Why are English-sounding Welsh people much more commonplace than English-sounding Scots?

[Graham]

What do you mean by this?

Scottish identity has strengthened and that goes with Scots dialect.

[Not a Cop]

Scottish identity has strengthened and that goes with Scots dialect.

What was identity before? More British?

[Andullero]

I thought I would revive this debate, having earlier today seen Welsh footballer Aaron Ramsey being interviewed on TV. Despite being from Caerphilly (I have visited the town - it is hardcore Valleys), he sounds like a weird London-Yorkshire hybrid.

Anyway, my two hypotheses are:

(1) Scots tend to be more nationalistic and proud than the Welsh, thus are more likely to retain their accents even when outside their homeland.
(2) Scottish accents diverge much more from Received Pronunciation than do Welsh ones in the first place, thus they are more obvious even in their mildest forms and harder to lose.

Scotland is in reality the merging of three different groups: 1. The original Scots people, which crossed from the Irish sea and took the West of the country, with which they formed the kingdom of Dal Riata with their brethen across the strait. 2. The Picts, which occupied the East of the country and 3. The Welsh remnants to the South, which were fleeing from the Saxon advance and consolidation in England proper, and which would form the ephemeral kingdom of Strathclyde in the South of the country, on the border between Scotland and Northumbría.

[Graham]

What was identity before? More British?

yeah. The Scots identity was always there. The "Scottish cringe" is dying off.

[Not a Cop]

yeah. The Scots identity was always there. The "Scottish cringe" is dying off.

I guess British-English identity was considered more prestigious while Scottish had a rural hillybilly conatations to it?

[JamesBond007]

I thought I would revive this debate, having earlier today seen Welsh footballer Aaron Ramsey being interviewed on TV. Despite being from Caerphilly (I have visited the town - it is hardcore Valleys), he sounds like a weird London-Yorkshire hybrid.

Anyway, my two hypotheses are:

(1) Scots tend to be more nationalistic and proud than the Welsh, thus are more likely to retain their accents even when outside their homeland.
(2) Scottish accents diverge much more from Received Pronunciation than do Welsh ones in the first place, thus they are more obvious even in their mildest forms and harder to lose.

1.) Welsh is a celtic language not Germanic even if Welsh speak English like the Irish now

2.) Scots is a Germanic closer to olde English than RP so saying RP is more 'English sounding' is not technically correct at least in a certain sense.

[Tooting Carmen]

1.) Welsh is a celtic language not Germanic even if Welsh speak English like the Irish now

2.) Scots is a Germanic closer to olde English than RP so saying RP is more 'English sounding' is not technically correct at least in a certain sense.

Scots Gaelic, as opposed to Scots, is just as Celtic as Welsh is.

[Andullero]

1.) Welsh is a celtic language not Germanic even if Welsh speak English like the Irish now

2.) Scots is a Germanic closer to olde English than RP so saying RP is more 'English sounding' is not technically correct at least in a certain sense.

Nope. All three foundational groups of Scotland (Scots, Picts and Northern Welsh) were Celtic. The only outliers are the mutts in the Orkney islands (which are basically Celtic Nordics from the union of Scandos and native Celts during the Viking era) and the people of the Isle of Man.

[JamesBond007]

Scots Gaelic, as opposed to Scots, is just as Celtic as Welsh is.

True, but there is more sheep than people in the highlands and I don't think all of the highlands is Gaelic speaking, anyway, since I don't think they speak Gaelic in the Orkneys for instance.

Anyway, there is definitely a legitimate argument to be made that Scots is more English sounding than RP due to Scots being more closely aligned to Olde English.

[Tooting Carmen]

yeah. The Scots identity was always there. The "Scottish cringe" is dying off.

But juxtaposed with that is the more generalised trend where people move around more, watch more TV, are more educated and adopt a more 'global' identity than in the past, where we basically speak American mixed with RP, isn't there?