Iranian GEDmatch kits

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Originally Posted by Lukasz

You can open, they don't respond because it's hard to say something more on some kits with many calc results presented already. I also usually don't respond but find them interesting.

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You may have a point. To be honest, I don't want stupid trolling or off-topic discussions either (certain idiots tried to do so when I posted Russian results). I've never posted controversial stuff only to stir up negative feelings. Everyone can search the threads opened by Leto.

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Originally Posted by Leto

From another forum — a Lur from Western Iran

Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 42.08
2 East_Med 29.86
3 South_Asian 7.68
4 Red_Sea 6.36
5 West_Med 5
6 North_Atlantic 3.34
7 Baltic 2.98
8 Sub-Saharan 1.04
9 Siberian 0.95
10 Oceanian 0.69

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kurdish 2.57
2 Iranian 4.76
3 Azeri 7.82
4 Armenian 9.97
5 Georgian_Jewish 10.75
6 Turkish 13.15
7 Georgian 13.69
8 Assyrian 13.82
9 Abhkasian 14.79
10 Kumyk 14.97
11 Iranian_Jewish 15.9
12 Adygei 16.21
13 Kurdish_Jewish 16.42
14 Ossetian 17.87
15 Balkar 18.37
16 Turkmen 18.37
17 North_Ossetian 18.65
18 Kabardin 19.5
19 Lezgin 19.88
20 Chechen 20.35

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 94.3% Kurdish + 5.7% Abhkasian @ 2.41
2 94.7% Kurdish + 5.3% Georgian @ 2.45
3 99.5% Kurdish + 0.5% Yoruban @ 2.49
4 99.5% Kurdish + 0.5% Mandenka @ 2.5
5 98% Kurdish + 2% Makrani @ 2.51
6 99.5% Kurdish + 0.5% Bantu_S.W. @ 2.51
7 98.4% Kurdish + 1.6% Brahui @ 2.51
8 99.5% Kurdish + 0.5% Bantu_S.E. @ 2.52
9 98.5% Kurdish + 1.5% Balochi @ 2.52
10 99.6% Kurdish + 0.4% Biaka_Pygmy @ 2.53
11 91.1% Kurdish + 8.9% Iranian @ 2.53
12 99.7% Kurdish + 0.3% Luhya @ 2.54
13 99.7% Kurdish + 0.3% Bantu_N.E. @ 2.55
14 99.8% Kurdish + 0.2% Mbuti_Pygmy @ 2.56
15 99.1% Kurdish + 0.9% Ossetian @ 2.56
16 99.1% Kurdish + 0.9% North_Ossetian @ 2.56
17 99.2% Kurdish + 0.8% Lezgin @ 2.56
18 99.9% Kurdish + 0.1% Papuan @ 2.56
19 99.9% Kurdish + 0.1% San @ 2.56
20 99.7% Kurdish + 0.3% Adygei @ 2.56

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Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 37.69
2 South_Central_Asian 25.53
3 Near_East 11.44
4 North_African 7.02
5 European_Early_Farmers 6.69
6 European_Hunters_Gatherers 3.95
7 South_Indian 2.23
8 Ancestral_Altaic 1.76
9 Subsaharian 1.35
10 Austronesian 0.95
11 South_East_Asian 0.59
12 African_Pygmy 0.38
13 Tungus-Altaic 0.23
14 Paleo_Siberian 0.17

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kurd_South ( ) 5.27
2 Kurd_East ( ) 5.51
3 Kurd_North ( ) 5.98
4 Kurd ( ) 6.2
5 Azeri ( ) 6.84
6 Uzbek_Tashkent ( ) 9.94
7 Turk_Adana ( ) 10.61
8 Iraqi_Mandean ( ) 10.76
9 Baku_WGA ( ) 11.01
10 Uzbekistani_Jew ( ) 11.53
11 Kurd_Jew ( ) 12.78
12 Iraqi_Chaldean ( ) 13.05
13 Iraki ( ) 13.67
14 Iranian ( ) 13.68
15 Georgian_Jew ( ) 14.32
16 Stalskoe_Kumyk ( ) 14.42
17 Turk ( ) 14.5
18 Iranian_Jew ( ) 14.56
19 Turk_Kayseri ( ) 14.6
20 Azeri_Dagestan ( ) 15.31

