Iranian GEDmatch kits

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomansman

COuld be indian then.

And the ones i suggest being mixed arent the ones with 5-8% SI, im talking about the ones hitting 9%+ SI(but those would probs also be partly indian....not IVC i assume, because i would imagine that admix from such long time ago to be largely washed away and not have that much of an influence in iraqi admix)

You shouldn’t assume that because the Elamite empire lasted till only 2300 years ago and I m guessing many of them fled to S Iraq after that. Admixture easily picks up even 5000 year old ancestry

The other hint is since most of S Iraqis score decent S Indian it must be old and was past down to the present population as they multiplied. A stronger case for new can be made is when only less than 1% of a population has a certain admixture

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomansman

I changed the ones that could be azeris/partly azeris.

But the other ones 100% seems to be from the norht east

High Baloch is the most important indicator for Notheastern ancestry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoro

You shouldn’t assume that because the Elamite empire lasted till only 2300 years ago and I m guessing many of them fled to S Iraq after that. Admixture easily picks up even 5000 year old ancestry

The other hint is since most of S Iraqis score decent S Indian it must be old and was past down to the present population as they multiplied. A stronger case for new can be made is when only less than 1% of a population has a certain admixture

Yeah, could be that. But ones with 10-16% SI do seemed to have indian ancestry to me. Ones below 10% might have saved more of that ancient elamite and IVC admix

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomansman

Yeah, could be that. But ones with 10-16% SI do seemed to have indian ancestry to me. Ones below 10% might have saved more of that ancient elamite and IVC admix

What percentage have 10-16% S Indian?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoro

What percentage have 10-16% S Indian?

I did add two kind of those samples. One getting 10% SI(9,78%) and the other 15,7% SI

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nomansman

I did add two kind of those samples. One getting 10% SI(9,78%) and the other 15,7% SI

I guess the one with 15% likely has some recent ancestry from outside Iraq although I’m wondering if there are pockets like that within S Iraq

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoro

I guess the one with 15% likely has some recent ancestry from outside Iraq although I’m wondering if there are pockets like that within S Iraq

I think that one might have indian ancestry.

I even found two samples having indian ancestry from generations back. One was nephew or child of the latter sample and got like 13% SI, while the other even got 23% SI. Another sample with 7% SI(he was only suspecting though) suspected to have some indian ancestry some time ago.

I guess these types will pop up once a while, but are really uncommon

Quote:

Originally Posted by Negah

Pamirirs are a population isolate rather than a real ethnicity. Their contribution to civilization is like zero. They are interesting as far as genetics is concerned but for some reason, many groups that have been inconsequential historically from these regions get a lot of interest on these boards.

I would say they are interesting because they are the closest population to ancient peoples like the Sogdians and Bactrians. And of course non-Europeans with a large amount of European-like ancestry unrelated to recent colonialism and migrations would be of interest to many people. Linguistically they are also quite unique. Persian dialects are spoken by 100 million people and Pamiri languages are basically endangered.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoro

Wouldn’t make sense because pretty much all the S Iraqi samples I’ve seen score decent S Indian. Can’t be that all S Iraqis are gypsies.

The more sensible explanation is like what kyp pointed out S Iraqis have Elamite ancestry because we knoe that’s where they moved to in addition to further east when they weee attacked ( you know the guys that spoke an extinct dravidian language and had alot of trading relationships with IVC). There could also be additional Indian admixture due to sea trade between persian gulf and India

The whole Eastern part of Iraq has traditionally been part of various persian empires that’s why the genetics in Iraq is different west of Euphrates river

To me S Iraqis even look Indian also

Do you know anything about these times? Unfortunately there is very little known about the times of the arrival of Iranic tribes into Iran. What happened to all the people like Kassites, Gutians, Elamites etc.. Any indication that they were largely assimilated?. I think the only thing that is known is that the Persians (who derived from the Median tribes) went south and sacked Elam. And Elam language remained important under the Persian rulers, so we can assume that most of them were assimilated. Gutians probably got assimilated by the Medes? Or were they early IAryan off-branches like the Mitanni?

Another thing what interests me. Werent the Aryans/Iranics nomadic/pastoralist people similar in culture to the Gutians who were descibed quite barbaric by Mesopotamian sources? So they basically leeched off the Sumer-Elamite suffistication in forming their empires?
So the Parthians remained the culture while Persians and Medes took over Mesopotamian influenced culture.
Some people remained Nomadic in Persian times and frequently attacked Persian and Median cities. Who were they?
There is way too much unknown about Iranian history unfortunately.

