Serbian Autosomal DNA

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bosniensis

Some balkanites tend to have higher Baltic score, but that's on individual level depending on how much they mixed with more slavic influenced people.

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Slavs owe their ancestry partially to Scandinavians/Balts as well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

Among "central" Serbs the highest Baltic score is 34, on a very large sample. And among the "northern" there are already a couple of individuals with 36. This is what the northern group is based on. The difference is very small, but it exists for sure.

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There surely exist outliers, but the "Baltic" score average for your "North" regional is still ~30. Are they in minority and from a specific region? From where are exactly these samples you based your "North" average?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

There surely exist outliers, but the "Baltic" score average for your "North" regional is still ~30. Are they in minority and from a specific region? From where are exactly these samples you based your "North" average?

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They are not outliers but "edge-liers". They are just a natural peak of old Slavic ancestry for their region. For example in Lika there are 2 people with 34, and there are also samples with 33, 32 ,31. Somebody with 37 would be an outlier, because there would be a gap, people 35 and 36 are missing.

If the central range is 24-34 and the average is 29, then the North might end up 26-36, average 31, when more samples are collected. But maybe it won't be so clear-cut.
It seems a genetic cluster (a group of completely mixed people who freely intermarry) has a range of individual components of around 10. (or 8-12)

For now, North is Kordun-Banija, Bosanska Krajina, Northeast Bosnia and Vojvodina. With more samples with a more precise place of origin, it should just be the Northern part of Bosanska Krajina, and also the northern parts of central Serbia.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

They are not outliers but "edge-liers"... If the central range is 24-34 and the average is 29, then the North might end up 26-36, average 31, when more samples are collected. But maybe it won't be so clear-cut. It seems a genetic cluster (a group of completely mixed people who freely intermarry) has a range of individual components of around 10. (or 8-12)

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Ok, that makes sense.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

For now, North is Kordun-Banija, Bosanska Krajina, Northeast Bosnia, and Vojvodina. With more samples with a more precise place of origin, it should just be the Northern part of Bosanska Krajina, and also the northern parts of central Serbia.

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Hmm, it's kind of following the Sava river, but basically now or then we're not speaking about an established geographic or administrative supra-region. Posavina is too far-fetched by definition, but it's kind of along the line. Now understand "the approximate geographic distribution" of the "North" average. Interesting, wonder if newer samples will be more northern shifted. Keep us updated.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

Also, it's interesting that Serbs from Croatia are so much southern shifted from Croatian regional averages south of river Sava. As if the Serbs were already southernly shifted and intermarried for centuries within their own ethnic & religious community?

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It is well known fact that intermarriages between Croats and Serbs in Croatia were very rare because of different religion, in exception of Tito Yugoslav period.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

It is well known fact that intermarriages between Croats and Serbs in Croatia were very rare because of different religion, in exception of Tito Yugoslav period.

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Yes, but it can be read around that supposedly happened partial assimilation of the natives. It's something that would be especially expected in those early centuries upon arrival. If the average of eg Serbs from Bosanska Krajina is a bit more northern-shifted possibly did happen in a low amount, but seemingly, generally speaking, did not as they are all around the Serbian central/national average.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

Yes, but it can be read around that supposedly happened partial assimilation of the natives. It's something that would be especially expected in those early centuries upon arrival. If the average of eg Serbs from Bosanska Krajina is a bit more northern-shifted possibly did happen in a low amount, but seemingly, generally speaking, did not as they are all around the Serbian central/national average.

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Western Bosnia, Lika, Kordun, Banija and Dalmatian hinterland were deserted because of Ottoman-Austrian wars, and then these empty areas were settled by Serbs.
I don't know what assimilation could happen.

I for example have higher Baltic score than Serbian average, but it means nothing unusual, since my pre-Slavic element is more central Balkan, or even southern Balkan, than it should be suppoused for far western Dinaric area.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Western Bosnia, Lika, Kordun, Banija, and Dalmatian hinterland were deserted because of Ottoman-Austrian wars, and then these empty areas were settled by Serbs. I don't know what assimilation could happen.

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Wasn't some Y-DNA subclade unusual for Serbs found among Serbs in Western Bosnia a clue?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

Wasn't some Y-DNA subclade unusual for Serbs found among Serbs in Western Bosnia a clue?

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Stop thumb down me for no reason.
Why you desperately want to prove that we got assimilated some Croats? You are so pathetic.

What Y-DNA subcladе? If they exist, they are less than 5%.

Ethnic map of part of Lika.
Red are Serbs, blue are Croats.

As people can see, villages were very very homogenous. Serbs and Croats lived in separated communities, until industrialisation and urbanisation in Titos Yugoslavia, when lot of population moved to cities, and there started intermarriages.

https://i.imgur.com/yfWY6cp.png

And BTW, these Lika Croats were no natives either, but Bunjevci settlers from Herzgovina.

Yes, it's true what Dušan says. For Lika I know that as well.

Region of Banija 100 years ago - ethnic map.

There were few mixed settlement, especialy little towns, but most villages were either 100% Serbian or 100% Croatian.

https://i.imgur.com/aYvUFEH.png

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Stop thumb down me for no reason.

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Sorry, my mistake.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Why you desperately want to prove that we got assimilated some Croats? You are so pathetic.

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Where? I don't, only said that can be read an opinion which considers partial i.e. minor assimilation. Watch your language.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

What Y-DNA subcladе? If they exist, they are less than 5%.

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This was published recently I-S17250*, but was also something else, don't remember now if it were R1a subclade. Thought you knew something.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

but was also something else, don't remember now if it were R1a subclade. Thought you knew something.

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You have Carpatho-Dalmatian R1a subclade in mind (R-Y2608). Yeah it clearly follows Croat expansion. But it's minor among Serb R1a.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

This was published recently I-S17250*, but was also something else, don't remember now if it were R1a subclade. Thought you knew something.

