The Filipino Anthropological Issues Thread

[Dictator]

The identity crisis is due the mixture of cultures, and the 170 different ethnic groups and languages that we have. Bisayans dont like Tagalogs, Tagalogs think they're the best because their language is official. Ilocanos are too dark. Bicolanos are lazy. Warays are mean. That's what the identity crisis is. But I'm absolutely sure that thats not what you meant, because you have no idea about that. But if you go to this Philippines and ask the people if they give a fuck about the Spanish, they will say no. And they dont care about having Spanish blood or speaking Spanish or anything about the Spanish. Spanish was more than a century ago.

You know nothing, Jon Snow.

[Vesuvian Sky]

Most Philippine people I've met rarely identify with "Spanish-ness". Most I've met trump up Tagalog speaking roots so to speak. Genetics more or less has shown what I've always expected:

Filipinos are an Austronesian people, a linguistic and genetic group that includes other ethnicities from maritime Southeast Asia, Madagascar, and the Pacific islands.[70] The most frequently occurring Y-DNA haplogroup among modern Filipinos is Haplogroup O3-M122, which is found with high frequency in populations from East Asia, Southeast Asia, and Polynesia. In particular, the type of O3-M122 that is found frequently in Filipinos, O-P201(xM7, M134), is also found frequently in other Austronesian populations, especially the Batak Toba from Sumatra and the Polynesians.[71] Haplogroup O1a-M119 (labeled as "Haplogroup H" in this study) is also commonly found among Filipinos and is shared with other Austronesian-speaking populations, especially those in Taiwan, western Indonesia, and Madagascar.[72][73] After the 16th century, the colonial period saw the influx of limited genetic influence from Europeans and other populations from the Americas, Oceania, and Asia.

I can't help to think its somewhat of a trumped up internet thing. The more pressing issue is why so hyper sexed up all the time?

[simple]

Most Philippine people I've met rarely identify with "Spanish-ness". Most I've met trump up Tagalog speaking roots so to speak. Genetics more or less has shown what I've always expected:



I can't help to think its somewhat of a trumped up internet thing. The more pressing issue is why so hyper sexed up all the time?

Well the location of the Philippines is far from any other European countries so most of the European that came to the Philippines were men during the 16th century. It takes more than 3 months from Americas or Europe to get in the Philippines and some of these Europeans didn't even make it due to the distance while they were in a ship so some of them died during the trip. My French GGG Grandfather came in when the Suez Canal was opened because it takes only less than 3 months to get in the Philippines, these was mostly during the early or middle of 19th century, when they open the Philippines to the other Europeans.

Most of them they open up their own business and I guess they would like to try their luck in the Pearl of the Orient. My GGG Grandfather open up a winery shop in Escolta & married my Filipina GGG Grandmother.

[Vesuvian Sky]

Well the location of the Philippines is far from any other European countries so most of the European that came to the Philippines were men during the 16th century. It takes more than 3 months from Americas or Europe to get in the Philippines and some of these Europeans didn't even make it due to the distance while they were in a ship so some of them died during the trip

Quite honestly, I don't see too much European in the phenotypes of the Philippine people I've met over the years unless they are say from half Irish American half Filipino house background like one guy I know. But he's of course an American descended from such a mix. Regardless, most I've met directly from the Philippines don't look like him.

[clete27]

You know nothing, Jon Snow.

The identity crisis caused by the 170 different ethnic groups in the Philippines is not something you know about and it's definitely not what you were referring to in your first post..

[Dictator]

The identity crisis caused by the 170 different ethnic groups in the Philippines is not something you know about and it's definitely not what you were referring to in your first post..

Yes, because only filipinos can know that there are more than 100 different ethnic groups and whatever.

[simple]

Quite honestly, I don't see too much European in the phenotypes of the Philippine people I've met over the years unless they are say from half Irish American half Filipino house background like one guy I know. But he's of course an American descended from such a mix. Regardless, most I've met directly from the Philippines don't look like him.

