Indigenous Balkan I2a1 in southern Albania

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03-03-2017, 12:57 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

Single individuals sharing Y-DNA doesn't mean anything. I am E-V13 and it doesn't make me an Albanian.

There is zero evidence that I2 was brought by Slavic-speakers to the Balkans... only wannabe smart-asses who try to sell their opinions off as facts. Don't believe them.

All the proof is there in the link, I checked it.

There is no diversity in "I2-din" clades of the Balkans, it expanded in the area recently thanks to the founder effect.
03-03-2017, 02:34 AM
Dema

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

Single individuals sharing Y-DNA doesn't mean anything. I am E-V13 and it doesn't make me an Albanian.

There is zero evidence that I2 was brought by Slavic-speakers to the Balkans... only wannabe smart-asses who try to sell their opinions off as facts. Don't believe them.

What Skerdi told you is correct Loki. It has been calculated that all people bearing I2a1b M423 known as Dinaric come out of a single man who lived only 2200 years ago. And countries over the Carpathian mountains like Poland have more variations then Balkan does. So this is strongest proof that it has come with Slavs. Even tho there are some smaller proofs also like this haplo is not found West of Rhine river where Slavs have not intruded.

formed 5300 ybp, TMRCA 2200 ybp

So yes, it has come with Slavs. And even Serbs and everybody actually agrees on this.
Except Laberia :D
03-03-2017, 02:37 AM
geffao

Teoricamente não 3 15
03-03-2017, 02:41 AM
Ranger0075

Interesting
03-03-2017, 02:45 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scholarios Chiotis

It is not an accusation or something, I have said similar things about Greeks. I am sure the ethnic symbiosis and assimilation was/is as complicated in Albania as anywhere else.

No, it's not true. We are two neighbouring countries, but not with the same story. The invasion of Greece from foreign population is documented. It's also documented the assimilation of this population and the invention of greek nation. You have to answer to my question, what happened to all this slavs in South Albania?
03-03-2017, 02:47 AM
Dick

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skerdilaid

Ok, I checked again and the inconsistency seems to be with the calculator that calculates x and y axis: http://gen3553.pagesperso-orange.fr/ADN/K15.htm

I basically retried my results again just to see how accurate they are and it placed me on the same spot where Xhak Bauer and Kurt are. What we are seeing there is two sub-clusters because they were done at different times. Don't waste your time with it, Saf.

It's an old calculator and a plot made by someone that didn't even invent that calculator. Petalpusher makes good calcs and plotting maps, at least he used to for TA members.
03-03-2017, 02:48 AM
Scholarios

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loki

Looks more like Sarmato-Scythians then.

Irrelevant. Sarmato-scythians didn't settle balkans in the millions, bringing their language and culture with them. Them were the Slavs who did that. i.e. Slavs brought it. So a Slavicized Sarmato-Scythian descendant who crossed the Daunbe in 670AD is the ancestor of all them I2a1b Croats, Bosnians, and Tosks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

No, it's not true. We are two neighbouring countries, but not with the same story. The invasion of Greece from foreign population is documented. It's also documented the assimilation of this population and the invention of greek nation. You have to answer to my question, what happened to all this slavs in South Albania?

I've answered you several times. It's not my problem you swallowed the shit sandwich your national propaganda served you and has directed you to look outward instead of inward. Block-headed Balkan bastard.
03-03-2017, 02:54 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dema

What Skerdi told you is correct Loki. It has been calculated that all people bearing I2a1b M423 known as Dinaric come out of a single man who lived only 2200 years ago. And countries over the Carpathian mountains like Poland have more variations then Balkan does. So this is strongest proof that it has come with Slavs. Even tho there are some smaller proofs also like this haplo is not found West of Rhine river where Slavs have not intruded.

formed 5300 ybp, TMRCA 2200 ybp

So yes, it has come with Slavs. And even Serbs and everybody actually agrees on this.
Except Laberia :D

