Estlandssvenskar på Ormsö

[Äike]

Finlandssvenskar have a completely different position in Finnish society compared to Estlandssvenskar in Estonia.

I know that.

[The Ripper]

I know that.

Which is why I believe there far larger share of finlandssvenskar would have remained in Finland.

[Äike]

Which is why I believe there far larger share of finlandssvenskar would have remained in Finland.

Put their position in the society of Finland into your own words.

[The Ripper]

Put their position in the society of Finland into your own words.

Central, not peripheral.

[Äike]

Central, not peripheral.

Being peasants is peripheral, okay...

Every country in WW2 which was re-occupied by the USSR had a big emigration of war refugees. You're practically saying that Finn-Swedes wouldn't have emigrated the same way that the Finns would have.

When thinking about the hypothesis of Finland being annexed by the USSR in 1940, taken over by Germany in 1941 and occupied again in 1944. Then already before 1941, about 5-10% of the Finn-Swede population would have perished. I'm certain the autonomous Finland under German occupation would have had the same privileges as Estonia did over the other "autonomous areas" and both Finns and Finn-Swedes would have started to emigrate to some extent in 1944. Sweden would have helped, like it helped Estonia. About 50-60% of the remaining Finn-Swede population would have left. By 1944, when the Soviets control Finland again, 1/4 or 1/5 of the former Finn-Swede population would have remained(but still in considerable numbers). By 1950, the Finn-Swede population would have been very small and at max ~15 000 would still exist in Finland by 1991.

[The Ripper]

Being peasants is peripheral, okay...

Well, compared to being the movers and shakers of the economy, politics, culture, academic world, etc, I'd say it is.

Every country in WW2 which was re-occupied by the USSR had a big emigration of war refugees. You're practically saying that Finn-Swedes wouldn't have emigrated the same way that the Finns would have.

No, I'm saying that finlandssvenskar would have stayed put to a greater extent than the Swedes in Estonia. I believe so because the population, especially in the south was far more integrated and it had less chances of escape, unlike the ones living on the western coast.

When thinking about the hypothesis of Finland being annexed by the USSR in 1940, taken over by Germany in 1941 and occupied again in 1944. Then already before 1941, about 5-10% of the Finn-Swede population would have perished. I'm certain the autonomous Finland under German occupation would have had the same privileges as Estonia did over the other "autonomous areas" and both Finns and Finn-Swedes would have started to emigrate to some extent in 1944. Sweden would have helped, like it helped Estonia. About 50-60% of the remaining Finn-Swede population would have left. By 1944, when the Soviets control Finland again, 1/4 or 1/5 of the former Finn-Swede population would have remained(but still in considerable numbers). By 1950, the Finn-Swede population would have been very small and at max ~15 000 would still exist in Finland by 1991.

Interesting speculation, but I believe a higher number would have remained, because of the different position finlandssvenskar have. Think of finlandssvenskar as nicer, milder Baltic Germans.

[Äike]

Well, compared to being the movers and shakers of the economy, politics, culture, academic world, etc, I'd say it is.

The movers and shakers of the Estonian economy, politics, culture and academic world all fled Estonia or were sent to Siberia. I hope you get my point.

No, I'm saying that finlandssvenskar would have stayed put to a greater extent than the Swedes in Estonia. I believe so because the population, especially in the south was far more integrated and it had less chances of escape, unlike the ones living on the western coast.

The evacuation of the Estonian-Swedes in 1944 was organized by Sweden, Carl Mothander to be precise. Without that organization, thousands would have probably stayed put, but would have been exterminated in one way or another, luckily all of them arrived safely in Sweden.

Interesting speculation, but I believe a higher number would have remained, because of the different position finlandssvenskar have. Think of finlandssvenskar as nicer, milder Baltic Germans.

If I would think of the Finlandssvenskar as Baltic-Germans, then I would have said zero, not ~15 000. The Baltic-Germans who remained in Estonia were exterminated and completley deported from Estonia for the same reason that they were "Central" and "movers of the economy etc".

[Motörhead Remember Me]

Think of finlandssvenskar as nicer, milder Baltic Germans.

That would not be right either...

[The Ripper]

That would not be right either...

Not quite, no. It was tongue-in-cheek.

[Moonbird]

Tragiskt nog verkar det som de stolta ättlingarna till de fruktade och krigiska vikingarna alltid var de första att fegt fly sina hemländer när det krisat.

Jag skäms över så mycket som svenskspråkiga gjort.

So, I see your honeymoon with the Finns is still on.