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 91.2% Kurd ( ) + 8.8% Shaigi_Sudan ( ) @ 2.33
2 91.7% Kurd ( ) + 8.3% Algerian ( ) @ 2.4
3 92.7% Kurd ( ) + 7.3% Morocco_South ( ) @ 2.44
4 93.2% Kurd ( ) + 6.8% Berber_WGA ( ) @ 2.46
5 91% Kurd ( ) + 9% Tunisian ( ) @ 2.61
6 93.6% Kurd ( ) + 6.4% Saharawi ( ) @ 2.63
7 94.4% Kurd ( ) + 5.6% Mozabite ( ) @ 2.69
8 94.6% Kurd_North ( ) + 5.4% Mozabite ( ) @ 2.71
9 91.8% Kurd ( ) + 8.2% Moroccan ( ) @ 2.81
10 94.2% Kurd_North ( ) + 5.8% Saharawi ( ) @ 3.14
11 93.9% Kurd_North ( ) + 6.1% Berber_WGA ( ) @ 3.18
12 93.7% Kurd_North ( ) + 6.3% Morocco_South ( ) @ 3.43
13 92.9% Kurd_North ( ) + 7.1% Algerian ( ) @ 3.58
14 92.9% Kurd_North ( ) + 7.1% Moroccan ( ) @ 3.61
15 92.6% Kurd_North ( ) + 7.4% Shaigi_Sudan ( ) @ 3.64
16 92.5% Kurd_North ( ) + 7.5% Tunisian ( ) @ 3.75
17 95.9% Kurd_East ( ) + 4.1% Mozabite ( ) @ 3.76
18 92.2% Kurd ( ) + 7.8% Spanish_Canarias_IBS ( ) @ 3.89
19 87.2% Kurd ( ) + 12.8% Egyptian_Tanta ( ) @ 4.02
20 95.4% Kurd_East ( ) + 4.6% Berber_WGA ( ) @ 4.04

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Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 40.35
2 Gedrosia 26.47
3 Southwest_Asian 13.32
4 North_European 6.57
5 Atlantic_Med 5.34
6 South_Asian 3.76
7 Northwest_African 3.38
8 East_Asian 0.42
9 East_African 0.38

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 Kurd (Dodecad) 4.51
2 Iranian (Dodecad) 4.58
3 Kurds (Yunusbayev) 5.05
4 Iranians (Behar) 6.32
5 Uzbekistan_Jews (Behar) 9.82
6 Turks (Behar) 14.13
7 Azerbaijan_Jews (Behar) 15.31
8 Iranian_Jews (Behar) 15.54
9 Georgia_Jews (Behar) 15.6
10 Assyrian (Dodecad) 16.1
11 Turkish (Dodecad) 16.62
12 Turkmens (Yunusbayev) 16.74
13 Armenians_15 (Yunusbayev) 16.86
14 Iraq_Jews (Behar) 17.33
15 Armenian (Dodecad) 17.95
16 Kumyks (Yunusbayev) 18.22
17 Lebanese (Behar) 19.07
18 Armenians (Behar) 21.1
19 Syrians (Behar) 21.24
20 Lezgins (Behar) 21.47

