Slavic G25 (ancient) calculator

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

I forget, your father's coordinates were created using the method that utilizes yours and also your mother's coordinates, right?

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Yes, I think by me if I remember well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

I forget, your father's coordinates were created using the method that utilizes yours and also your mother's coordinates, right?

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Yup, Lucas did it using that method. I think someone used that approach for your father if I remember correctly. One of these days I'll get him tested for real.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daco Celtic

Yup, Lucas did it using that method. I think someone used that approach for your father if I remember correctly. One of these days I'll get him tested for real.

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Yup, Kaspias made my father's that same way. I think it's the premium method for phasing a parent.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

Yup, Kaspias made my father's that same way. I think it's the premium method for phasing a parent.

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The best and also simple if you use spreadsheet. Manually it is quite time consuming (at first I did it that way).

But it is still aproximation. For example my father or mother artificial results have about 70-80% accuracy ( I have their real raw datas for both to compare).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lucas

The best and also simple if you use spreadsheet. Manually it is quite time consuming (at first I did it that way).

But it is still aproximation. For example my father or mother artificial results have about 70-80% accuracy ( I have their real raw datas for both to compare).

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What about when parental admixture has less overlap, does accuracy go up? I think I have seen some plots where people who have parents of the same ethnicity (i.e. both Polish) do not plot exactly between them. But people who have 2 different parental admixes, like me and Daco, plot more precisely between them. I could be wrong, I've only seen a few cases including myself.

Gijaxo told me he does in fact plot right between his parents on G25 (but not on Eurogenes), which I find quite interesting.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

What about when parental admixture has less overlap, does accuracy go up? I think I have seen some plots where people who have parents of the same ethnicity (i.e. both Polish) do not plot exactly between them, but people who have 2 parental admixes, like me and Daco, plot more between them. I could be wrong, I've only seen a few cases including myself.

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Yes I don't plot between parents, we create a flattened triangle:)
I think it is true, more distant parental admixtures, more you are exactly between them on PCA.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lucas

Yes I don't plot between parents, we create a flattened triangle:)
I think it is true, more distant parental admixtures, more you are exactly between them on PCA.

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Sorry, I added this comment to my above post after you responded:


Gijaxo told me he does in fact plot right between his parents on G25 (but not on Eurogenes), which I find quite interesting.

Any idea why it works for him on G25 but not GEDmatch?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

Sorry, I added this comment to my above post after you responded:


Gijaxo told me he does in fact plot right between his parents on G25 (but not on Eurogenes), which I find quite interesting.

Any idea why it works for him on G25 but not GEDmatch?

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If this Gedmatch calc is from Eurogenes also?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lucas

If this Gedmatch calc is from Eurogenes also?

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I believe so.

I have used a simplistic method of phasing my father on Eurogenes, and you and I used it for K36, where we assumed I plot halfway between my parents on each component, creating a basic kit from that. Well, I was showing that in a thread and gixajo made the statement that he plots exactly between his parents on G25, but not GEDmatch. I assume he meant Eurogenes as that was what I was talking about. In fact, I'm just guessing, but he may have been referencing that old K15 PCA.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr.G

I believe so.

I have used a simplistic method of phasing my father on Eurogenes, and you and I used it for K36, where we assumed I plot halfway between my parents on each component, creating a basic kit from that. Well, I was showing that in a thread and gixajo made the statement that he plots exactly between his parents on G25, but not GEDmatch. I assume he meant Eurogenes as that was what I was talking about. In fact, I'm just guessing, but he may have been referencing that old K15 PCA.

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If it is K15 PCA from Tolan it is not the same PCA you can create in PAST for example (Tolan has his own method which I can't understand). So he could have different position here and there.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyp

all calculatore can be flawed for someone. For example on k13 my mother is far too close to Austria because she has high Baltic score (look at my signature). On k15 she is far away from Austria becuase Baltic + East European gets split. She even is closer to Northern Germany than to Austria on k15. But on k13 its the closest distance.

