Turanid race

[oszkar07]

Please answer honestly here: how many people do you see around you claiming to be Turkic or Asiatic or Turanian compared to those who claim to be European? Because if I have to use a random 100 people sample for my case, then I couldn't even number on one hand those who would claim any of the former ones, while the latter one is claimed by dozens. And do you know why is that? Because to most people it is logical and natural to acknowledge who they are and where they live. Seriously, how would it be anything close to realistic to start to ignore that we live in the heart of Europe, we have Central European culture and we look like our neighbors, and all of a sudden we would rather visualize ourselves being in Central Asia, looking like Europo-Mongoloids? Where is the sanity in such a worldview?

Yes exactly my thoughts.
pontosan

[Stears]

Every quote, there are another series of topics brought up that, although interesting, are not always related to the previous conversation at hand. I wasn't talking about Turkish opinion on Hungarian Turanism (as though it somehow would even negate historical facts on the matter). But, since we are bringing up anecdotal experiences, I would be willing to wager that I have spoken and spent time with more Turkish turks than most people here have, both online and in person, and have found them to be overwhelmingly positive about Hungary and most certainly DO view them in a brotherly light. Now, one could wager that this is because we are seeking out our own opinion biases, but I have gone to Turkish events, dinners, as guest and as visitors, and I have always had just as much interest presented between Magyar-turkic culture as I showed in Turkish-turkic culture. I've even had a casual conversation on the street with a student vacationing form Turkey, who simply opened up with great interest when discussing the Székely flag, and low-key hinted as to how he felt a very close brotherhood between Turks and Hungarians and our family in th east (I'm assuming because of the divided topic of Islam and Turks in general permeating Europe). When I reciprocated the notion, he was absolutely thrilled, and shared that he was surprised that so many Hungarians are waking up to an ancient truth. If anything, my friend, I believe the attitude you described Turks' opinions on Hungarians and there relative unawares is actually reversed; it is Hungarians that are more unaware and indifferent towards the Turkish connection than Turkish people are.

It is both humbling and awesome (in the classical sense of the word), and I am keen to pay the sentiments forward to our Turkish friends.

Thanks for a bit of the information about your Asia result; you are right, 0.9% is a very small number that might be statistical noise. I have not seen many things about your results on Apricity because I generally don't hunt around randomly for the tests of others unless it comes up in casual conversation (as you brought it up here). That's why the other questions I asked were important as well like what area of Asia did they say was a match, etc. It is always very interesting to see results from Hungarians, and I would love for there to be more wider studies of ethnic Hungarians in the future. It is always very disappointing and frustrating to me when they use such small sample numbers, and even then take them from cosmopolitan areas only. The studies on more rural populations always seem to be so much smaller, sub 100 or ever 50, from which many of these arguments are drawn from.

So according to you, all Hungarian and foreign geneticists historian scholars are liars, and all the linguist scholars, who considered the Hungarian language as finno-ugric. They are all globally conspired, and they are controlled by the long-Dead Habsburg monarchs.

Turanism was an anti-hungarian weapon in the hands of the politiians of little Entente Nations during the Trianon peace conference.

Read about the negative effects of turanism in the peace negotiations of Trianon:


http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/273638

[Stears]

Youare from a fake-turkic identity quasi-minority territory, the Kunsag. Neo-cumans suffers from identity crisis, that why they try to turkicize the Hungarian identity. Fortunatelly most Hungarians confuse the turanism with turism.

Every quote, there are another series of topics brought up that, although interesting, are not always related to the previous conversation at hand. I wasn't talking about Turkish opinion on Hungarian Turanism (as though it somehow would even negate historical facts on the matter). But, since we are bringing up anecdotal experiences, I would be willing to wager that I have spoken and spent time with more Turkish turks than most people here have, both online and in person, and have found them to be overwhelmingly positive about Hungary and most certainly DO view them in a brotherly light. Now, one could wager that this is because we are seeking out our own opinion biases, but I have gone to Turkish events, dinners, as guest and as visitors, and I have always had just as much interest presented between Magyar-turkic culture as I showed in Turkish-turkic culture. I've even had a casual conversation on the street with a student vacationing form Turkey, who simply opened up with great interest when discussing the Székely flag, and low-key hinted as to how he felt a very close brotherhood between Turks and Hungarians and our family in th east (I'm assuming because of the divided topic of Islam and Turks in general permeating Europe). When I reciprocated the notion, he was absolutely thrilled, and shared that he was surprised that so many Hungarians are waking up to an ancient truth. If anything, my friend, I believe the attitude you described Turks' opinions on Hungarians and there relative unawares is actually reversed; it is Hungarians that are more unaware and indifferent towards the Turkish connection than Turkish people are.

It is both humbling and awesome (in the classical sense of the word), and I am keen to pay the sentiments forward to our Turkish friends.

