Which language is more similar to Catalan? Occitan or Castillian?

[AphroditeWorshiper]

Occitano-Romance languages







anyone information? thanks

[wvwvw]

I like the first better

[AphroditeWorshiper]

please, anyone?

[Mens-Sarda]

Catalan and Occitan are basically the same language, they were divided in the middle ages by national borders, but they remain much closer than Catalan and Castillan

[AphroditeWorshiper]

Catalan and Occitan are basically the same language, they were divided in the middle ages by national borders, but they remain much closer than Catalan and Castillan

one Spanish member says one time that understands perfectly Catalan, so I was wondering, since Occitan and Catalan have the same origin, I would like to know who is more similar, thanks!

[Mens-Sarda]

one Spanish member says one time that understands perfectly Catalan, so I was wondering, since Occitan and Catalan have the same origin, I would like to know who is more similar, thanks!

surely a Spaniard can be quite used to hear Catalan sometimes and is not very difficult for them, but in matter of resemblance, Catalan and Occitan are really close, in middle ages they couldn't be distinguished one from another, just after they were separated by national borders that they were distinguished as Catalan and Occitan

example, a table taken from Wikipedia with various phrases in many Romance languages, I just added Sardinian to make a comparison

Italian	French	Occitan	Catalan (Mallorca)	Sardinian (northern)
Tritate la carne alla macchina (o chiedete al macellaio di farlo)	Hachez les viandes à la machine (ou demandez au boucher de le faire)	Passar las carns a la maquina de capolar (o demandatz al carnsaladièr d'o far)	Passar les carns a la màquina de capolar (o demanau al carnisser de fer-ho)	Maghinade sa petta in sa macchina (o domandade a su masellaju de lu fàghere)
Mescolate tutti gli ingredienti del ripieno	Mélangez tous les ingrédients de la farce	Barrejar totes los ingredients del fars	Barrejar tots els ingredients de la farsa	Misciade totus sos ingredientes de s'imbuttidura
Stendere la lepre su un buon pezzo di garza (la si può comprare in farmacia)	Etendre le lièvre sur un bon morceau de gaze (on peut en acheter en pharmacie)	Espandir la lèbre sus un bon tròç de gasa (se pòt crompar en farmacia)	Estendre la llebre davall un bon troç de gasa (se pot comprar en apotecaria)	Istérrere su lépere ind'unu bellu bìcculu de garza (si pódet comporare in s'abutica)
Distribuire il ripieno su tutta la lunghezza dell'animale, e avvolgerlo nella garza	Répartir la farce sur toute la longueur de l'animal, l'enrouler dans la gaze	Repartir lo fars sus tota la longor de l'animal, lo rotlar dins la gasa	Repartir la farsa sobre tota la llargària, enrodillar-lo dins la gasa	Ispàrghere s'imbuttidura pro tota sa longària de s'animale, e imboligàdelu cun sa garza
Legare senza stringere troppo. Far arrostire gli ingredienti al forno	Ficeler sans trop serrer. Faire rôtir les ingrédients au four	E ficelar pas tròp sarrat. Far rossir los ingredients pel fons de lums	Lligar sense estrènyer gaire. Fer rostir els ingredients dins el forn.	Ligare chena astrìnghere troppu. Fàghere arrustire sos ingredientes in su furru.

[AphroditeWorshiper]

Catalan and Occitan are basically the same language, they were divided in the middle ages by national borders, but they remain much closer than Catalan and Castillan

one curiosity:

The Occitano Romance languages are more similar to the languages that Romans brought to France and the Gallo Romance is more like a Romance/Celtic mix?

[Ouistreham]

Which language is more similar to Catalan? Occitan or Castillian?

Occitan.

Catalan and Occitan are basically the same language, they were divided in the middle ages by national borders, but they remain much closer than Catalan and Castillan

Right.
Written Catalan, Valencian and Central-Southern Occitan (which is said to be the purest form of that langage) are just dialects of each others.

one Spanish member says one time that understands perfectly Catalan

This is quite likely.

Catalan has undergone many influences from Castilian (it sounds Spanish, except it lacks the distinctive Spanish J-sound), while Occitan has been heavily influenced by French.

Hence a number of big phonetical differences: vowels are pronounced differently, word stressing is also different (Occitan ignores the palabras esdrugolas).

one curiosity:

The Occitano Romance languages are more similar to the languages that Romans brought to France and the Gallo Romance is more like a Romance/Celtic mix?

Difficult to say.
All Romance languages have inherited, to various extents, a number of grammatical features (and words) that never existed in Latin but are found in Celtic and/or Germanic languages.
It makes sense that such a synthesis might have taken place in the Occitan area which is at the heart of the Romance continuum. But no one can say.

Anyway, it's a dead core nowadays. Occitan has been reduced to a cluster of French dialects with a special accent, it's virtually dying out.

[Jehan]

Occitan isn't a language, it's a family of 6 locals dialects.
Sometimes Catalan is considers as an occitan language, so it's probably the closest.

[AphroditeWorshiper]

Occitan.


Right.
Written Catalan, Valencian and Central-Southern Occitan (which is said to be the purest form of that langage) are just dialects of each others.


This is quite likely.

Catalan has undergone many influences from Castilian (it sounds Spanish, except it lacks the distinctive Spanish J-sound), while Occitan has been heavily influenced by French.

Hence a number of big phonetical differences: vowels are pronounced differently, word stressing is also different (Occitan ignores the palabras esdrugolas).




Difficult to say.
All Romance languages have inherited, to various extents, a number of grammatical features (and words) that never existed in Latin but are found in Celtic and/or Germanic languages.
It makes sense that such a synthesis might have taken place in the Occitan area which is at the heart of the Romance continuum. But no one can say.

Anyway, it's a dead core nowadays. Occitan has been reduced to a cluster of French dialects with a special accent, it's virtually dying out.

Langues D'oïl and Franco Provençal seems to have a high Germanic/Celtic influence compared to the Occitan, this is why about the Romans question that I talk