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K13 is trash -- K15 splits Atlantic and North Sea and Batlic and East European which is better. On K13 it says my closest population is 'Irish' and K15 says "English". That is a big difference since the Irish are Celtic and the English are Germanic. It's a mentally retarded contradiction.

This is the truth, for me, so far, at least until more middle ages samples are released for G25 :

Target: KevinG_scaled
Distance: 1.9624% / 0.01962356
42.8 England_IA
32.0 ISL_Viking_Age_Pre_Christian
25.2 SVK_Poprad_MA

England Iron Age is basically Celtic, Iceland Viking is mostly Germanic and Slovakia Poprad is Germanic because during this time period it was inhabited by Germanic tribes. Poprad used to be called Deutschendorf .

I don't like this calculator, in this thread, for what should be obvious reasons :

Target: Kevin_scaled
Distance: 3.5674% / 0.03567384 | ADC: 0.25x
87.8 Germanic
11.2 Balkan
0.6 Turkic
0.4 Finnic

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stearsolina

Run with 0.25X please.

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Target: Nurzat
Distance: 1.1677% / 0.01167709 | ADC: 0.25x
27.8 Scythian_HUN: DA195
25.4 RUS_Sunghir_MA:Sunghir6
15.6 CZE_Early_Slav:RISE569
8.2 Iberia_Northeast_c.6CE_PL:I12031
6.0 HUN_MA_Szolad:SZ18
3.6 ARM_LBA:RISE397
3.2 Bell_Beaker_Bavaria:I5017
3.2 Scythian_UKR:MJ35
3.0 IND_Roopkund_B:I3404
1.6 Scythian_MDA:scy197
1.4 HUN_Avar_Szolad:Av1
1.0 TUR_Ikiztepe_LC:IKI002


Target: Nurzat
Distance: 1.5821% / 0.01582098 | ADC: 0.5x
40.8 Scythian_HUN: DA195
21.6 CZE_Early_Slav:RISE569
16.6 Iberia_Northeast_c.6CE_PL:I12031
11.6 RUS_Sunghir_MA:Sunghir6
3.2 HUN_Avar_Szolad:Av1
2.6 HUN_MA_Szolad:SZ18
2.2 Scythian_UKR:MJ35
1.4 HUN_Prescythian_IA:IR1

Target: Bosniensis_scaled
Distance: 1.9283% / 0.01928339 | ADC: 0.25x
56.6 Slavic
24.4 Greco-Roman
19.0 Balkan

This makes sense:

So Pre-Slavic populace was Greco-Roman+Native (Balkan)

Now we are 50% Slavic + 50% (Greco-Roman+Native)

Code:

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Target: Viriato_scaled
Distance: 3.5420% / 0.03541953
49.8        Celtic
25.4        Greco-Roman
24.8        Balkan

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Code:

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Distance to:        Viriato_scaled
0.05071065        Balkan
0.05128532        Balkan
0.05189892        Balkan
0.05474916        Celtic
0.06280636        Balkan
0.06712573        Celtic
0.08219571        Balkan
0.08529823        Germanic
0.09902430        Greco-Roman
0.10011045        Slavic
0.10027099        Greco-Roman
0.11238118        Slavic
0.11461071        Slavic
0.15930931        Baltic
0.18158645        Baltic
0.18554612        Baltic
0.23577573        Finnic
0.24460771        Turkic
0.25258231        Turkic

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Target: Endovelicus_scaled
Distance: 4.2807% / 0.04280654 | ADC: 0.25x
58.6 Celtic
34.2 Greco-Roman
7.2 Balkan

Code:

