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R1 initiated the Late Bronze Age Collapse. Sea Peoples and other sons of Dagon. Branches became associated with the steppes slightly later, as the children of Minos’ brothers became wanderers and nomads after banishment from Crete.
Even Egypt fell by our hand.
I like Tamerlane because he was good strategistQuote:
Originally Posted by Leto
Ye he did a battle with ottomans but anatolian Turkmens changed side and joined Timurid in ankara battle (i am an anatolian Turkmen too) also Timur didn't act badly against to Ottomans and Ottoman Sultans they did just war Timurid didn't kill Turks in anatolia probably just killed native anatolian people
Also i am not sure about this but maybe my tribe was dulkadirid in that era
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beylik_of_Dulkadir
I like both Ottoman and Timurid
Both of us know that Yamnaya had Black hair and brown eyes. EHG R1 Barbarians looked foreign to them (thats why they conquered them) compared to their J2 compatriots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leto
Okay, I consider only R1a cultures to be muh people, to be honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Maul
How do you view the haplogroup struggle in Iran? Our diaspora in Iran is still not exactly small.
The presence of R1a+R1b has proved to be quite disastrous for Iran, considering their numbers (1/3 in total?) but do not underestimate J2 in those lands either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leto
I have a question how EHG looked like? some people say they looked asiatic influenced but i am not sure
I am not sure but probably like Turanid/Uralid maybe?Quote:
Originally Posted by Altaylı
They looked mixed of Asian and European, but they were Barbarians overall. Good thing that we J2's conquered the steppe from them :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Altaylı
And this was the first on a large scale transindoeuropean intercontinental war,Quote:
Originally Posted by CordedWhelp
because the Middle Eastern at that time, was basically ruled by Indoeuropeans.
Maybe Sea Peoples punished imperial IEs for being too far deindoeuropeanized :laugh:
Wrong. We ARE Japhethites.Quote:
Originally Posted by CordedWhelp
Lul, its interesting to see an autosomal warrior like you in y-dna wars.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leto
Yes, my haplogroup is J2a1b1.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedora
My docedad K12b Results.
# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 36.06
2 Gedrosia 15.47
3 Atlantic_Med 11.86
4 North_European 11.40
5 East_Asian 7.96
6 Southwest_Asian 7.71
7 Siberian 7.65
Distance to: Bozkurt
4.64109664 Turk_Southwest
5.64923004 Turk_South
5.85249528 Turk_Central_Black_Sea
6.25984824 Turk_Northwest
6.70061937 Turk_West_BlackSea
6.70353638 Turk_Central_West
8.32176063 Turk_Central_East
10.00053999 Turk_Southeast
10.75142316 Azerbaijani_Turkey
11.84880585 Azerbaijani_Republic
12.29116756 Azerbaijani_Iran
12.98587694 Kabardin
13.10019084 Crimean_Tatar_Mountain
13.46963622 Azerbaijani_Dagestan
13.62603391 Abazin
14.26534262 Turkmen_Iran
14.53156220 Kumyk
14.54865286 Circassian
14.70993542 Turk_East
15.17929511 Karachay
15.40556718 Balkar
15.64257651 Turkmen_TM
15.66417250 Nogai
15.95909772 Kurd_Kurmanji
16.40718135 Udi_Azerbaijan
Anatolian Hunter Gatherer was mostly G, i suppose, not J.
Natufian J, i suppose...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flashball
Quote:
According to ancient DNA analyses conducted by Lazaridis et al. (2016) on Natufian skeletal remains from present-day northern Israel, the Natufians carried the Y-DNA (paternal) haplogroups E1b1b1b2 (xE1b1b1b2a, E1b1b1b2b) (2/5; 40%), CT (2/5; 40%), and E1b1 (xE1b1a1, E1b1b1b1) (1/5; 20%).
Quote:
Ancient J-M410, specifically subclade J-Y12379*, has been found, in a mesolithic context, in a tooth from the Kotias Klde Cave in western Georgia dating 9.529-9.895 cal. BP.[13] This sample has been assigned to the Caucasus hunter-gatherers (CHG) autosomal component.[14] J-M410, more specifically its subclade J-PF5008, has also been found in a mesolithic sample from the Hotu and Kamarband Caves located in Mazandaran Province of Iran, dating back to 9,100-8,600 B.C.E (approximately 11,000 ybp).[15] Both samples belong to the Trialetian Culture. It is likely that J2 men had settled over most of Anatolia, the South Caucasus and Iran by the end of the Last Glaciation 12,000 years ago.
