Real IRA is ready for 'long war'

[Oisín]

Any regional conflict within England cannot fairly be contrasted to Ireland, particularly when speaking hypothetically.

Foreigners with a different tradition and culture displacing the natives and then demanding special treatment, it's the exact same.

How many times do I have to say it? It's called reality; that's never going to happen. Lay out the perks of unification on the table all you want, Protestants aren't simply going to abandon the Unionist tradition and become born-again Republicans. That might have worked centuries ago when the entire island was under the domination of Britain and an Anglican elite, allowing some common Catholic/Dissenter identity to emerge, but that is in no way applicable to today. The people who you're referring to as historical Irish Republicans are, today, the most firebrand Unionists (Presbyterians and Methodists have long since displaced Anglo-Irish Anglicans in that role).

The most hard line Unionist party are now sharing power with Sinn Féin and Britain has washed it's hands of the NI statelet with the GFA, we're more than halfway towards a united Ireland as it is
Another 300,000 votes isn't as impossible as you'd like to think it is.

Now let me ask you; assume Protestants continue to overwhelmingly reject a united Ireland, meaning it is against their will, what happens then?

Well seen as neither of us can predict the future we'll just have to wait and see wont we.

[Loyalist]

Foreigners with a different tradition and culture displacing the natives and then demanding special treatment, it's the exact same.

In-fighting amongst the English isn't comparable to the ethnic, cultural, and religious divide in Ireland. Unless you're speaking of Cornwall.

The most hard line Unionist party are now sharing power with Sinn Féin and Britain has washed it's hands of the NI statelet with the GFA, we're more than halfway towards a united Ireland as it is
Another 300,000 votes isn't as impossible as you'd like to think it is.

I have a feeling that the DUP is going to be hammered at the next election by the UUP-Conservative coalition. Either way, the Conservatives are going to sweep to victory in Westminster, and that is the last party which will simply abandon Northern Ireland. But, as you say, we'll wait and see.

[Oisín]

In-fighting amongst the English isn't comparable to the ethnic, cultural, and religious divide in Ireland. Unless you're speaking of Cornwall.

No I was thinking more along the lines of the Muslims who have established colonies all over England.

I have a feeling that the DUP is going to be hammered at the next election by the UUP-Conservative coalition. Either way, the Conservatives are going to sweep to victory in Westminster, and that is the last party which will simply abandon Northern Ireland.

Well even if the DUP to get hammered then all that means is it will be the UUP sharing power with Sinn Féin instead, nothing will change that. I was certain that the Conservatives would clean up at the next general election too until recently, Brown is starting to steady the boat lately and making a comeback in the polls. According to this he's only one point behind, although that is 4 weeks old. If Brown can keep the country ticking over through the current economic crisis I think he has a good chance of being elected, bear in mind he doesn't even have to hold a GE until 2010. With the global economy the way it is people might be more inclined to back the devil that they know rather than the untried & untested Cameron.
Even if the Conservatives are in power it makes no difference, they could do nothing to stop a united Ireland if that's what the people vote for, Britain is bound by international treaty to accept and implement the result of any referendum.

But, as you say, we'll wait and see.

[TheGreatest]

Why support this IRA if they have no position of anything?


I find it hypocritic that most of the men leading the Scottish Independence Movement have a bad track record regarding multi-culturalism. So you're going to throw out the British, so you can have East Indian Scotsmen?

[Fortis in Arduis]

Why support this IRA if they have no position of anything?

I find it hypocritic that most of the men leading the Scottish Independence Movement have a bad track record regarding multi-culturalism. So you're going to throw out the British, so you can have East Indian Scotsmen?

Absolutely. It makes no sense to support these demagogues, unless they can come up with a a proper programme. Perhaps similarly it makes next to zero sense to support the Unionist cause beyond supporting democracy itself.

Why is it that Irish Protestants who make up a minority of the Irish population should have the right to keep our nation divided? The last time a vote was taken on an all Ireland basis the Irish people voted overwhelmingly in favour of a unified Irish Republic, the British ignored this and imposed partition under the threat of 'immediate and terrible war'. It is the right of the Irish people as a whole to decide our future.