The Iranian history is quite similar to those of Anatolia actually. Just thousands of years earlier.

My fathers updated k13 2way oracle:

Code:

[1,] "88.8 % Kurd_Iran + 11.2 % Mari" "3.1059" [2,] "11.6 % Chuvash + 88.4 % Kurd_Iran" "3.267" [3,] "85.5 % Kurd_Iran + 14.5 % Turk_Dobruja-Tatar" "3.2847" [4,] "14.1 % Afghan_Turkmen + 85.9 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.2952" [5,] "75 % Talysh + 25 % Turk_North_West" "3.2957" [6,] "93.4 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 6.6 % Pathan" "3.3917" [7,] "86.8 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 13.2 % Uzbeki" "3.4213" [8,] "12.6 % Crimean_Tatar + 87.4 % Talysh" "3.4365" [9,] "82.9 % Talysh + 17.1 % Turk_Edirne" "3.4467" [10,] "89.5 % Talysh + 10.5 % Turk_Dobruja-Tatar" "3.4511" [11,] "78.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 21.8 % Iran_Centraleast" "3.4778" [12,] "93.8 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 6.2 % Kalash" "3.5186" [13,] "94.5 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 5.5 % Sindhi" "3.5189" [14,] "70.8 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 29.2 % Turkmen" "3.5282" [15,] "17.1 % Crimean_Tatar + 82.9 % Kurd_Iran" "3.5384" [16,] "88.1 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 11.9 % Iran_Bandari" "3.5555" [17,] "94.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 5.8 % Burusho" "3.5922" [18,] "94.8 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 5.2 % Punjabi_Jat" "3.6003" [19,] "95.9 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 4.1 % Gujarati" "3.6052" [20,] "88.8 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 11.2 % Parsi_India" "3.6108" [21,] "82.5 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 17.5 % Turkmen_Uzbekistan" "3.6168" [22,] "96 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 4 % Kshatriya" "3.637" [23,] "91.4 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 8.6 % Shors" "3.6471" [24,] "92.7 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 7.3 % Makrani" "3.6479" [25,] "84.7 % Talysh + 15.3 % Turk_Komotini" "3.6604" [26,] "85.7 % Talysh + 14.3 % Turk_Kardzhali-Mountaineer" "3.6649" [27,] "96.7 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.3 % Velamas" "3.6657" [28,] "7.8 % Afghan_Pashtun + 92.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey" "3.6669" [29,] "96.6 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.4 % Kanjar" "3.6701" [30,] "12.8 % Afghan_Turkmen + 87.2 % Talysh" "3.6892" [31,] "96.6 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.4 % Dharkar" "3.6906" [32,] "96.9 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.1 % North_Kannadi" "3.6917" [33,] "94 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 6 % Brahui" "3.6944" [34,] "87 % Kurd_Iran + 13 % Tatar" "3.7003" [35,] "69.7 % Talysh + 30.3 % Turk_South" "3.7027" [36,] "8.2 % Hakas + 91.8 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.7068" [37,] "84.9 % Talysh + 15.1 % Turk_Kardzhali-South-Plain" "3.707" [38,] "96.8 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.2 % Kurumba" "3.7078" [39,] "96.1 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.9 % Brahmin_UP" "3.7101" [40,] "68.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 31.8 % Talysh" "3.7126" [41,] "94.1 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 5.9 % Balochi" "3.7169" [42,] "97 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3 % Piramalai" "3.7193" [43,] "69.8 % Talysh + 30.2 % Turk_Anatolia" "3.7358" [44,] "96.9 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.1 % Kol" "3.7402" [45,] "97 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3 % Dusadh" "3.7463" [46,] "97.