Within Europe, what is a more important source of identity: social class or ethnicity?

[wvwvw]

In other words, do e.g. middle-class Greeks have more in common with working-class Greeks or with middle-class Swedes (or indeed vice versa)?

Middle class Greeks have more in common with working class people and other Greeks of course.

[Herr Abubu]

Culture is dead and all that matters now is economics. Commonalities between social classes anywhere aren't cultural in nature but commercial. What supposed culture that exists is simply anti-culture concocted by Capital. This is the totalitarianism that neither Orwell nor Huxley never really put their fingers on.

[nightrider+]

I was going to answer but then it came to me: Does anyone really have an identity nowadays?
I guess most are going to stick with people that can spend a similar amount of money.

[Tooting Carmen]

bump

[Autrigón]

before i opened this thread, i knew you made it. nothing against. just saying i knew its you. just like the "language or race" thread.

It's me or you look thinner in your picture than some months ago?

[Mortimer]

It's me or you look thinner in your picture than some months ago?

yes i do indeed, im slimmer. its cool that its already visible.

[Bobby Martnen]

yes i do indeed, im slimmer. its cool that its already visible.

Congrats! My weight loss isn't going so well, but I dropped 65 lbs in a year before, so I'm optimistic that I can lose 20 in the next 2 months.

[♥ Lily ♥]

England is an extremely classist society... so social background, accent, mannerisms, societal connections, heritage, the type of school a person attended, etc, is what gives a person their identity in regards to England.

If a politically-correct and dutiful person who has done very well in society is recommended and placed onto the Queen's Birthday Honours List, they can receive a title from Her Majesty the Queen in return they uphold their duty to defend the British Empire.

They're given a title in society, such as a 'Sir', a 'Lady', a 'Baron', 'Baroness,' 'Lord', 'Duchess', 'Duke', etc... and it instantly gives them a higher social status, societal respect, and many privileges in life. A person who is nominated to receive a title to their name isn't obliged to accept a title though.

Ozzy Osbourne and John Lydon are seen as nouveau-riche, because despite being self-made millionaires, Ozzy still has the behaviour and mannerisms of a lout, and he talks with a distinct working-class Brummie accent... and Irish-Londoner and punk-rocker John Lydon still talks like a working-class cockney, and he's still rebellious and non politically-correct eversince his censored song about the British monarchy and the UK anthem was a no.1 hit song in the UK: 'God save the Queen;- the fascist regime...' and making songs like 'Anarchy in the UK'... , so he'll never be invited to receive a title from the Queen... he wouldn't accept a title anyway. (Mick Jagger turned down an offer to recieve a title to his name from the Queen.)

The working-classes are used like pawn pieces in chess on the front lines of war, and the military officers in charge are usually of middle-class background.

The UK isn't like the US where money can buy peoples way into the upper classes;- the type of school a person attended, accent, cultural hobbies and interests, (i.e; being part of an elite horse show-jumping group or a polo group, being part of the Oxford vs Cambridge university rowing teams, wearing elegant hats at Royal Ascot's Ladies Hats Day and hobnobbing with the upper echelons of society at grand horse-racing events in England, watching cricket amongst middle-class spectators at Lords, eating stawberries & cream whilst watching tennis at Wimbledon... rather than standing amongst a crowd of rowdy working-class soccer fans... attending the Proms at the Royal Albert Hall, attending audiences to watch operas, orchestras, royal ballet shows and theatres.... and wearing sensible shoes and sipping afternoon high tea in Harrods and at The Ritz, etc, and regularly attending prestigious events in society, such as the Chelsea Flower Show, etc,) and family background and the type of school a person attended, instantly defines class and social status in the UK.

Chuka Umunna is viewed as upper middle-class due to his upper-class and posh accent and family background, his societal connections with powerful politicians, his elite education, etc. I'm sure he'll be invited to have tea with the Queen in her palaces and dines with the Lords in society, like John Sentamu, Baroness Scotland, Harvard law student and former US President Barack Obama, and George Bush's politically-correct US Secretary of State, Condoleeza Rice.

The situation may be different in other European nations which have a much less class-governed society than England.

1:40 onwards in the video clip below... a statement by Penny 'Lapsang' Rimbaud (a writer, poet, philosopher, painter, musician and activist 'The entire military, the entire legal profession, the entire literary world in England, is dominated by the middle and upper classes.'

'You can't buy your way into the upper classes in England - it's not like America;- in this country background and accent defines class. It's as deeply ingrained into the English psyche and character as is the caste system in India... except it's not quite so explicit as the caste system in India;- it doesn't need to be in England, because each one of us as a Brit knows exactly where we belong from childhood schooling... and if you don't know, then you'll soon be reminded of which social class you belong to.'

'If, for example, I'm stopped by security guards or by the police in a store, (because I attract attention from security due to looking a bit scruffy and trampish,) my accent will immediately inform them of what I'll essentially be thinking... or how I'll defend myself. As soon as they hear my upper class accent, they think, 'Oh, it's okay... he's just an upper-class eccentric... rather than a working-class tramp,' and so the security leaves me alone after hearing my accent. It's in action all the time in English society.'

[♥ Lily ♥]

'Sir' Robert Mugabe was once knighted by the Queen and given the title of a Sir. Robert Mugabe gained 6 university degrees at the prestigious Oxford University in England... and later he came into power... but he turned against the British Empire, so his prestigious title was stripped from him by the UK government.

