Dodecad k12b West, Central & South Asian results Vol. 2

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08-21-2020, 12:10 PM
Bender1999

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

No Mongoloid in Afghanistan? No way. The Eurogenes Afg Tajik is nearly 20% EE. Maybe people in Herat or just Persianized Pashtuns have low Mongoloid but still I think 5% would be the minimum.

I saw some with very low to nearly non, even some who had less than 5%. Afghans who had more than 5% east eurasian admixture have distant Turkic ancestors.

By the way, although Uzbeks are Karluk Turkics, they also have Oghuz and Kipchak ancestors.
08-21-2020, 12:11 PM
Kyp

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

Yes, I have to agree, the Tajik example is inadequate because the Tajiks in Tajikistan are a (post)-Soviet nation and in Afghanistan it's a different thing and not a homogeneous group.

Btw. to get back to the prior discussion: if you search the documents for most turkic tribes in Azerbaijan/Iran (Azerbaijani DNA Project does that) they will lead to Anatolian origin. So I guess the completion of turkification of Azerbaijan was the Aq Qoyunlu/Kara Qoyunlu (14th/15th century) and the following Safavid period. Prior to it turkish was mostly one of many influential languages in that region.

Another thing they found out: It turned out Aq qoyunlu were allies with some Kurds. Some turkish tribes are actually of Kurdish origin in Azerbaijan.

The immigration from Anatolia was mostly filled with kind of outcasts/low class or poor turkmen nomads or other people (kurds for example). Ive read a study about it that concluded it wasnt just because of religious reasons but also socio-economic. This also showed in the Safavid rebellions inside of Ottoman-Empire (Şahkulu-rebellion for example).
08-21-2020, 12:22 PM
Leto

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyp

Btw. to get back to the prior discussion: if you search the documents for most turkic tribes in Azerbaijan/Iran (Azerbaijani DNA Project does that) they will lead to Anatolian origin. So I guess the completion of turkification of Azerbaijan was the Aq Qoyunlu/Kara Qoyunlu (14th/15th century) and the following Safavid period. Prior to it turkish was mostly one of many influential languages in that region.

Another thing they found out: It turned out Aq qoyunlu were allies with some Kurds. Some turkish tribes are actually of Kurdish origin in Azerbaijan.

The immigration from Anatolia was mostly filled with kind of outcasts/low class or poor turkmen nomads or other people (kurds for example). Ive read a study about it that concluded it wasnt just because of religious reasons but also socio-economic. This also showed in the Safavid rebellions inside of Ottoman-Empire (Şahkulu-rebellion for example).

So basically Azerbaijan has recent Anatolian ancestry. Then it should go like this: Qafqaz -> Iran -> Oghuz -> Anatolia.
08-21-2020, 12:23 PM
Leto

This is a very well preserved specimen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

Turkmen from Northern Turkmenistan (originally posted a couple of years ago by Kaspias)

Code:

Y-DNA: Q-L53 mt-DNA: U2c1 Gedrosia 14.13 Siberian 18.60 Northwest_African - Southeast_Asian - Atlantic_Med 5.17 North_European 15.33 South_Asian 2.82 East_African - Southwest_Asian 2.37 East_Asian 22.83 Caucasus 18.74 Sub_Saharan - Target: TM Distance: 2.7315% / 2.73149393 | ADC: 0.25x 45.6 Karakalpak 21.0 Nogais 19.2 Turkmen_Uzbekistan 11.6 Hazara 2.6 Mongol
08-21-2020, 12:25 PM
Kyp

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leto

So basically Azerbaijan has recent Anatolian ancestry. Then it should go like this: Qafqaz -> Iran -> Oghuz -> Anatolia.

Yes but recent Anatolian admixture would still be only 5-10% on average. Also how foreign was that admixture to begin with?
08-21-2020, 12:47 PM
Aren

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyp

Doesn't the 29% Iranian proofs what Kaspias was trying to say? Anyway I believe M2196 is a good (medieval period) proxy escpecially for Azerbaijanis since most of their turkic ancestry is from Anatolian Turks from 15th century.