Which of the Indo-Aryan/ Vedic samples were J2? Which one is J2-Z2443? and which one is J2-Y26741?
PAK_Loebanr_IA:I12982 is J2-Z2433 , other one is KGZ_Aigyrzhal_BA:I11527Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaazi
The cradle of civilization is obviously E1b
KGZ_Aigyrzhal_BA is BMAC + WSHG, not Steppe MLBA while Loebanr is Swat valley Iron Age and there's confusion whether Swat valley IA is Indo-Aryan or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Maul
Indo-Aryan is Steppe MLBA and Vedic is Painted Grey Ware.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Painted_Grey_Ware_culture
Katelai and Butkara IA also have J2. Also the Steppe MLBA outlier was Kazakhstan_Taldysay_MLBA2Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaazi
The funny thing is that J2 is a minority in all the European populations mentioned in the map.
Cardle of civilisation had no particular hg, because all people were there. Problem solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by MechtoidAfalouHG
Not only a minority, but very insignificant minority, even very tiny in average.Quote:
Originally Posted by L.o.l.i.t.a
The only place in the World where J2 is in majority is Ingushgetia and to lesser
degree Chechnya. And even this was probably caused by recent founder effect.
It is just one of the most mental threads on this forum, which shouldn't be bumped ever.
No, it was only E1bQuote:
Originally Posted by Rethel
Particularly E-M78
Tell me yet, it was in Somalia... :picard2:Quote:
Originally Posted by MechtoidAfalouHG
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...28Y-DNA%29.png
Elite always represent minority lineagesQuote:
Originally Posted by L.o.l.i.t.a
No, it was in Egypt and Nubia. On the Nile valley. Nile Valley is the birthplace of all civilization because all humans ultimately came from thereQuote:
Originally Posted by Rethel
but what type of civilisation? bankster and covid one
Nope.Quote:
Originally Posted by MechtoidAfalouHG
Egyptian civilization was from Sumer.
And modern people came from Armenian highlands and Mesopotamia.
In Turkey, the most inteligent muslim country with 90 IQ points, a ~quarter = mostly. Impressive.Quote:
Originally Posted by AhmetFaruk
I said country. In some researches even below 90.Quote:
Originally Posted by AhmetFaruk
And the 100 is the maximum, in what you have showed, so, it cannot be 100 in average anyway.
You have still problems with numbers.
And btw, it isn't the point. The point is, that you think, that 24% = mostly.
Technically speaking it is one of the highest %Quote:
Originally Posted by Rethel
https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qim...d0a02d9be.webp
Rethel, you are just a triggered R1 who is mad at the superiority of J2. You thought since you easily overtook R2/H peoples in India, and replaced N/Q folks in the east, that we would have it. But no, J2 survived, took your language, and formed the elite. Your heroes of Europe and slavers of R1 aka Romans were J2 hellenes, Ottoman empire J2a (check Karluks, Karakhanids, Karakaba Y-DNA haplos) were the ones who would have completely eliminated R1 from Europe if the J2 Safavid didn't occupy their minds.
But not the most, as he claimed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Maul
:picard2:Quote:
who is mad at the superiority of J2.
You allready made one insane thread about it, so spare us this insanity here.
Welcome to the masterrace homieQuote:
Originally Posted by Ritz06
Have you done any subclade predictors by any chance?
G2 has a greater claim to that distinction at least in Europe before the arrival of Steppe.
Anyway, thank you very much for bringing this information to us. It's really nice of you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gecko
Anatolian farmer pride!!! :DQuote:
Originally Posted by kleenex
Come on dr maul, you post a desinformative map entirely of J2a´s conquests, when u are yourself J2b-L283, the most hermit of the hermit lineages.
The only L283 on the map is an ancient gaul who god knows why died and got buried in imperial rome.