Here are some of them from Toto Gonzalez Blog, I think I met him in forumbiodiversity and surprised to know he knew my GGG Grandfather too ...

quite a few in the business community in the Philippines (commerce, shipping, banking, real estate, agriculture, media, etc.) are descended from families from northern Spain (mostly Basque).

Quite a few are from Navarra (Navarre) and established themselves among the merchant elite in Manila and the sugar barons of the Visayas: Elizalde, Legarda, Arrieta, Arlegui, Lizárraga, Belzunce, Echarri, Arrastia, Arraiza, Echegoyen, Oquiñena.

In Manila, many of the old merchant families and civil servants were from the Basque Country of northern Spain. Many were also recruited to work in the Filipino-Basque, Navarrese, and Spanish-owned businesses, such as Ynchausti y Compañía, Elizalde and Company, Aldecoa y Compañía, Sociedad Lizárraga Hermanos, the Jai-Alai Frontón, Compañía General de Tabacos de Filipinas, the San Miguel Corporation, etc.: de Azcárraga, Azaola, Gorostiza, Irastorza (Yrastorza), de Ynchausti, Yrisarry, Teus, Zabarte, de Ayala, Zangróniz, Aguirre, Menchatorre, de Otadui, Gorricho, de Larrañaga, Mondragón, de Irureta-Goyena, Salazar, Arando, Vergara, de Zuzuarregui, de Zulueta, de Yriarte (Iriarte), de Gárriz, de Ubago, Olondriz, Tamayo, Oteyza, Echevarría, Yrezábal, Costas, de Azparren, Iturralde, de Rotaeche, de Egozcue, Aurrecoechea, de Tellechea, de Zaracondegui, de Barainka, Larrabeiti, de Egurrola, de Eiguren, de Amusategui, de Erenchun, de Jauregui, de Leguina, Gamegoicoechea, Dampierre, Urra, Daudén, de Loyzaga, de Ibazeta, Eizmendi, Eleizegui, de Larrazábal, Ibañez de Aldecoa, Trápaga, Matute, Artadi, Goitia, Got, Mendieta, Maldonado, de Sarasola, Loinaz, García, Malluquiza, de Argarate, de Garteiz, Guixasola, Guerrero.

In the Bicol Region, many immigrants from northern Spain joined the trading firms (originally abaca and copra) operating there or established their own haciendas: de Ursúa, Garchitorena, Barrenechea, Zuluaga, Alegría, Oturbe, Larrauri, Achával, Michelena, Anduiza, Barainca, Espinosa, Zubeldia, Goitisolo, de Madarieta, Anzorandia, del Gallego.

In the Western Visayas, one finds some very old Basque mestizo clans in Iloilo (e.g., Araneta), in addition to 19th and 20th century immigrants from the Basque Country who established a great many of the modern sugar plantations on the island of Negros (most of these families are still fixtures in Negrense society): Araneta, Zaldarriaga, Gonzaga, Ruíz de Luzuriaga, Gallaga, Gálatas, Echauz, Aldecoa, Arnáiz, Arrieta, Amiscaray, Baena, Larena, de Ugalde, Ballesteros, de Salutregui, Azcona, de Ysasi, de Elordi, Bilbao, Callejo, Sagarbarría, Goñi, Barrica, Gurrea, Zabaljauregui, de Gamboa, Llantada, Arteabarro, Gamboa, Uriarte, Erquiaga, Zamacona, Barrena, Sangróniz, Azarloza, Rotaeche, Muñoa, Bengoechea, Zabaleta, Zubiri, Idirin, de Uriondo, de Telleria, Zabala, Arteta, Larrabeiti, Vidaurrazaga, Gurrucharri, Aburto, Sarasola, Ormarementería, Imaz, Flamarique, de Sagastasola, Anchustegui, Echano-Jauregui, Inchausti, Inunciaga, Mendiola, Escalante, Menchaca, Urquijo, Cincunigui (Zincunigui).