Thanks for a bit of the information about your Asia result; you are right, 0.9% is a very small number that might be statistical noise. I have not seen many things about your results on Apricity because I generally don't hunt around randomly for the tests of others unless it comes up in casual conversation (as you brought it up here). That's why the other questions I asked were important as well like what area of Asia did they say was a match, etc. It is always very interesting to see results from Hungarians, and I would love for there to be more wider studies of ethnic Hungarians in the future. It is always very disappointing and frustrating to me when they use such small sample numbers, and even then take them from cosmopolitan areas only. The studies on more rural populations always seem to be so much smaller, sub 100 or ever 50, from which many of these arguments are drawn from.

[itilvolga]

hüngarians are nöt türanid


fake finnö türkics


hüngarians are nöt related with türks



HAJRA TURAN

[Turul Karom]

So according to you, all Hungarian and foreign geneticists historian scholars are liars, and all the linguist scholars, who considered the Hungarian language as finno-ugric. They are all globally conspired, and they are controlled by the long-Dead Habsburg monarchs.

No, I have never said that all Hungarian and foreign linguists are liars. I do not believe in a coordinated global conspiracy as you claim I do. It seems as though you are using hyperbole to make my statements more outrageous than what I am actually saying. It also seems like you do not believe that there are political interests at play in these discussions (though obviously on any side, there will be politics involved). It is clear that the people have changed as have the powers, which is why you are attempting to slander by saying that Hungarian Turanists are afraid of “dead Hapsburg monarchs”. What I am saying is that, in the 18th and 19th centuries especially, the Hapsburgs had a vested interest in seeing us not identify as a Turkic people. Largely, due to the issues of having the Ottoman Empire on the border, through which Hungary could be an exploitable territory to spark revolution and allow the Ottomans another possible attempt at the heart of Austria, or at the very least, weaken Austrian control over the unstable Balkans. This makes sense if you are part of the Austrian government to allow the Hungarians to dabble in their history, but to also bolster the opposition theories. Allow the talk, but do not allow the unfavorable verdict. The Hapsburgs were continuously sensitive to the growing nationalism in their Empire, so the gentle touch was needed. They never considered Hungary as a reliable nation due to revolutions anyway. Now, in the 21st century, it is agreed upon that the “Ugric-Turkic langauge wars” (as they are quite interestingly described) were never properly closed due to the political events at the time (WW1, WW2, etc). Therefore, Finno-Ugrics simply claimed the “victory”. What we are seeing is the resurgence of the facts boiling to the surface as we, as a free nation, are again able to study our own legacy. It's not a secret that the last century was absolutely disastrous for us, and the least of our issues was talking about the exact origins of a few words while Hungary (sometimes literally) burned.

Since we are talking about linguists, perhaps you know Marácz László? He has a PhD in linguistics, and works in the university of Amsterdam.



He emphasizes the critical flaws in the theories put forward by Sajnovics, illustrating that it was never even translated into Hungarian. Marácz László states and postulated that the classification of Magyar as a Finno-Ugric language was based on political reasons.

As far as genetics, Hungary is a very mixed nation, which I am sure that you will agree with. I have never said that we're not, or somehow a “pure” Turkic peoples (which you would be hard-pressed to find in the 21st century in general). However, the distinct Central Asian influences can be found in many locations. What would you consider a “Hungarian”, in the biological sense? Would you consider them only Hungarian if they have a certain range of haplogoups, or a certain percentage of European DNA, etc? It's a real question, because having different definitions while trying to make a point as to who is what makes the opinion of each person challenging. When Central Asian influences or population matches are found in us, do you call us non-Hungarian? If so, then what are we? What do you identify as, and how do you get to that conclusion?

Turanism was an anti-hungarian weapon in the hands of the politiians of little Entente Nations during the Trianon peace conference.

I agree that the Hungarian “otherness” has played an important role in the Treaty of Trianon. However, I disagree that it was the Hungarian association with Turanism that made the western powers “punish” Hungary. Hungarians have long since been associated with Asian peoples, well before Turanism. Turanism came out of the interest in establishing closer ties with them because of already scholarly acknowledged similarity, not as an attempt to shed all European connections 100%.

Read about the negative effects of turanism in the peace negotiations of Trianon:
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/273638

Thank you for the article, even though it was just an OP-ED. It was very interesting, although it had many quotes and opinions that I already mentioned (some even verbatim in this thread). The article really painted a pleasant picture of Hungarians, and illustrated the how Hungarians can experience discrimination based on our origins (which obviously every group is capable of suffering from). I might use this article for a few future writings.

Youare from a fake-turkic identity quasi-minority territory, the Kunsag. Neo-cumans suffers from identity crisis, that why they try to turkicize the Hungarian identity. Fortunatelly most Hungarians confuse the turanism with turism.

This is not merely name-calling, but also confusing. Sometimes in threads you call those who are not quite Hungarians to you as “Cumans”, and then you also say that that Cumans do not exist today. With that logic, do Hungarians not exist today since we're a very different mix than 1000 years ago? Were Árpád and his followers Turkic/Ugric/whatever your fancy, even though they encompassed different genes as they moved west in relation to the original populations? Would any peoples “exist”, in the same sense as they were 1000 years ago? 500? As far as “turkicizing” the modern Hungarian identity, since the original Magyars were quite Turkic in culture, government structure, and appearance, if anything we are honoring our ancestors by keeping their traditions alive today. That to me, is a pillar of Turanism.