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 96.2% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 3.8% Mozabite (HGDP) @ 3.2
2 96.8% Iranian (Dodecad) + 3.2% Mozabite (HGDP) @ 3.23
3 95% Iranian (Dodecad) + 5% Moroccans (Behar) @ 3.4
4 95% Iranian (Dodecad) + 5% Moroccan (Dodecad) @ 3.42
5 94.2% Iranian (Dodecad) + 5.8% Algerian (Dodecad) @ 3.44
6 96.8% Kurd (Dodecad) + 3.2% Pulliyar (Metspalu) @ 3.45
7 96% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4% Pulliyar (Metspalu) @ 3.47
8 95.9% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.1% MALAYAN (Behar) @ 3.52
9 91.1% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 8.9% Bnei_Menashe_Jews (Behar) @ 3.57
10 95.7% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.3% North_Kannadi (Behar) @ 3.59
11 92.1% Iranian (Dodecad) + 7.9% Egyptans (Behar) @ 3.6
12 95.8% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.2% Nihali (Metspalu) @ 3.6
13 95.6% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.4% Hakkipikki (Metspalu) @ 3.61
14 96.9% Kurd (Dodecad) + 3.1% MALAYAN (Behar) @ 3.62
15 95.3% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.7% Chenchus (Metspalu) @ 3.63
16 87% Iranian (Dodecad) + 13% Lebanese (Behar) @ 3.63
17 95.6% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.4% Gond (Metspalu) @ 3.63
18 95.5% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4.5% Chamar (Metspalu) @ 3.64
19 97.4% Kurd (Dodecad) + 2.6% Mozabite (HGDP) @ 3.65
20 96% Kurds (Yunusbayev) + 4% ASUR (Chaubey) @ 3.65

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Admix Results (sorted):

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 42.1
2 Baloch 25.6
3 SW-Asian 13.76
4 Mediterranean 7
5 NE-Euro 4.73
6 S-Indian 4.03
7 Beringian 1.32
8 Papuan 0.67
9 Siberian 0.3
10 San 0.29
11 E-African 0.2

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 kurd (harappa) 2.08
2 iranian (harappa) 4.07
3 kurd (yunusbayev) 4.36
4 iranian (behar) 4.55
5 kurd (xing) 4.72
6 uzbekistan-jew (behar) 7.63
7 turkish (harappa) 7.9
8 armenian (harappa) 8.73
9 azeri (harappa) 8.78
10 iraqi-arab (harappa) 11.13
11 iraqi-mandaean (harappa) 11.81
12 assyrian (harappa) 12
13 turk-kayseri (hodoglugil) 12.42
14 turk (behar) 12.53
15 iranian-jew (behar) 13.03
16 turk-istanbul (hodoglugil) 13.3
17 azerbaijan-jew (behar) 13.76
18 georgia-jew (behar) 14.32
19 iraq-jew (behar) 14.37
20 armenian (yunusbayev) 15.34

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 93.7% kurd (harappa) + 6.3% assyrian (harappa) @ 1.92
2 94.5% kurd (harappa) + 5.5% azerbaijan-jew (behar) @ 1.92
3 90.8% kurd (harappa) + 9.2% uzbekistan-jew (behar) @ 1.94
4 95.1% kurd (harappa) + 4.9% georgia-jew (behar) @ 1.95
5 95.7% kurd (harappa) + 4.3% armenian (behar) @ 1.95
6 97.2% kurd (harappa) + 2.8% druze (hgdp) @ 1.95
7 95.4% kurd (harappa) + 4.6% iraq-jew (behar) @ 1.96
8 94.4% kurd (harappa) + 5.6% iraqi-mandaean (harappa) @ 1.96
9 95.1% kurd (harappa) + 4.9% iranian-jew (behar) @ 1.97
10 97.1% kurd (harappa) + 2.9% cypriot (behar) @ 1.97
11 96.9% kurd (harappa) + 3.1% lebanese-druze (haber) @ 2
12 97.9% kurd (harappa) + 2.1% samaritian (behar) @ 2
13 97.2% kurd (harappa) + 2.8% lebanese-christian (haber) @ 2
14 87.6% kurd (harappa) + 12.4% kurd (yunusbayev) @ 2
15 98.3% kurd (harappa) + 1.7% georgian (behar) @ 2.01
16 99.4% kurd (harappa) + 0.6% irula (xing) @ 2.02
17 98.4% kurd (harappa) + 1.6% abhkasian (yunusbayev) @ 2.03
18 99.5% kurd (harappa) + 0.5% pulliyar (metspalu) @ 2.04
19 97.8% kurd (harappa) + 2.2% lebanese-muslim (haber) @ 2.04
20 98.1% kurd (harappa) + 1.9% syrian (behar) @ 2.05