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 2.8 % Chamar" "3.7626" [47,] "96.9 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.1 % Uttar_Pradesh" "3.7681" [48,] "11.6 % Hazara + 88.4 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.7896" [49,] "97.3 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 2.7 % Sakilli" "3.7904" [50,] "96.6 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 3.4 % Bangladeshi" "3.8158" [51,] "12.8 % Aghan_Hazara + 87.2 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.8201" [52,] "97.2 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 2.8 % Chenchu" "3.8238" [53,] "87.4 % Talysh + 12.6 % Turk_Kazanlik" "3.8247" [54,] "85.1 % Talysh + 14.9 % Turk_Kardzhali-Alevi" "3.8314" [55,] "87.2 % Talysh + 12.8 % Turk_Kardzhali-East" "3.8565" [56,] "7.8 % Shors + 92.2 % Talysh" "3.8594" [57,] "6.8 % Ket + 93.2 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.8725" [58,] "9.7 % Karakalpak + 90.3 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.8756" [59,] "90.9 % Talysh + 9.1 % Tatar" "3.8835" [60,] "91.9 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 8.1 % Yagnobi" "3.8937" [61,] "6.3 % Ket + 93.7 % Talysh" "3.8938" [62,] "93.4 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 6.6 % Selkup" "3.8974" [63,] "86.7 % Talysh + 13.3 % Turk_Kardzhali-West" "3.9086" [64,] "91.2 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 8.8 % Yagnobi" "3.9141" [65,] "7.5 % Mari + 92.5 % Talysh" "3.9196" [66,] "8.8 % Kazakh + 91.2 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.9244" [67,] "82.7 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 17.3 % Nogay" "3.9245" [68,] "94.8 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 5.2 % Pathan" "3.9339" [69,] "84.1 % Talysh + 15.9 % Turkmen_Uzbekistan" "3.9387" [70,] "6.1 % Selkup + 93.9 % Talysh" "3.9459" [71,] "17.3 % Afghan_Turkmen + 82.7 % Kurd_Iran" "3.9473" [72,] "9 % Karakalpak + 91 % Talysh" "3.9631" [73,] "7.3 % Afghan_Tadjik + 92.7 % Azerbaijani_Turkey" "3.9662" [74,] "88.9 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 11.1 % Uygur" "3.9734" [75,] "13.9 % Afghan_Turkmen + 86.1 % Zaza" "3.9797" [76,] "7.4 % Hakas + 92.6 % Talysh" "3.9825" [77,] "29.5 % Turkmen + 70.5 % Zaza" "3.9867" [78,] "88.4 % Talysh + 11.6 % Uzbeki" "3.9898" [79,] "96.7 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 3.3 % Mari" "3.994" [80,] "7.5 % Altaian + 92.5 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "3.9967" [81,] "6.7 % Afghan_Pashtun + 93.3 % Azerbaijani_Iran" "3.997" [82,] "95.7 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 4.3 % Punjabi_Jat" "4.0018" [83,] "92.1 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 7.9 % Mari" "4.0019" [84,] "17.8 % Afghan_Tadjik + 82.2 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "4.0067" [85,] "88.3 % Talysh + 11.7 % Turk_Razgrad" "4.0107" [86,] "95.2 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 4.8 % Kalash" "4.0134" [87,] "95.4 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 4.6 % Burusho" "4.0241" [88,] "87.3 % Talysh + 12.7 % Turk_Drama" "4.0254" [89,] "96.6 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 3.4 % Brahmin_UP" "4.0263" [90,] "96.8 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 3.2 % Kshatriya" "4.03" [91,] "96.7 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 3.3 % Gujarati" "4.0314" [92,] "87.4 % Talysh + 12.6 % Turk_Stara-Zagora" "4.0353" [93,] "96.7 % Azerbaijani_Iran + 3.3 % Chuvash" "4.0357" [94,] "8.6 % Kirgiz + 91.4 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "4.0421" [95,] "82.1 % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 17.9 % Iranian" "4.0454" [96,] "89.6 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey + 10.4 % Turk_Dobruja-Tatar" "4.0467" [97,] "12.5 % Crimean_Tatar + 87.5 % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "4.0501" [98,] "13.6 % Romani + 86.4 % Talysh" "4.0512" [99,] "10.2 % Romanian_Muntenia + 89.8 % Talysh" "4.0544" [100,] "13 % Uzbeki + 87 % Zaza" "4.0572"

50/50 mode for the fun of it:

Code:

[1,] "50% % Iran_Centraleast + 50% % Turk_Central_Black_Sea" "4.1579" [2,] "50% % Azerbaijani_Iran + 50% % Azerbaijani_Turkey" "4.2972" [3,] "50% % Iran_Centraleast + 50% % Turk_Central_East" "4.8391" [4,] "50% % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 50% % Talysh" "5.0106" [5,] "50% % Azeri + 50% % Talysh" "5.1274" [6,] "50% % Azeri + 50% % Azerbaijani_Turkey" "5.2443" [7,] "50% % Azeri + 50% % Azerbaijani_Iran" "5.2564" [8,] "50% % Azerbaijani_Iran + 50% % Talysh" "5.5" [9,] "50% % Iran_Centraleast + 50% % Turkish_mixed" "5.5187" [10,] "50% % Azerbaijani_Turkey + 50% % Kurd_Kurmanji_Turkey" "5.7735" [11,] "50% % Turk_East_Black_Sea + 50% % Turkmen" "5.7912"