In the Eastern and Central Visayas, many Basque immigrants became involved in the abaca trade and shipping industries. The epicenter of this society would eventually shift from Samar and Leyte to Cebu, where most are still found among the region’s business leaders: Yrastorza, Aboitiz, Moraza, Mendieta, Mendezona, Garamendi, Ugarte, Uriarte, Arizaleta, Muertegui, Gorordo, Larrazábal, Herranz, Gárriz, Urrutia, Losada, Ayesa, Antúnez, Guibelondo, Garavilla, Aberasturi, Pando, Ibarlucea, Larrañaga.

In Mindanao, one also finds several well-known Basque families: Ozámiz, Iruasegui, Urquiaga, Achondoa.

And then there are the Asturian families in the Philippines: Roces, Balmori, de la Riva.

Lastly, some families that are descended from immigrants from Spain might actually trace their ancestry to regions in France:
Cabarrús, Cuisia, Duterte, de Oglou.

Spanish mestizo families of French descent that came by way of Spain (e.g., Prieto — Mauro St. was named in honor of Don Mauro Prieto y Gorricho, by the way). It seems that the families you mentioned above are descended from immigrants from France (or French colonies)… Henry Lhuillier (Henri L’Huillier) was an immigrant from France who had also lived in Vietnam, which is where his son Michel was born. The Gaston family of Negros is descended from French agronomist Yves Leopold Germain Gaston, who was brought over to the Philippines by Don Domingo Roxas from Mauritius (at the time, Mauritius was producing 10x the amount of sugar produced in the entire Philippine Islands!). Kahn family patriarch Leopoldo Kahn was actually an immigrant from France (an Alsatian). The old, prominent Perrenoud and Elzingre (who left France for Switzerland before coming to the Philippines and are relatives of the famous French Dumas family) clans are other well-known families in the Philippines of French ancestry. The Spanish-French Arcellier family members are cousins of the Roxas family. I know nothing about the Maihler family…

BTW, the old Pellicer family is originally of Catalán descent — not French.

The Lammoglia family was Italian. It is likely that the old Spanish mestizo Aldanese (one of the genuine, older Spanish mestizo families of Cebu), Guidotti (not to be confused with the Guidote Spanish mestizo family), and Piccio families trace their ancestry to Italy. Of course, the famous Badolato family (cousins of the old Gonzáles-Azaola-de Oglou-Pardo de Tavera-Cacho-Castillejo-Araneta-Cojuangco, de las Cagigas-Jugo, Rodríguez, Sanz, etc. clans) immigrated to Spain from Calabria, Italy before setting sail for the Philippines during the colonial period. Although it is certainly possible, the very old Borromeo clan of the Visayas is unlikely Italian. Actually, it’s somewhat of a mystery as to whether they were originally from Spain (though they would later marry into many prominent Spanish mestizo clans from the Visayas and Manila). Of course, De la Rama Steamship Co. President and General Manager Enrico Pirovano was Italian (he was also murdered by the Kempetei at Ft. Santiago during the Second World War for his involvement in the Philippine resistance).

Actually, several of the German mestizo families. Among the old German mestizo families one finds the Roensch (proprietors of A. Roensch y Cía, whose famous Spanish-German member Adolfo Roensch was a long-time A. Soriano & Co. executive), Richter (proprietors of A. Richter y Cía, which was later taken over along with A. Roensch y Cía by Brías Roxas y Cía), Faustmann, Oppen, Koch, von Kauffmann (Fritz von Kauffmann was a Managing Partner of Elizalde and Company — they would even intermarry), Loewinsohn-Mohr, Ganz, Kummer, Karuth, Mossesgeld, etc. clans. Actually, the early Zóbels were the business partners of Gustav Grupe and Julius Nohr in the Philippines. Actually, they were part of a significant group of German immgrant who came to the Philippines in the 19th century to enter the pharmacy business: http://www.karl-prokop.de/Botica_Boie/botica_boie.html. Incidentally, the Zóbels had relatives in both Germany and Denmark. There were also a number of families descended from 19th century Danish merchants in Manila and Iloilo who married into the Spanish mestizo families there: Klar, the far-flung Kierulf clan (relatives of the de Carlès, Aldeguer, Preysler, etc. families), etc. Of course, Manila not only had an active German Club (located beside the Casino Español), but also an active Swiss Club. There were also a number of Swiss in Iloilo in the late 1800s: Frederick Luchsinger, Charles and Samuel Bischoff, Paul Wuthrich, and the Jeanjaquet brothers ran businesses there. The firms Kuenzle & Streiff, Inc. and A.C. Lutz & Co. (later Lutz & Zuellig and then F.E. Zuellig, Inc.) also had offices in Iloilo. The Ayala Foundation’s Filipinas Heritage Foundation published “Meine Lieben: Swiss Letters from the Philippines” not too long ago. Of course, the famous Alhambra brand cigars were from a Swiss (not Spanish!) cigar company founded in Manila in 1898. Recent Swiss and German expats seem to still be involved in the Philippine Cigar retail business…