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I am not into Y-dna, autosomal genetics is more interesting.

These are 10 surnames among hundreds and hundreds others.
Maybe they don't have matches in Herzegovina, but somewhere more eastern.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MoroLP

Sorry, my mistake.



Where? I don't, only said that can be read an opinion which considers partial i.e. minor assimilation. Watch your language.



This was published recently I-S17250*, but was also something else, don't remember now if it were R1a subclade. Thought you knew something.

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You probably think on these ones:
https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=2668.0
https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=532.0

I2-Y3120>S17250>S17250* Serbian families from Bosanska Krajina and Lika who celebrate Markovdan are from Zmijanje. Their further origin is from Konjic according to legend of Knežević family from Zmijanje. They are present on Zmijanja since first half of 16th century for sure.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Varda

You probably think on these ones:
https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=2668.0
https://forum.poreklo.rs/index.php?topic=532.0

I2-Y3120>S17250>S17250* Serbian families from Bosanska Krajina and Lika who celebrate Markovdan are from Zmijanje. Their further origin is from Konjic according to legend of Knežević family from Zmijanje. They are present on Zmijanja since first half of 16th century for sure.

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Nice post from Poreklo forum:


"However, I think that this sub-branch in Krajina is not indigenous. We forget about one unpublished result from Popovo polje (research of Herzegovinians), with a story about the origin from Montenegro. I will quote the editor's comment for this result: "It belongs to haplogroup R1a-Z280, branch YP237> YP951. The closest matches are with those tested from genus A, Medic (1/18), Djap (1/17), Novakovic (2/23) and Demonja (1/15). "

Furthermore, the increased presence of this sub-branch in Krajina can be attributed to two causes:

- the reason for the otherwise increased presence of R1a: M458 L1029 and Z280 Y2613 (solid and Y2902), in Krajina, and the advantage of this haplogroup over E-V13 (emerges in second place in terms of representation after Dinaric), can be found in migrations of farmers from the interior of the Balkans after the collapse of the Serbian state in the Middle Ages. They are immigrants through traditional Serbian areas (Herzegovina, Montenegro, Raska), but we also find them there. I have already discussed that we have Z280 Y2613 in Pomoravlje, Raska, Romania, Bulgaria, and here Aksa says that we have YP237 further east in the interior of the Balkans. YP237 is also present in Montenegro and Herzegovina through the L366 sub-branch (Petrovići and Kadijević from Čeklić). We should not forget (in Krajina) the larger share of sub-branches DYS448 = 20 in Dinaric, which also supports the thesis of more present migrations from the interior of the Balkans. Therefore, the greater presence of these Slavic sub-branches in the western Serbian regions cannot be attributed to the indigenous, and especially not to the old Croatian origin, because it is not just one sub-branch, but several: R1a: M458 L1029, Z280 Y2613, and I2-CTS10228 : Z17855 and S17250 (PH908-).

- founder effect: arrival in desolate areas and sudden demographic expansion, which is present in several other haplogroups. Let's not forget N-P189.2 in Krajina, then Maleševci around Prnjavor, of which there are now more than in Herzegovina and Podrinje together, then Kriče J2b M205, Drobnjake I1 P109, and these are individual genera. These haplogroups are not more represented than R1a in total, but we reduce it to a common ancestor to the level of some 1,000 years, then Banjani / Pivljani, Drobnjaci and Kriči as individual genera had a much stronger demographic expansion than R1a genera (looking at the age of 1,000 years), and I think these three genera together reach even a total of R1a in Krajina. The reason that we have more R1a in Krajina than in Herzegovina and Montenegro, can never be the indigenous presence, especially since we have poorly tested areas of southern Serbia, Kosovo and Metohija, Macedonia, which is a possible base for these immigrants, and these areas were already deep in the interior of the Serbian territory during the collapse of the Serbian state in the Middle Ages."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dušan

Nice post from Poreklo forum:


"However, I think that this sub-branch in Krajina is not indigenous. We forget about one unpublished result from Popovo polje (research of Herzegovinians), with a story about the origin from Montenegro. I will quote the editor's comment for this result: "It belongs to haplogroup R1a-Z280, branch YP237> YP951. The closest matches are with those tested from genus A, Medic (1/18), Djap (1/17), Novakovic (2/23) and Demonja (1/15). "

Furthermore, the increased presence of this sub-branch in Krajina can be attributed to two causes:

- the reason for the otherwise increased presence of R1a: M458 L1029 and Z280 Y2613 (solid and Y2902), in Krajina, and the advantage of this haplogroup over E-V13 (emerges in second place in terms of representation after Dinaric), can be found in migrations of farmers from the interior of the Balkans after the collapse of the Serbian state in the Middle Ages. They are immigrants through traditional Serbian areas (Herzegovina, Montenegro, Raska), but we also find them there. I have already discussed that we have Z280 Y2613 in Pomoravlje, Raska, Romania, Bulgaria, and here Aksa says that we have YP237 further east in the interior of the Balkans. YP237 is also present in Montenegro and Herzegovina through the L366 sub-branch (Petrovići and Kadijević from Čeklić). We should not forget (in Krajina) the larger share of sub-branches DYS448 = 20 in Dinaric, which also supports the thesis of more present migrations from the interior of the Balkans. Therefore, the greater presence of these Slavic sub-branches in the western Serbian regions cannot be attributed to the indigenous, and especially not to the old Croatian origin, because it is not just one sub-branch, but several: R1a: M458 L1029, Z280 Y2613, and I2-CTS10228 : Z17855 and S17250 (PH908-).

