Sunni islam is shirk and maltheistic

**~~monfret~~** · 11-22-2017, 08:50 PM

ashari sunni islaam says that the word of god is uncreated.tbh,IDK if this means they are inscribed on tablets and these tablets(lawh al mahfudh)are eternal or that these words are only uncreated in the sence of being abstract ideas in allah's mind.but it does say allah has a arsh a literal throne uncreated.also it says allah has a jism(body)and is not omnipresent so he was eternally restricted by space and his body.shia consider all these referances to be metaphorical and consider the quran to be created.they are thus not condemned in this aspect.

as for maltheism.allah in orthodox sunni islam is the origin of all his servants actions,good or bad also known as Qadir or Taqdir.this is supported by many quranic verses and ahadith so I would go as far as to say this is quranic islam and the shi'a are heretics for denying it.yet this being condemns his creation for the disbelief,murder and adultery he ordains them and forces them to do.a corrupt judge and a mock trial is his judgement.this being is thus evil and unjust .he cannot be God,surely not the god of yahwism,the almighty whom the prophet Job inspired by the spirit says''will not do wickedly nor pervert justice''

I will list the referances below.

**~~monfret~~** · 11-22-2017, 08:55 PM

It is narrated on the authority of Yahya b. Ya'mur that the first man who discussed about Qadr (Divine Decree) in Basra was Ma'bad al-Juhani. I along with Humaid b. 'Abdur-Rahman Himyari set out for pilgrimage or for 'Umrah and said: Should it so happen that we come into contact with one of the Companions of the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) we shall ask him about what is talked about Taqdir (Division Decree). Accidentally we came across Abdullah ibn Umar ibn al-Khattab, while he was entering the mosque. My companion and I surrounded him. One of us (stood) on his right and the other stood on his left. I expected that my companion would authorize me to speak. I therefore said: Abu Abdur Rahman! There have appeared some people in our land who recite the Holy Qur'an and pursue knowledge. And then after talking about their affairs, added: They (such people) claim that there is no such thing as Divine Decree and events are not predestined. He (Abdullah ibn Umar) said: When you happen to meet such people tell them that I have nothing to do with them and they have nothing to do with me. And verily they are in no way responsible for my (belief). Abdullah ibn Umar swore by Him (the Lord) (and said): If any one of them (who does not believe in the Divine Decree) had with him gold equal to the bulk of (the mountain) Uhud and then, it (in the way of Allah), Allah would not accept it unless he affirmed his faith in Divine Decree. He further said: My father, Umar ibn al-Khattab, told me: One day we were sitting in the company of Allah's Apostle when there appeared before us a man dressed in pure white clothes, his hair extraordinarily black. There were no signs of travel on him. None amongst us recognized him. At last he sat with the Apostle. He knelt before him placed his palms on his thighs and said: Muhammad, inform me about al-Islam. The Messenger of Allah said: Al-Islam implies that you testify that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah, and you establish prayer, pay Zakat, observe the fast of Ramadan, and perform pilgrimage to the (House) if you are solvent enough (to bear the expense of) the journey. He (the inquirer) said: You have told the truth. He (Umar ibn al-Khattab) said: It amazed us that he would put the question and then he would himself verify the truth. He (the inquirer) said: Inform me about Iman (faith). He (the Holy Prophet) replied: That you affirm your faith in Allah, in His angels, in His Books, in His Apostles, in the Day of Judgment, and you affirm your faith in the Divine Decree about good and evil. He (the inquirer) said: You have told the truth… He (the narrator, Umar ibn al-Khattab) said: Then he (the inquirer) went on his way but I stayed with him (the Holy Prophet) for a long while. He then, said to me: Umar, do you know who this inquirer was? I replied: Allah and His Apostle knows best. He (the Holy Prophet) remarked: He was Gabriel (the angel). He came to you in order to instruct you in matters of religion. (Sahih Muslim, Book 001, Number 000

if thy Lord willed, all who are in the earth would have believed together. Wouldst thou (Muhammad) compel men until they are believers? It is not for any soul to believe save by the permission of Allah. He hath set uncleanness upon those who have no sense. S. 10:99-100

