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Thread: Atheism vs. Agnosticism Explained

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    Veteran Member Petros Agapetos's Avatar
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    Default Atheism vs. Agnosticism Explained

    Agnostic means "without knowledge"
    Gnostic means "with knowledge"
    Theist means "belief in God"
    Atheist means "no belief in God"

    Agnostic Atheist = I don't believe in God, and I don't claim to know God doesn't exist, I just don't believe

    Gnostic Atheist = I don't believe in God, and I claim to know God does not exist. {I know God does not exist.}

    Agnostic Theist = I believe in God, but I don't know it

    Gnostic Theist = I believe in God, and I claim to know God exists. {I know God exists}

    Which of these four categories applies to you?
    Please vote.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member Petros Agapetos's Avatar
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    Agnosticism is one of two states. Positivist agnosticism is a philosophical position stating that there can be no proof either way that a god does exist or does not exist (see also, skepticism). Positivist agnostics believe that there may be a god, but that he/she is unknown or inherently unknowable.

    Non-positivist agnosticism is the state of holding no particular convictions with regard to the existence of god(s). This second form of agnosticism overlaps with weak atheism.

    "With regard to the gods I am unable to say either that they exist or do not exist."
    — Protagoras (c. 490 – c. 420 BCE)

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    Agnosticism has two general meanings.

    Knowledge of the divine is impossible.

    This definition is not to be taken as an alternative to strong atheism. Strong Atheism and theism deal with belief, while agnosticism and gnosticism deal with the basis for such belief — in particular, knowledge. For example, agnostic atheism holds that knowledge of the divine is impossible (or currently lacking) and thus belief in any gods is unjustified and illogical. On the other hand, agnostic theism is also perfectly valid. Any theist who says ‘just have faith’ is holding such a position, as they are admitting that they have no knowledge of whether a god or gods exist and yet still believe. Gnostic atheism and gnostic theism are pretty much self-explanatory given that the definition of "gnostic" is ‘believing that knowledge of the existence or nonexistence of the divine is possible or currently held’. A gnostic atheist claims that he or she knows that a god does not exist (or thinks that one day such knowledge will be obtained), and thus believes that there is no god. A gnostic theist, on the other hand, believes in a god because he or she claims to know that the god exists.

    Not believing in something without support.

    One can be agnostic about the existence of invisible immaterial pink leprechauns inside computers making them work (for example), because there is no evidence whatsoever that they exist. Assuming they do exist would be delusional. The logical default position must be that they don't exist unless evidence is found that they do. This is because the number of things we have no evidence of is essentially infinite: anyone could easily come up with hundreds of fantastical examples similar to the one above. In addition, there would remain an unending supply of ideas that no one has thought of yet. Believing in any particular such thing may not be illogical, but one simply cannot believe in everything until proven otherwise. Therefore, the default position is to not believe in anything, including gods, until or unless presented with sufficient evidence to cause one to believe. In the absence of such evidence, non-belief is the necessary default position. (The problem in this scheme is, of course, the definition of "sufficient evidence", which will differ from person to person.)

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    An atheist, in the general sense, is a person who does not believe in the existence of any gods. Atheism is the corresponding philosophical position. Atheism may or may not be a position of faith, depending on the type of atheism, as atheism may or may not refer to a stance on the theistic question, depending on the individual in question and how the term 'atheism' is meant. Arguments over whether or not atheism constitutes a belief are often based on one side assuming that the term always does or always doesn’t constitute a positivist statement, and therefore, a belief.

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    A "strong" atheist is one who asserts that "there is no god." Strong atheism is the form of atheism that most theists reference in debates, since most don't know the distinction between strong and weak atheism. However, strong atheists are rarer than most people think.

    "Atheism is a proposition or a truth claim about the world; and that proposition is: God does not exist."

    "One would need to be omniscient in order to prove there is no God, but if one were omniscient one would, by definition, already be God!"

    For the above reason, strong atheism is sometimes criticized for "requiring faith." This criticism often rests on the assumption that faith is a fault, which, if spoken by an arguer whose stance rests on faith, is self-defeating in a direct sense. Other times this idea is argued by theists to 'bring them down to our level'. Most often it is argued as a 'your stance is no better than mine' argument. Often, this is successful in derailing the conversation, as many atheists are uncomfortable with admitting that any element of their thoughts contain faith. Users of this wiki are advised to consider that, in the literal epistemic sense, all knowledge eventually requires some basic assumptions, and that assumption is functionally identical to faith. The difference relies not in avoiding faith/assumption, but in grounding one's knowledge in firmer and more well-reasoned thought.

    Strong atheism is also called 'positivist' atheism. In this usage the term 'positivist' comes from the root 'to posit' meaning 'to take a position'. Thus a positivist atheist is one who has taken the position that there are no gods.

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    A "weak" atheist is one who doesn't claim to know that there is no god, but instead simply lacks belief in a god. This form of atheism is the most common, and is sometimes called "agnostic atheism" (see our discussion of atheist vs. agnostic). Every newborn baby is (unknowingly) a weak atheist, and remains so until the concept of god is introduced to him or her.
    Weak atheists often argue that theirs is the only rational position, as both theism and strong atheism make positivist claims. Weak atheism is also called non-positivist atheism.

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    Atheist beliefs, attitudes, and behaviour

    Apart from not believing in the existence of any gods, there is no official atheist doctrine. There is no atheist pope or church, and there are no atheist rules to live by. This does not mean that atheists do not also follow societal and legal rules, lack ethical principles, nor that they are never religious.