- founder effect: arrival in desolate areas and sudden demographic expansion, which is present in several other haplogroups. Let's not forget N-P189.2 in Krajina, then Maleševci around Prnjavor, of which there are now more than in Herzegovina and Podrinje together, then Kriče J2b M205, Drobnjake I1 P109, and these are individual genera. These haplogroups are not more represented than R1a in total, but we reduce it to a common ancestor to the level of some 1,000 years, then Banjani / Pivljani, Drobnjaci and Kriči as individual genera had a much stronger demographic expansion than R1a genera (looking at the age of 1,000 years), and I think these three genera together reach even a total of R1a in Krajina. The reason that we have more R1a in Krajina than in Herzegovina and Montenegro, can never be the indigenous presence, especially since we have poorly tested areas of southern Serbia, Kosovo and Metohija, Macedonia, which is a possible base for these immigrants, and these areas were already deep in the interior of the Serbian territory during the collapse of the Serbian state in the Middle Ages."

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One Croatian guy from western Herzegovina who is R1a-Z280>YP237>YP951 explores own further origin, his surname is Grubišić.
Interesting fact is that Serbian Krajina family Grubor is also R1a-Z280>YP237>YP951 and according to legend they originated from prince Grubiša from Zmijanje.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stearsolina

You have Carpatho-Dalmatian R1a subclade in mind (R-Y2608). Yeah it clearly follows Croat expansion. But it's minor among Serb R1a.

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That branch exists among Serbs from the Kosovo-Raška area too. One muslim from Sandžak on our FTDNA project belongs to that clade. His surname is Kuč and he claims to be from a family indigenous to old Raška and that the Kuči tribe was originally of Slavic paternal descent as he is. I saw that he posted on the Bosniak DNA project facebook page too but they got mad at him because he was allegedly spreading Serbian and Slavic propaganda lol.

Some of my new matches on Gedmatch:

Population
North_Atlantic 29.01 Pct
Baltic 28.46 Pct
West_Med 15.98 Pct
West_Asian 6.2 Pct
East_Med 17.74 Pct
Red_Sea 0.33 Pct
South_Asian -
East_Asian -
Siberian 1.68 Pct
Amerindian 0.52 Pct
Oceanian -
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan -

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 4.52
2 Romanian 7.26
3 Hungarian 8.29
4 Moldavian 9.45
5 Bulgarian 9.52
6 Croatian 10.33
7 Austrian 11.18
8 East_German 12.74
9 West_German 15.67
10 South_Polish 16.27
11 Ukrainian_Lviv 16.54
12 Greek_Thessaly 16.97
13 French 17.12
14 South_Dutch 17.16
15 Ukrainian 17.34
16 North_Italian 17.58
17 Tuscan 19.37
18 Polish 20.03
19 Portuguese 20.08
20 North_German 20.33

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 54.3% Tuscan + 45.7% Belorussian @ 3.48
2 54% Tuscan + 46% Estonian_Polish @ 3.78
3 51.7% Tuscan + 48.3% Southwest_Russian @ 3.83
4 57.9% Tuscan + 42.1% Estonian @ 3.84
5 77.6% Hungarian + 22.4% Ashkenazi @ 3.87
6 57.9% Greek_Thessaly + 42.1% Southwest_Finnish @ 3.87
7 59.1% Tuscan + 40.9% Lithuanian @ 3.88
8 54.6% South_Polish + 45.4% Tuscan @ 3.88
9 52.9% West_Sicilian + 47.1% Estonian @ 4
10 81.6% Hungarian + 18.4% Italian_Jewish @ 4.05
11 81.8% Hungarian + 18.2% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.06
12 52.9% Ukrainian + 47.1% Tuscan @ 4.1
13 69.6% Hungarian + 30.4% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.15
14 59.6% South_Polish + 40.4% West_Sicilian @ 4.19
15 53.8% Tuscan + 46.2% Russian_Smolensk @ 4.23
16 94.1% Serbian + 5.9% Southwest_Finnish @ 4.29
17 84% Serbian + 16% Hungarian @ 4.31
18 94.4% Serbian + 5.6% North_Swedish @ 4.33
19 72.1% Bulgarian + 27.9% North_Swedish @ 4.33
20 94.5% Serbian + 5.5% Southeast_English @ 4.34

---

Population
North_Atlantic 22.7 Pct
Baltic 29.25 Pct
West_Med 20.08 Pct
West_Asian 6.95 Pct
East_Med 17.81 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian 0.28 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian 1.17 Pct
Amerindian 1.06 Pct
Oceanian -
Northeast_African 0.64 Pct
Sub-Saharan 0.06 Pct

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Romanian 6.79
2 Serbian 6.92
3 Bulgarian 7.28
4 Moldavian 9.39
5 Croatian 11.51
6 Hungarian 12.76
7 Greek_Thessaly 14.71
8 Austrian 15.98
9 East_German 17.07
10 Ukrainian_Lviv 17.71
11 North_Italian 18.29
12 South_Polish 18.5
13 Ukrainian 18.5
14 Tuscan 19.29
15 West_German 20.95
16 French 21.44
17 Italian_Abruzzo 21.75
18 Southwest_Russian 21.78
19 Polish 21.83
20 Central_Greek 21.93

