Expansionist maps

[Jarl]

Grad Większa Polska!

Jawohl!









Whopsie!


Here we go!



Vindico Polabie! Laus ut Germania Slavica!




P.S.


This one is nice too:



Slavic toponyms in Austria!

and Germany:




Uch ach! We don't even need to convert you! You are all krypto-Slavs anyway!

[Jarl]

Now, Ladies and Gentlemen!


Especially...



...for the famed pinnacle of German magnanimosity...



...Herr Zyklopp!




Introducing (yes, oh yes!)....




Bavaria Slavica!




http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bavaria_Slavica

[Zyklop]

Introducing (yes, oh yes!)....

Bavaria Slavica!

Cool, but I wonder what makes these Slavic regions specifically Polish. Why not Czech for example? Wanking off to Panslavia again?

Nice one too:

[Jarl]

Cool, but I wonder what makes these Slavic regions specifically Polish. Why not Czech for example? Wanking off to Panslavia again?

Nice one too:

Bavaria Slavica was indeed ethnically and linguistically closer to the Czechoslovakian, or perhaps Serbolusatian group.


However, everything East of the Elbe and North of the Spree was exactly of the very same Lechitic stock as the tribes that later formed the Polish nation. In fact, both the Obodrites and the Veleti came to Germania Slavica from Western Poland in VII-VIII centuries, bearing a very similar type of material culture and language, quite distinct to the more Southerly Serbolusatian and Czech-Bohemian cultures.

Still in XV century, a famous Polish historian - Dlugossus wrote that the whole Western Pomerania (by that time still an independent state ruled by a local Pomeranian dynasty, related to Polish Piasts) once spoke in the "Polish tongue" though, "corrupted by German".


Look at the vicinity of Schwerin. At Eastern Mecklenburg and find me German village names. You will get a handful at most... in an ocean of Grabows ,Gustrows, Rambows, and other toponyms which can be found exactly the same in Pomerania and Polonia.


Not to mention the whole Vorpommern. Particulalry the islands of Rugen and Usedom, which are principally germanised Polabian strongholds. The ducal house of Western Pomerania and the princes of Rugen were related to Piasts. In fact, Pomeranian dukes bore the same coat of arms as some of the most famous Polish noble houses -the Griffin.


Havelan/Stodoran duke Jaksa was most likely from Lesser Poland nobility. He also sought refuge in Poland after the demise of his domain. After the Northern crusades many Obodrites and Sprewians took refuge or were sold as slaves (by Germans and Danes) to the Polish Piast principalities.

[poiuytrewq0987]

[Jarl]

That Mesco ruled Pomerania and Wolin, while his son - Boleslaw I became the ruler of Lusatia and Milzen - is a well known fact mentioned by German, Czech and Polish chronicles alike. His great-great-grandson Boleslaw Wrymouth became the ruler of whole Pomerania.


In fact - unification of Western Pomerania under the Griffin dynasty was possible only because the Griffins became vassals of the duke of Poland with his full political and military support.

It was Boleslaw who enforced and promoted Christianity in Pomerania and supported Pomeranian raids against Danes and Norwegians (like sacking of Konungahela). Thanks to Boleslaw's, Eastern Pomerania (Pomerelia) became for long an integral Polish domain. Western Pomerania maintained close linke with Poland.

Still in XIV century there were serious plans for unification of Western Pomerania and Poland, designed by the Pomeranian duke Casimir IV and king Casimir the Great. The last Polish king of the "indigenous" Piast dynasty, leaving no heir, wanted to pass the rights to the Polish throne onto the Griffin duke.

This was strongly supported by the nobility of Greater Poland. However, a different faction took lead in the kingdom and in the aftermath the Luxembourgs and the Jagiellonians were elected.


So why the Sorbs were indeed a separate ethnic group. Related both to Czechs and Lechites. The Polabians - Obodrites and Veleti - were Lechites. Exactly the same as Mazovians, Polans, Kashubians or Silesians. Only, they did not make it until XIX century and national awakening. Quite unfortunately...

[poiuytrewq0987]

That Mesco ruled Pomerania and Wolin, while his son - Boleslaw I became the ruler of Lusatia and Milzen. His great-great-grandson Boleslaw Wrymouth became the ruler of whole Pomerania.

So why the Sorbs were indeed a separate ethnic group. Related both to Czechs and Lechites. The Polabians - Obodrites and Veleti - were Lechites. Exactly the same as Mazovians, Polans, Kashubians or Silesians. Only, they did not make it until XIX century and national awakening. Quite unfortunately...

I find it rather interesting that the Sorbs never formed their own separate country.

[Jarl]

I find it rather interesting that the Sorbs never formed their own separate country.

By the time they underwent the national awakening in XIX century, they were already strongly germanised and utterly dependent on Germany. There was nobody else they could turn to and hope for support. XIX century was an unfrotunate time for Sorbs. Poles and Czechs were themselves being expropriated and germanised on their very own soils. However, after WW I and WW II Sorbs campaigned for autonomy, and even for support from Poland and Czech Rep. This was unsuccesful. Lloyd George feared weakning Germany too much would tip the balance in favour of France. He even objected to most cessions for Poland.

Later on, Stalin did not see any purpose in independen Lusatia. There were no gains from it. He chose to support his little puppet DDR instead as his "model" of socialism.


Lusatia:




Polabians were germanised long before that. Only Wendland Slavs (WEST of Elbe) held until XVIII century. By then their language was very corrupted. Interstingly, Wendish died out very quickly. Within a single or two generations.


What is fascinating. By the end of XVIII century, there were still 500 people in Luneburg kreis who would still consider themselves as "Wends". Even though they would not speak the native tongue.


However Polabians were simple rural folk. Their leaders became germanised. Niklot gave rise to the house of Mecklenburg-Sterlitz and its off-shoots. His descendants are still alive. Wizlaw and the house of Rugen also quickly became germanised.


The politcal pressures from the Saxon nobles and bishops was immense. Yet in his last will Wizlaw expressed his concern and asked his descendants to "look after" his "Wendish citizens". Pomeranian dukes maintained close links to Poland until XV century. Even during the reign of Jagiellonians Pomerania was within the sphere of Polish influence. For some timpe the Duchy of Western Pomernia - Slupsk (Stolp) was a Polish fief.


However, XV and XVI century brought the end to this. Polabians became germanised. They slowly blended with the Saxon colonists. Their elites lost interest in ethnic purity. They have never really even expressed it - often looking more to their personal benefits coming from orgasnised taxed German settlements.

[Zyklop]

These regions were sparsely populated in the early medieval period, calling them Slavic "strongholds" is a bit far fetched. So is claiming every toponym with the elements wend and wind or the suffix -ow as Slavic. The first are common German words and are found in place-names all across Germany:




Additionally there are also places in West Germany going by the ending -ow without having indication of Slavic settlement, like the district Spradow in North Rhine Westphalia, which indicates that -ow often is just a different form of German -au (Germanic ahwo/ouwe) describing a watery region.

[Jarl]

Sparsely populated? Zyklop, the truth is that Western Pomerania had a Slavic majority.

Rugen and Western Pomerania:



(it is from a German website).



These are facts.



Slavic settlements of Mecklenburg and Wagrien. This is a tiny fraction. I could not be asked to tag everything. Soon I realised it is not even feasible using google maps.



You also saw the other map I posted on previous page.


Fehrman about 50% Slavic villages.

Usedom and Rugen about 75-88% Slavic toponyms.