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Thread: Clan and Clann the Etruscan and Gaelic Word

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mens-Sarda View Post
    Perhaps instead Latin acquired Clan from Etruscan or from other previous languages, it makes me think to some Latin composed words :

    Clandestinus -> Clan + Destinus = son of destiny? = that who entrusts his life to destiny for the chance of a better life?
    Let's not get in the business of producing false folksy etymologies please.

    Clandestine [etymonline.com]
    "secret, private, hidden, furtive," 1560s, from Latin clandestinus "secret, hidden," from clam "secretly," from adverbial derivative of base of celare "to hide" (from PIE root *kel-(1) "to cover, conceal, save"), perhaps on model of intestinus "internal." Related: Clandestinely. As a noun form, there is awkward clandestinity (clandestineness apparently being a dictionary word).

    Clan [etymonline.com]
    "a family, a tribe," especially, among the Highlanders of Scotland, a form of social organization consisting of a tribe holding land in common under leadership of a chieftain, early 15c., from Gaelic clann "family, stock, offspring," akin to Old Irish cland "offspring, tribe," both from Latin planta "offshoot" (see plant (n.)).

    Cf. Clan [thefreedictionary.com]
    Middle English, from Scottish Gaelic clann, family, from Old Irish cland, offspring, from Latin planta, plant, sprout; see plat- in Indo-European roots.]


    Only butthurted clowns minuses my posts. -- Лиссиы

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mens-Sarda View Post
    Perhaps from Latin "Bubulus" (bovine), this word evolved into the Sardinian "Bulu" (bovine)
    Yes..

    Bue, bove in italian too

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Óttar View Post
    Let's not get in the business of producing false folksy etymologies please.

    Clandestine [etymonline.com]
    "secret, private, hidden, furtive," 1560s, from Latin clandestinus "secret, hidden," from clam "secretly," from adverbial derivative of base of celare "to hide" (from PIE root *kel-(1) "to cover, conceal, save"), perhaps on model of intestinus "internal." Related: Clandestinely. As a noun form, there is awkward clandestinity (clandestineness apparently being a dictionary word).

    Clan [etymonline.com]
    "a family, a tribe," especially, among the Highlanders of Scotland, a form of social organization consisting of a tribe holding land in common under leadership of a chieftain, early 15c., from Gaelic clann "family, stock, offspring," akin to Old Irish cland "offspring, tribe," both from Latin planta "offshoot" (see plant (n.)).

    Cf. Clan [thefreedictionary.com]
    Middle English, from Scottish Gaelic clann, family, from Old Irish cland, offspring, from Latin planta, plant, sprout; see plat- in Indo-European roots.]
    Very helpful thanks

    Althought the Clann / Clan hypotesys seems to have struck to me

  4. #14
    In Corpore Sardo Mens-Sarda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiCa View Post
    Yes..

    Bue, bove in italian too
    That is another word, Latin "Bos - Bovis" which from the accusative Bovem evolved into the Italian "Bue" and Sardinian "Boe".

    A cognate of "Bubulus" in Italian seems to be "Bufalo"
    Non Auro, Sed Ferro, Recuperanda Est Patria (Not by Gold, But by Iron, Is the Nation to be Recovered) - Marcus Furius Camillus (Roman General)

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    Quote Originally Posted by gıulıoımpa View Post
    sicuramente la connessione Italoceltica č innegabile (si lo so l'etrusco non č indoeruopeo) comunque č pazzesco quanto si assomigliano, se si sa un po di latino si colgono inoltre un bel po' di connessioni





    Sono entrambe lingue ricostruite, non esiste alcuna iscrizione proto-Italica o proto-Celtica. Quindi č ovvio che siano rassomiglianze, perché la ricostruzione č probabilmente basata sull'albero filogenetico che prevede un legame tra proto-Italico e proto-Celtico. Inoltre chi ha fatto i video non č un linguista, ma uno che ci prova senza aver piena consapevolezza di quello che sta facendo. Anche perché il proto-Italico č certamente precedente al 1000 a.C. Per quanto l'ipotesi Italo-Celtica rimane molto credibile a mio avviso.