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 56.2% Greek_Thessaly + 43.8% Ukrainian @ 4.52
2 63% Ukrainian + 37% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.92
3 57.1% Croatian + 42.9% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.93
4 62.8% Greek_Thessaly + 37.2% Estonian_Polish @ 4.95
5 77% Bulgarian + 23% Ukrainian @ 4.97
6 58.9% Ukrainian + 41.1% South_Italian @ 4.98
7 55% Ukrainian + 45% West_Sicilian @ 5.01
8 74.5% Croatian + 25.5% Algerian_Jewish @ 5.02
9 67.4% Greek_Thessaly + 32.6% Lithuanian @ 5.07
10 66.5% Bulgarian + 33.5% Croatian @ 5.08
11 60.6% Greek_Thessaly + 39.4% Polish @ 5.09
12 81.8% Bulgarian + 18.2% Estonian_Polish @ 5.09
13 67.1% Greek_Thessaly + 32.9% Estonian @ 5.1
14 84.6% Bulgarian + 15.4% Estonian @ 5.17
15 56.3% Greek_Thessaly + 43.7% South_Polish @ 5.19
16 84.9% Bulgarian + 15.1% Lithuanian @ 5.2
17 63.2% Ukrainian + 36.8% Italian_Jewish @ 5.2
18 80.7% Bulgarian + 19.3% Polish @ 5.21
19 82.7% Bulgarian + 17.3% Belorussian @ 5.24
20 55.2% Greek_Thessaly + 44.8% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 5.25

---

Population
North_Atlantic 26.24 Pct
Baltic 33.77 Pct
West_Med 16.01 Pct
West_Asian 7.19 Pct
East_Med 15.23 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian 0.24 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian 0.11 Pct
Amerindian -
Oceanian 0.25 Pct
Northeast_African 0.21 Pct
Sub-Saharan 0.7 Pct

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moldavian 5.55
2 Croatian 5.93
3 Serbian 6.59
4 Hungarian 7.9
5 Romanian 9.73
6 Bulgarian 11.42
7 Austrian 11.95
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 12.02
9 South_Polish 12.22
10 East_German 12.5
11 Ukrainian 12.72
12 Polish 15.74
13 Southwest_Russian 16
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 16.47
15 Russian_Smolensk 17.79
16 Estonian_Polish 18.08
17 Belorussian 18.6
18 West_German 18.75
19 Greek_Thessaly 20.01
20 South_Dutch 20.18

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 51.8% Bulgarian + 48.2% South_Polish @ 3.25
2 62.6% South_Polish + 37.4% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.27
3 75.4% South_Polish + 24.6% Algerian_Jewish @ 3.37
4 69% Ukrainian + 31% West_Sicilian @ 3.37
5 58.5% Bulgarian + 41.5% Polish @ 3.39
6 62.7% Bulgarian + 37.3% Belorussian @ 3.42
7 52.9% Bulgarian + 47.1% Ukrainian @ 3.43
8 74.6% Ukrainian + 25.4% Italian_Jewish @ 3.44
9 60.3% Southwest_Russian + 39.7% Tuscan @ 3.45
10 61.7% Ukrainian + 38.3% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.48
11 67.3% Bulgarian + 32.7% Estonian @ 3.52
12 85.8% Croatian + 14.2% Ashkenazi @ 3.53
13 62% Bulgarian + 38% Estonian_Polish @ 3.54
14 75.5% South_Polish + 24.5% Italian_Jewish @ 3.55
15 56.2% Polish + 43.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.57
16 66.2% Romanian + 33.8% Estonian_Polish @ 3.59
17 66.9% Romanian + 33.1% Belorussian @ 3.59
18 54.4% Lithuanian + 45.6% West_Sicilian @ 3.59
19 71.2% South_Polish + 28.8% Ashkenazi @ 3.6
20 88.4% Croatian + 11.6% Italian_Jewish @ 3.6

---

Population
North_Atlantic 23.03 Pct
Baltic 30.75 Pct
West_Med 15.57 Pct
West_Asian 9.11 Pct
East_Med 17.94 Pct
Red_Sea -
South_Asian -
East_Asian -
Siberian 1.67 Pct
Amerindian 0.26 Pct
Oceanian 1.32 Pct
Northeast_African 0.35 Pct
Sub-Saharan -

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 5.83
2 Romanian 6.69
3 Moldavian 7.37
4 Bulgarian 7.54
5 Croatian 9.83
6 Hungarian 11.11
7 Austrian 15.22
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.7
9 Greek_Thessaly 16.13
10 East_German 16.35
11 South_Polish 16.4
12 Ukrainian 16.62
13 Southwest_Russian 19.22
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 19.64
15 Polish 19.92
16 West_German 20.76
17 North_Italian 20.88
18 Tuscan 21.38
19 Russian_Smolensk 21.54
20 Tatar 21.85

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 73.2% Bulgarian + 26.8% Southwest_Russian @ 2.87
2 76.2% Bulgarian + 23.8% Belorussian @ 2.92
3 75.7% Bulgarian + 24.3% Estonian_Polish @ 2.95
4 79.5% Bulgarian + 20.5% Lithuanian @ 3.02
5 79.3% Bulgarian + 20.7% Estonian @ 3.07
6 79.8% Bulgarian + 20.2% East_Finnish @ 3.12
7 70.5% Bulgarian + 29.5% Ukrainian @ 3.2
8 77.2% Bulgarian + 22.8% Kargopol_Russian @ 3.21
9 54.5% Greek_Thessaly + 45.5% Southwest_Russian @ 3.22
10 75.8% Bulgarian + 24.2% Russian_Smolensk @ 3.25
11 74.1% Bulgarian + 25.9% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 3.3
12 79.5% Bulgarian + 20.5% Finnish @ 3.33
13 78.1% Bulgarian + 21.9% Erzya @ 3.4
14 70.5% Bulgarian + 29.5% South_Polish @ 3.45
15 59% Southwest_Russian + 41% South_Italian @ 3.48
16 60.3% Ukrainian + 39.7% Ashkenazi @ 3.48
17 66.3% Ukrainian + 33.7% Italian_Jewish @ 3.49
18 74.6% Bulgarian + 25.4% Polish @ 3.51
19 58.4% Greek_Thessaly + 41.6% Belorussian @ 3.54
20 55.7% Southwest_Russian + 44.3% West_Sicilian @ 3.57

