Pontic Greek Gedmatch results

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xripkan

Very interesting results! Most Pontic Greek results we have so far are close to Caucasian groups. Yours are half Caucasian-like and the rest is similar to Greek Islander or maybe Smyrniot results.
However there is an explanation.
The Pontic Greek samples we have so far are from Trabzon area. We don't have samples from Western Pontus. Your Trabzon side seems typical. Your Western Pontus side is different but in fact may be typical for the region. We need samples from this area and it is very useful to see your results.
Could you also post your K15? I would like to see both your mixed mode (press oracle) and 4 (oracle 4)populations results.

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If you mean these results here

puntDNAL K15 Oracle

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 39.51
2 Mediterranean 33.91
3 NE_European 16.27
4 SW_Asian 8.33


Finished reading population data. 157 populations found.
15 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Turk_Kayseri @ 7.830898
2 Armenian @ 13.553785
3 Kurdish @ 13.666525
4 Turk_Istanbul @ 13.681021
5 Assyrian @ 13.836654
6 Azerbaijani @ 15.074780
7 Cypriot @ 15.436791
8 Turk_Trabzon @ 15.461801
9 Sephardic_Jew @ 17.591301
10 Lebanese @ 17.870195
11 Balkar @ 17.986387
12 Kumyk @ 18.196001
13 Druze @ 18.607718
14 Sicilian @ 18.870451
15 Chechen @ 19.064428
16 North_Ossetian @ 19.118385
17 Palestinian @ 19.317678
18 Ashkenazy_Jew @ 19.516176
19 Iranian @ 20.141754
20 Greek_Central @ 20.492445

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazy_Jew +50% Abkhasian @ 3.668109


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Central +25% Assyrian +25% Georgian @ 1.763983


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++
1 Croatian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.058715
2 Hungarian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.239543
3 Serbian + Abkhasian + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.244972
4 English + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.308802
5 Serbian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.370612
6 Utahn_White + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.373172
7 Austrian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.396637
8 Tuscan + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.431575
9 Orcadian + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.466574
10 Slovenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.490400
11 Albanian + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.496147
12 Scottish + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.538998
13 French + Abkhasian + Turk_Trabzon + Druze @ 1.557125
14 South_German + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.561283
15 Croatian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.570972
16 French + Armenian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.571699
17 Greek_Thessaly + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.576627
18 Macedonian + Abkhasian + Cypriot + Armenian @ 1.583088
19 Croatian + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian @ 1.607055
20 South_German + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.613979

Done.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Roman-Anatolian

If you mean these results here

puntDNAL K15 Oracle

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 39.51
2 Mediterranean 33.91
3 NE_European 16.27
4 SW_Asian 8.33


Finished reading population data. 157 populations found.
15 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Turk_Kayseri @ 7.830898
2 Armenian @ 13.553785
3 Kurdish @ 13.666525
4 Turk_Istanbul @ 13.681021
5 Assyrian @ 13.836654
6 Azerbaijani @ 15.074780
7 Cypriot @ 15.436791
8 Turk_Trabzon @ 15.461801
9 Sephardic_Jew @ 17.591301
10 Lebanese @ 17.870195
11 Balkar @ 17.986387
12 Kumyk @ 18.196001
13 Druze @ 18.607718
14 Sicilian @ 18.870451
15 Chechen @ 19.064428
16 North_Ossetian @ 19.118385
17 Palestinian @ 19.317678
18 Ashkenazy_Jew @ 19.516176
19 Iranian @ 20.141754
20 Greek_Central @ 20.492445

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Ashkenazy_Jew +50% Abkhasian @ 3.668109


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Greek_Central +25% Assyrian +25% Georgian @ 1.763983


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++
1 Croatian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.058715
2 Hungarian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.239543
3 Serbian + Abkhasian + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.244972
4 English + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.308802
5 Serbian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.370612
6 Utahn_White + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.373172
7 Austrian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.396637
8 Tuscan + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.431575
9 Orcadian + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.466574
10 Slovenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.490400
11 Albanian + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.496147
12 Scottish + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.538998
13 French + Abkhasian + Turk_Trabzon + Druze @ 1.557125
14 South_German + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian + Druze @ 1.561283
15 Croatian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.570972
16 French + Armenian + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.571699
17 Greek_Thessaly + Lezgin + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.576627
18 Macedonian + Abkhasian + Cypriot + Armenian @ 1.583088
19 Croatian + Cypriot + Turk_Trabzon + Georgian @ 1.607055
20 South_German + Armenian + Turk_Trabzon + Turk_Trabzon @ 1.613979

Done.