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The reason you are seeing Kurds in 1st place ahead of Iranians and with such a small distance for the Lur, even smaller than what even most Kurds get is because Lurs are Kurds. Some still identify as kurds. They started to distinguish themselves from kurds only about 500-1000 years ago.

You may see Kurds in 1st place with some Bakhtiaris also

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Originally Posted by Zoro

The reason you are seeing Kurds in 1st place ahead of Iranians and with such a small distance for the Lur, even smaller than what even most Kurds get is because Lurs are Kurds. Some still identify as kurds. They started to distinguish themselves from kurds only about 500-1000 years ago.

You may see Kurds in 1st place with some Bakhtiaris also

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Luri is not considered a dialect of Kurdi
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luri_language

That Baltic is so low. I really believe the real Indo Iranians weren't very high in it, unless we are talking about elite dominance on a Gagauz scale.

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Originally Posted by War Chief

That Baltic is so low. I really believe the real Indo Iranians weren't very high in it, unless we are talking about elite dominance on a Gagauz scale.

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Nah, they just don't have much Steppe, they're mostly native Iranian (i.e. the Iranian plateau). Look at their Y-DNA, R1a is 15-20% only in Persians and Kurds. That Lur guy is J2 for example.

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Originally Posted by War Chief

That Baltic is so low. I really believe the real Indo Iranians weren't very high in it, unless we are talking about elite dominance on a Gagauz scale.

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Exactly. That means that there was no so called 'elite dominance' since R1a or other haplogroups didn't bottlenecked and spread like fire like R1a in Eastern Europe or India and R1b in the western Europe. The source of R1a in Eastern Europe were just few males, the same can be said about India. The source of R1a (Saka) in India is also just few males. That means that there was elite dominate in those places.

Second stage PIEan Yamnya was R1b. My people the Ezdi Kurds who can be considered as proto-Kurds have also much more R1b, J2a than R1a in our ancestral homeland.

Also, don't forget that ancient IEans like the Hittites and Myceneans, similar to the Indo-Iranians, had also nothing to do with the Steppes. Those ancient Indo-Europeans were also full of J2a. So, it is perfectly normal that Indo-Iranians had nothing to do with the Steppes at all.


I'm sure that the ancient proto-Indo-Iranians had a lot R1b, J2a, G2a and even L in them (and also some other haplogroups).

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Originally Posted by MS85

Exactly. That means that there was no so called 'elite dominance' since R1a or other haplogroups didn't bottlenecked and spread like fire like R1a in Eastern Europe or India and R1b in the western Europe. The source of R1a in Eastern Europe were just few males, the same can be said about India. The source of R1a (Saka) in India is also just few males. That means that there was elite dominate in those places.

Second stage PIEan Yamnya was R1b. My people the Ezdi Kurds who can be considered as proto-Kurds have also much more R1b, J2a than R1a in our ancestral homeland.

Also, don't forget that ancient IEans like the Hittites and Myceneans, similar to the Indo-Iranians, had also nothing to do with the Steppes. Those ancient Indo-Europeans were also full of J2a. So, it is perfectly normal that Indo-Iranians had nothing to do with the Steppes at all.


I'm sure that the ancient proto-Indo-Iranians had a lot R1b, J2a, G2a and even L in them (and also some other haplogroups).

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Iranians/Afghans/Tajiks have more R1a than R1b. Only Kurds and Lurs have more R1b than R1a. R1b is also very present in non-Iranian groups like Assyrians, Mesopotamians, Armenians..