Verily! This is an admonition, so whosoever wills, let him take a Path to his Lord (Allah). But you cannot will, unless Allah wills. Verily, Allah is Ever All-Knowing, All-Wise. He will admit to His Mercy whom He will; But the wrong-doers,- for them has He prepared a grievous Penalty." S. 76:29-31

To whomsoever among you who wills to walk straight, And you will not, unless (it be) that Allah wills, the Lord of the worlds. S. 81:28-29

Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he OF NECESSITY MUST COMMIT (or there would be no escape from it). (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6421; see also Number 6422)

'Abdullah b. Mas'ud reported: Evil one is he who is evil in the womb of his mother and the good one is he who takes lesson from the (fate of) others. The narrator came to a person from amongst the Companion of Allah's Messenger who was called Hudhaifa b. Usaid Ghifari and said: How can a person be an evil one without (committing an evil) deed? Thereupon the person said to him: You are surprised at this, whereas I have heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: When forty nights pass after the semen gets into the womb, Allah sends the angel and gives him the shape. Then he creates his sense of hearing, sense of sight, his skin, his flesh, his bones, and then says: My Lord, would he be male or female? And your Lord decides as He desires and the angel then puts down that also and then says: My Lord, what about his age? And your Lord decides as He likes it and the angel puts it down. Then he says: My Lord, what about his livelihood? And then the Lord decides as He likes and the angel writes it down, and then the angel gets out with his scroll of destiny in his hand and nothing is added to it and nothing is subtracted from it. (Sahih Muslim, Book 033, Number 6393) If it had been Allah's plan, they would not have taken false gods: but We made thee not one to watch over their doings, nor art thou set over them to dispose of their affairs. S. 6:107

He (Ibn Sa‘d) said: Then they said: O Apostle of Allah, our mother Mulaykah Bint al-Hulw used to secure the freedom of prisoners, feed the mendicant and show compassion to the poor. She had died. She had interred alive a daughter of very tender age, so what would be her condition. He said: She who interred her (daughter) alive and she who was interred alive are BOTH in hell fire. Thereupon they got infuriated. He said: Come to me. They came back and he said: My mother is with yours. They rejected it, and went away saying: By Allah! This man who made us eat the heart and thinks that our mother is in hell-fire, is not worthy of being followed. They set out and on the way they confronted one of the Companions of the Apostle of Allah who was bringing camels of sadaqah. They tied him and carried away the camels. This news reached the Prophet. He cursed them along with those whom he was cursing in these words: May Allah curse Ri‘l, Dhakwan, ‘Usayyah, Lihyan, and two sons of Mulaykah–Ibn Harim and Murran. (Ibn Sa'ad's Kitab Al-Tabaqat Al-Kabir, English translation by S. Moinul Haq, M.A., PH.D, assisted by H.K. Ghazanfar M.A. [Kitab Bhavan Exporters & Importers, 1784 Kalan Mahal, Daryaganj, New Delhi - 110 002 India], Volume I, Parts I & II, pp. 383-384; capital and underline emphasis ours)

Not only did the mother who buried her baby daughter alive go to hell, but so did her infant child who died!

And lest a Muslim argue that this is a weak narration here is another report which scholars have classified as sahih or sound that confirms that a woman who buries her daughter and the girl who is buried will both end up in hell:

4717. It was narrated from Ibn Abi Za’idah: “My father narrated to me, from Amir who said: ’The Messenger of Allah said: “The woman who buries her infant daughter alive, and the girl who is buried alive, are both in the Fire.”’” Yahya bin Zakariyya said: “My father said: ‘Abu Ishaq narrated to me, that ‘Amir narrated that to him from ‘Alqamah, from Ibn Mas‘ud, from the Prophet.’” (Sahih) (English Translation of Sunan Abu Dawud, From Hadith no. 4351-5274, Volume 5, Chapter 17. Regarding The Offspring Of The Idolaters, pp. 221-222; underline emphasis ours)