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Εννοουσα το Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15. Απλα αν μπορεις να ποσταρεις και τις δυο εκδοχες. Την πρωτη πατας το oracle και την δευτερη το oracle 4 οπως αυτο που ποσταρες.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by catgeorge

Not necessarily true. Pontus and Principality of Theodoro which was a Greek/Gothic Crimean mix was a brother/sister type relationship - meaning alot of trade occured between these two people.

Not overly atypical at all - you see some Pontians that are fairly light and others that look full Iranic. They are as diverse as any other people on the planet.

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I've seen hundreds of Pontic Greek results on GEDMatch, this is the first time I've seen one score such high North Atlantic + Baltic, higher than Dodecanese islanders in fact. I'm almost certain he has a European grandparent, that's why I want to see the results to the commercial test he took.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AncientGreek

I've seen hundreds of Pontic Greek results on GEDMatch, this is the first time I've seen one score such high North Atlantic + Baltic, higher than Dodecanese islanders in fact. I'm almost certain he has a European grandparent, that's why I want to see the results to the commercial test he took.

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Pontians typically score Azov_Greek in almost every result and that alone scores high Baltic.

North Atlantic is another discussion which does make it interesting.

I'm not sure which Pontians you've seen, but most I have kits of are closest to Armenian. This one from Imera, Georgia:

Code:

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Admix Results (sorted):

#        Population        Percent
1        Caucasus        52.79
2        Gedrosia        16.95
3        Southwest_Asian        13.69
4        Atlantic_Med        12.05
5        North_European        4.25


Finished reading population data. 223 populations found.
12 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Armenian_Dodecad @ 3.751723
2 Armenians_15_Yunusbayev @ 4.585120
3 Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar @ 6.443458
4 Assyrian_Dodecad @ 6.823298
5 Georgia_Jews_Behar @ 7.004762
6 Armenians_Behar @ 8.358053
7 Turks_Behar @ 10.078381
8 Uzbekistan_Jews_Behar @ 10.531536
9 Turkish_Dodecad @ 10.700020
10 Iranian_Jews_Behar @ 11.908551
11 Iraq_Jews_Behar @ 13.273272
12 Druze_HGDP @ 13.590092
13 Cypriots_Behar @ 15.089098
14 Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 16.721233
15 Lebanese_Behar @ 17.146748
16 Kurd_Dodecad @ 18.359600
17 Iranian_Dodecad @ 18.996466
18 Syrians_Behar @ 21.245981
19 Kumyks_Yunusbayev @ 21.920626
20 Iranians_Behar @ 22.631540

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenians_Behar +50% Uzbekistan_Jews_Behar @ 3.621940


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenians_Behar +25% Cypriots_Behar +25% Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.378110


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.276105
2 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.378110
3 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.441347
4 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.527525
5 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.705791
6 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 1.850797
7 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 1.890053
8 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.906078
9 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 1.925614
10 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 2.010584
11 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.058552
12 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.061245
13 Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.125730
14 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranians_Behar @ 2.126134
15 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.130968
16 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.138367
17 Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.166177
18 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 2.175122
19 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.205736
20 Armenians_Behar + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.261011

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Common pattern is Armenia + Armenia + Armenia + Cypriot prediction on Eurogenes & Dodecad.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AncientGreek

I'm not sure which Pontians you've seen, but most I have kits of are closest to Armenian. This one from Imera, Georgia:

Code:

---

Admix Results (sorted):

#        Population        Percent
1        Caucasus        52.79
2        Gedrosia        16.95
3        Southwest_Asian        13.69
4        Atlantic_Med        12.05
5        North_European        4.25


Finished reading population data. 223 populations found.
12 components mode.

--------------------------------

Least-squares method.