    While there are no unifying beliefs of atheists other than non-belief, there are some general patterns of belief and behaviour that distinguishes atheists from non-atheists. However, assuming an individual atheist conforms to these patterns is not justified. From Zuckerman's scientific literature review, atheists are markedly "less nationalistic, less prejudiced, less anti-Semitic, less racist, less dogmatic, less ethnocentric, less close-minded, and less authoritarian" and more politically independent than religious believers. Atheists are less likely to support right wing political parties and are generally more liberal/progressive. Atheists are more supportive of gender equality and accepting of homosexuality. Zuckerman suggests this implies that atheists may have a superior sense of social justice than the religious. Atheists and more secular nations generally are less likely to support the use of corporal punishment on children and place more emphasis on independent thinking in children.

    Atheist are less likely to commit violent crime than non-atheists. Atheists are also significantly under-represented in the prison population. However, atheists are more likely to consume alcohol while underage and partake in illegal drug use.

    Atheists in the US have similar sexual behaviours when compared to non-atheists, except for: a higher proportion having more than 20 sexual partners over a lifetime, have sex for a longer period of time, more likely to engage in anal sex and women are more likely to receive oral sex. Atheism is also associated with pre-marital sex, more likely to have an extra-marital affair, to approve of oral sex and masturbation and to feel less guilt over their sexual activity.

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    Views of academic atheist philosophers

    A survey of academics in philosophy departments found that atheist in the group generally accept the philosophical positions of:

    mind physicalism (68%),
    free will compatiblism (67.4%),
    naturalism (63.2%),
    using switch in the trolley problem (77.3%),
    moral realism (59.2%),
    scientific realism (80.9%),
    the existence of a-priori knowledge (69.8%),
    non-skeptical realism (86.6%),
    rejecting virtue ethics (67.1%),
    moral cognitivism (71.1%),
    analytic-synthetic distinction (65.3%),
    truth is deflationary (66.7%),
    rejecting sense-datum theory (81.2%)
    and the existence of free will (77.2%)

    The biggest contrasts between atheists and theists are in the areas of mind physicalism (68% atheists, 25.1% theists), free will libertarianism (7.7%/44.4%), naturalism (63.2%/25%), free will compatibilism (67.4%/35.9%), B-theory of time (50.1%/29.2%) and moral consequentialism (32.1%/11.9%).

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    Default Explaining Atheism vs. Agnosticism

    Atheism vs. Agnosticism

    Theism addresses the issue of belief. For any claim asserting the existence of a god, a theist is an individual who accepts (or positively believes) that the claim is true and an atheist (literally, "one without theism") is someone who does not.

    Note that this doesn't mean that theists must accept any existence claim about any god. One can be a theist with respect to some claims and an atheist with respect to others. In particular, followers of one religion are typically atheists with respect to the gods of all other religions.

    To be more precise about the issue of belief, consider the two possible claims one can make regarding the existence of a god:

    1.The god exists.
    2.The god does not exist.

    There are two positions one can take with respect to either claim:
    1. Belief or acceptance of the claim.
    2. Disbelief or rejection of the claim.

    For claim number 1 (the god exists), the theist takes the first position (belief), while the atheist takes the second (disbelief).

    For claim number 2 (the god does not exist), the theist takes the second position (disbelief), while the atheist can hold either position (belief or disbelief).

    Note that one may wish to consider a "third option" of simply reserving judgment. This is actually consistent with position number 2. "Disbelief" means lack of belief. If someone reserves judgment, then clearly they don't believe — and thus they disbelieve, which is position 2. In light of this, one must interpret the term "rejection of a claim" as meaning "lack of acceptance" (and thus, in a sense, only a rejection "if forced to choose right now"). In particular, the term "rejection" should not be interpreted as being based in any way on an acceptance of the opposite claim.

    Therefore, atheists need not positively believe that no gods exist. Some do, and this position is often known as strong atheism. By contrast, other atheists hold that neither claim is sufficiently supported by evidence to justify acceptance, a position known as weak atheism. (The weak atheism position is often confused with agnosticism, which is discussed below.)

    While logic dictates that exactly one of the two claims above must be true (assuming the concept of "god" is sufficiently well-defined in the first place) — and so if one claim is not true the other must be true — there is no such implication in the case of belief. Just because someone doesn't believe something, that doesn't mean they believe the opposite. (For example, not believing the claim that the inventor of the Slinky died in a spring-related accident doesn't mean one positively believes that he didn't die that way.) This is one reason why the theist's accusation that atheism requires "just as much faith" as theism is unfounded (except possibly in the case of particularly strong forms of strong atheism, as discussed below).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Petros Agapetos View Post
    Agnostic means "without knowledge"
    Gnostic means "with knowledge"
    Theist means "belief in God"
    Atheist means "no belief in God"

    Agnostic Atheist = I don't believe in God, and I don't claim to know God doesn't exist, I just don't believe

    Gnostic Atheist = I don't believe in God, and I claim to know God does not exist. {I know God does not exist.}

    Agnostic Theist = I believe in God, but I don't know it

    Gnostic Theist = I believe in God, and I claim to know God exists. {I know God exists}

    Which of these four categories applies to you?
    Please vote.
    Agnostic Atheist
    Agnostic Theist
    Gnostic Atheist
    Gnostic Theist

    Which of these four positions describes you?
    Please vote.

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