Few more

Population
North_Atlantic 24.94 Pct
Baltic 31.23 Pct
West_Med 16.28 Pct
West_Asian 9.15 Pct
East_Med 13.42 Pct
Red_Sea 2.68 Pct
South_Asian -
East_Asian -
Siberian -
Amerindian 1.06 Pct
Oceanian 0.7 Pct
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan 0.54 Pct

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moldavian 4.14
2 Serbian 4.71
3 Croatian 6.35
4 Romanian 7.59
5 Hungarian 8.17
6 Bulgarian 9.5
7 Austrian 11.97
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 12.78
9 East_German 12.92
10 South_Polish 13.76
11 Ukrainian 14.16
12 Polish 17.08
13 Southwest_Russian 17.46
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 17.69
15 Greek_Thessaly 18.13
16 West_German 18.37
17 Russian_Smolensk 19.15
18 Estonian_Polish 19.68
19 South_Dutch 19.82
20 Belorussian 20.32

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 80.2% Croatian + 19.8% Central_Greek @ 1.33
2 80.9% Croatian + 19.1% East_Sicilian @ 1.39
3 82.6% Croatian + 17.4% South_Italian @ 1.43
4 74.5% Croatian + 25.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 1.44
5 60.3% Croatian + 39.7% Bulgarian @ 1.55
6 84.9% Croatian + 15.1% Algerian_Jewish @ 1.58
7 85% Croatian + 15% Sephardic_Jewish @ 1.67
8 85% Croatian + 15% Italian_Jewish @ 1.7
9 86.7% Croatian + 13.3% Cyprian @ 1.72
10 59.6% Polish + 40.4% Central_Greek @ 1.77
11 51.5% Polish + 48.5% Greek_Thessaly @ 1.81
12 86.2% Croatian + 13.8% Tunisian_Jewish @ 1.82
13 80.8% Croatian + 19.2% West_Sicilian @ 1.83
14 63.4% Polish + 36.6% South_Italian @ 1.84
15 80% Croatian + 20% Italian_Abruzzo @ 1.87
16 54.8% Croatian + 45.2% Romanian @ 1.88
17 82% Croatian + 18% Ashkenazi @ 1.88
18 64.6% Bulgarian + 35.4% Polish @ 1.91
19 58.8% Ukrainian_Lviv + 41.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 1.94
20 86.3% Croatian + 13.7% Libyan_Jewish @ 1.94

Population
North_Atlantic 24.3 Pct
Baltic 29.58 Pct
West_Med 20.48 Pct
West_Asian 7.9 Pct
East_Med 16.63 Pct
Red_Sea 0.93 Pct
South_Asian -
East_Asian 0.18 Pct
Siberian -
Amerindian -
Oceanian -
Northeast_African -
Sub-Saharan -

Spoiler!

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 5.75
2 Romanian 6.51
3 Bulgarian 7.54
4 Moldavian 8.55
5 Croatian 10.42
6 Hungarian 11.59
7 Austrian 14.37
8 Greek_Thessaly 15.34
9 East_German 15.55
10 Ukrainian_Lviv 16.85
11 South_Polish 17.51
12 Ukrainian 17.76
13 North_Italian 17.84
14 Tuscan 19.31
15 West_German 19.6
16 French 20.17
17 Polish 20.91
18 South_Dutch 20.91
19 Southwest_Russian 21.31
20 Portuguese 21.61

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 60.8% Croatian + 39.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 4.25
2 53.9% Greek_Thessaly + 46.1% Ukrainian @ 4.33
3 56.6% Ukrainian + 43.4% West_Sicilian @ 4.41
4 84% Moldavian + 16% Sardinian @ 4.42
5 60.7% Bulgarian + 39.3% Croatian @ 4.44
6 70.4% Croatian + 29.6% West_Sicilian @ 4.52
7 77% Croatian + 23% Algerian_Jewish @ 4.57
8 73.7% Croatian + 26.3% South_Italian @ 4.58
9 74.1% Bulgarian + 25.9% Ukrainian @ 4.59
10 58.2% Greek_Thessaly + 41.8% Polish @ 4.61
11 53.6% Greek_Thessaly + 46.4% South_Polish @ 4.62
12 60.5% Ukrainian + 39.5% South_Italian @ 4.69
13 77.5% Bulgarian + 22.5% Polish @ 4.7
14 70.3% Croatian + 29.7% Central_Greek @ 4.7
15 74.2% Bulgarian + 25.8% South_Polish @ 4.74
16 77.2% Croatian + 22.8% Italian_Jewish @ 4.75
17 71.5% Croatian + 28.5% East_Sicilian @ 4.79
18 66.9% Croatian + 33.1% Tuscan @ 4.83
19 52.3% Ukrainian + 47.7% Tuscan @ 4.83
20 73.6% Bulgarian + 26.4% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 4.85

Population
North_Atlantic 26.03 Pct
Baltic 32.4 Pct
West_Med 15.3 Pct
West_Asian 10.59 Pct
East_Med 11.2 Pct
Red_Sea 1.27 Pct
South_Asian 0.32 Pct
East_Asian -
Siberian 0.64 Pct
Amerindian 0.9 Pct
Oceanian 0.8 Pct
Northeast_African 0.23 Pct
Sub-Saharan 0.34 Pct

Spoiler!

