Debate religion/God with me

**poiuytrewq0987** · 06-13-2015, 05:09 AM

I don't know if there is a God. There is no way to verify whether there is one or not. I do love how Christianity has brought order to our chaotic lives and I thank God for it.

**Desaix DeBurgh** · 06-13-2015, 05:12 AM

Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

Loki, what debate is there?

There isn't any, there's just stupid people and not stupid people. Debating against them is like debating people who believe the earth isn't flat.

Yeah, as arrogant as that may sound to some that pretty much sums it up. Arguing with religious people is usually a waste of time because on average they are pretty dumb IQ wise.

Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

Although, I do like watching Richard Dawkins waste his time debating some American Religious nuts and Muslims.

It sucks that America is so religious and has more in common with some third world countries in that regard than NorthEast Asia and parts of Europe. Pretty sad and pathetic really.

**Loki** · 06-13-2015, 05:13 AM

Originally Posted by Polk

I don't know if there is a God. There is no way to verify whether there is one or not. I do love how Christianity has brought order to our chaotic lives and I thank God for it.

One good thing about religion is that it provides a feeling of belonging to a community. Like an instant circle of friends. Atheists don't have that. I actually lost a lot of friends when I became an atheist, but it was my decision and I would not have had it otherwise. I'm not going to live a lie just to fit into a community.

**~~Anthony PV~~** · 06-13-2015, 05:20 AM

Originally Posted by Loki

One good thing about religion is that it provides a feeling of belonging to a community. Like an instant circle of friends. Atheists don't have that. I actually lost a lot of friends when I became an atheist, but it was my decision and I would not have had it otherwise. I'm not going to live a lie just to fit into a community.

Did your friends reject you simply because you stated to them that you don't believe in the existence of a transcendant divinity? Or because you alienated them by saying stuff like 'atheists are smart and religious ppl are stupid'?

**XenophobicPrussian** · 06-13-2015, 05:26 AM

Originally Posted by Loki

No, not really.

It's not as simple as that. Do not discount the influence of being indoctrinated from youth by your parents/community. I myself was religious for a long time, but eventually I broke away from that, thanks to my critical thinking skills/habits. And it would have been more difficult if I was still in South Africa -- where atheists are basically shunned by society in general.

I agree with you, though, that the most intelligent people would [eventually] be or become non-theists. However it does not help the debate when you call religious people stupid. It would just cause them to erect an emotional barrier, and they would stop listening to your arguments.

Yup, that's true. Dawkins said the same thing(your last sentence), and he toned down his debating methods. He used to call people out right idiots and such, lol. Of course early indoctrination has a lot to do with it but I'm pretty sure most atheists today were also raised as Catholics/Protestants/Buddhists, etc.

I also agree with your point that it creates a sense of community, but I think making people care about race(we were on that track in the 1920s before it got irrelevant) can do the same thing, along with other things like language/culture/ethnicity/etc..

I actually think whether Religion is better or not for humanity is a much more interesting debate. Like, if I thought it did more good than bad, I would promote Religion very well knowing isn't true. I have no idea about this, Dawkins thinks Religion isn't better or has caused harm for humanity and I'm not sure I agree with that, specifically talking about the past.

I do still sort of respect Protestantism or Protestant culture(even though I was raised a Catholic, since Canada is majority Catholic and Catholic schools are rated the highest, my mom was Catholic, dad was raised Protestant, they're still Christian culturally but pretty sure their beliefs are agnostic), but that doesn't mean it's true. I wouldn't give up cultural stuff like Christmas and such though, no way.

**Loki** · 06-13-2015, 05:28 AM

Originally Posted by Anthony PV

Did your friends reject you simply because you stated to them that you don't believe in the existence of a transcendant divinity? Or because you alienated them by saying stuff like 'atheists are smart and religious ppl are stupid'?

The first. I am not that arrogant to tell them the second.

By the way, this does not only include friends, but also family members. I am the only atheist in my family. This has caused a lot of painful arguments, mostly by them attacking me. Even stooping as low as telling me I'm going to hell.

**poiuytrewq0987** · 06-13-2015, 05:31 AM

Originally Posted by Loki

The first. I am not that arrogant to tell them the second.

By the way, this does not only include friends, but also family members. I am the only atheist in my family. This has caused a lot of painful arguments, mostly by them attacking me. Even stooping as low as telling me I'm going to hell.

I don't think Christians should tell others how to live their lives. Rather respect their decision and move on.

**Loki** · 06-13-2015, 05:35 AM

Incidentally, the concept of hell (eternal torment) does not exist in the Old Testament. As Christopher Hitchens phrased it, hell "was first introduced by gentle Jesus meek and mild" in the New Testament.

**Desaix DeBurgh** · 06-13-2015, 05:37 AM

Originally Posted by XenophobicPrussian

Yup, that's true. Dawkins said the same thing(your last sentence), and he toned down his debating methods. He used to call people out right idiots and such, lol. Of course early indoctrination has a lot to do with it but I'm pretty sure most atheists today were also raised as Catholics/Protestants/Buddhists, etc.

I also agree with your point that it creates a sense of community, but I think making people care about race(we were on that track in the 1920s before it got irrelevant) can do the same thing, along with other things like language/culture/ethnicity/etc..

I actually think whether Religion is better or not for humanity is a much more interesting debate. Like, if I thought it did more good than bad, I would promote Religion very well knowing isn't true. I have no idea about this, Dawkins thinks Religion isn't better or has caused harm for humanity and I'm not sure I agree with that, specifically talking about the past.

I do still sort of respect Protestantism or Protestant culture(even though I was raised a Catholic, since Canada is majority Catholic and Catholic schools are rated the highest, my mom was Catholic, dad was raised Protestant, they're still Christian culturally but pretty sure their beliefs are agnostic), but that doesn't mean it's true. I wouldn't give up cultural stuff like Christmas and such though, no way.

I was raised Catholic but no amount inculcation at on early age could keep me from being skeptical enough to eventually become an atheist thanks to my superior ethnic French intellect (tongue-in-cheek kind of but my IQ is in the superior range). Religion is just sheer bullshit you have to be outright stupid to believe it.

**poiuytrewq0987** · 06-13-2015, 05:40 AM

Originally Posted by Desaix DeBurgh

I was raised Catholic but not amount inculcation at on early age could keep me from being skeptical enough to eventually become an atheist thanks to my superior ethnic French intellect (tongue-in-cheek kind of but my IQ is in the superior range). Religion is just sheer bullshit you have to be outright stupid to believe it.

Christianity is great for guidelines, morals and a way of life. I think everyone should be raised a Christian but it doesn't mean they have to be a Christian the rest of their lives but a good person perhaps.