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Distance to:        Endovelicus_scaled
0.05634331        Balkan
0.05642168        Balkan
0.06051921        Celtic
0.06178605        Balkan
0.06605726        Balkan
0.07740635        Celtic
0.08305121        Balkan
0.09077523        Germanic
0.09414643        Greco-Roman
0.09758891        Greco-Roman
0.10616156        Slavic
0.12087957        Slavic
0.12431277        Slavic
0.16597611        Baltic
0.18959178        Baltic
0.19212771        Baltic
0.23915380        Finnic
0.24594289        Turkic
0.25434767        Turkic

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Distance to: cpalscaled
0.04450023 Germanic
0.04766961 Slavic
0.05292540 Celtic
0.06136246 Slavic
0.07037031 Slavic
0.07056659 Celtic
0.07266952 Balkan
0.07655583 Balkan
0.08497456 Balkan
0.08664117 Balkan
0.10998655 Baltic
0.12089803 Balkan
0.13326320 Baltic
0.13450562 Baltic
0.13934307 Greco-Roman
0.14587890 Greco-Roman
0.19978616 Finnic
0.23798754 Turkic
0.24059108 Turkic

Target: cpalscaled
Distance: 2.8591% / 0.02859093 | ADC: 0.25x RC
34.2 Germanic
32.0 Slavic
31.0 Balkan
2.8 Finnic

More Slavic than I thought I would be xD

Target: 7.62x39_scaled
Distance: 2.4135% / 0.02413463
41.4 Baltic
26.0 Balkan
18.6 Slavic
8.4 Turkic
5.6 Greco-Roman





Distance to: 7.62x39_scaled
0.03469591 Slavic
0.03963463 Slavic
0.03999490 Slavic
0.06700094 Germanic
0.07569013 Celtic
0.08113270 Baltic
0.09648216 Balkan
0.10037287 Baltic
0.10041860 Celtic
0.10315555 Balkan
0.10652194 Baltic
0.11275955 Balkan
0.11425229 Balkan
0.14415820 Balkan
0.15744085 Greco-Roman
0.16826906 Greco-Roman
0.18332811 Finnic
0.22906272 Turkic
0.22949952 Turkic

Target: Polak_scaled
Distance: 3.1557% / 0.03155718
46.2 Baltic
28.4 Slavic
15.4 Germanic
10.0 Balkan

1/8 russian ancestry

Target: RA_scaled
Distance: 5.1016% / 0.05101551 | ADC: 0.25x RC

86.4 Greco-Roman
11.2 Baltic
2.4 Turkic

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stearsolina

Suprised Finns are scoring little Slavic in this.


Target: Finnish_East
Distance: 1.5728% / 0.01572783 | ADC: 0.25x

44.0 Baltic
31.0 Finnic
20.4 Germanic
4.6 Slavic

Target: Finnish
Distance: 1.4784% / 0.01478370 | ADC: 0.25x

34.2 Baltic
32.4 Germanic
21.0 Finnic
12.4 Slavic

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It isn't surprising, because the source of Baltic Finns was in Estonia and in the are known today as Pskov Oblast, where also early east Slavs lived.
Finnish science and even Russian mythology tell it without doubt. Another thing has to be commented is that the Finnishness in these tests depends on how it is opted. The genetic distance in Finland is rather big as a result of local admixtures with Saami and genetic drift. Plus that PCA is prone to find differential distances between particular components, even though the results may be weighted. PCA based tests are good as far as Fst distances are small. If they are not the component selections be weird and far from origins of groups.

Edit. Btw, Finns called those early east Slavs as Vends, not Russians.

Target: cakmir7y_scaled
Distance: 1.9137% / 0.01913675
39.8 Slavic
24.4 Balkan
17.2 Baltic
15.6 Celtic
3.0 Finnic


I seem to be quite a mongrel here haha, definitely more balkan than I thought.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cakmir7y

Target: cakmir7y_scaled
Distance: 1.9137% / 0.01913675
39.8 Slavic
24.4 Balkan
17.2 Baltic
15.6 Celtic
3.0 Finnic


I seem to be quite a mongrel here haha, definitely more balkan than I thought.