They are white Britons who live in that particular area and have done for a very long time.

Perhaps when the nature of British politics changes for the better their presence will cease to be such a sort point for Irish nationalists.

I hope so.

Would you apply the same logic to England? Presuming one day a Nationalist party has a majority in parliament, should the minorities be allowed to break away and form their own micro-nations where they are the majority so they can carry on doing as they please? What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

How many times do I have to say it? I am not talking about forcing Protestants into a united Ireland against their will. The idea is that they reclaim their Irish Republican roots and vote for a united Ireland themselves.

The minorities could certainly try that, but they might find themselves in untenable isolation.

I am in favour of the localisation of economy and democracy, issues which supercede whether one is Protestant, Catholic, Irish or British.

This is the long term; everything else is wallpaper - JMVHO...

[Oisín]

Why support this IRA if they have no position of anything?

Armies are not meant to be political, the IRA are about forcing a British withdrawal nothing more nothing less. No-one's asking you to support them. I posted this thread because the Real IRA's aim of a free united Ireland is one that is shared by all Irish nationalists.

[Revenant]

What's the RIRA relationship with the older IRA, if there is one?.

I am only asking this question from a position of pretty much total ignorance here.

I hope, sincerely, that differences can be sorted out and goals achieved amicably for both sides without the need for fighting.

[TheGreatest]

Well the last IRA did have a social aim and that was an unified; socialist Ireland. And most of the supporters of the provisional IRA were anti-Protestant and staunchly Catholic, maybe that's a reason why it never took off in Northern Ireland?


Had the Provisional IRA succeeded, I seriously doubt that the Northern would have had more representative power..

[Oisín]

What's the RIRA relationship with the older IRA, if there is one?.

I am only asking this question from a position of pretty much total ignorance here.

I hope, sincerely, that differences can be sorted out and goals achieved amicably for both sides without the need for fighting.

The RIRA was formed in 1997 by some senior members of the Provisional IRA who were not happy with the PIRA leadership and the way the peace process was going. Initially PIRA members called to the homes of RIRA members and told them to cease activities and stop using PIRA arms dumps under threat of death. PIRA have now decommissioned their weapons and no longer exist as a functioning military unit so RIRA members are no longer under threat from them and many RIRA Volunteers are disaffected PIRA members. The Provisional Republican movement now rejects violence and is committed to achieving its goals through solely peaceful means.
If it's a subject you're interested in I highly recommend reading Ed Moloney's A Secret History of the IRA.

[Oisín]

Well the last IRA did have a social aim and that was an unified; socialist Ireland. And most of the supporters of the provisional IRA were anti-Protestant and staunchly Catholic, maybe that's a reason why it never took off in Northern Ireland?


Had the Provisional IRA succeeded, I seriously doubt that the Northern would have had more representative power..

Without wanting to sound rude judging by your post I'd hazard a guess that you haven't much interest in Irish history or in the history of the Troubles and Irish Republicanism.
The PIRA certainly did 'take off' in northern Ireland, it fought the British army for 30 years, eventually the conflict came to a standstill with the British army admitting it did not defeat the IRA. Out of the conflict came the peace process, with the UK government for the first time ever conceding that if the majority of NI citizens vote for unification with the south then it will happen, the Provisional Republican movements political wing Sinn Féin now shares power with the major Unionist party, the DUP, in a devolved NI Assembly and are committed to working for their goal of a united Ireland through entirely political means.
While it's true that the the majority of PIRA Volunteers were Catholic the organisation was not anti-Protestant and it is/was not a sectarian conflict, though that's not to say that there were not incidents of sectarian violence, but given the history of Irish-British relations that's hardly surprising.
When a united Ireland does come about the Ulster Protestants of north east Ireland will be a minority of roughly 16%, they are currently a 1.6% minority within the UK so they certainly will have more representation and will be much more able to safeguard their culture and tradition than they are in the UK. As the UK continues to darken and become more multi-cultural everyday hopefully they will realise that before it's too late.
I don't really think there's anything more for me to say on the subject at the minute as otherwise myself and Loyalist will just be going round in circles again