We don’t know from which period they are from, since I they weren’t carbon dated.
Either way it doesn’t matter, a sample that scores that much native Anatolian and Iranian isn’t going to be a good proxy for actual medieval Turkic input, the other sample is the most logical one to use since she was actually found in Anatolia and looks like a transplant from Central Asia. Anything else is speculation.
08-22-2020, 05:05 PM
Leto

Georgian (presumably Gurian judging by the surname)
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...iew%29.svg.png

Population
Gedrosia 17.70 Pct
Siberian -
Northwest_African 1.10 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 5.98 Pct
North_European 10.00 Pct
South_Asian 1.35 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 8.21 Pct
East_Asian 0.68 Pct
Caucasus 54.98 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Manana
3.95861087 Turk_Ahiska
5.20112488 Georgian_Gurian
5.20566999 Abkhazian
5.76084195 Georgian_Imereti
6.69208488 Georgian_Turkey
7.03962357 Laz
7.30020548 Georgian_Mingrelian
7.31261923 Hemshin
7.35807040 Georgian_Svan
7.56132925 Georgian_Adjara

Target: Manana
Distance: 2.1625% / 2.16247591 | ADC: 0.5x
58.6 Turk_Ahiska
25.2 Georgian_Gurian
16.2 Abkhazian

Target: Manana
Distance: 1.0906% / 1.09056167 | ADC: 0.25x
39.8 Georgian_Gurian
39.8 Turk_Ahiska
15.4 Abkhazian
2.6 Samaritians
1.2 Ashkenazy_Jews
0.8 Pulliyar
0.4 Mozabite
08-22-2020, 10:10 PM
Leto

Found some curious kit, wonder what she could possibly be. A mix of Dagestan and Afghanistan? :icon_ask:

Gedrosia 27.84 Pct
Siberian 3.32 Pct
Northwest_African -
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 4.67 Pct
North_European 16.82 Pct
South_Asian 9.57 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 4.50 Pct
East_Asian 2.84 Pct
Caucasus 30.44 Pct
Sub_Saharan -

Distance to: Marina
9.48784486 Iran_Khorasan
10.26712715 Turkmens
10.42632246 Turkmen_Iran
10.72367474 Yagnobi
11.21394667 Tajik_Balanovsky2019
12.29712975 Iran_Central_East
12.49862392 Lezgin
13.60998898 Azerbaijani_Dagestan
13.70540040 Qumuq
13.91079796 Tabasaran

Target: Marina
Distance: 1.4608% / 1.46076454 | ADC: 0.25x
37.4 AFG_Tajik
32.2 Avar_Dagestan
22.8 Iran_Khorasan
6.4 Lezgin
1.2 North_Ossetians

Target: Marina
Distance: 2.6119% / 2.61193695 | ADC: 0.5x
36.2 Iran_Khorasan
24.2 AFG_Tajik
16.8 Avar_Dagestan
9.8 Avar
9.8 Yagnobi
2.6 Lezgin
0.6 Tajik_Balanovsky2019

Eurogenes K13:
53.6% Afghan_Pashtun + 46.4% Kumyk @ 1.38
08-23-2020, 09:30 AM
Leto

Armenian with some recent additional European/Steppe ancestry

Gedrosia 13.08 Pct
Siberian -
Northwest_African 2.05 Pct
Southeast_Asian -
Atlantic_Med 10.37 Pct
North_European 13.01 Pct
South_Asian 1.53 Pct
East_African -
Southwest_Asian 12.51 Pct
East_Asian -
Caucasus 47.23 Pct
Sub_Saharan 0.23 Pct

Target: Mikayel
Distance: 2.1790% / 2.17904454 | ADC: 0.25x
46.8 Armenian_East
20.0 Adygei
16.4 Lebanese
11.8 Bulgarian
2.4 Samaritians
1.6 Ashkenazy_Jews
1.0 Balkan_Gypsy

HarappaWorld:
1 82.4% armenian (yunusbayev) + 17.6% ukranian (yunusbayev) @ 1.56
2 83.8% armenian (yunusbayev) + 16.2% belorussian (behar) @ 1.73
3 85.4% armenian (yunusbayev) + 14.6% lithuanian (behar) @ 1.77
4 80.8% armenian (yunusbayev) + 19.2% slovenian (xing) @ 1.78
5 80.6% armenian (yunusbayev) + 19.4% hungarian (behar) @ 2