    Il problema č che le lingue italiche sono divise in due famiglie linguistiche (Latino-Falisca e Umbro-Osca), e la separazione potrebbe essere avvenuta fuori dall'Italia, con due origini diverse (centro Europa la prima, balcanica la seconda). Quindi l'ipotesi Italo-Celtica su quale famiglia linguistica italica si basa? Su quella occidentale (Latino-Falisca) o quella orientale (Umbro-Osca)? O entrambe? Se cosě fosse che cosa significa allora la divisione della famiglia italica?

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    Parcere subiectis, debellare superbos. gıulıoımpa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Percivalle View Post
    Sono entrambe lingue ricostruite, non esiste alcuna iscrizione proto-Italica o proto-Celtica. Quindi č ovvio che siano rassomiglianze, perché la ricostruzione č probabilmente basata sull'albero filogenetico che prevede un legame tra proto-Italico e proto-Celtico. Inoltre chi ha fatto i video non č un linguista, ma uno che ci prova senza aver piena consapevolezza di quello che sta facendo. Anche perché il proto-Italico č certamente precedente al 1000 a.C. Per quanto l'ipotesi Italo-Celtica rimane molto credibile a mio avviso.

    Il problema č che le lingue italiche sono divise in due famiglie linguistiche (Latino-Falisca e Umbro-Osca), e la separazione potrebbe essere avvenuta fuori dall'Italia, con due origini diverse (centro Europa la prima, balcanica la seconda). Quindi l'ipotesi Italo-Celtica su quale famiglia linguistica italica si basa? Su quella occidentale (Latino-Falisca) o quella orientale (Umbro-Osca)? O entrambe? Se cosě fosse che cosa significa allora la divisione della famiglia italica?
    Si, questa storiella č fatta di proposito con parole, radici e verbi piuttosto semplici (owis per pecora simile ad ovis e tanti altri equivalenti, cosi come ber/fer per "trasportare" e wir/vir per uomo sono veramente quasi direi universali) che sono delle quali abbiamo piu probabilitŕ di avvicinarci ala versione reale tramite metodo comparativo a posteriori.

    Riguardo la divisione delle lingue italiche io sapevo che l'italo osco era a metŕ strada per dire, tra proto italico e proto greco mentre l italo falisco conservava caratteristiche piu simili al proto celtico.

    Inviato dal mio SM-G389F utilizzando Tapatalk



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  7. #17
    Veteran Member wvwvw's Avatar
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    There is no such thing as Etruscans nor such a thing as an Etruscan language. Etruria was a geographical term used to describe a region populated by dozen of unrelated tribes who spoke different languages. The Romans and historians do not refer to any entities called "Etruscan".

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    Quote Originally Posted by gıulıoımpa View Post

    Riguardo la divisione delle lingue italiche io sapevo che l'italo osco era a metŕ strada per dire, tra proto italico e proto greco mentre l italo falisco conservava caratteristiche piu simili al proto celtico.

    Inviato dal mio SM-G389F utilizzando Tapatalk
    Osco a metŕ tra proto-italico e proto-greco? Non lo so, mi sembra remota come possibilitŕ a meno che non si tratti di influenze avvenute in Italia. La lingua greca appartiene proprio a tutt'altro filone rispetto al latino e hanno proprio origini molto diverse, seppur all'interno della famiglia linguistica indo-europea. Quindi immagino che anche l'italico sia distante dal greco.

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    Etruscan was for sure, geographically in contact with Celtic languages thought.

    Both in Gallia Cisalpina (today po valley), both in the Alps of today Tyrol if the hipotesys of Retians speaking etruscan is true (wich is true i guess)


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    Venetian was probably italic too btw

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