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Kind of evens itself out with your Baltic and Finnic, doesn't it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cakmir7y

Target: cakmir7y_scaled
Distance: 1.9137% / 0.01913675
39.8 Slavic
24.4 Balkan
17.2 Baltic
15.6 Celtic
3.0 Finnic


I seem to be quite a mongrel here haha, definitely more balkan than I thought.

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It's desinged to be run with 0.25X ACD, with 0 pen it's innacurate.

Target: Gergo_scaled
Distance: 3.4263% / 0.03426273
36.6 Balkan
30.0 Baltic
26.0 Slavic
4.6 Greco-Roman
2.4 Turkic
0.4 Celtic


Target: Gergo_scaled
Distance: 3.5630% / 0.03562975 | ADC: 0.25x RC
77.2 Slavic
22.8 Balkan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Stearsolina

It's desinged to be run with 0.25X ACD, with 0 pen it's innacurate.

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I see, thank you for the correction. I am still learning.


Target: cakmir7y_scaled
Distance: 2.0122% / 0.02012224 | ADC: 0.25x RC
66.4 Slavic
18.6 Celtic
12.2 Balkan
2.2 Finnic
0.6 Germanic

This already looks more reasonable. Still Id expect to be more germanic and less celtic.
You said you only used ancient samples. Im wondering from which period were they?

Target: Milenko_scaled
Distance: 1.8421% / 0.01842136 | ADC: 0.25x RC
50.4 Slavic
38.6 Balkan
11.0 Greco-Roman


Distance to: Milenko_scaled
0.04832703 Balkan
0.05750425 Balkan
0.05757183 Slavic
0.06314450 Celtic
0.06417849 Balkan
0.06471300 Balkan
0.06816514 Celtic
0.07026102 Germanic
0.07479564 Slavic
0.07544494 Slavic
0.09171780 Balkan
0.10724711 Greco-Roman
0.11548168 Greco-Roman
0.12472583 Baltic
0.14863092 Baltic
0.15228700 Baltic
0.21131528 Finnic
0.22910345 Turkic
0.23605416 Turkic

Target: GeniKameni
Distance: 1.1617% / 0.01161705 | ADC: 0.25x RC
53.6 Slavic
25.2 Greco-Roman
21.2 Balkan

Distance to: alexmegas(Romanian)_scaled
0.04667493 Balkan
0.04833384 Balkan
0.05090139 Balkan
0.05320023 Celtic
0.05456860 Balkan
0.06524732 Celtic
0.07134673 Slavic
0.07462273 Germanic
0.08240098 Balkan
0.08459238 Slavic
0.08701556 Slavic
0.09944469 Greco-Roman
0.10467146 Greco-Roman
0.13699200 Baltic
0.16015906 Baltic
0.16066640 Baltic
0.22175651 Finnic
0.23756357 Turkic
0.24527208 Turkic

Target: alexmegas(Romanian)_scaled
Distance: 2.1663% / 0.02166252 | ADC: 0.25x RC
42.2 Slavic
30.0 Greco-Roman
17.6 Balkan
10.2 Celtic

Target: Dušan_g25
Distance: 1.0509% / 0.01050914
51.8 Slavic
33.0 Balkan
10.2 Baltic
3.8 Greco-Roman
1.2 Finnic


Target: Dušan_g25
Distance: 1.0971% / 0.01097084 | ADC: 0.25x RC
68.0 Slavic
32.0 Balkan


Slavic seems bit inflated in 0.25x RC.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cakmir7y

I seem to be quite a mongrel here haha, definitely more balkan than I thought.

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Ali to nije ništa - as we in the Balkans say.