I don't know what is an haplogroup, do you understand? I don't know genetics. But what is nonsense is that using a sample of 104 persons and latter say that 23 of the population is of slavic origine is stupid. Do you understand this? We don't know from which part of South Albania are this people. You have to put this data now and confront with history. Genetics can not take the place of history.
03-03-2017, 03:00 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scholarios Chiotis

Irrelevant. Sarmato-scythians didn't settle balkans in the millions, bringing their language and culture with them. Them were the Slavs who did that. i.e. Slavs brought it. So a Slavicized Sarmato-Scythian descendant who crossed the Daunbe in 670AD is the ancestor of all them I2a1b Croats, Bosnians, and Tosks.

I've answered you several times. It's not my problem you swallowed the shit sandwich your national propaganda served you and has directed you to look outward instead of inward. Block-headed Balkan bastard.

It's not problem of propaganda. You have this possibility to debunk this propaganda. You can not sell me as pure gold a test of 104 persons and decide later for an entire population. You can change your mirror with gold, but not with me.
03-03-2017, 03:01 AM
Scholarios

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

I don't know what is an haplogroup, do you understand? I don't know genetics. But what is nonsense is that using a sample of 104 persons and latter say that 23 of the population is of slavic origine is stupid. Do you understand this? We don't know from which part of South Albania are this people. You have to put this data now and confront with history. Genetics can not take the place of history.

Poor little guy. Are you I2a1b? That's nice. It's not all bad. I imagine your great great grand-pappy looked like this Russian fella:

http://www.surrogatefinder.com/Photo...29cd1e7ea1.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

It's not problem of propaganda. You have this possibility to debunk this propaganda. You can not sell me as pure gold a test of 104 persons and decide later for an entire population. You can change your mirror with gold, but not with me.

What- you think they are going to test all of albania and kosovo? shithead. Look at the Albanian family tree DNA projects. History supports the settlement of Slavs in Epirus too. Duh.

But this is good. Step 1 in your journey to being a human-being: Self Knowledge.
03-03-2017, 03:04 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scholarios Chiotis

Poor little guy. Are you I2a1b? That's nice. It's not all bad. I imagine your great great grand-pappy looked like this Russian fella:

http://www.surrogatefinder.com/Photo...29cd1e7ea1.jpg

Scholarios, this is trolling. You can continue with this story but until now you have made here only a big shit. No sane person take seriously your claim.
03-03-2017, 03:08 AM
Scholarios

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

Scholarios, this is trolling. You can continue with this story but until now you have made here only a big shit. No sane person take seriously your claim.

Every Albanian in this thread has told you the same thing. Not only Abubu, but also Dema, Skerdiliad, Xhak Bauer etc. And Dick the Serb. Only you and Loki (who is trolling) honestly say this. If I2 is some kind of Illyrian haplo, then that is fucking hilarious- because it means Serbs and Croats and North Greeks are more Illyrian than any Tosk or Gheg. LOL

http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg
03-03-2017, 03:16 AM
Wrong

Laberia.

I know that you Labs are reputed for your hard-headed stubbornness, but it is time to realize the truth as everybody has been telling you here, I2a1b and R1a in the Balkans are completely of Slavonic origins.

Dwarven Lab battalion with the 'Stubborn' rule:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...s/DSC00095.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...451e2861ec.jpg
03-03-2017, 03:17 AM
Lek

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick

It's an old calculator and a plot made by someone that didn't even invent that calculator. Petalpusher makes good calcs and plotting maps, at least he used to for TA members.

Petalpusher plotted me and nilotik very nice when I look at our gedmatch components. I'm guessing Kurgan will plot slightly south of me or south west of me and fustan. Somewhere in that place. Kurt will plot somewhere close too I believe. Maybe slightly south of me. Same with Dema. He probably plot the same. We will plot close in that circle if done correctly.