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Armenian_Dodecad @ 3.751723
2 Armenians_15_Yunusbayev @ 4.585120
3 Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar @ 6.443458
4 Assyrian_Dodecad @ 6.823298
5 Georgia_Jews_Behar @ 7.004762
6 Armenians_Behar @ 8.358053
7 Turks_Behar @ 10.078381
8 Uzbekistan_Jews_Behar @ 10.531536
9 Turkish_Dodecad @ 10.700020
10 Iranian_Jews_Behar @ 11.908551
11 Iraq_Jews_Behar @ 13.273272
12 Druze_HGDP @ 13.590092
13 Cypriots_Behar @ 15.089098
14 Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 16.721233
15 Lebanese_Behar @ 17.146748
16 Kurd_Dodecad @ 18.359600
17 Iranian_Dodecad @ 18.996466
18 Syrians_Behar @ 21.245981
19 Kumyks_Yunusbayev @ 21.920626
20 Iranians_Behar @ 22.631540

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenians_Behar +50% Uzbekistan_Jews_Behar @ 3.621940


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Armenians_Behar +25% Cypriots_Behar +25% Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.378110


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
1 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.276105
2 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.378110
3 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Kurds_Yunusbayev @ 1.441347
4 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.527525
5 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.705791
6 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 1.850797
7 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 1.890053
8 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Kurd_Dodecad @ 1.906078
9 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 1.925614
10 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 2.010584
11 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.058552
12 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.061245
13 Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.125730
14 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_Behar + Cypriots_Behar + Iranians_Behar @ 2.126134
15 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.130968
16 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.138367
17 Armenians_Behar + Assyrian_Dodecad + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.166177
18 Armenians_Behar + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Cypriots_Behar + Iranian_Dodecad @ 2.175122
19 Armenian_Dodecad + Armenian_Dodecad + Armenians_15_Yunusbayev + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.205736
20 Armenians_Behar + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Azerbaijan_Jews_Behar + Turkish_Dodecad @ 2.261011

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Common pattern is Armenia + Armenia + Armenia + Cypriot prediction on Eurogenes & Dodecad.

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Pontic Georgian mixes or Pontic Armenian mixes are not Pontic Greek. The one you posted is close to a Kurdish result.

Pontic Greeks almost always score Cyprian, Greek_Crete and Azov_Greek in their results. Besides Pontian results are largely hit and miss.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xripkan

Εννοουσα το Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15. Απλα αν μπορεις να ποσταρεις και τις δυο εκδοχες. Την πρωτη πατας το oracle και την δευτερη το oracle 4 οπως αυτο που ποσταρες.

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Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 31.89
2 East_Med 27.79
3 Atlantic 13.14
4 West_Med 9.07
5 Baltic 8.49
6 Red_Sea 3.94
7 Eastern_Euro 3.7
8 North_Sea 1.99

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Turkish 9.57
2 Azeri 13.21
3 Armenian 14.24
4 Georgian_Jewish 14.34
5 Kurdish 14.68
6 Assyrian 15.87
7 Iranian 17.03
8 Central_Greek 17.21
9 Lebanese_Muslim 17.34
10 South_Italian 17.85
11 Cyprian 18.11
12 Kumyk 18.18
13 East_Sicilian 18.38
14 Italian_Abruzzo 18.51
15 Ashkenazi 18.99
16 Iranian_Jewish 19.47
17 Sephardic_Jewish 19.71
18 Greek 19.73
19 Syrian 19.74
20 Kurdish_Jewish 20.33

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:


# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 52.4% Sephardic_Jewish + 47.6% Adygei @ 6.96
2 58% Cyprian + 42% North_Ossetian @ 7.09
3 55.6% Sephardic_Jewish + 44.4% North_Ossetian @ 7.1
4 50.4% Adygei + 49.6% Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.1
5 52.9% Tunisian_Jewish + 47.1% North_Ossetian @ 7.22
6 54.8% Cyprian + 45.2% Adygei @ 7.24
7 51.3% Adygei + 48.7% Algerian_Jewish @ 7.33
8 56.6% South_Italian + 43.4% Georgian @ 7.34
9 53.7% Sephardic_Jewish + 46.3% Georgian @ 7.38
10 60.6% South_Italian + 39.4% Abhkasian @ 7.4
11 55.6% Cyprian + 44.4% Kabardin @ 7.41
12 57.7% Sephardic_Jewish + 42.3% Abhkasian @ 7.5
13 52% Algerian_Jewish + 48% North_Ossetian @ 7.53
14 55.3% South_Italian + 44.7% Adygei @ 7.58
15 51% West_Sicilian + 49% Georgian @ 7.65
16 53.7% Greek + 46.3% Georgian @ 7.67
17 58.9% Cyprian + 41.1% Chechen @ 7.7
18 55% West_Sicilian + 45% Abhkasian @ 7.7
19 57.8% Greek + 42.2% Abhkasian @ 7.76
20 61.8% Central_Greek + 38.2% Abhkasian @ 7.76


