View Poll Results: Are Estonians Scandinavians/Nordic?

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  • Ja!

    25 17.99%
  • Nej!

    75 53.96%
  • Karl!

    39 28.06%
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Thread: Are Estonians Scandinavians/Nordic?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    At the same time, Estonians live in a country which is geopolitically Baltic, but as people(cultural aspect), they're Nordic.
    Define a cultural Nordic, please.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voinstvennyi View Post
    The term, Nordic, is essentially an outgrowth of Scandinavism but the definition was never changed.
    Wrong. The term Nordic is far older than Scandinavism and used to be synonymous with Scandinavian or "North Germanic". It becoming a political-cultural term being applied to non-Scandinavian countries is an outgrowth of Scandinavism, though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Loki View Post
    Define a cultural Nordic, please.
    Look at Danish, Finnish and Swedish culture. Then think what makes their culture unique/Nordic and you have an answer.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    Look at Danish, Finnish and Swedish culture. Then think what makes their culture unique/Nordic and you have an answer.
    That would only be part of the answer, since we know that there is a vast difference between Germanic and Finnish culture.
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  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riippumatto View Post
    Weren't you just going on about how Northern Latvians are close to Estonians?
    Bad news to Karl - Northern Latvians aren't much different from Southern Latvians (Semigallians, Zemgalians) or Western Latvians (Curonians, Kurlandians). They all speak same middle-Latvian dialect

    Exception are coastal areas of Riga bay and most northern borderline regions, where people in past (little bit also still nowdays) spoke middle-Latvian dialect with Finnic (Livonian, Estonian) accent. This accent made speech to be somewhat different from middle-Latvian dialect, because in this speech were some specifics, which "ignored" Baltic language rules (division in genders, the endings of words, so that they didn't end with usual Latvian endings -s etc.). These kind of speech were called tāmnieku izloksnes, I don't know how the hell it could be called in English language, perhaps, Livonian dialects, but it makes confusion with Livonian language, so I would call perhaps as Tamnieku dialects? But even these dialects, as I said, generally were based on middle-Latvian dialect, just "made funnier" by people, who were Finnic, because they spoke with accent.

    So I told you about two Latvian dialects so far - middle Latvian dialect, which is spoken in Northern, Southern and Western areas, and which is closest to modern, normal Latvian language, and Tamnieku dialects, which were spoken by Livonian or Estonian people. But there is also third Latvian dialect, and it is Latgalian dialect. This dialect I consider as most different from normal Latvian language. And actually some people even call Latgalian dialect as seperate language, although I don't really agree. Middle Latvian dialect and Tamnieku dialect evolved in Lutheran areas, where main landlords were Germans, but Latgalian dialect evolved in Catholic areas.

    Latvian language


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    Quote Originally Posted by Aino View Post
    Estonians are not Scandinavians. However, they are northern Europeans, and more so than Scandinavians, who have all sorts of non-northern components in them.
    Like what?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Matuo View Post
    Bad news to Karl - Northern Latvians aren't much different from Southern Latvians (Semigallians, Zemgalians) or Western Latvians (Curonians, Kurlandians). They all speak same middle-Latvian dialect
    Your post about Latvian linguistics was nice, but I was talking about Northern-Latvians being Estonians and Livonians, in a genetic sense.

    I think that Latvians are the most Finnic, non-Finnic people.

    By some genetic researches, Latvians and Lithuanians have more Finno-Ugric Y-DNA than Estonians. I think that this can be explained by Estonians having 3 times more Scandinavian Y-DNA, which lowers the percentage of other Y-DNA haplogroups.

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    IMO eesti and soumen tasavalta form a group of their own. Including them in the same group than nordics, which are basically north germanic peoples is utterly discriminating.

    I like both Norsemen and Finns (spent 6 months there and fell inlove with the land)

    But they are two sepparate groups as are Lituanians and Latvians, and Poles, Czechs, Slovaks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Averrhoës View Post
    IMO eesti and soumen tasavalta form a group of their own. Including them in the same group than nordics, which are basically north germanic peoples is utterly discriminating.
    Scandinavians=North-Germanics. Nordic is more of a cultural term.

    I like both Norsemen and Finns (spent 6 months there and fell inlove with the land)
    They're nice people, I agree.