**~~monfret~~** · 11-22-2017, 08:56 PM

With Allah is the argument that reaches home: if it had been His will, He could indeed have guided you all." (Sura 6:149).
The Hadith (Sahih Muslim, page 1395) :

"Allah's Messenger, what is your opinion that the people do in the world, and strive for, is something decreed for them, something preordained for them, and (sic) will their fate in the Hereafter be determined by the fact that their prophets brought them teachings which they did not act upon, and thus they became DESERVING of punishment? Thereupon he said:
"'Of course, it happens as it is decreed by Destiny and preordained for them, and this view is confirmed by this verse of the Book of Allah, the Exalted and Glorious: 'Consider the soul and Him who made it perfect, then breathed into it its sin and its piety.'Sura 9:51:

"Nothing shall ever befall upon us except what Allah has ordained for us."muhammed narrated that moses said to adam,You are our father, you did us harm and caused us to get out of Paradise. Adam said to him ... 'You blame me for an act which Allah had ordained for me 40 years before he created me.' Allah's Apostle then said (or added): 'This is how Adam came the better of Moses."'
Abu Huraira reported Muhammed as saying:

"Verily Allah has fixed the very portion of adultery which a man will indulge in, and which he of necessity must commit (or "there would be no escape from it). If we had so willed, we could have given every soul this guidance, but now my word is realized: 'Assuredly I shall fill Gehenna (hell) with jinns (spirits) and men altogether.'" (Sura 32:13) If Allah had willed he would have made you one nation. But he leads astray whom he will and guides whom he will. But you shall certainly be called to account for all your actions." (Sura 16:93). Sura 7:178-179 :

"Whomsoever Allah guides, he is rightly guided, and whom he leads astray, they are the losers! We have created for Gehenna many jinns and men ..."
"Do ye desire to guide him whom Allah led astray? Whom Allah leads away, you will find no way for him." (Sura 4:88).
Race to forgiveness from your Lord, and a Garden the breadth whereof is as the breadth of heaven and earth, made ready for those who believe in Allah and His Messengers. That is the bounty of Allah; He gives it unto whomsoever He will; and Allah is of bounty abounding. No affliction befalls in the earth or in yourselves, but it is in a Book, before We create it; that is easy for Allah; that you may not grieve for what escapes you, nor rejoice in what has come to you; Allah loves not any man proud and boastful, S. 57:21-23
"If Allah willed he would have made mankind one nation, but they continue in their differences, excepting those on whom your Lord has mercy. To that end, he created them and perfectly is fulfilled the word of your Lord: 'I shall assuredly fill Gehenna with jinns and men altogether.'" (Sura 11:118-119).

"Allah leads astray whomsoever he will and guides whomsoever he will." (Sura 14:4) "If it were Allah's will, he could gather them together unto true guidanceSura 6:35

**~~al-Bosni~~** · 11-23-2017, 09:11 AM

Yes, he is in heaven above his throne. Believing this is a part of Muslim belief. Just like when the Prophet

asked a young slave girl where he is and she said that he is in heaven, so he ordered her master to set her free because she is a Muslim.

But in the Quran it also says that he is closer to us than our jugular vein, this is because of his knowledge of everything and It's indicated in verse 50:16.

"And We have already created man and know what his soul whispers to him, and We are closer to him than [his] jugular vein"

(verse 50:16)

**~~monfret~~** · 12-14-2017, 09:41 PM

Originally Posted by al-Bosni

Yes, he is in heaven above his throne. Believing this is a part of Muslim belief. Just like when the Prophet

asked a young slave girl where he is and she said that he is in heaven, so he ordered her master to set her free because she is a Muslim.

But in the Quran it also says that he is closer to us than our jugular vein, this is because of his knowledge of everything and It's indicated in verse 50:16.

"And We have already created man and know what his soul whispers to him, and We are closer to him than [his] jugular vein"

(verse 50:16)

what about his a3rsh and lawh al mahfudh being uncreated?what about him being an evil god?