Target: G25noricum_scaled
Distance: 1.8356% / 0.01835593 | ADC: 0.25x RC
42.2 Balkan
31.8 Baltic
11.4 Slavic
11.0 Germanic
3.6 Celtic

Distance to: G25noricum_scaled
0.04296864 Germanic
0.04341445 Slavic
0.04424075 Slavic
0.04924678 Celtic
0.05036160 Slavic
0.07789848 Celtic
0.08345309 Balkan
0.08500978 Balkan
0.08588544 Balkan
0.08952184 Baltic
0.09444629 Balkan
0.11552966 Baltic
0.11689254 Baltic
0.12648572 Balkan
0.14556913 Greco-Roman
0.15339291 Greco-Roman
0.20711074 Finnic
0.24844810 Turkic
0.25010243 Turkic

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dick

I made average for all samples. Le me know if it is different or same. Also try using R program instead of Vahaduo with pen = 0.01 instead of Dist Col 0.25x for example.

Code:

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Slavic,0.1307067,0.125418,0.0709617,0.0548023,0.0353398,0.0204987,0.0086167,0.010884,0.0012953,-0.018163,-0.0006227,-0.0062693,0.0094152,0.0162393,-0.0131648,-0.0027622,0.0039982,-0.0002535,0.0012568,-0.0015633,-0.0007903,-0.0026587,0.008422,-0.0062055,-0.0036127
Celtic,0.128051,0.1469982,0.0592078,0.0198645,0.0473162,-0.0036955,0.0026438,0.0064615,0.0142655,0.02565,-0.0027605,0.0038217,-0.0109635,-0.0054702,3.43e-05,-0.0002648,-0.0022165,-0.0010135,-0.0004082,0.0069098,-0.000967,0.0057498,-0.0009862,-0.005904,-0.0076638
Germanic,0.1223596,0.1303939,0.061169,0.048773,0.039792,0.0199408,0.010975,0.0052151,0.0013295,-0.0024966,-0.003735,0.001109,-0.0091576,-0.0038398,0.0161643,-0.0008352,-0.0133511,0.0032684,0.0041354,0.0040271,0.0060019,0.0037342,-0.0007273,0.011146,-0.00044297
Finnic,0.1044325,-0.036051,0.1057825,0.0792965,-0.0122328,0.008576,0.006169,0.0141918,0.0037328,-0.0303422,0.033046,-0.0083175,0.019772,-0.0182695,-0.0065485,-0.0034805,-3.28e-05,-0.0031672,-0.0073848,0.0008442,0.016658,-0.0018547,-0.0016945,0.004097,0.0008382
Balkan,0.1242948,0.1454576,0.0219609,-0.0209304,0.0280257,-0.0091291,-0.0018095,-0.0004308,0.0046495,0.025416,0.0011531,0.0085724,-0.0165656,-0.0051472,-0.0072882,-0.0015733,0.0054804,0.0019638,0.006243,-0.0079413,-0.0038933,0.0035984,-0.0013271,0.0019118,-0.0048139
Baltic,0.1328567,0.1247033,0.0959075,0.101518,0.050032,0.0416115,0.0128388,0.0187342,-0.0028142,-0.047054,-0.0026255,-0.0208925,0.0301752,0.0349791,-0.0056551,0.0007021,-0.0051359,0.0015229,-0.0007774,-0.0003869,0.0023916,-0.0073366,0.0078833,-0.0164144,0.0046989
Greco-Roman,0.1052743,0.152689,-0.0159294,-0.0611177,0.0130344,-0.0237231,-0.0009327,-0.0035407,0.002921,0.033336,0.0043776,0.0096213,-0.008353,-0.0010681,-0.0122106,-0.005805,0.0123988,0.0020733,0.0068258,-0.0035316,-0.0041542,0.0010294,-0.0037448,0.000329,-7.61e-05
Turkic,0.0782535,-0.0807345,0.0218728,0.0037145,-0.034314,-0.0054383,0.0038775,0.0042693,-0.0137032,-0.010752,-0.014209,-0.004646,-0.0043855,-0.0097712,0.002986,0.0028838,0.003814,0.001172,0.0007228,3.15e-05,-0.0070502,0.0027515,-0.0076108,-0.0011748,0.0016168