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 32.4
2 North_Atlantic 26.03
3 West_Med 15.3
4 East_Med 11.2
5 West_Asian 10.59
6 Red_Sea 1.27
7 Amerindian 0.9
8 Oceanian 0.8
9 Siberian 0.64
10 Sub-Saharan 0.34
11 South_Asian 0.32
12 Northeast_African 0.23

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moldavian 2.36
2 Croatian 4.54
3 Serbian 6.31
4 Hungarian 6.76
5 Romanian 9.48
6 Austrian 10.79
7 Ukrainian_Lviv 10.8
8 East_German 11.42
9 Bulgarian 11.59
10 South_Polish 11.68
11 Ukrainian 12.22
12 Polish 15.15
13 Southwest_Russian 15.64
14 Ukrainian_Belgorod 15.72
15 Russian_Smolensk 17.3
16 West_German 17.73
17 Estonian_Polish 18
18 Belorussian 18.63
19 South_Dutch 19.2
20 Kargopol_Russian 19.56

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 78.9% Moldavian + 21.1% Serbian @ 1.72
2 91.6% Moldavian + 8.4% West_German @ 1.72
3 92.7% Moldavian + 7.3% French @ 1.73
4 91.8% Croatian + 8.2% Armenian @ 1.76
5 94.2% Moldavian + 5.8% Spanish_Cataluna @ 1.78
6 92.6% Moldavian + 7.4% South_Dutch @ 1.8
7 94.7% Moldavian + 5.3% Spanish_Valencia @ 1.81
8 90.2% Croatian + 9.8% Turkish @ 1.82
9 94.7% Moldavian + 5.3% Spanish_Murcia @ 1.82
10 94.5% Moldavian + 5.5% Spanish_Castilla_Y_Leon @ 1.82
11 94.9% Moldavian + 5.1% Spanish_Andalucia @ 1.82
12 94.9% Moldavian + 5.1% Spanish_Castilla_La_Mancha @ 1.82
13 93.8% Moldavian + 6.2% North_Italian @ 1.83
14 94.3% Moldavian + 5.7% Portuguese @ 1.83
15 95.3% Moldavian + 4.7% Spanish_Aragon @ 1.84
16 94.6% Moldavian + 5.4% Spanish_Extremadura @ 1.84
17 95% Moldavian + 5% Spanish_Cantabria @ 1.87
18 53.4% Romanian + 46.6% Ukrainian_Lviv @ 1.87
19 69.2% Croatian + 30.8% Romanian @ 1.88
20 88.1% Moldavian + 11.9% Austrian @ 1.88

Distance: 2.5514% / 0.02551449
39.9 Baltic_EST_BA
17.0 Turkish_Rumeli
15.1 Cossack_Ukrainian
14.2 Rumelia_East
13.7 Portuguese
0.1 Orcadian

Serbian or possibly Montenegrin results (uploaded a couple of months ago)

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 31.32
2 North_Atlantic 24.87
3 West_Med 17.62
4 East_Med 13.59
5 West_Asian 7.48
6 Red_Sea 2.46
7 Siberian 1
8 Northeast_African 0.82
9 Sub-Saharan 0.49
10 Oceanian 0.35

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moldavian 5
2 Serbian 5.08
3 Croatian 6.78
4 Romanian 7.99
5 Hungarian 8.63
6 Bulgarian 9.81
7 Austrian 12.16
8 East_German 13.01
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 13.11
10 South_Polish 14
11 Ukrainian 14.3
12 Polish 17.33
13 Southwest_Russian 17.8
14 Greek_Thessaly 18.16
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 18.23
16 West_German 18.51
17 Russian_Smolensk 19.44
18 Estonian_Polish 19.81
19 South_Dutch 19.82
20 French 20.11

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 84.3% Croatian + 15.7% Algerian_Jewish @ 2.27
2 64.4% Ukrainian + 35.6% West_Sicilian @ 2.31
3 80.2% Croatian + 19.8% West_Sicilian @ 2.51
4 74.1% Croatian + 25.9% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.55
5 84.6% Croatian + 15.4% Italian_Jewish @ 2.57
6 80.7% Croatian + 19.3% East_Sicilian @ 2.6
7 66.5% Ukrainian_Lviv + 33.5% West_Sicilian @ 2.66
8 82.5% Croatian + 17.5% South_Italian @ 2.69
9 81.6% Croatian + 18.4% Ashkenazi @ 2.74
10 84.9% Croatian + 15.1% Sephardic_Jewish @ 2.78
11 80.3% Croatian + 19.7% Central_Greek @ 2.79
12 86% Croatian + 14% Tunisian_Jewish @ 2.8
13 86% Croatian + 14% Libyan_Jewish @ 2.81
14 51.2% Polish + 48.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.85
15 56.1% Ukrainian + 43.9% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.86
16 60.4% Croatian + 39.6% Bulgarian @ 2.87
17 65.1% Ukrainian + 34.9% East_Sicilian @ 2.93
18 67.7% Ukrainian + 32.3% South_Italian @ 2.93
19 78.1% Croatian + 21.9% Tuscan @ 2.95
20 58.4% Ukrainian_Lviv + 41.6% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.02


Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 19.78
2 North_Sea 18.37
3 West_Med 14.03
4 Atlantic 13.83
5 Eastern_Euro 13.35
6 East_Med 10.19
7 West_Asian 6.71
8 Red_Sea 2.47
9 Sub-Saharan 0.83
10 Oceanian 0.2
11 Northeast_African 0.18
12 Siberian 0.05

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Moldavian 4.82
2 Serbian 5.99
3 Croatian 6.69
4 Romanian 7.53
5 Hungarian 7.78
6 Bulgarian 9.6
7 Austrian 9.99
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 11.75
9 East_German 12.32
10 Ukrainian 12.56
11 South_Polish 12.67
12 Polish 15.32
13 Greek_Thessaly 16.01
14 Russian_Smolensk 16.13
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 16.24
16 Southwest_Russian 16.71
17 Greek 17.58
18 Estonian_Polish 18.12
19 Belorussian 18.17
20 North_Italian 18.23