  10. #30
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    Today I found a very good Latvian comment about Estonians, with which I absolutely agree, and which I want that Karl sees:

    Ikauņi ir visskaudīgākā nācija kādu esmu saticis. Pie pirmās izdevības vienmēr vēsturiski ir Latviešiem mugurā dunci dūruši. Pat 1939. gadā kad zeme dega zem kājām mēģināja kautko aizmugurski slēgt ar krieviem un nacistiem ar mums pat neparunājuši. Tallinā nav ne Rīgas ne kādas citas Latvijas ielas, Rīgas centrā Igauņijas pilsētām ir kaudze ielu. Viņi mūs uzskata par bezmazvai krieviem, lai gan par spīti visu viņu tā sauktajam "nordiskumam" mēs viņiem kulturāli esam vistuvākā tauta, kad viņiem to norāda tad viņu bezmazvai no biksēm lec ārā sašutumā. Mēģinādāmi mākslīgi attālināties no mums viņi vienmēr iebrauc auzās un novelk lejā visu Baltijas savienību.
    Translation:
    "Estonians are most jealous nation which I have met. They always historically have stabbed at Latvian back at the first chance. Even in year 1939, when land was burning under feet, they tried to make deals with Russians and Nazis behind our back, without consulting with us. In Tallinn there isn't a single street with Riga's name or any other street with Latvian name, but in Riga's center are many streets with names of Estonian towns. They look at us almost like at Russians, although, despite all their so called "nordicism" we are culturally the closest ethnicity to them. But when for them somebody draws attention to it , Estonians almost jump out their trousers from angriness. By trying artificially getting enstranged themselves from Latvians, they always go out of road, and pull down whole Baltic unity."

    http://www.financenet.lv/financenet/...omments/page/7

    And crashing of Baltic unity means weaker each of Baltic countries, about what are happy our enemies or competitors. Baltic countries are much stronger, if cooperate each with other, and don't try to alienate each from other. After all, we don't have so big inhabitant size (especially, if you count only native inhabitants) nor big distances from our capital cities between each other. Baltic unity would benefit starting from economics until military issues. And, after all, we aren't much different each from other. Even Lithuanians are closer to Estonians than to Poles. If you want to tell opposite, then you simply haven't been in Lithuania or Poland, and don't have a clue about these countries and people. Ask Lithuanians, if they feel close to Poles, and answer you'll get is "no".

    Read one Lithuanian comment below youtube video "3 Baltic sisters":

    ...there's no fucking way that Lithuanians consider themselves closer to Polish. That's actually not true. Lots of Lithuanians make fun of Polish and don't seem to like their roads, language, patriotism and religiousness. I personally and many people i have met in my life feel close to Latvians and Estonians. That's for sure!! No other countries around. But Estonians feel great ties with Finland, that's true.
    Another Lituanian comment:

    Lithuanians don't feel themselves closer to Poles. And they understand a bit of Latvian.
    3 Baltic sisters

    I think that the Latvian comment above, which I translated, was right that Estonians are very jealous people. Same can be said about Latvians too. Many people say, that Lithuanians are jealous people too (watch the "3 Baltic sisters" videos). This kind of mentality of course doesn't lead to proper cooperation or unity, rather, it leads to competition and talking behind each other's back.
    It is time to understand, that jealousiness is a bad psychological trait, from where everybody should get out. We should not be jealous each to other, but helpful and open each to other.

    What would you, Estonians, do without the Finnish help??? Thanks to Finns you have little government corruption (Finns have been teaching how to govern), better state economics (Finns have been investing) etc. It's all thanks to Finnish help, and not because you, Estonians, are some kind mysterious "nordic people", like some kind genetic code. Open your eyes, please! Without Finland's help you would be in same place as Latvia or Lithuania!

    Who was helping to Latvia? There wasn't a rich and prosperous ethnically related neighbour, who would help. So nobody really helped.

    And remember, the closest people to Estonians, culturally and mentally, are Latvians. And not Finns or Swedes. Don't believe it? I can prove.

    Check out this map of lesbian and gay rights. I think this map shows something from mentality of countries. Estonia is in same colours as Latvia or Lithuania, not Finland and Sweden.

    http://old.ilga.org/Statehomophobia/...ap_2010_A4.pdf

    Later I will post other charts, which show mentality patterns. You will be surprised how Estonians are much closer to Latvians and Lithuanians, than to Swedes or Finns. I am not posting right now, because I don't remember right now where exactly I saw those charts.

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