---

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58.8 Slavic
38.4 Greco-Roman
2.8 Balkan
too much Greco Roman

Target: Domitius_scaled
Distance: 3.2185% / 0.03218485
69.4 Greco-Roman
30.6 Turkic

With a celtiberian sample:

Target: Beowulf_Scaled
Distance: 0.0151% / 0.01505340 | ADC: 0.25x RC
56.8 Celtiberian
17.3 Germanic
13.4 Slavic
10.3 Greco-Roman
2.2 Celtic

Target: Vitez_newg25
Distance: 0.0117% / 0.01169432 | ADC: 0.25x RC
59.8 Slavic
14.9 Greco-Roman
14.7 Balkan
6.7 Germanic
3.9 Celtic

With the average :

Target: Vitez_newg25
Distance: 0.0126% / 0.01257938 | ADC: 0.25x RC
64.5 Slavic
20.8 Greco-Roman
11.3 Germanic
3.4 Celtic

Target: Mister
Distance: 3.0882% / 0.03088229
43.8 Greco-Roman
34.2 Baltic
12.0 Slavic
10.0 Turkic

Distance to: Mister
0.06378495 Balkan
0.06787961 Slavic
0.08164162 Germanic
0.08421327 Slavic
0.08459410 Balkan
0.08539923 Slavic
0.08939837 Balkan
0.09068351 Balkan
0.09633753 Celtic
0.09729075 Celtic
0.11015827 Greco-Roman
0.11341077 Balkan
0.12428057 Baltic
0.13323849 Greco-Roman
0.15036298 Baltic
0.15223801 Baltic
0.19749495 Finnic
0.20961230 Turkic
0.21772055 Turkic

I've that, what is this well then?

Target: Dušan_scaled
Distance: 1.9699% / 0.01969895
54.0 Slavic
22.2 Greco-Roman
16.4 Balkan
7.4 Baltic


Target: Dušan_scaled
Distance: 1.9872% / 0.01987242 | ADC: 0.25x RC
64.8 Slavic
20.6 Greco-Roman
14.6 Balkan

Target:
Distance: 1.6852% / 0.01685240
86.0 Greco-Roman
8.0 Baltic
6.0 Celtic

Target: Viktor_scaled
Distance: 2.3529% / 0.02352887 | ADC: 0.25x RC
62.6 Slavic
20.2 Greco-Roman
17.2 Balkan

Target: Petalpusher
Distance: 3.1598% / 0.03159826 | ADC: 0.25x RC
63.2 Celtic
21.4 Germanic
10.8 Baltic
4.6 Balkan


Distance to: Petalpusher
0.03967270 Celtic
0.04873747 Germanic
0.05148296 Celtic
0.06963827 Slavic
0.06976159 Balkan
0.07299195 Balkan
0.07760965 Slavic
0.08454460 Balkan
0.08837458 Slavic
0.09073716 Balkan
0.11711095 Balkan
0.12135255 Baltic
0.14375149 Baltic
0.14528038 Greco-Roman
0.14633153 Greco-Roman
0.14782442 Baltic
0.23150126 Finnic
0.27065250 Turkic
0.27339350 Turkic

Target: Vessna_scaled
Distance: 1.8843% / 0.01884302 | ADC: 0.25x RC
78.4 Slavic
21.6 Baltic


Distance to: Vessna_scaled
0.02447558 Slavic
0.03144234 Slavic
0.04601678 Slavic
0.05414280 Baltic
0.06913125 Baltic
0.07335077 Germanic
0.07807162 Baltic
0.08533862 Celtic
0.11936328 Celtic
0.12522857 Balkan
0.12991118 Balkan
0.13459475 Balkan
0.13833324 Balkan
0.17094718 Balkan
0.18424391 Finnic
0.18619771 Greco-Roman
0.19569345 Greco-Roman
0.24478727 Turkic
0.24763628 Turkic