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 90.7% Moldavian + 9.3% Sardinian @ 2.71
2 56.3% Ukrainian + 43.7% Greek_Thessaly @ 2.83
3 82.7% Moldavian + 17.3% North_Italian @ 3
4 83.7% Moldavian + 16.3% Tuscan @ 3.05
5 65.7% Ukrainian + 34.3% East_Sicilian @ 3.17
6 61.2% Ukrainian + 38.8% Tuscan @ 3.21
7 56.1% South_Polish + 43.9% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.23
8 51.2% Polish + 48.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.24
9 68.2% Ukrainian + 31.8% South_Italian @ 3.26
10 90.8% Moldavian + 9.2% Algerian @ 3.29
11 91.2% Moldavian + 8.8% Mozabite_Berber @ 3.29
12 91.2% Moldavian + 8.8% Moroccan @ 3.3
13 72.9% Croatian + 27.1% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.31
14 65% Ukrainian + 35% Central_Greek @ 3.32
15 86.8% Moldavian + 13.2% West_Sicilian @ 3.32
16 81.8% Moldavian + 18.2% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.33
17 65.6% Ukrainian + 34.4% West_Sicilian @ 3.33
18 91% Moldavian + 9% Tunisian @ 3.33
19 89.9% Moldavian + 10.1% Algerian_Jewish @ 3.36
20 58.2% Ukrainian_Lviv + 41.8% Greek_Thessaly @ 3.38

Women from Belgrade
# Population Percent
1 Baltic 27.69
2 North_Atlantic 25.03
3 West_Med 18.02
4 East_Med 13.59
5 West_Asian 10.49
6 Red_Sea 1.36
7 Siberian 1.26
8 South_Asian 1.09
9 Amerindian 0.86
10 Northeast_African 0.6
11 Sub-Saharan 0.01

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 3.86
2 Romanian 5.05
3 Moldavian 6.65
4 Bulgarian 7.33
5 Croatian 9.36
6 Hungarian 9.59
7 Austrian 12.5
8 East_German 13.89
9 Greek_Thessaly 15.6
10 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.86
11 South_Polish 16.67
12 Ukrainian 17.17
13 West_German 17.52
14 North_Italian 17.82
15 French 18.69
16 South_Dutch 18.96
17 Tuscan 19.42
18 Polish 20.21
19 Southwest_Russian 20.7
20 Ukrainian_Belgorod 20.9

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 27.19
2 North_Atlantic 22.22
3 West_Med 19.89
4 East_Med 17.8
5 West_Asian 8.06
6 Siberian 2.59
7 Red_Sea 1.43
8 Sub-Saharan 0.28
9 East_Asian 0.27
10 South_Asian 0.27

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Romanian 5.26
2 Bulgarian 5.64
3 Serbian 6.4
4 Moldavian 10.06
5 Croatian 12.74
6 Greek_Thessaly 12.88
7 Hungarian 13.48
8 Austrian 16.48
9 North_Italian 17.01
10 Tuscan 17.6
11 East_German 17.87
12 Ukrainian_Lviv 18.94
13 Italian_Abruzzo 19.76
14 South_Polish 19.83
15 Ukrainian 19.96
16 Central_Greek 20
17 West_Sicilian 20.5
18 West_German 20.95
19 French 21.03
20 East_Sicilian 21.13

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 32.15
2 North_Atlantic 24.37
3 West_Med 17.57
4 East_Med 16.76
5 West_Asian 7.88
6 East_Asian 0.43
7 Siberian 0.36
8 Sub-Saharan 0.32
9 Amerindian 0.13
10 Oceanian 0.03

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 5.91
2 Moldavian 6.67
3 Romanian 7.8
4 Croatian 8.28
5 Bulgarian 8.98
6 Hungarian 10.08
7 Austrian 13.85
8 Ukrainian_Lviv 14.46
9 East_German 14.73
10 South_Polish 14.98
11 Ukrainian 15.19
12 Greek_Thessaly 17.49
13 Southwest_Russian 18.37
14 Polish 18.44
15 Ukrainian_Belgorod 18.79
16 West_German 19.95
17 Russian_Smolensk 20.33
18 Estonian_Polish 20.61
19 North_Italian 20.72
20 Belorussian 21.22

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Baltic 29.35
2 North_Atlantic 23.39
3 East_Med 15.99
4 West_Med 15.47
5 West_Asian 9.64
6 Red_Sea 2.92
7 Amerindian 1.69
8 East_Asian 1.55

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 4.43
2 Romanian 5.59
3 Moldavian 6.74
4 Bulgarian 7.02
5 Croatian 9.31
6 Hungarian 10.32
7 Austrian 14.16
8 East_German 15.46
9 Ukrainian_Lviv 15.49
10 Greek_Thessaly 15.58
11 South_Polish 16.45
12 Ukrainian 16.75
13 Southwest_Russian 19.65
14 West_German 19.66
15 Polish 19.79
16 Ukrainian_Belgorod 19.84
17 North_Italian 19.91
18 Tuscan 20.58
19 French 21.12
20 South_Dutch

found them on gedmatch, did my best to look up there roots, dhow do you guys do, contact them or just go on surname ?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Milenko

found them on gedmatch, did my best to look up there roots, dhow do you guys do, contact them or just go on surname ?

---

I saw the family tree of the individuals whose results I had shared in the past. Mingle and vbnetkhio usually messaged the owners of the kits they found. What about you, did you contact those women from Belgrade or?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CommonSense

I saw the family tree of the individuals whose results I had shared in the past. Mingle and vbnetkhio usually messaged the owners of the kits they found. What about you, did you contact those women from Belgrade or?

---

i have sent here or acctualy Him, her husband has the email put his emaila, with no replay so far, so i found here on FB and the kit after here is here husbands, i will tell you as soon as o know somthing

Ancestry from Crnjelovo, Bijeljina (Bosnia):

Spoiler!