Some of those probably are correct. As I believe skerdi did plot me same as petalpusher before.I
03-03-2017, 03:38 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by IceT

Petalpusher plotted me and nilotik very nice when I look at our gedmatch components. I'm guessing Kurgan will plot slightly south of me or south west of me and fustan. Somewhere in that place. Kurt will plot somewhere close too I believe. Maybe slightly south of me. Same with Dema. He probably plot the same. We will plot close in that circle if done correctly.

Some of those probably are correct. As I believe skerdi did plot me same as petalpusher before.I

That's right. This new plotting map caught me by surprise, since I've always been somewhere in the midst of Ghegnian plotting prior to this.

Was good to know that myself and the other newly added Albanians were plotting wrongly by far afterall, mistakes do happen. :D

Would be great if Skerdi/Saf adds a new map with with all Albanian plot results under the same algorithms, later on.
03-03-2017, 03:54 AM
Lek

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

That's right. This new plotting map caught me by surprise, since I've always been somewhere in the midst of Ghegnian plotting prior to this.

Was good to know that myself and the other newly added Albanians were plotting wrongly by far afterall, mistakes do happen. :D

Would be great if Skerdi/Saf adds a new map with with all Albanian plot results under the same algorithms, later on.

I'm working on getting a new map done. I've collected so far several k15 calcs. Can you send me skerdis kit nr and fustans if you
got

You and ylla get a lot of east med btw.

My estimation where we will plot is just a guess :p
03-03-2017, 03:58 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by IceT

I'm working on getting a new map done. I've collected so far several k15 calcs. Can you send me skerdis kit nr and fustans if you
got

You and ylla get a lot of east med btw.

My estimation where we will plot is just a guess :p

Ah cool. I don't have their kit numbers, I'll ask Fustan and send to you, Skerdi will prolly PM it to you.

Yes. In my case some extra East Med shouldn't be too surprising considering one grandparent is from Ohrid, quite south.

Still I didn't get additional Slavonic-like admixture such as Baltic & East Euro, it's in line with most other Ghegs. Not that I wouldn't mind it, I wouldn't mind at all marrying some other ethnicity provided there's mutual love in play. Primarily I would choose a Gheg waifu, of course.

Only been at Ohrid twice in my lifetime, but it's absolutely stunning:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-GYApZDrr81...landscapes.jpg
http://travel2macedonia.com.mk/image...tery-ohrid.jpg

http://www.exploringmacedonia.com/co...ipality%20.jpg
03-03-2017, 04:06 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

Laberia.

I know that you Labs are reputed for your hard-headed stubbornness, but it is time to realize the truth as everybody has been telling you here, I2a1b and R1a in the Balkans are completely of Slavonic origins.

Dwarven Lab battalion with the 'Stubborn' rule:

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c1...s/DSC00095.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...451e2861ec.jpg

OK, since Scholarios don't want to elaborate his theory i am going to ask you. Where are all this slavs?
03-03-2017, 04:08 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scholarios Chiotis

Every Albanian in this thread has told you the same thing. Not only Abubu, but also Dema, Skerdiliad, Xhak Bauer etc. And Dick the Serb. Only you and Loki (who is trolling) honestly say this. If I2 is some kind of Illyrian haplo, then that is fucking hilarious- because it means Serbs and Croats and North Greeks are more Illyrian than any Tosk or Gheg. LOL

http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/DBFs52N.jpg

Scholarios, first of all you have not a theory. Do you have one? Tell me.
03-03-2017, 04:08 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

OK, since Scholarios don't want to elaborate his theory i am going to ask you. Where are all this slavs?

You will know this once you learn how direct patrilineal lines work.
03-03-2017, 04:10 AM
Lek

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

Ah cool. I don't have their kit numbers, I'll ask Fustan and send to you, Skerdi will prolly PM it to you.

Yes. In my case some extra East Med shouldn't be too surprising considering one grandparent is from Ohrid, quite south.

Still I didn't get additional Slavonic-like admixture such as Baltic & East Euro, it's in line with most other Ghegs. Not that I wouldn't mind it, I wouldn't mind at all marrying some other ethnicity provided there's mutual love in play. Primarily I would choose a Gheg waifu, of course.

