Spain, Portugal, Granada [Split from the FUBAR thread]

[Fred]

Italians only started immigrating to South America after the second half on nineteen century basically.

I read somewhere that the Sicilians, Corsicans, Sardinians and Balearans were not allowed to the colonies. Is this true? Some have said that only the crypto-Jews and crypto-Muslims were the chief body of colonists, but the administrators were all Visigoths. I know of a few Italian missionaries and navigators, most of them famous, of course.

[Matritensis]

Some have said that only the crypto-Jews and crypto-Muslims were the chief body of colonists, but the administrators were all Visigoths.

You're grossly mixing dates here,by a margin of several centuries.

[Fred]

I suppose you deny the Visigodo identification with Spain?

[Matritensis]

The Visigoths had their role when they had it(450 AD aprox--711 AD) They were always a minority and then got diluted in the Hispano-Roman majority.We are not Visigoths any more than we are Moors...

[Kadu]

I read somewhere that the Sicilians, Corsicans, Sardinians and Balearans were not allowed to the colonies. Is this true? Some have said that only the crypto-Jews and crypto-Muslims were the chief body of colonists, but the administrators were all Visigoths. I know of a few Italian missionaries and navigators, most of them famous, of course.

Well in the very beggining they sent all personae non grata to the new world, and among them were crypto-jews, witches, homosexuals, sinful priests, con artists, peasants etc...
The Men incharge of the captaincies were Noble men but everybody was Portuguese there were no Visigoths by then.
Dunno about any kind of restriction toward Italians during Colonial times but in 1930, the Brazilian President Getúlio Vargas imposed an immigration law which stipulated strict quotes of entrance except for Portuguese immigrants.

[Fred]

The Visigoths had their role when they had it(450 AD aprox--711 AD) They were always a minority and then got diluted in the Hispano-Roman majority.We are not Visigoths any more than we are Moors...

If Spain is the amalgamation of Castile, Leon, Aragon, Navarre and Granada, then which one is the primary nation of Spain and what is the antecessor of that nation? I know that France's la Marca Hispanica is the basis for Spain, but which nation of Spain is the most direct heir?

Well in the very beggining they sent all personae non grata to the new world, and among them were crypto-jews, witches, homosexuals, sinful priests, con artists, peasants etc...
The Men incharge of the captaincies were Noble men but everybody was Portuguese there were no Visigoths by then.
Dunno about any kind of restriction toward Italians during Colonial times but in 1930, the Brazilian President Getúlio Vargas imposed an immigration law which stipulated strict quotes of entrance except for Portuguese immigrants.

I find it funny that Portugal is actually an ex-county of France, an offshoot of Burgundy.

[Kadu]

I find it funny that Portugal is actually an ex-county of France, an offshoot of Burgundy.

Not really...

In 1093 the county of Portugal was offered by Alfonso VI of León and Castile to Henry of Burgundy (who gave his aid in the Reconquista and who also received the hand of Teresa of León, the king's daughter, in marriage). Henry's territories were larger than Nuno II's, including the territories of the old County of Coimbra, parts of Trás-os-Montes e Alto Douro and even the south of Galicia. This county would evolve in 1139 into the Kingdom of Portugal under Henry of Burgundy's son, Afonso Henriques.

Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Portugal

[Fred]

Not really...



Source:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Portugal

The French intervention made sure that Spain and Portugal would never be reunited into one body, despite the best efforts of Philip. It would make much more sense, if Portugal was on the Spanish coat of arms and Granada was a separate country, perhaps joined to Gibraltar as an anomalous no-man's land for tourists and the UN office rather than Geneva. I'd still keep the Bourbon lily on the Spanish arms. The Bonaparte arms of Plvs Vltra could go with the Granada/Gibraltar country.

[Comte Arnau]

If Spain is the amalgamation of Castile, Leon, Aragon, Navarre and Granada, then which one is the primary nation of Spain and what is the antecessor of that nation? I know that France's la Marca Hispanica is the basis for Spain, but which nation of Spain is the most direct heir?

Spain is not the amalgamation of it. Spain is basically the expansion of Castile, started in the 15th century and finished in the 18th century. Some nations other than Castile in the peninsula have been gradually assimilated, like Leon and Aragon. Others still resist, who knows for how long.

The Hispanic March has actually nothing to do with the basis for Spain. Hispanic in that name just means Iberian. Actually, the Hispanic March is the basis for Catalonia and Aragon. (Paradoxically, though, the word español was born there, in the Pyrenees)

Even Spanish nationalists know at heart that the core of their nation is Castile.

[Damião de Góis]

I find it funny that Portugal is actually an ex-county of France, an offshoot of Burgundy.

LOL