J-L283:ITA_Rome_Imperial:RMPR116,0.126344,0.139128,0 .053551,0.020026,0.044008,0.001394,0.00047,0.00715 4,0.01943,0.01877,0.000812,0.006444,-0.014123,-0.009496,0.008822,0.004906,-0.001825,-0.002154,0,-0.003752,0.003494,0.002844,-0.005793,0.002048,0.00455
Target: J-L283:ITA_Rome_Imperial:RMPR116
Distance: 2.0019% / 0.02001871 | R3P
49.2 FRA_Alsace_IA1(Hallstatt)
25.8 ITA_Boville_Ernica_IA
25.0 FRA_Alsace_IA2(Hallstatt)
Target: J-L283:ITA_Rome_Imperial:RMPR116
Distance: 3.5054% / 0.03505399 | R3P
49.4 TUR_Barcin_N
36.2 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
14.4 WHG
J-L283 was mostly bottlenecked until about 3000bc 2500bcQuote:
Originally Posted by Tongio
The expansion of J-L283 was due to Roman expansion. It mostly concentrated in the balkans and italalian peninsula and islands as the heaviest J-L283 origin was adriatic. Southern italians were J-L283 when illiyrians crossed into southern italy.
Some proto illyrians split and became nuraghe.
The oldest J-L283 was found in croatia.
A disproportionate number of pre z597 ancient sample lineages were found in sardinia
https://www.yfull.com/tree/j-l283/
Search for word age and you will see the majority, almost all ancient samples found so far are from sardinia, croatia or Italy.
Theres also ancient J-L283 from corsica but there wasnt enough good quality data to show which J-L283 sublineage it is part of.
https://phylogeographer.com/insights...di-cristofaro/
Corsica was linked with Etruscan in ancient times.
Its also possible that some J-L283 lineages were from nobility which is probably why there was such a low rate of J-L283 as they would mostly mingle with other nobility for hundreds of years.
Here is one lineage noted for it
https://phylogeographer.com/vpb-307-...hely-cemetery/
Not solely, the romans never been to Poland , Russia or scandinavia, for example.The indo europeans were the ones who spread L283 in europe , via tumulus culture and derivates aka Bell beackers , hallstattQuote:
Originally Posted by zebruh
Corrected. You had writen much wrong stuff.Quote:
Some J-L283 of illiyrian origin crossed into southern italy.
Some tumulus culture splits mygrated to sardinia and became nuraghe.
The oldest J-L283 was found in panonian Serbia , mokrin.
A disproportionate number of dead end early split clades were found in sardinia
Ok man i dont know If i understand how your coment relates to my inicial comment in matter of context , cool that you are excited about our haplogroup but i know enough about my lineage dont need you typing made up ideas of yours.Quote:
Theres also ancient J-L283 from corsica but there wasnt enough good quality data to show which J-L283 sublineage it is part of.
https://phylogeographer.com/insights...di-cristofaro/
Corsica was linked with Etruscan in ancient times.
Its also possible that some J-L283 lineages were from nobility which is probably why there was such a low rate of J-L283 as they would mostly mingle with other nobility for hundreds of years.
Here is one lineage noted for it
https://phylogeographer.com/vpb-307-...hely-cemetery/
Here is Flor veseli's map so you can get tô know better:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer...5836047676&z=4
Only the revised and atested ones make up to the map, but u could already see on yfull that the Bell beaker from mokrin is the oldest , hell i told you that some few days ago.
poland isn't J-L283 heavy. Germany has more J-L283 than poland.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tongio
Also none of the Ancient J-L283 are from poland or Germany.
Although before arriving to the balkans its possible that they crossed poland. It wasnt a heavier concentration of J-L283 there. Its mostly in the adriatic and italian regions where we have ancient samples from.
Also having a current day polish person of J-L283 doesnt mean it spent most of its time in poland. Its more recent migration
Yes you can see there is only 1 ancient J-L283 in nederlands 1300 CE. Its recentQuote:
Ok man i dont know If i understand how your coment relates to my inicial comment in matter of context , cool that you are excited about our haplogroup but i know enough about my lineage dont need you typing made up ideas of yours.
Here is Flor veseli's map so you can get tô know better:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer...5836047676&z=4
Flor feve
Only the revised and atested ones make up to the map, but u could already see on yfull that the Bell beaker from mokrin is the oldest , hell i told you that some few days ago.
None in poland.
The viking is about 1000 ad
The one in estonia is 1500ad
Its actually possible they crossed the black sea and landed straight into the balkans first. Which may reflect sea faring capabilties and is why they are concentrated in the adriatic and also have very old samples in sardinia with basal pre z585 J-L283 ancient samples.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...cf8e9a1bf1.jpg
Also we have J-L283 in spain that has been linked to Albanian J-L283