Eurogenes EUtest V2 K15 Oracle results:

oracle 4

Using 1 population approximation:
1 Turkish @ 10.599535
2 Azeri @ 14.828458
3 Armenian @ 16.572374
4 Georgian_Jewish @ 16.621008
5 Kurdish @ 16.750233
6 Assyrian @ 18.482376
7 Iranian @ 19.278263
8 Central_Greek @ 19.946358
9 Lebanese_Muslim @ 19.978722
10 South_Italian @ 20.640289
11 Cyprian @ 21.015095
12 Kumyk @ 21.040009
13 East_Sicilian @ 21.256687
14 Italian_Abruzzo @ 21.538033
15 Ashkenazi @ 22.024593
16 Syrian @ 22.441050
17 Iranian_Jewish @ 22.589724
18 Sephardic_Jewish @ 22.728846
19 Greek @ 22.934450
20 Kurdish_Jewish @ 23.633982

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% Adygei +50% Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.894929


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% Georgian +25% Greek +25% Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.487044


Using 4 populations approximation:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++++
1 Abhkasian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Greek @ 7.178179
2 Cyprian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + North_Ossetian @ 7.301996
3 Abhkasian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + South_Italian @ 7.368804
4 Abhkasian + Bulgarian + Georgian_Jewish + Sephardic_Jewish @ 7.400661
5 Abhkasian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Italian_Abruzzo @ 7.424911
6 Abhkasian + Cyprian + Greek + Turkish @ 7.463977
7 Abhkasian + Bulgarian + Cyprian + Turkish @ 7.473678
8 Georgian + Georgian + Greek + Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.487044
9 Abhkasian + Greek + Kurdish + Sephardic_Jewish @ 7.487513
10 Abhkasian + Greek + Kurdish + South_Italian @ 7.492231
11 Armenian + Cyprian + Greek + North_Ossetian @ 7.495560
12 Cyprian + Greek + Kurdish + North_Ossetian @ 7.498627
13 Abhkasian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + West_Sicilian @ 7.500682
14 Abhkasian + Bulgarian + Georgian_Jewish + Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.508333
15 Abhkasian + Assyrian + Greek + Greek @ 7.510170
16 Abhkasian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Sephardic_Jewish @ 7.519049
17 Abhkasian + Central_Greek + Georgian_Jewish + Greek @ 7.527063
18 Georgian_Jewish + Greek + North_Ossetian + Sephardic_Jewish @ 7.539021
19 Georgian + Georgian_Jewish + Greek + Greek @ 7.563488
20 Adygei + Georgian + Greek + Tunisian_Jewish @ 7.563562

Done.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by catgeorge

Pontic Georgian mixes or Pontic Armenian mixes are not Pontic Greek. The one you posted is close to a Kurdish result.

Pontic Greeks almost always score Cyprian, Greek_Crete and Azov_Greek in their results. Besides Pontian results are largely hit and miss.

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I agree. Besides I think xripkan is onto something. From what he understands we haven't seen Pontic Greek results west Western Pontus region (Giresun area) before, until now.

Mixes? There are 100s of Pontic Greeks on GEDMatch with the exact same admixture, from Georgia, Turkey, you name it. OP is hugely abnormal and needs to share one of MyHeritage/23andme/FTDNA/AncestryDNA results before I beleive he doesn't have a non-Pontic parent/grandparent.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AncientGreek

Mixes? There are 100s of Pontic Greeks on GEDMatch with the exact same admixture, from Georgia, Turkey, you name it. OP is hugely abnormal and needs to share one of MyHeritage/23andme/FTDNA/AncestryDNA results before I beleive he doesn't have a non-Pontic parent/grandparent.

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And what do you expect? He shows "European" and you don't believe him? You sound like the police haha.