As for the Manila/San Juan families, the Aenlle clan is also one of the old Catalán families in Manila.

old Basque mestizo de Marcaida clan of Manila (the descendents of merchant Don Ángel de Marcaida).

Ibarra is too common a name in the Philippines. As for the Liquete clan, the father of former family patriarch Don Leoncio González Liquete (the famous journalist, historian, and Filipinologist) was definitely a Spaniard.

Arrastia clan is very much alive (well, in Spain and Australia, in particular). Actually, there are quite a few in Pampanga still who trace their lineage to the sons of Valentín Arrastia y Roncal —

http://remembranceofthingsawry.wordp...panish-manila/

One of the grand daughter of my GGG Grandparents married to one of the Badolato family member in the Philippines, Italian Mestizo family who has strong European background


The Genealogy of Badolato family clan in the Philippines
http://jamiesonlapp.familytreeguide....ND00054&tree=2

So he is also related to the Sanz family of Visayas

some retain European features because they got more European genes, well the mixing in the Philippines has malay, negrito, sangley and they have more high percentage when it comes to population but a lot of them they also have descended that doesn't look like what you wanted to see. Because some of these European Mestizo descended married to the other Filipino population and the features will diluted if not maintain.

Like one of the Gonzalez family member of Bulacan

^you won't probably see their European features anymore or some of these descendant member of the Gonzalez because it was already diluted.

[RMuller]

Also, do you know what you get when you mix an East Asian person with a European one?

This.



~Daniel Sitterle from Hapavoices
http://hapavoice.com/2010/08/12/korean-french/

He's French-Korean. And he looks like an ordinary Filipino.


Just some random Filipino dude I randomly Googled.

Half East Asian-white mixes don't look Filipino at all. Filipinos have to much Aeta-negrito.

Rex Walters half Japanese/white


Maria Ozawa half Japanese/French Canadian

[RMuller]

Quite honestly, I don't see too much European in the phenotypes of the Philippine people I've met over the years unless they are say from half Irish American half Filipino house background like one guy I know. But he's of course an American descended from such a mix. Regardless, most I've met directly from the Philippines don't look like him.

European blood among Filipinos is rare. Only 1% of the Filipino population has a tiny tiny tiny drop of Spanish blood.
The rest are a mix of Austronesean,Austroloid,Papuan,Negrito and Aeta .

[Vesuvian Sky]

Autosomal breakdowns for Filipino groups based on language from Dinekes analysis:



Ilocano
African: 0
W. Eurasian: 0.2
Australoid: 34.5
SE Asian: 3.8
E. Asian: 61.5

Visaya
African: 0.2
W. Eurasian: 2.6
Australoid: 33.8
SE Asian: 8.2
E. Asian: 55.3

Tagalog
African: 0.1
W. Eurasian: 0.9
Australoid: 29.9
SE Asian: 7.4
E. Asian: 61.7

Very little W. Eurasian influence which is a very broadly defined category mind you.

It peaks at 11.4 among Ayta. Though for most ethnicity its well below that. Source:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...CN7mhq0E#gid=0