Norwegian Muslims volunteer to protect synagogue

[King Claus]

For what exactlyyy?

you're always desperately trying to proof that muslims are saints

[Methmatician]

you're always desperately trying to proof that muslims are saints

Where?

[LightHouse89]

Well I an think of a way as this might backfire.

[Anglojew]

We've already discussed this verse in another thread a while back. Though I don't agree with the jizya or any society entirely based on religion this particular verse does not apply to non-Muslims outside Muslim lands. It only applied to those living in the Islamic State in the time of Muhammad. You could argue that ISIS is the continuation of this but most Muslims reject their legitimacy. If they didn't ISIS wouldn't be at war with Muslims.


This is taken from The Book Pertaining to the Turmoil and Portents of the Last Hour (Kitab Al-Fitan wa Ashrat As-Sa'ah). It describes the signs that indicate the coming of 'the final hour'. I don't know how well you read that paragraph but it says that a stone or a tree will talk to a Muslim and lie to him because it's a Jewish stone or tree It's not a command to kill Jews otherwise the Muslims would be killing Turks as well:

Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The Last Hour would not come until the Muslims fight with the Turks-a people whose faces would be like hammered shields wearing clothes of hair and walking (with shoes) of hair.

I highly doubt you're going to change the Islamic theological view on this but you can teach Muslims to respect separation of Church and State and explain the benefits of a secular society in the same way it was taught to Christians (well it was more forced but still). However, truly secular countries are not common. Many Christian countries and Christians (mainly in Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and Africa) believe that Christianity needs a role in politics. This doesn't cause violence even though I don't agree with. Even our 'secular' Australian government is not completely secular.


Surah 3:7

It is He who has sent down to you, [O Muhammad], the Book; in it are verses [that are] precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation [suitable to them]. And no one knows its [true] interpretation except God. But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All [of it] is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding.

For what exactlyyy?

The fact remains millions of Muslims support violent Jihad, and hundreds of thousands take part in it, based on verses like this. Those Jihadists may or may not be misinterpreting Islam but arguing with me quoting the interpretations of verses THEY USE to support this behaviour will not change this. You need to convince them of the error of their ways not me for just quoting their own justification for such violence.

This video goes addresses this verse and your argument:

[Furnace]

The headline makes no sense, it should be: "Muslims living in Norway" instead of "Norwegian muslims".

Hajrad Arshad doesn't sound Norwegian to me.

[Dandelion]

The headline makes no sense, it should be: "Muslims living in Norway" instead of "Norwegian muslims".

Hajrad Arshad doesn't sound Norwegian to me.

Common sense indeed. Citizenship is different from ethnicity (and by saying that you haven't insulted nor discriminated anyone). I doubt this is bound to change though. Almost all of the muslim population in Europe are a result from immigration not from conversion. But even this obvious fact is considered politically incorrect or borderlines it.

[Anglojew]

Basically there's some sort of an inter-Islamic debate between those that want to attack Jews and those that don't (unless, as Meth says, they live in an Islamic State).

[Methmatician]

The fact remains millions of Muslims support violent Jihad, and hundreds of thousands take part in it, based on verses like this. Those Jihadists may or may not be misinterpreting Islam but arguing with me quoting the interpretations of verses THEY USE to support this behaviour will not change this. You need to convince them of the error of their ways not me for just quoting their own justification for such violence.

But the research shows that the theology is not the source of religious extremism. So if they have extremist beliefs regardless of what the Quran says then changing the Quran isn't going to do anything. They're just going to reject it and continue to claim to be the 'true Muslims'.

Changing anything about Islam is not going to get rid of of Islamic terrorism. If anything, it might increase because of it. That doesn't mean that reforming Islam is a bad thing, just that it will do very little to stop people like ISIS and the young Western Muslims who don't even understand the religion that well in the first place.

[Wadaad]

the silent majority strikes again...stay silent, stay the majority.

[Dandelion]

But the research shows that the theology is not the source of religious extremism. So if they have extremist beliefs regardless of what the Quran says then changing the Quran isn't going to do anything. They're just going to reject it and continue to claim to be the 'true Muslims'.

Changing anything about Islam is not going to get rid of of Islamic terrorism. If anything, it might increase because of it. That doesn't mean that reforming Islam is a bad thing, just that it will do very little to stop people like ISIS and the young Western Muslims who don't even understand the religion that well in the first place.

No one is talking about changing the Qur'an. Changing the Qur'an is impossible, because it would make it 'not the Qur'an'.