R1a is still the 2nd most present Hg in Iran. They are just very diverse in terms of Hapolgroups. That's because of their crucial location for ancient human migrations.

Also, elite dominance in the mountains is very difficult. Maybe one group can dominate other group in a valley, but what about other valleys? There are many tribes in many different areas/locations.

Kurdish society has been a tribalic society for thousands of years. Our Kurdic/Aryan tribes are spread all over the Kurdic mountains and it is very difficult to unite them. Only during the era of the Medes, Kurds were successful in uniting all Kurdic/Aryan tribes in Kurdistan. With other words, it is not really possible to force elite dominance on tribalic people/society in the mountains. Many people tried that, but sooner or later Kurds wiped all their enemies out in Kurdistan.

Only the Medes were successful in uniting all Kurdic/Aryan tribes in Kurdistan and we have got ancient DNA from the era. Those Medes were very similar to the modern day Kurds.

Also, since Kurds are divided by different tribes, how is it than possible that all Kurdic tribes speak different dialects of Kurdic language very specific to own areas. The evolution of Kurdic language was organic and not imposed from outside. Since Kurdic is an 'ergative' language is very native to Kurdistan. Nobody in our ancient history ever mentioned something like 'elite dominance' in Kurdistan.

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Originally Posted by Kyp Snow

Iranians/Afghans/Tajiks have more R1a than R1b. Only Kurds and Lurs have more R1b than R1a. R1b is also very present in non-Iranian groups like Assyrians, Mesopotamians, Armenians..

R1a is still the 2nd most present Hg in Iran. They are just very diverse in terms of Hapolgroups. That's because of their crucial location for ancient human migrations.

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ancient Iranians like the Mitanni, Kassites and Gutians ruled Medopotamia/Babylon for thousands of years. I'm sure that ancient Assyrians, Mesopotamians or Armenians have a lot Iranic DNA in them. But nevertheless they are very low of Steppes or R1a.

R1a in South Central just bottlenecked and is a founder effect in that area. Obvious there was 'elite dominance' there. R1a is in that area evolved only from few males, most likely Scythians/Saka. It has nothing to do with much more ancient proto-Iranians from Kurdistan.

Afghans are mostly Pashtuns and Pashtuns are very close to Punjabis. Both groups were dominated by the Scythians and later they mixed with them. Tajiks have a lot of haplogroup R2a, J2a and even L. Tajiks are originally from Persia/Fars. Later on when they migrated into Central Asia they mixed with Central Asiac people, mostly Turco-Mongoloid people who had a lot R1a in them from the ancient Scythians


You should not confuse the history of Indian Peninsula with the Aryan history of Kurdistan.

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Originally Posted by MS85

Also, elite dominance in the mountains is very difficult. Maybe one group can dominate other group in a valley, but what about other valleys? There are many tribes in many different areas/locations.

Kurdish society has been a tribalic society for thousands of years. Our Kurdic/Aryan tribes are spread all over the Kurdic mountains and it is very difficult to unite them. Only during the era of the Medes, Kurds were successful in uniting all Kurdic/Aryan tribes in Kurdistan. With other words, it is not really possible to force elite dominance on tribalic people/society in the mountains. Many people tried that, but sooner or later Kurds wiped all their enemies out in Kurdistan.

Only the Medes were successful in uniting all Kurdic/Aryan tribes in Kurdistan and we have got ancient DNA from the era. Those Medes were very similar to the modern day Kurds.

Also, since Kurds are divided by different tribes, how is it than possible that all Kurdic tribes speak different dialects of Kurdic language very specific to own areas. The evolution of Kurdic language was organic and not imposed from outside. Since Kurdic is an 'ergative' language is very native to Kurdistan. Nobody in our ancient history ever mentioned something like 'elite dominance' in Kurdistan.

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I'm not sure how much sense it makes to talk about Kurds in the ancient era, they were basically non-existent as an actual ethnic group at the time.