Eurogenes K13:
1 85.7% Armenian + 14.3% Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 1.82
2 87.5% Armenian + 12.5% Lithuanian @ 1.86
3 86.5% Armenian + 13.5% Russian_Smolensk @ 1.96
4 86% Armenian + 14% Southwest_Russian @ 2.07
5 87.7% Armenian + 12.3% Estonian @ 2.12

I'd guess he has one Slavic great-grandparent or something like that. It's misread as North Caucasian and Balkan by Dodecad.
08-23-2020, 11:15 AM
Kyp

Azerbaijani from Baku

Gedrosian: 20.08
Siberian: 3.43
Northwest_African: 0.00
Southeast_Asian: 0.00
Atlantic_Med: 6.55
North_European: 10.03
South_Asian 4.03
East_African 0.68
Southwest_Asian: 12.37
East_Asian: 4.07
Caucasian: 38.66
SSA: 0.11

Distance to: AzRep
3.36694223 Azerbaijani
4.00522159 Azerbaijani_Iran
4.17481736 Azerbaijani_Turkey
5.58977638 Turk_Southeast
7.31131999 Kurd_Kurmanji
7.69141079 Turk_South
7.87506190 Zaza
7.94428726 Turk_Central_East
7.94729514 Talysh_Azerbaijan
8.17282081 Turkmen_Iraq
8.30949457 Kurd_Sorani
8.76243117 Turk_Central_Black_Sea
9.19873361 Turk_Anatolia
9.59172560 Turk_Central_West
9.85240072 Turk_East
10.19831849 Azerbaijani_Dagestan
10.44301202 Iranian_Fars
10.51680084 Iran_Khorasan
10.54890990 Iranian
10.81289508 Kurd_KAZ
10.84321908 Lur_Iran
11.04334641 Kurd
11.16937330 Iran_Central_East
11.29023915 Kurds
11.51116415 Turk_Southwest

Target: AzRep
Distance: 1.7035% / 1.70348729 | ADC: 0.25x
74.4 Azerbaijani
8.2 Iran_Central_East
5.4 North_Ossetians
5.0 Nogais
3.6 Iran_Khorasan
2.8 Yemen_Jews
0.6 Pulliyar

Her son who is half Armenian:

Gedrosian: 19.57
Siberian: 1.04
Northwest_African: 0.00
Southeast_Asian: 0.00
Atlantic_Med: 8.56
North_European: 8.94
South_Asian 2.15
East_African 0.37
Southwest_Asian: 11.97
East_Asian: 1.74
Caucasian: 45.46
SSA: 0.17

Distance to: Armenian+Azrep
3.36190422 Turk_East
6.03840211 Azerbaijani_Turkey
6.21774879 Zaza
6.92239843 Armenian_East
7.39645861 Azerbaijani_Iran
7.59192334 Talysh_Azerbaijan
7.61303487 Azerbaijani
7.97735545 Kurd_Kurmanji
8.34722109 Uzbekistan_Jews
8.40778806 Turk_Central_East
8.47757630 Turk_Ahiska
8.50562167 Turk_Southeast
9.54864388 Turkmen_Iraq
9.56565732 Armenian_West
9.56821300 Kurd_KAZ
10.01980539 Kurd_Sorani
10.27171359 Kurds
10.35411995 Turk_Central_Black_Sea
11.03787117 Turk_South
11.11405866 Turk_East_Black_Sea
11.55491670 Kurd
11.60319353 Iranian
11.60617508 Turk_Anatolia
11.64371934 Assyrian
11.65131752 Turk_Central_West

Target: Armenian+Azrep
Distance: 1.1974% / 1.19736297 | ADC: 0.25x
31.8 Armenian_East
24.4 Azerbaijani_Turkey
15.6 Turk_Ahiska
11.8 Azerbaijani
9.6 Azerbaijani_Dagestan
3.2 Talysh_Azerbaijan
2.8 Uzbekistan_Jews
0.6 Circassian
0.2 Pulliyar

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