Some Etonian Tory politicians on QT feigned ignorance when questioned about Robert Mugabe's title and pretended to be unaware of him formerly having a prestigious title to his name, after he'd turned against the UK government and became heavily demonised in the British media.

Thatcher's son Mark Thatcher is banned from entering some nations in Africa as he's a thug and a criminal... but he works for the British elite so he's not demonised in the UK media.

My Irish friend in London absolutely loves Robert Mugabe and President Putin as his heroes. (President Putin sided with Mr. Mugabe when the UK tried to bully and issue weapons sanctions against Zimbabwe at the UN. All the nations at the UN sided with the UK - except for Russia and China who vetoed the sanctions... and so they saved the day for Mr. Mugabe.)

Nelson Mandela went from being imprisoned and heavily demonised by the UK government and media... to being praised by the UK government and media... and he was seen in photos sipping tea with Queen Elizabeth II in her palaces.

'I have no quarrels with the ordinary British people... only with the demons in 10 Downing Street, Westminster, running the country... who must be exorcised.' Robert Mugabe.


Mr. Mugabe gets his Egyptian and Zimbabwean security guards to remove an arrogant and provocative ITN British news reporter and yells at him, 'We are not a British colony!' (His security guards chant, 'That's right - tell him again! Tell him again!') 'You're a bloody idiot;- you work for MI5/6 and British Intelligence.'


Basically, if you're politically-correct and don't rebel against the hierarchy and monarchy and serve the interests of the British Empire, then you can be respected and elevated and praised amongst the upper and middle classes in society... and you can be given honours and a prestigious title to your name... regardless of ethnicity.... but it you're non politically-correct and turn against the UK government and hierarchy, you'll be heavily demonised by the UK government and their media.

Billionaire Mohamed Al Fayed is another example of someone who used to be friends with the Royal Family and with the ruling elites in UK society - when he was funding their horse shows at a cost of £20 million per year... (despite once being a military officer in the Egyptian military that kicked the British military out of his country... and despite exposing some top Conservative government politicians who tried to illegally sell armed weapons in one of his hotels, who he exposed in the UK media and subsequently had jailed.)

He's now demonised in the UK media and shunned by the Royal Family since he insists the Royal Family murdered his son and his pregnant lover Princess Diana.

The Royal Family requested for the Royal Crest and Royal Seal of Approval over the grand and historical and luxurious Harrods department store (that Mr. Al Fayed had purchased and owned,) to be removed.

Al Fayed installed Egyptian elevators, huge gold Ancient Egyptian statues, a Dodi & Diana memorial fountain and a love statue of Dodi & Diana, etc, inside the prestigious store.

Al Fayed was shown on UK news videos as smashing-up the Royal Crest and Royal Seal of Approval outside of Harrods in anger. 'They can take it back as I don't want it anyway!'

Since selling Harrods in Knightsbridge for a huge sum of money, he spends a lot of time now in Scotland living in his Scottish castle, and funding the SNP and supporting them for Scottish independence from the United Kingdom. He speaks-out heavily against the UK government and against the Royal Family at every opportunity he gets to be heard on UK, US, and Canadian TV.

He ranted against a British journalist (below) outside the Royal Courts of Justice in London where he tried to prosecute the Royal Family as being 'terrorists, murderers and gangsters'... and made allegations and accusations against the British Prime Minister... and against the British security and British intelligence agencies.

He's become an embarrassment to the corrupt UK government and Royal Family, and he has personal bodyguards with him at all times - so he doesn't get bumped-off like his son and Diana.

'I give the Royal Family hell! I will not talk to you as you're a British journalist and a bloody idiot who works for MI6.'


'I love the ordinary British people... I think they're great people and that Great Britain is a great country that I love. I've been to schools in the UK and I've lived and worked in Great Britain for over 40 years and consider it as my second home. I've paid billions in taxes to the UK and I've created tens of thousands of jobs in the UK. I used to be close friends to the Queen and the Duke of Edinburgh when I was funding their horse-shows at a cost of £20million per year... but not since they murdered my son and Lady Diana on the orders of Prince Philip (a racist.)'

'The Queen's husband, Prince Philip, the Duke of Edinburgh, was kicked-out of Greece at age 6... he's a racist who grew-up with Hitler's generals in Germany. He was taken away from his crazy parents as a child and grew-up with his Nazi German Aunt who was married to a top Nazi General called Goebbels. He's a son-of-a-bitch and a crooked and criminal gangster... he's got no decency or morals.... he's got no conscience... his family were mentally sick and crazy.... and he's gone insane with greed.... you want a fucking criminal gangster like that running this nation?! I will keep exposing the truth.'



Mr. Al Fayed spoke on national Canadian TV (below) about how he loves the ordinary British people, but not the gangsters running Great Britain. He angrily demanded to know (whilst the Canadian audience and Canadian interviewer laughed at him,) why Canadians are 'zombies who are living in a coma and who are still servolic servants of their ruling Queen over them... instead of being an independent nation like the US.'

So he's non politically-correct and is demonised by the Lords and Peers and hierarchy of Great Britain.

'This is the 21st century, yet you still have this awful bloody royal family ruling over your nation. What's the matter with you people in Canada? Why don't you wake-up instead of living in a coma?! Too many people are like zombies who are living in a coma... so they elect donkey politicians to rule over them because they're zombies.'


The ruling elite can get away with many crimes though (from mass murder to corruption and grand theft,) due to the double-standards and the separate laws unto the rich and the poor in English society.

[Illancha]

We're at a stage of civilizational decay. Rootless cosmopolitans, homo economicus, are dominant.