I just realised what nilotik had sent me wasn't his k15 but it was something close but will fix that. Got his kit nr. It's almost ready to be made. I will ask deburgh to do it. . Got some Greek and Albanian users. Skerdi and fustan will be added later.
03-03-2017, 04:11 AM
Wrong

. .
03-03-2017, 04:13 AM
Dick

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

. .

I concur.
03-03-2017, 04:13 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

You will know this once you learn how direct patrilineal lines work.

I don't know this, i am waiting you to explain. My question id simple and nobody from you want to answer:
Where the fuck are this slavs in South Albania? Do you have an answer?
03-03-2017, 04:14 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick

I concur.

Doppelpost accident
03-03-2017, 04:14 AM
Dick

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

Where the fuck are this slavs in South Albania? Do you have an answer?

In your ballsack, semen, cum, snps etc
03-03-2017, 04:15 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

I don't know this, i am waiting you to explain. My question id simple and nobody from you want to answer:
Where the fuck are this slavs in South Albania? Do you have an answer?

https://imgflip.com/s/meme/X-Everywhere.jpg
03-03-2017, 04:16 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick

In your ballsack, semen, cum, snps etc

When and how this mixing happened?
03-03-2017, 04:16 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

https://imgflip.com/s/meme/X-Everywhere.jpg

OK, you don't have an answer.
03-03-2017, 04:16 AM
Lek

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

I don't know this, i am waiting you to explain. My question id simple and nobody from you want to answer:
Where the fuck are this slavs in South Albania? Do you have an answer?

Assimilated. Just like normans were in north
03-03-2017, 04:17 AM
Dick

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

When and how this mixing happened?

Dude, everyone in the Balkans were fucking together before the Ottomans divided everyone via religious lines. Nobody cared!
03-03-2017, 04:17 AM
Laberia

Guys, Scholarios is a retard and this is a fact. I invite you, don't follow his example.
03-03-2017, 04:23 AM
Wrong

There is this I2a2 clade that exists among Albanians, but it has nothing to do with I2a1b-Din. There was an Albanian from FYROM that had this NW Euro clade.

I2a1b-Din is the one in huge % and was definitely brought by Slavic speakers & perhaps Vlachs to Toskeria.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Iirk_VViZhw/maxresdefault.jpg
03-03-2017, 04:37 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by IceT

Assimilated. Just like normans were in north

When happened this process and how? Hope that you can explain this story.
03-03-2017, 04:38 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick

Dude, everyone in the Balkans were fucking together before the Ottomans divided everyone via religious lines. Nobody cared!

Not exactly.
03-03-2017, 04:39 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

Not exactly.

They did, otherwise we would all be inbred. Fresh blood to the genepool is good.
03-03-2017, 04:40 AM
Lek

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laberia

When happened this process and how? Hope that you can explain this story.

Historical records. Search it up.
03-03-2017, 04:42 AM
Dick

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xhak Bauër

There is this I2a2 clade that exists among Albanians, but it has nothing to do with I2a1b-Din. There was an Albanian from FYROM that had this NW Euro clade.

I2a1b-Din is the one in huge % and was definitely brought by Slavic speakers & perhaps Vlachs to Toskeria.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Iirk_VViZhw/maxresdefault.jpg

Could've come with slavs too :heh:

http://dnk.poreklo.rs/tabela-pojedin...-filter=I2M223
03-03-2017, 04:45 AM
Laberia

Quote:

Originally Posted by IceT

Historical records. Search it up.

I can not search to prove your theory. It's you who have to prove your theory. This is what I am asking to this retard Scholarios. Prove it. There is no serious scholar in the world who deal with all the crap of genetics posted here. Do you understand?
So, bring us this historical records.
03-03-2017, 04:46 AM
Wrong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dick

Could've come with slavs too :heh:

http://dnk.poreklo.rs/tabela-pojedin...-filter=I2M223

Slavs, Normans, Saxons, Celts, Norse, Goths, Huns, Boogars :D

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