Kit WP6979108

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 28.17
2 Baltic 27.14
3 East_Med 16.93
4 West_Med 15.83
5 West_Asian 9.31
6 Siberian 2.35
7 East_Asian 0.27

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Serbian 3.28
2 Romanian 5.35
3 Bulgarian 7.9
4 Hungarian 8.79
5 Moldavian 8.99
6 Croatian 10.75
7 Austrian 11.61
8 East_German 13.42
9 Greek_Thessaly 15.79
10 West_German 15.8
11 South_Polish 17.01
12 Ukrainian_Lviv 17.08
13 North_Italian 17.11
14 French 17.3
15 South_Dutch 17.37
16 Ukrainian 18.07
17 Tuscan 18.62
18 Portuguese 20.24
19 North_German 20.63
20 Spanish_Galicia 20.75

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 75.6% Bulgarian + 24.4% North_Swedish @ 2.76
2 83.6% Romanian + 16.4% North_Swedish @ 2.91
3 84.3% Romanian + 15.7% Southwest_Finnish @ 2.96
4 65.1% Romanian + 34.9% Hungarian @ 2.99
5 53.1% Bulgarian + 46.9% Hungarian @ 3.06
6 98.7% Serbian + 1.3% Evens @ 3.07
7 98.7% Serbian + 1.3% Dolgan @ 3.07
8 98.7% Serbian + 1.3% Evenki @ 3.08
9 98.8% Serbian + 1.2% Yakut @ 3.1
10 98.5% Serbian + 1.5% Selkup @ 3.12
11 98.8% Serbian + 1.2% Koryak @ 3.12
12 98.5% Serbian + 1.5% Ket @ 3.13
13 98.9% Serbian + 1.1% Oroqen @ 3.13
14 98.9% Serbian + 1.1% Chukchi @ 3.15
15 98.8% Serbian + 1.2% Tuvinian @ 3.17
16 98.9% Serbian + 1.1% Buryat @ 3.17
17 98.8% Serbian + 1.2% Altaian @ 3.18
18 98.6% Serbian + 1.4% Shors @ 3.19
19 98.7% Serbian + 1.3% Hakas @ 3.19
20 99% Serbian + 1% Mongolian @ 3.21

^^^^High Siberian for a Serb.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CommonSense

Ancestry from Crnjelovo, Bijeljina (Bosnia):



Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 North_Atlantic 28.17
2 Baltic 27.14

---

I noticed that often who has higher North Atlantic, then he has lower Baltic, and vice versa.
But sum of North Atlantic and Baltic is most usualy 54-56%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stearsolina

^^^^High Siberian for a Serb.

---

Those 'lesser' components vary based on the chip, but I think all of us have some minimal Siberian-like ancestry (considering western Euros don't ever score this component).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stearsolina

^^^^High Siberian for a Serb.

---

https://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/...lan-serbia.jpg
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...87_cropped.jpg

from the Vranje area

https://spos.info/wp-content/uploads...anje-mapa-.jpg

Population

North_Atlantic	19.62 Pct
Baltic	29.31 Pct
West_Med	19.67 Pct
West_Asian	9.93 Pct
East_Med	19.29 Pct
Red_Sea	-
South_Asian	-
East_Asian	0.93 Pct
Siberian	0.25 Pct
Amerindian	0.98 Pct
Oceanian	-
Northeast_African	-
Sub-Saharan	-

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by vbnetkhio

from the Vranje area

https://spos.info/wp-content/uploads...anje-mapa-.jpg

Population

North_Atlantic	19.62 Pct
Baltic	29.31 Pct
West_Med	19.67 Pct
West_Asian	9.93 Pct
East_Med	19.29 Pct
Red_Sea	-
South_Asian	-
East_Asian	0.93 Pct
Siberian	0.25 Pct
Amerindian	0.98 Pct
Oceanian	-
Northeast_African	-
Sub-Saharan	-

---

Let's ask JohnnyP if this person is also a lost Macedonian :biggrin:

from Vojvodina

North_Atlantic	Baltic	West_Med	West_Asian	East_Med	Red_Sea	South_Asian	East_Asian	Siberian	Amerindian	Oceanian	Northeast_Afr	Sub0Saharan
26.35	23.93	19.28	9.2	16.51	1.17	2.64	0.93	0	0.00	0.00	0.00	0.00
29.15	24.38	18.11	5.65	17.03	2.89	0.63	0	1.73	0.31	0	0.11	0
21.75	25.45	16.87	13.04	17.59	1.18	1.56	0.7	0.56	0.31	0.22	0.14	0.63
25.88	27.57	18.12	7.9	17.73	1.24	0.17	0	0.08	1.3	0	0	0
20.25	28.47	17.62	8.98	20.51	2.74	0	0	0.48	0.76	0.12	0	0.07
20.85	29.26	14	13.95	17.61	1.36	0	0.72	0.85	0.42	0.16	0	0.83

all ancestry from the Čačak area

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Ca%C4%8Dak.png

North_Atlantic	30.07
Baltic	24.8
West_Med	18.01
West_Asian	9.26
East_Med	14.69
Red_Sea	1.86
South_Asian	0.32
East_Asian	0
Siberian	0.06
Amerindian	0.34
Oceanian	0.23
Northeast_Afr	0
Sub0Saharan	0.36

These Vojvodina Serbs are in line with Milenko. Basically southern Serbian results that reflect what we know of their origin from historical sources.

I have to say it's really sad that even some ethnic Serbs took the Croatian bait and believe that those from Vojvodina are 'pure' Serbs while southerners like the ones in Niš and Leskovac are just a bunch mutts.
Fact is that if we discount Srem there's just as many Gypsies in Vojovodina as in the south and plenty more individuals mix with them.