sud
9.29840847	Romania_Maramures
10.68732427	Romania_Moldova_Nord
10.82529907	Romania_Transilvania_Szekely
11.25233753	Romania_Transilvania_Hungarian
11.85785815	Romania_Moldova_Csango
12.05781489	Moldova_average
12.14342209	Moldova_Centru
12.74888230	Romania_Suceava_Botosani
13.90160063	Romania_Transilvania_Saxon
15.33687387	Moldova_Nord
20.11311761	Romania_Ukrainian
20.22744176	Ukrainian_Carpathian
20.57993440	Ukrainian_Ivano_Frankivsk

Distance to:	Alba_2
5.68118826	Romania_Crisana_Arad
5.74447561	Romania_Transylvania_Brasov
6.23065005	Romania_Transylvania_Alba
6.95118695	Romania_Banat_Timis
7.14690143	Romania_Banat_Caras-Severin
7.32382414	Romania_Transylvania_Mures
7.33554361	Romania_Transylvania_Sibiu
7.48017379	Romania_Transylvania_Cluj
7.96312753	Romania_Transylvania_Hunedoara
8.56510946	Romania_Transylvania_Bistrita-Nasaud
8.60361552	Romania_Crisana_Bihor
9.17774482	Romania_Maramures_SatuMare
9.59102184	Romania_Transylvania_1/4Roma
9.91143784	Romania_Maramures_Maramures
10.57259192	Romania_Transylvania_Covasna
10.99346169	Romania_Crisana_Salaj
11.59997845	Romania_Transylvania_Szekler
13.90160063	Romania_Transylvania_Saxon
14.02367284	Romania_Transylvania_Hungarian

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Please enlighten me, what is "North Atlantic" and "Red Sea"... Are they testing our fish ancestry?;)

If they do, then I withdraw all my negative statements. One thing though is that 300 million years ago there was no North Atlantic or Red Sea...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aherne

Please enlighten me, what is "North Atlantic" and "Red Sea"... Are they testing our fish ancestry?;)

If they do, then I withdraw all my negative statements. One thing though is that 300 million years ago there was no North Atlantic or Red Sea...

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North Atlantic is Northwest Euro-like ancestry and Red Sea is Arabian-like.
No relation to fish unfortunately

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ion Basescul

No relation to fish unfortunately

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That's too bad: it would have made more sense :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by aherne

Please enlighten me, what is "North Atlantic" and "Red Sea"... Are they testing our fish ancestry?;)

If they do, then I withdraw all my negative statements. One thing though is that 300 million years ago there was no North Atlantic or Red Sea...

---

North Atlantic = Corded/Nordid and MED mix