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The Genomic History Of Southeastern Europe
Y and MtDNA samples list and results
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Is there any I2a-Din or R1a in pre-Medieval Balkan samples?
There is one R1a in Bronze age Bulgaria I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Litvin
R1b in Lepenski Vir, d' fuck! xD
im seeing many r1a's and i2's in the Balkans, seems like we have to rethink the impact of the Slavic migrations
It's I2-M223 in Mesolithic Balkan, far away from Dinaric subclade.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorcelow
Can not wait to see Bosniak reaction :pound:
Is that the clade found predominantly in Sardinia? Even if so, r1a seems to have preceded the Slavic migrations. I guess the only true Slavic marker is the dinaric clade.Quote:
Originally Posted by Europa Nazione
It's predominant in German lands.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorcelow
Yes, Dinaric (I2a-CTS10228) is the pure Slavic marker.
No y-dna from Peloponnese Neolithic. Autosomaly they are "south-eastern" shifted compared to other Euro farmers though.
http://i.imgur.com/UDrLmPE.png
One interesting thing is Peloponnese_neo was already Levant shifted, like almost half LBK / Levant_neo, while it's younger than LBK, Balkan_neo and ofc Anatolia_neo. It's not only due to not have absorbed much local HG like LBK or Balkan_neo and other similar groups did, since even Anatolia_neo outside of Europe and the regular Greece_neo is more similar to LBK.
https://s10.postimg.org/5qhpwxqw9/ppsneo.png
https://s15.postimg.org/u4dknujkb/ppsneo2.png
One Cucuteni-Trypillian culture member Ydna is G2a-P303>L497>L43 :laugh:
So it seems like J2b2 was found in proto-Illyrian culture ;). No I2a1b(Din) was found which basically confirms that it isn't native there but in fact a Slavic arrival, nearly all I2a in the Balkans was I2a2. All the Bosniaks are crying right now xD
There wasn't any I2a-Din found but there was R1a which probably was part of the older Indo-European clusterQuote:
Originally Posted by Litvin
I2-M223 is part of the Pre-Celtic/Germanic cluster if I am not mistaken. Yh same I can't wait to see their reactions xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Europa Nazione
There are different subcladesQuote:
Originally Posted by Sorcelow
Subclades... Those are what matter.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorcelow
There was a shit-tonne of G2a though which doesn't really surprise me
Yes, G2a was high in parts of Europe for awhile back then, but others invaded and attacked them from all directions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelmendasi
But this is R1a1a1b2, which is R1a-Z93, Indo-Iranian marker (not Balto-Slavic).Quote:
Originally Posted by Europa Nazione
I haven't checked subclade :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Litvin
Scythian? Then I am not surprised. I don't see many modern Euros carrying this marker anyhow, except maybe Tatars?Quote:
Originally Posted by Litvin
So maybe j2b2 l283 originated more north which is why some of us plot so north xD
Which mtDNA would you associate with Slavs?Quote:
Originally Posted by Europa Nazione
pretty much proves Thracians were indo iraniansQuote:
Originally Posted by Litvin
I'd say it's harder to pinpoint migratory patterns in mtDNA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ylla
It's actually quite common among European Gypsies and some branches are Jewish-related.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xhak Bauėr
Seems to be the case & it's rare nowadays in Europe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Feiichy
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...78d8fa6711.png
I'm really not interested or even expert for mtDNA, sorry. xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Ylla
There is too much bullshit written by stupid fucks across this entire forum. I will make it simple: As I said before months ago and I was right, Albanians were more or less unchanged autosomally since the Bronze Age.
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xhak Bauėr
R1a1a1b2 (R-Z93) (Asia)
R1a1b2a2* (R-M780) occurs at high frequency in South Asia: India, Pakistan, Afghanistan, and the Himalayas. The group also occurs at >3% in some Iranian populations and is present at >30% in Roma from Croatia and Hungary.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplog....29_.28Asia.29
It is true Aryan marker though, Gypsies and other groups must have picked it up in contact with Indo-Iranian groups.
If j2 Is Illyrian then what is ev13. Trako_serb?Quote:
Originally Posted by Europa Nazione
Is R1a-Z93 possibly related to the -Getae groups? From Central Asia to Thrace?Quote:
Originally Posted by Feiichy
Marked with red circles
http://i.imgur.com/0dA3c7B.jpg
You mean J2b2-M241 and it's Euro branches can be called as a Illyrian, unlike J2b1-M205 which is more connected to Roman expansion.Quote:
Originally Posted by blondbeast
E-V13 is highly ''indoeuropeanised'' before it's expansion with Romans, Greeks, Thracians or even Germans.
Sicilians today have some of the lowest, if not the lowest, WHG in Europe. Therefore, these samples must predate CHG genes in Europe, and imply that the original WHG population has been replaced by Near Eastern input that is comparatively recent.
Quote:
"We report new data from hunter-gatherers from France, Sicily and Croatia, as well as higher
246 coverage data from three previously published hunter-gatherers from France and Germany.18
247 The Sicilian and Croatian individuals dating to 12,000 and 6100 BCE cluster closely with
248 western hunter-gatherers, including individuals from Loschbour24 (Luxembourg, 6100 BCE),
249 Bichon20 (Switzerland, 11,700 BCE), and Villabruna18 (Italy 12,000 BCE). These results
250 demonstrate that the western hunter-gatherer population24 was widely distributed from the
251 Atlantic seaboard of Europe in the West, to Sicily in the South, to the Balkan Peninsula in the
252 Southeast, for at least six thousand years, strengthening the evidence that the western hunter-
253 gatherers represent a population that expanded from a southeastern European refugium
254 following the last Ice Age around 15,000 years agoin the process displacing or admixing
255 with the existing population of western Europe.18 38"
Possible :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Xhak Bauėr
I also think the Bulgars must have carried some Z93, but we'd need ancient samples for that :)
The sample from Sicily is in the mesolithic, the surprising part (or not) is they were exactly like the other mesolithic WHG back then, even in Sicily, so yea extremely different than today population but that predates by long all the neolithic and bronze age influences that came much later.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sikeliot
it is indo european most likely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xhak Bauėr
So this means the population in Sicily as of 6000 BC has been almost completely replaced, since WHG ancestry is very low there. The next wave of migration from the Caucasus must then be the predominant one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Petalpusher
It's not unless you take a coding region mtdna testQuote:
Originally Posted by Xhak Bauėr
U4d2, U5a1Quote:
Originally Posted by Ylla
Zemunica Cave, Croatia E-L618 (7600-7470 ybp), father clade of E-V13.